Interesting opinion from Pretty Famous .... But to me Connery has displayed more range as a Bond. He is like a Ferrari. Craig is good too and I like his performances, but he is like a Maserati, IMO -{
As Bond films, CR and SF are strong entries but it is hard to keep them in the top 5 as they both seem to lose steam towards the end (last 1/3rd or so)
LoeffelholzThe United States, With LovePosts: 8,998Quartermasters
Interesting opinion. But to me Connery has displayed more range as a Bond. He is like a Ferrari. Craig is good too and I like his performances, but he is like a Maserati, IMO -{
As Bond films, it is hard to rate CR and SF in the top 5 as they both seem to lose steam towards the end
CR cracks my top 5 by virtue of its many strengths---aside from the third act, which curiously shares the issue of an extended denouement with the Fleming novel.
Check out my Amazon author page!Mark Loeffelholz
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
CR cracks my top 5 by virtue of its many strengths---aside from the third act, which curiously shares the issue of an extended denouement with the Fleming novel.
Spot on - the 3rd act! .... One of key reasons why films like DAF are usually not rated higher is because of the weak 2nd half .... Objectively speaking, both CR and SF have weak last 1/3rd which prevents me to rate them in the top 5-7 .... But because of their strengths and weighing relative pros and cons, they can fit in nicely at other spots
IMO, Below are Bond films in their respective segments that have very few weaknesses relatively speaking:
Group A (Closer to Fleming's) - FRWL and OHMSS
Group B (OTT plot)- TSWLM
Group C (Different/Weird plot) - LALD
Group D (Others / Standard Formula) - DN and GF
Group E (Special mention) - TLD
I seriously still can't see why anyone could put AVTAK at the bottom. Most memorable villain, with some of the most memorable scenes.
Villian is great.
But honestly Ill say it again. Roger just looks to old for the role. It really shows. The fire truck scene for me was way to much. He could have reasoned with the police, nope ill steal a fire truck and race it through town.
The Bond girl is bad. Classic cliche dimwitted girl. And Moore is twice her age and it REALLY shows. Its like a dad saving his daughter. Its that bad.
It seemed like a lot of action that just wasn't necessary.
Visual effects to me were lackluster and at some points the stunt double is so obvious.
Although I do like Zorin, and I really like the Mine scene. That was fun.
Overall, to me its just a really forgettable film. Feels like a over the top 80's action movie. I will say the 80's were my least favorite decade for Bond.
The fire truck scene for me was way to much. He could have reasoned with the police, nope ill steal a fire truck and race it through town.
Umm, did you watch the film? He was about to be arrested for murder he didn't do as well as supposingly killed Howe and started a fire in City Hall. I don't think the police would have believed anything he said.
It seemed like a lot of action that just wasn't necessary.
Jarvio and MF, the biggest champions of AVTAK on this site.
"Hostile takeovers. Shall we?"
New 2020 ranking (for now DAF and FYEO keep their previous placements)
1. TLD 2. TND 3. GF 4. TSWLM 5. TWINE 6. OHMSS 7. LtK 8. TMWTGG 9. L&LD 10. YOLT 11. DAD 12. QoS 13. DN 14. GE 15. SF 16. OP 17. MR 18. AVTAK 19. TB 20. FRWL 21. CR 22. FYEO 23. DAF (SP to be included later)
Bond actors to be re-ranked later
I seriously still can't see why anyone could put AVTAK at the bottom. Most memorable villain, with some of the most memorable scenes.
Villian is great.
But honestly Ill say it again. Roger just looks to old for the role. It really shows. The fire truck scene for me was way to much. He could have reasoned with the police, nope ill steal a fire truck and race it through town.
The Bond girl is bad. Classic cliche dimwitted girl. And Moore is twice her age and it REALLY shows. Its like a dad saving his daughter. Its that bad.
It seemed like a lot of action that just wasn't necessary.
Visual effects to me were lackluster and at some points the stunt double is so obvious.
Although I do like Zorin, and I really like the Mine scene. That was fun.
Overall, to me its just a really forgettable film. Feels like a over the top 80's action movie. I will say the 80's were my least favorite decade for Bond.
The age gap never bothered me. To me, it's not that much different from Bond and Melina in FYEO. Also, age gaps between couples do exist. There were 33 years between my parents. Not common no, but it can and does happen.
I disagree about the fire engine chase though, basically for the reasons MF said, but also, the chase is very fun and memorable. And unnecessary action is all good if it is fun and memorable. Which the majority of AVTAK is for me.
Stunt doubles, ok, not AVTAK's strongest point, but the exact same can be said for many other bond films.
I can see how many think Stacey is bad, but meh, I liked her, and found her humerous. And she was hot too.
I always thought Stacey was your typical Bond girl, ok a damsel in distress and saved by Bond from the villain, but she did help with some of the exposition and the plot.
I always thought Stacey was your typical Bond girl, ok a damsel in distress and saved by Bond from the villain, but she did help with some of the exposition and the plot.
No, Stacy is very unique among Bond girls as she is the only one who is an ordinary person. She has a home, job, cat, car…. She's not a CIA agent or russian spy etc. She's very smart and helps Bond with geological information. She can believably defend herself with a rocksalt shotgun. She has high principles and refuses to sell out to Zorin. Overall, a very remarkable and likable woman.
I would agree her scream is too shrill, but she only yells out for "James" like x4 times. Hardly a constant annoyance like some detractors would have you believe.
My current 10 favorite:
1. GE 2. MR 3. OP 4. TMWTGG 5. TSWLM 6. TND 7. TWINE 8.DN 9. GF 10. AVTAK
No, Stacy is very unique among Bond girls as she is the only one who is an ordinary person. She has a home, job, cat, car…. She's not a CIA agent or russian spy etc. She's very smart and helps Bond with geological information. She can believably defend herself with a rocksalt shotgun. She has high principles and refuses to sell out to Zorin. Overall, a very remarkable and likable woman.
I would agree her scream is too shrill, but she only yells out for "James" like x4 times. Hardly a constant annoyance like some detractors would have you believe.
Great points Firemass. I have no problem with Stacey Sutton, infact I love the cast of AVTAK - Moore, Walken, Jones and Macnee are all on top form. -{
No, Stacy is very unique among Bond girls as she is the only one who is an ordinary person. She has a home, job, cat, car…. She's not a CIA agent or russian spy etc. She's very smart and helps Bond with geological information. She can believably defend herself with a rocksalt shotgun. She has high principles and refuses to sell out to Zorin. Overall, a very remarkable and likable woman.
I would agree her scream is too shrill, but she only yells out for "James" like x4 times. Hardly a constant annoyance like some detractors would have you believe.
BGs who are ordinary (Not CIA / KGB / MI6 / direct member of the gang) and generally innocent - Honey Rider, Domino, Tracey, Melina, Kara, Natalya, Jones, Solange, and Swann ..... Stacey character has not been acted / presented as well as some of the others so I would not be surprised if she be among the not-so popular BGs
No, Stacy is very unique among Bond girls as she is the only one who is an ordinary person. She has a home, job, cat, car…. She's not a CIA agent or russian spy etc. She's very smart and helps Bond with geological information. She can believably defend herself with a rocksalt shotgun. She has high principles and refuses to sell out to Zorin. Overall, a very remarkable and likable woman.
I would agree her scream is too shrill, but she only yells out for "James" like x4 times. Hardly a constant annoyance like some detractors would have you believe.
Great points Firemass. I have no problem with Stacey Sutton, infact I love the cast of AVTAK - Moore, Walken, Jones and Macnee are all on top form. -{
I always thought Stacey was your typical Bond girl, ok a damsel in distress and saved by Bond from the villain, but she did help with some of the exposition and the plot.
No, Stacy is very unique among Bond girls as she is the only one who is an ordinary person. She has a home, job, cat, car…. She's not a CIA agent or russian spy etc. She's very smart and helps Bond with geological information. She can believably defend herself with a rocksalt shotgun. She has high principles and refuses to sell out to Zorin. Overall, a very remarkable and likable woman.
I would agree her scream is too shrill, but she only yells out for "James" like x4 times. Hardly a constant annoyance like some detractors would have you believe.
When you talk about all of her strong points, she seems a lot more likeable.
BGs who are ordinary (Not CIA / KGB / MI6 / direct member of the gang) and generally innocent - Honey Rider, Domino, Tracey, Melina, Kara, Natalya, Jones, Solange, and Swann .....
I would say most of those ARE direct members of the gang, even though they might be innocent.
Honey is generally innocent, except she is more of a fantasy type character with her white bikini and knife. Not an ordinary 9-5 girl who gets all flustered after being fired at work.
Melina kills people with a cross bow. Not exactly the "girl next door"
I still think Stacey is unique in the sense of being realistic and ordinary.
My current 10 favorite:
1. GE 2. MR 3. OP 4. TMWTGG 5. TSWLM 6. TND 7. TWINE 8.DN 9. GF 10. AVTAK
Draco is not a villain. Though he is a crime boss, he is not Bond's enemy in any way. Columbo is a similar character (on Bond's side but has questionable morals), and Bond sleeps with his mistress.
I considered that and I do agree to an extent. However, Draco was the one dispatching thugs to get Bond in the PTS, hotel room, and then abducting him. All the fight scenes in the first half of the film were against Draco's men.
Plus, Draco knows where Blofeld is. Maybe even does business with him. Not your average guy.
My current 10 favorite:
1. GE 2. MR 3. OP 4. TMWTGG 5. TSWLM 6. TND 7. TWINE 8.DN 9. GF 10. AVTAK
This is my most current list. It's definitely an ever evolving ranking and it certainly has changed a lot over the last few years. I'll see if Spectre ends up somewhere else after a couple more viewings.
BGs who are ordinary (Not CIA / KGB / MI6 / direct member of the gang) and generally innocent - Honey Rider, Domino, Tracey, Melina, Kara, Natalya, Jones, Solange, and Swann .....
I would say most of those ARE direct members of the gang, even though they might be innocent.
Honey is generally innocent, except she is more of a fantasy type character with her white bikini and knife. Not an ordinary 9-5 girl who gets all flustered after being fired at work.
Melina kills people with a cross bow. Not exactly the "girl next door"
I still think Stacey is unique in the sense of being realistic and ordinary.
If we are trying to establish a connection, Stacey was connected to Zorin through business, iirc (don't see AVTAK much so a little hard to recollect) .... That is one of the reasons she could give Bond information
Melina was trying to avenge her parents death. That is what she explained to Bond and that Greek women avenge for their loved ones
Natalya worked with Boris who was a bad guy
Kara probably knew Koskav as someone in Russian military and not as a villain
And so on
So the characters are somehow connected to bad guys .... Most of the girls on the list are as or nearly as "innocent" as Stacey. And there appears to be little doubt over characters such as Jones. Therefore, if have to view Stacey as innocent, there are other candidates as well
Interesting discussion from the posts above for sure...
I would have to agree with the 80's being the best decade for Bond, followed closely by the 60's, then this decade.
This is my top ten, probably polarising, but I love these films...
1. For Your Eyes Only [1981]
2. On Her Majesty's Secret Service [1969]
3. The Living Daylights [1987]
4. From Russia With Love [1963]
5. Spectre [2015]
6. Licence To Kill [1989]
7. The Spy Who Loved Me [1977]
8. A View To A Kill [1985]
9. Skyfall [2012]
10. Dr No [1962]
My list has recently gone through quite a lot of change:
1. You Only Live Twice
2. The Spy Who Loved Me
3. Casino Royale
4. On Her Majesty's Secret Service
5. SkyFall
6. Licence To Kill
7. For Your Eyes Only
8. From Russia With Love
9. The Living Daylights
10. Goldfinger
11. GoldenEye
12. A View To A Kill
13. SPECTRE
14. Moonraker
15. Octopussy
16. Dr. No
17. The World Is Not Enough
18. Tomorrow Never Dies
19. Die Another Day
20. Thunderball
21. Diamonds Are Forever
22. Live And Let Die
23. The Man with the Golden Gun
24. Quantum Of Solace
If Never Say Never Again is included, it would go right after DAF, at # 22
Comments
Interesting opinion from Pretty Famous .... But to me Connery has displayed more range as a Bond. He is like a Ferrari. Craig is good too and I like his performances, but he is like a Maserati, IMO -{
As Bond films, CR and SF are strong entries but it is hard to keep them in the top 5 as they both seem to lose steam towards the end (last 1/3rd or so)
CR cracks my top 5 by virtue of its many strengths---aside from the third act, which curiously shares the issue of an extended denouement with the Fleming novel.
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
Spot on - the 3rd act! .... One of key reasons why films like DAF are usually not rated higher is because of the weak 2nd half .... Objectively speaking, both CR and SF have weak last 1/3rd which prevents me to rate them in the top 5-7 .... But because of their strengths and weighing relative pros and cons, they can fit in nicely at other spots
IMO, Below are Bond films in their respective segments that have very few weaknesses relatively speaking:
Group A (Closer to Fleming's) - FRWL and OHMSS
Group B (OTT plot)- TSWLM
Group C (Different/Weird plot) - LALD
Group D (Others / Standard Formula) - DN and GF
Group E (Special mention) - TLD
{[]
1. OHMSS
2. TB
3. GF
4. FRWL
5 .CR
6. Dr No
7. TSWLM
8. SF
9. LD
10.TND
11.TWINE
12. LALD
13. LTK
14. YOLT
15. TMWTGG
16. GE
17. QoS
18. FYEO
19. DAD
20 .MR
21. SP
22. DAF
23 .OP
24. AVTAK
Bottom half dozen are interchangeable.
1 - Moore, 2 - Dalton, 3 - Craig, 4 - Connery, 5 - Brosnan, 6 - Lazenby
Choose between them, and in my opinion AVTAK is a lot of fun. -{
Villian is great.
But honestly Ill say it again. Roger just looks to old for the role. It really shows. The fire truck scene for me was way to much. He could have reasoned with the police, nope ill steal a fire truck and race it through town.
The Bond girl is bad. Classic cliche dimwitted girl. And Moore is twice her age and it REALLY shows. Its like a dad saving his daughter. Its that bad.
It seemed like a lot of action that just wasn't necessary.
Visual effects to me were lackluster and at some points the stunt double is so obvious.
Although I do like Zorin, and I really like the Mine scene. That was fun.
Overall, to me its just a really forgettable film. Feels like a over the top 80's action movie. I will say the 80's were my least favorite decade for Bond.
Umm, did you watch the film? He was about to be arrested for murder he didn't do as well as supposingly killed Howe and started a fire in City Hall. I don't think the police would have believed anything he said.
As it is with a lot of Bond films.
1.AVTAK
2.LTK
3.FYEO
4.OP
5.GE
6.SF
7.TSWLM
8.GF
9.LALD
10.MR
11.SPECTRE
12.TND
13.CR (06)
14.TMWTGG
15.TLD
16.DAF
17.YOLT
18.FRWL
19.TWINE
20.DAD
21.NSNA
22.QoS
23.OHMSS
24.TB
25.DN
26.CR (67)
An unique list!
New 2020 ranking (for now DAF and FYEO keep their previous placements)
1. TLD 2. TND 3. GF 4. TSWLM 5. TWINE 6. OHMSS 7. LtK 8. TMWTGG 9. L&LD 10. YOLT 11. DAD 12. QoS 13. DN 14. GE 15. SF 16. OP 17. MR 18. AVTAK 19. TB 20. FRWL 21. CR 22. FYEO 23. DAF (SP to be included later)
Bond actors to be re-ranked later
The age gap never bothered me. To me, it's not that much different from Bond and Melina in FYEO. Also, age gaps between couples do exist. There were 33 years between my parents. Not common no, but it can and does happen.
I disagree about the fire engine chase though, basically for the reasons MF said, but also, the chase is very fun and memorable. And unnecessary action is all good if it is fun and memorable. Which the majority of AVTAK is for me.
Stunt doubles, ok, not AVTAK's strongest point, but the exact same can be said for many other bond films.
I can see how many think Stacey is bad, but meh, I liked her, and found her humerous. And she was hot too.
1 - Moore, 2 - Dalton, 3 - Craig, 4 - Connery, 5 - Brosnan, 6 - Lazenby
No, Stacy is very unique among Bond girls as she is the only one who is an ordinary person. She has a home, job, cat, car…. She's not a CIA agent or russian spy etc. She's very smart and helps Bond with geological information. She can believably defend herself with a rocksalt shotgun. She has high principles and refuses to sell out to Zorin. Overall, a very remarkable and likable woman.
I would agree her scream is too shrill, but she only yells out for "James" like x4 times. Hardly a constant annoyance like some detractors would have you believe.
1. GE 2. MR 3. OP 4. TMWTGG 5. TSWLM 6. TND 7. TWINE 8.DN 9. GF 10. AVTAK
Great points Firemass. I have no problem with Stacey Sutton, infact I love the cast of AVTAK - Moore, Walken, Jones and Macnee are all on top form. -{
BGs who are ordinary (Not CIA / KGB / MI6 / direct member of the gang) and generally innocent - Honey Rider, Domino, Tracey, Melina, Kara, Natalya, Jones, Solange, and Swann ..... Stacey character has not been acted / presented as well as some of the others so I would not be surprised if she be among the not-so popular BGs
Agreed.
"And I thought that creep loved me!!!"
"Better make that two."
When you talk about all of her strong points, she seems a lot more likeable.
I would say most of those ARE direct members of the gang, even though they might be innocent.
Domino - Villain's girlfriend
Tracey - Villain's daughter
Kara - Villain's girlfriend
Solange- Villain's girlfriend
Swann - Villain's daughter
Honey is generally innocent, except she is more of a fantasy type character with her white bikini and knife. Not an ordinary 9-5 girl who gets all flustered after being fired at work.
Melina kills people with a cross bow. Not exactly the "girl next door"
I still think Stacey is unique in the sense of being realistic and ordinary.
1. GE 2. MR 3. OP 4. TMWTGG 5. TSWLM 6. TND 7. TWINE 8.DN 9. GF 10. AVTAK
Draco is not a villain. Though he is a crime boss, he is not Bond's enemy in any way. Columbo is a similar character (on Bond's side but has questionable morals), and Bond sleeps with his mistress.
I considered that and I do agree to an extent. However, Draco was the one dispatching thugs to get Bond in the PTS, hotel room, and then abducting him. All the fight scenes in the first half of the film were against Draco's men.
Plus, Draco knows where Blofeld is. Maybe even does business with him. Not your average guy.
1. GE 2. MR 3. OP 4. TMWTGG 5. TSWLM 6. TND 7. TWINE 8.DN 9. GF 10. AVTAK
1. SF
2. FRWL
3. OHMSS
4. YOLT
5. CR
6. DN
7. GF
8. TLD
9. TB
10. GE
11. QoS
12. SP
13. OP
15. TSWLM
16. TMWTGG
17. LTK
18. DAF
19. FYEO
20. LALD
If we are trying to establish a connection, Stacey was connected to Zorin through business, iirc (don't see AVTAK much so a little hard to recollect) .... That is one of the reasons she could give Bond information
Melina was trying to avenge her parents death. That is what she explained to Bond and that Greek women avenge for their loved ones
Natalya worked with Boris who was a bad guy
Kara probably knew Koskav as someone in Russian military and not as a villain
And so on
So the characters are somehow connected to bad guys .... Most of the girls on the list are as or nearly as "innocent" as Stacey. And there appears to be little doubt over characters such as Jones. Therefore, if have to view Stacey as innocent, there are other candidates as well
I would have to agree with the 80's being the best decade for Bond, followed closely by the 60's, then this decade.
This is my top ten, probably polarising, but I love these films...
1. For Your Eyes Only [1981]
2. On Her Majesty's Secret Service [1969]
3. The Living Daylights [1987]
4. From Russia With Love [1963]
5. Spectre [2015]
6. Licence To Kill [1989]
7. The Spy Who Loved Me [1977]
8. A View To A Kill [1985]
9. Skyfall [2012]
10. Dr No [1962]
Honourable Mentions: Goldfinger and Octopussy
1. Dalton 2. Moore 3. Connery 4. Lazenby 5. Craig 6. Brosnan
1 - AVTAK (10/10)
2 - LTK (10/10)
3 - OP (10/10)
4 - LALD (10/10)
5 - FYEO (9.5/10)
6 - SF (9.5/10)
7 - GE (9/10)
8 - OHMSS (9/10)
9 - DN (8.5/10)
10 - DAF (8.5/10)
11 - SP (8.5/10)
12 - TMWTGG (8.5/10)
13 - TSWLM (8/10)
14 - TLD (8/10)
15 - MR (7.5/10)
16 - YOLT (7.5/10)
17 - GF (7/10)
18 - QOS (7/10)
19 - DAD (7/10)
20 - FRWL (6.5/10)
21 - TND (6.5/10)
22 - TWINE (6.5/10)
23 - TB (6.5/10)
24 - CR (6/10)
1 - Moore, 2 - Dalton, 3 - Craig, 4 - Connery, 5 - Brosnan, 6 - Lazenby
1. You Only Live Twice
2. The Spy Who Loved Me
3. Casino Royale
4. On Her Majesty's Secret Service
5. SkyFall
6. Licence To Kill
7. For Your Eyes Only
8. From Russia With Love
9. The Living Daylights
10. Goldfinger
11. GoldenEye
12. A View To A Kill
13. SPECTRE
14. Moonraker
15. Octopussy
16. Dr. No
17. The World Is Not Enough
18. Tomorrow Never Dies
19. Die Another Day
20. Thunderball
21. Diamonds Are Forever
22. Live And Let Die
23. The Man with the Golden Gun
24. Quantum Of Solace
If Never Say Never Again is included, it would go right after DAF, at # 22
1. Roger 2. Timmy 3. Connery 4. Craig 5. George 6. Pierce