Unsure about main villains
Doctor Kananga
Posts: 3MI6 Agent
In most Bond films the main villain is obvious but I am unsure about who is the main villain in these films.
1. From Russia With Love
a) Rosa Klebb?
b) Red Grant?
c) Blofeld?
d) Kronsteen?
2. Octopussy
a) Kamal Khan?
b) General Orlov?
3. The Living Daylights
a) Georgi Koskov?
b) Brad Whittaker?
4. The World is Not Enough
a) Renard?
b) Elektra King?
5. Die Another Day
a) Colonel Moon?
b) Gustav Graves?
Or is it someone I have not mentioned?
1. From Russia With Love
a) Rosa Klebb?
b) Red Grant?
c) Blofeld?
d) Kronsteen?
2. Octopussy
a) Kamal Khan?
b) General Orlov?
3. The Living Daylights
a) Georgi Koskov?
b) Brad Whittaker?
4. The World is Not Enough
a) Renard?
b) Elektra King?
5. Die Another Day
a) Colonel Moon?
b) Gustav Graves?
Or is it someone I have not mentioned?
Comments
1. From Russia With Love
a) Rosa Klebb?
b) Red Grant?
c) Blofeld?
d) Kronsteen?
Since Klebb, Grant and Kronsteen all work for Blofeld, I would say Blofeld.
2. Octopussy
a) Kamal Khan?
b) General Orlov?
By the films billing and screentime I think we're supposed to think it's Kamal Khan but I think General Orlov is the real threat in the film and the one who stands to gain the most from the evil operation.
3. The Living Daylights
a) Georgi Koskov?
b) Brad Whittaker?
They're both about equal although I think Koskov has a slight edge but Whitaker does get a memorable death scene(it reminded me of Scaramanga's demise in TMWTGG)
4. The World is Not Enough
a) Renard?
b) Elektra King?
I believe initially the viewer is supposed to think Renard is the main villain and Elektra is Bond's main love interest but in the end, Elektra turns out to be the main villain. An excellent twist on Bond cliches by the way, combining Bond's main leading lady and main villain in the same character.
5. Die Another Day
a) Colonel Moon?
b) Gustav Graves?
Colonel Moon and Gustav Graves are one and the same like Dr. Kananga and Mr. Big in LALD.
Another Homage maybe lol
Although Graves has more screen time than Colonel Moon I would say Colonel Moon since Graves is just the 2nd identity he takes on to fulfill Moon's main objective: to use the Icarus weapon to destroy the landmines in the DMZ, occupy South Korea and Japan and eventually the West(echoes of General Orlov's plot against Western Europe in OP).
1)Blofeld
He is a supervillain..he doesn't even die in the movie, or several movies for that matter. It doesn't seem as though that has happened since, for any villain (Jaws the exception.)
2)Kamal Khan
He dies well after Orlov, and the battle throughout the movie is clearly more between Khan and Bond. In the end Orlov is little more than a co-conspirator.
3)I am ashamed to admit that I can't remember who died last in TLD.
4)Toss-up...I think this could be the exception to my theory. Elektra did play a larger role in this...it seems she is using her body to manipulate Renard for her own purposes, and succeeds.
5)There is no other answer to this than they are one-in-the-same. Very interesting-perhaps it was a homage to LALD like you pointed out.
JB
In TMWTGG, Nick Nack doesn't die at all.
In Goldeneye, Boris dies (does being frozen count as dying?) after Trevelyan.
In TND, Stamper dies after Carver.
Nick Nack is Francisco Scaramanga's sidekick--he's not the principal villain in The Man With The Golden Gun:that's Scaramanga. Boris is a supporting character and the comedy relief in GoldenEye--the main villain in that film is Alec Trevelyan--the former 006,who is assisted by Xenia Onatopp.And in Tomorrow Never Dies,Eliot Carver is the principal villain-Stamper is merely his henchman.
As for the villain in Die Another Day?That's Colonel Moon.We see him at the start of the movie with his original face and we meet him again when Moon reappears with his new face in his guise as "Gustav Graves"--a character he creates in order to insinuate himself into British society and international prominence.Although he looks decidedly different from his original persona,Gustav Graves is really Colonel Moon.
And Elektra King is the real villain in The World is Not Enough.
2) Orlov is the one with the plot and he's the real threat, but based on what happens, and given the classic scenes (Bond vs. the main villain), I'd say Kamal Khan.
3)The main villain is not a great villain, but the film is spectacular. Koskov is just an idiot. A henchman. The real villain is Whittaker, but he's not that important.
4)In TWINE, for me, It's Elektra. She has the intellect and she controls Renard and Bond. Renard is a minor villain or a very important henchman. He's just an executioner, some kind of modern Grant.
5) I haven't seen DAD, but I know (unfortunatelly) that they are the same man. So, I can't give an oppinion about it.
From Argentina With Love.
1) This one was the first one that baffled me. Kronsteen had the plan, Klebb carried throught the plan, Grant was just a henchman, and Blofeld was in charge. Bolfeld, however was also in charge in Thunderball, but Largo carried out the operation. According to jamesbond.com, Klebb is the main villain, probably because she played the perfect mixture of active and commanding. She was the main villain in the novel. I believe she is in the movie as well.
2)Though General Orlov did have the plan and the most to gain, Khan pits himself against Bond and continues the plan after Orlov is dead. Khan is not the first villain to team up with someone who wants something more in order to get money. Goldfinger did this with Red China. Blofeld did this in YOLT with an unnamed foreign power (it seems to me to be the Chinese). Scaramanga was doing this until he killed Hai-Fat and stole his empire. He then tried to sell the empire. Kristatos did this with USSR. Elliot Carver did this with the shown-for-five-seconds General Chang. Khan was working with Orlov for financial gain and pit himself against Bond. He was also provided with a background and had some character development. Khan is the main villain. According to jamesbond.com, he is, also.
3)Now here is something interesting. We are looking at nothing less than an alliance. Whitaker seems powerful in one of his scenes, but Necros was the subordinate; Koskov treated him like a partner. That would be unusual for a Russian general if he was lower than Whitaker. Whitaker is definitely not working for Koskov, though. Character development and background were split between the two. Koskov, though he had no background, had major character development with James and Kara (esp. Kara). Whitaker had very little character development but Pushkin provides us with his background. According to jamesbond.com and myself, they are both officially villains.
4) Now here's something. I believe that Elektra King is the villain here. All the way through the first 90 minutes, we are led to believe that Renard is the main villain. Even when Bond finds Elektra is evil, he still refers to "Stockholm Syndrome". Once James Bond is in that less-than-comfortable-looking chair, however, he finds that Elektra was evil all along. She hated her father. When she was kidnapped, this was Renard's doing, but she manipulated Renard into working for her. The plot is for her cause, too. Interestingly, jamesbond.com, the official site, claims Renard is the main villain, however I believe they just didnt want to spoil the movie for you. Elektra was considered a main Bond girl, for this reason, too. Miranda Frost in DAD was called a main girl, too; for spoiler purposes, most likely.
5) Finally, something that can easily be explained. There is no Gustav Graves. He is a character made up to cover Colonel Moon's identity.
Whew.
2. Octopussy: There might have been an intention to make General Orlov a main villain, by making him a paranoiac megalomaniac, but he comes off as laughable and pathetic. Kamal on the other hand is suave and more villainesque, and most important... He is a bigger threat to Bond! Orlov risks Bond life only once, Kamal does it many more times!
3. The Living Daylights: Brad Whitakker. It is obvious that Koskov is working FOR him, not with him. Koskov ordered the weapons FROM him and he goes out to arrange the opium smuggling for his boss. This is going to be a stretch, but Whitakker is like Blofeld and Stromberg. He never takes a pice of the action, just "pushes the buttons." People may think the Koskov is the vilain because of Whitakker's limted screen time, but good old Brad has all the trademarks of a Bond villainy, most notably the megalomania (see Hitler & Co. statues)! Plus he dies, Koskov doesn't.
4. The World is Not Enough: Elektra King all the way! Firstly... if she is not a villain ,than we are left with only Rosa Klebb (shrug-shrug) as the pnly female villain. The pretty portray of Elektra would be missed from this glorious pantheon. Secondly, Renard is working FOR Elektra, carrying out her instruction and plans.
If you go with Renard, he definatly would be the most sentimental of all villains. Elektra is a cold-hearted, manipulative b***h and this makes her the PURRfect villain(nes). Why is Renard advertised as the main villain? Because it would ruin the huge surprise. (Something similar happened, when Topol was credited first in front of Julian Glover...)
Die Another Day: I don't know who mentioned this, but yes, this is very similar to the KAnanga/Big case. The difference is that while Kananga and Big lived in parallels, Gustav Graves is the second incarnation of Colonel Moon. I would say tihs IS a tie and the villain is: Gustav Graves as Colonel Moon!
1. This is definitely the hardest one. Blofeld is not, because of what the cat said and what I said earlier. Kronsteen made the plan, so that gives him a piece of the villain pie. Rosa Klebb, though she seemed like the main villain, she actually pretty much did nothing. She attacked Bond once, and she was used to disinform Tania. Red Grant definitely gets another piece because he carried out the operation. I believe there is only one way to solve this. There is no main villain, with the exception of SPECTRE itself.
2.General Orlov. He made the plan. Kamal Khan is being paid by him to carry out the plan, so I call him a henchman.
3.Brad Whitaker. Same thing as Octopussy here, but a bit harder.
4.Elektra King. See what I said before.
5.They are the same, but I call him Colonel Moon.
And Jimmy Bond and Dr Noah. That really doesn't make much sense - two Jimmy Bonds who are James Bond's nephews? David must really have a thing for that name.
Actually he does die in For Your Eyes Only.
I say Klebb. The main thing that rules Grant out here is that, as far as I can remember, Klebb is SHOWN Grant on SPECTRE Island. She does not MEET him. And she TESTS him. Just goes to show he's not the main villain (although he's not exactly a henchman either - just call him an operative). Now for that old chessmaster Kronsteen. Nice plan mate, but you're similar to Truman-Lodge when it comes to your part in the film. And finally, Ernst Stavro Blofeld. No way is he the main villain in this movie.
OCTOPUSSY
Well I can't truthfully say because I haven't seen Octopussy (ok I saw the first ten minutes or something when I was about seven years old). But I would say Kamal Khan.
THE LIVING DAYLIGHTS
Koskov. Why? HE was the one who got the British onto Pushkin in the first place. And HE tried to betray Whitaker after he was dead.
THE WORLD IS NOT ENOUGH
I would still say Renard. He was the one who kidnapped Elektra, he was the one who was willing to kill a million people for her. What a loveboat.
DIE ANOTHER DAY
Colonel Moon IS Gustav Graves, as we've all said before. But Colonel Moon is still the main villain. Don't you just hate Gustav Graves' teeth?
1. In From Russia with Love, I'd have to disagree and say that Grant was the villain there, though he was also a henchman...something unique. We've already agreed to rule out Kronsteen and Blofeld, so they're not going to be factored into it. Observing only Klebb and Grant, we see that Grant gets far more screen time, he actually meets Bond (formally, not just in a fight scene), he reveals the plan to Bond personally. Not to mention the choice of actor; Robert Shaw is a perfect selection for a Bond villain.
2. Kamal Khan is a weak villain overall (Octopussy is a weak movie overall in any case; the plot is a copy of Goldfinger), though I'd have to agree that he's the villain. While Orlov did have the more devious of the two plots, it wasn't as if he was controlling Khan...they were more like business partners, each with something to gain from the deal (simply because Goldfinger wanted to increase the value of his gold and Ling wanted economic chaos doesn't mean that Ling is more villanous).
3. This one is tough, because Whittaker gets far less screen time and hardly meets Bond at all, when Koskov is a cunning man who plays MI6 like a fiddle for the first chunk of the movie. However, Koskov is clearly weak as a villain (he admits that he likes James as a friend, and also is cowardly and snobbish), and Dr. No was obviously the main villain, and Bond barely met him before the end of the film. Whittaker is the villain.
4. It's not easy enough to simply point out who dies first...Elektra and Renard both play large roles in the movie. But judging by what bits and pieces are revealed in the film, and what can be gathered from Benson's novelization, I think we can see that Renard was actually weak and vulnerable inside, Elektra merely pulled the strings. She had the perfect setup for becoming the main villain...a relationship with Bond, and was intelligent and controlling; Renard was just a henchman.
5. Yes, they're the same (though for some reason, after Bond learns that Graves is Colonel Moon, he still refers to him as Graves while tlaking with M and Falco in South Korea...hmmm...)
Well I still say Koskov, although Whitaker's appearances on screen sort of did him up as the main villain.
Gustav Graves was the MAIN, and Colonel Moon was the VILLAIN. So if you put them together it makes MAIN VILLAIN. I was a little too precise before.
By your logic, Blofeld is the villain in TB, instead of Largo.
Here are my votes:
Grant, The villain needs to converse with Bond
Kahn, He was the one wh tried to flee, and he sacrificed other men, or would've had he fled
Whitiker http://www.ajb007.co.uk/index.php?topic=18368
Electra, Her money, Her plan. She also sacrificed other men.
Graves and Moon are the same.
they usually save the main villain's death
till the end.
After all, Goldfinger dies after Oddjob.
Kamal Khan dies after Orlov.
er, I'm done.
If so, than...
- Stamper would be the villain, because he is killed after Carver.
- OHMSS does not have a villain, because no one is killed... except for Tracy! She is the main villain! :O
FRWL - This one is very hard. It's either Grant or Klebb. Klebb is the one who recruits tatiana, and Grant. However, Grant is the one who has the relationship with Bond most. I would say Klebb...
OP - Kamal Khan. He has the chemistry and relationship with Bond. He has a bigger part. He is more intelligent. He is more of a threat. And the film isn't over until he is killed.
TLD - Koskov. Bigger part. More background to the character. He is the one you see at the begining of the film, faking the defection. He is the one who tries to get Pushkin killed. And he is the one with the relationship with Bond.
TWINE - This one is very hard. Elektra King though, because like Koskov in TLD, Elektra starts off pretending to be good, and double-crosses.
OP and TLD are easy for me, but FRWL and TWINE were harder.
1 - Moore, 2 - Dalton, 3 - Craig, 4 - Connery, 5 - Brosnan, 6 - Lazenby
2. Kamal Kahn is definitely the villain. He was Bond's opposition from the beginning and Bond went back to India get him in the end. He also kept going with their plot even after Orlov was dead. And once again, almost every website names him the main villain.
3. Now this is a difficult decision. The main villain could be either one of them. IMO, Whitaker is the villain. He may not have as much screen time as Koskov but he seems to be the master planner. Also, in the scenes with Whitaker and Koskov, Whitaker was giving orders to both Necros and Koskov and he seemed superior to Koskov. And at the end, Whitaker doesn't care about Koskov, he was gonna let bond have him if bond hadn't of destroyed the opium.
4. Now I believe that Elektra is the main villain because she controls Renard and she gains the most out of their arrangement.
5. They are the same person so they are both the villain. But I honestly prefer Graves over Moon.
That is what I think.