Bond's Political Affiliations

DAWUSS

OK, I know we're heading into fine-line controversyland (eventually, you know it's coming when this thread goes off-topic), but I'm just curious as to what you think Bond's political affiliations are. Is he more of a right-wing conservative or a left-wing liberal or a moderate of some sort?

canoe2

Right-wing conservative. Queen and country and all that. Although, I think that any inept government, right or left wing, that allowed disorder, scandal, or didn't release the need for men like himself would annoy Bond. He probably fights for and believes in the "idea" of Britain, more than the reality of it.

Hardyboy

This is tough to say. Bond's creator was a conservative who held on to old-fashioned ideas about "Rule Britannia" while the Empire was fading away, and I would imagine that informs the literary Bond's thinking. However, I think an important element of Bond's character is that he is a servant of the government and not of any particular party, and it's the government itself that claims his loyalties. Just as there are soldiers who loyally serve the government even though they can't stand the party in power, I think Bond willingly does as his government asks--whether he's commanded by a left-winger or a right-winger.

The Cat

Hardyboy wrote:

This is tough to say. Bond's creator was a conservative who held on to old-fashioned ideas about "Rule Britannia" while the Empire was fading away, and I would imagine that informs the literary Bond's thinking. However, I think an important element of Bond's character is that he is a servant of the government and not of any particular party, and it's the government itself that claims his loyalties. Just as there are soldiers who loyally serve the government even though they can't stand the party in power, I think Bond willingly does as his government asks--whether he's commanded by a left-winger or a right-winger.

What a great topic! Something that has been bugging me is the question, whether the literary Bond ever conflicted with 'politics' Fleming or continuaition authors. I know the movies have some spotty 'cameos' like the Margaret Thatcher parody or Freddy Gray, who doesn't seem to care who's governing the country, he is still there. Now that I think about it, Bond seems to be rather apolitical considering that he works 'for the government.'

Hugo Drax

I would say that James Bond is somewhat politically apathetic. He's seen governments come and go, he follows their orders whoever is in power.

Bond's allegiance is to Queen and Country. However, I don't think this automatically makes him a conservative.

Sir Hillary Bray

Hugo Drax wrote:

I would say that James Bond is somewhat politically apathetic. He's seen governments come and go, he follows their orders whoever is in power.

Bond's allegiance is to Queen and Country. However, I don't think this automatically makes him a conservative.

Thank you, Hugo -- you took the words out of my mouth (keyboard?). Bond's loyalty seems to be to the country, not the party running it. Perhaps Fleming deliberately drew him that way.

canoe2

Hugo Drax wrote:

I would say that James Bond is somewhat politically apathetic. He's seen governments come and go, he follows their orders whoever is in power.

Bond's allegiance is to Queen and Country. However, I don't think this automatically makes him a conservative.

I don't think it makes him apathetic at all. I'm sure he gets upset that the government can't control striking workers, or that let the Empire disolve. "Queen and Country" is inherently imperialistic, conservative and right wing: maintain the status quo and all that. IMO, this is a man who believes that Britain should still be at the top, regardless of the reality. Trevalyan crashing the computers in England was going to cause a "world-wide financial melt-down" afterall.

MBE_

"Governments change, the lies remain the same."

-James Bond, GoldenEye

Bond is a public servant and while he believes he serves the greater interest in saving the world from destructive murdering megolamanics, I've never seen him as political or pushing a certain party's agenda. In the films (and really the books) he's fought terrorists not nations -- he's hardly the banner boy for imperialism.

MBE

canoe2

Yes, but he fights them on behalf of an ideal of "for Queen and Country" and this is a distinctly imperialistic statement. I don't mean he's right wing in relation to his associations to a particular political party, but in the sense of where he believes Britain should be. Just because he is fed up with the political system doesn't mean he is apolitical. He probably doesn't think that any political party is worthy of his support.

Hugo Drax

Sir Hillary Bray wrote:

Thank you, Hugo -- you took the words out of my mouth (keyboard?).

I took the words from under your fingers maybe?

Canoe, I disagree that Bond's allegiance to 'Queen and Country' makes him a right-wing, conservative. I don't believe this makes him an imperalist either. Patriotism and imperialism are two different things. I would describe myself as a patriot, I love my country. But I certainly don't yearn for the days of Empire.

Tee Hee

It could go either way.

Bond would probably be a member of the NRA, owning a Walther PPK and all. Also, we saw how he handled Mr. Wint & Mr. Kidd, so I think we can safely assume he wouldn't support gay marriage. In this case, I see him as a conservative.

However, Bond has a sexually spontaneous lifestyle. I think its pretty safe to say that if during one of his usual sexual ventures he became a father, he might find an abortion an acceptable solution. Of course, in this case he would be a liberal.

Well, hopefully he made the smart choice and is a Republican.

taity

Id say politically conservative - he loves all English society -Queen, old racing cars ect. Yet at the same time shows no interest in the capitalist wealth in england - Drax, Goldfinger ect.

Id say hes conservative to his idea of Britian, and lets not all forget some of the descriptions used to describe the vast majority of the characters in Live and let die.

canoe2

Hugo Drax wrote:

Sir Hillary Bray wrote:

Thank you, Hugo -- you took the words out of my mouth (keyboard?).

I took the words from under your fingers maybe?

Canoe, I disagree that Bond's allegiance to 'Queen and Country' makes him a right-wing, conservative. I don't believe this makes him an imperalist either. Patriotism and imperialism are two different things. I would describe myself as a patriot, I love my country. But I certainly don't yearn for the days of Empire.

Maybe you don't think it does, but in many areas of the world Britain over which once held domain, the saying is certainly is still associated with imperialism. It is a very specific statement that references a very specific period of time. I didn't use it to relate it to modern patriotism, which I think is a different thing. I also think that Bond (at least in his literary form and early to mid-film incarnations: Moore was doing a great British Raj routine in OP) would have supported a more imperialistic Britain. I would say that Brosnan's Bond is more patriotic than "Queen and Country", and possibly more apolitical.

Barbel

Kingsley Amis makes a stab at this subject at the start of Chapter 10 of "The James Bond Dossier", and quotes a (now slightly dated) piece of Fleming from the end of DN (Cape, p247). The previous chapter has a few good points, too.

canoe2

I have to disagree with that: It's not Bond's attraction to the finer things in life that is important; it's which ones he is attracted to and why. Up until Brosnan, almost all of Bond's choices reflected the snobbery of the British upper-middle to upper class, and had been maintained as a means of seperating themselves from the masses. I find that to be a very conservative attitude. Think about his clothing alone ( and see article three of Bill Tanner's excellent series!).

I agree that Bond's attitudes towards sex could be seen as very liberal, but I think this is a little misleading: he likes to keep his affairs very private (except when Q decides to come snooping around ) and very rarely uses PDA's (except for that unfortunate jump into the pool in LTK). His attitudes about male and female stereotypes are very traditional. Sex to Bond is the same as a massage, not because he is liberal about it, but because he refuses to invest any emotion in the act. It just relieves stress.

I'm trying to use "conservative" in the traditional British sense, not in the neo-American "religious-right" way and not as a substitute for patriotism.

Robinson

I think its also significant that Bond lives in the electoral constituency of Kensington and Chelsea. This is the safest seat for the Conservative Party in the entire country.

Trust me, he is a blue!

Ark Royal

Oh...I should say Conservative. Most Upper Middle Class characters from Fleming's era of literature and indeed in real life , and even today in Britain , are by inclination , eight times out of ten , vote Conservative in elections. Bond's not an extremist , just a moderate ordinary Conservative.

Trust me , he's true blue.

Klaus Hergescheimer

On the point of his sexual liberation, I don't think that's really valid when looking at his political leanings. Conservative and liberal, atheist and religious right, capitalist or socialist: whatever their political leanings, all heterosexual men want sex, and lots of it, from very attractive women. And there are tons of examples of such politicians from all ideological persuasion or party affiliation who have very loose sexual lives. Heck, let's just go back to the time of the Clinton Administration in the US: Clinton was having his, but pretty much every Republican leader in Congress was getting plenty of sex from women not their wives, as well. Newt Gingrich, the Speaker of the House, and Bob Livingston, the guy who was about to become Speaker of the House, both resigned because they were having extramarital affairs that were about to become hot news while the impeachment proceedings were going on. One other name I would like to bring up from the right who had trouble keeping his snake in his cage, with which our English mates may be familiar:

Winston, anyone?

With this established, we should not even consider this point.

Personally, I would definitely say that Bond, at least the literary character, is a Conservative/Tory. He is a patriot through and through and very much one who cherishes and believes all of the tradition and rhetoric of "Queen and Country," a strongly nationalistic trait that is seen much more often in right-wingers than left-wingers. Furthermore, he is described as having a number of very conservative social attitudes: toward women, toward minorities, etc.. I don't recall a time in the text when he expresses support for a particular politician or party, but this is what I would derive from what I have read.

On film, I see pretty much all of them being conservatives, with the exception of Moore.

7289

I would observe that the film Bonds have no politics, and that this is quite deliberate. The literary oo7, does but keeps them to himself - an outburst to Tiger Tanaka in Chapter 8 of "You Only Live Twice" gives us Bonds take on Britian of the early 1960's.

"England may have been bled pretty thin by a couple of world wars, our welfare-state politics may have made us expect too much for free, and the liberation of our colonies may have gone too fast, but we still climb Everest and beat plenty of the world at plenty of sports and win Nobel prizes. Our politicians may be a feather-pated bunch, but I expect yours are too. All politicians are. But there is nothing wrong with the British people - although there are only 50 million of them."

James F E

Tee Hee wrote:

It could go either way.

Bond would probably be a member of the NRA, owning a Walther PPK and all. Also, we saw how he handled Mr. Wint & Mr. Kidd, so I think we can safely assume he wouldn't support gay marriage. In this case, I see him as a conservative.

However, Bond has a sexually spontaneous lifestyle. I think its pretty safe to say that if during one of his usual sexual ventures he became a father, he might find an abortion an acceptable solution. Of course, in this case he would be a liberal.

Well, hopefully he made the smart choice and is a Republican.

i don't think he's a Republican, because he cares about the greater good for all of GB.Also he doesn't go into things half-@$$ed, to help his oil buddies. Now who does do that?

7289

This should be about Bond's or Fleming's politics and in that we are talking about the early pre Beatles/Vietnam 1960's ... not today's preceptions of our current "feather-pated policitians".

Bringing this around to discussions about oil wells and guns is pointless and will cause this thread to become as amusing as a night with LeChiffre and his rope.......

Loeffelholz

I think Fleming's Bond is essentially a traditionalist, but he's also a pragmatist. There is a passage or two in the novels (TSWLM, perhaps) where his utterances betray at least a hint of empathy for elements of the Left (though one must wonder whether he was merely playing to Ms. Michelle... :v ).

Still and all, I think he remains---despite his occasional rebellion against authority---an 'Establishment' man. I'm reminded of his current dossier, from the official CR website, where his psychological evaluation is quoted:

"Most importantly, Bond is deeply loyal to institutions. After his parents' death, Bond embraced his British and Scottish roots. His concept of his nationality is a large part of his indentity. This is reflected in some his social attitudes, which seem to embrace a British identity of the not too distant past. When pressed, Bond seems to identify with the notion of helping to 'protect the realm', of 'serving the monarch' and the ideals embodied in the mythic notion of St. George."

7289

Loeffelholz wrote:

... I'm reminded of his current dossier, from the official CR website, where his psychological evaluation is quoted:

"... Bond is deeply loyal to institutions... When pressed, Bond seems to identify with the notion of helping to 'protect the realm', of 'serving the monarch' and the ideals embodied in the mythic notion of St. George."

Prehaps that is why Fleming gave Bond the Companion of St. Michael and St. George, some not so subtle symbolism.

The Eon Bio seems "spot on"....though I am suspicious of Bond "embracing" his Scottish roots. Seems like a nod to Connery to me, and Daniel Craig doesn't appear all that much a Scot. But if memory serves even the literary Bond did not become a Scot until Fleming met Connery.

Lazenby880

Interesting that most people seem to think Bond is a rather conservative character as Fleming himself thought the contrary: "He’s certainly got little in the way of politics, but I should think what politics he has are just a little bit left of centre" (Ian Fleming interview, Playboy, 1964).

Personally I think Bond is a fairly unpolitical character. Part of this is because I don't see him having rationally thought out political opinions; part of this is due to Fleming's inconsistencies as a writer. Sometimes Bond might suggest an opinion thought to be generally of the right, sometimes Bond might suggest an opinion of the leftish variety. I do not think Bond as a character gives it much thought, like most British people.

There are instances one could use to demonstrate ostensible conservatism, which Kingsley Amis does in the superlative James Bond Dossier. On the other hand, Bond argues against Captain Troop's stereotypical view of intellectuals and homosexuals in From Russia with Love (Chapter 11, The Soft Life). Troop accuses Bond of wanting to "staff the organisation with long-haired perverts". Not the instinct of a true blue, then.

Complicating matters further is that the conservatism dominant in British politics in the 1950s was pragmatic and actually quite progressive. Macmillan was the perfect pragmatist, as were the leading lights of what was called the 'new Conservatism' such as Rab Butler and Iain Macleod. Nevertheless, by temperament and general outlook I think Bond defies pigeon-holing like most people: Bond might have Tory views in some respects, Lefty views in others, liberal (in the British sense) views in others still. Overall, I don't think he is much of a decidedly political character.

7289

Lazenby880 puts forward some good points, and it is important to remember that "left of center" in 1964 does not mean the same thing today.

Captain Troop who Fleming describes as a a "lighting rod for all the usual office hates and fears" becomes a target of opportunity for Bond who is suffering from the dreaded soft life. Enjoying his status as a senior officer, temporarily assigned to the Committee of Inquiry" oo7 "Perversely, and knowing it would annoy" stirs it up with Troop. He does not plead for the service to hire "homosexuals". Bond merely suggests that the service should employ "a certain number of intellectuals" whom Troop dismisses as "long haired perverts".

Bond is reasonably suggesting that "retired officers of the Indian Army" are not likey to win the confidence of a Burgess or Maclean. In this instance it is Troop's misplaced desire to keep the SIS "shipshape and Bristol fashion" that is out of step with the times.

JADE66

Bond is, more than anything else, a Royalist and then an individualist. Aside from his remarks to Vivienne Michelle(undoubtedly a grateful nod to J.F.K. for declaring that From Russia with Love was one of his favorite books) Bond is a 'What's Best for England' man. He doesn't care for feather pated politicos and he admires independence in others. This is not someone who wants the government in every facet of his life.
Although he works for the government he lives his own life apart from it. A welfare state would be the last thing he wanted. His politics, I would say are more in keeping with a Reagan era kind of conservatism in which the government stays out of people's private lives and the military and intelligence services exist to protect rights, not to suppress them.
That said, he is very loyal to the Crown and the notion of Empire. Yet he would not accept a knighthood(The Man with the Golden Gun, novel).
In the end, if someone were to ask him, he would probably say "None of your business."
Bond is a British John Wayne, politically speaking. Let him live his life and he''ll let you live yours.-{

7289

A British John Wayne.....I never thought of Bond in that way.....hmmmmm!

TOOTS

Bond is a Green Party supporter, I thought. He has a fuel efficient Saab 900 Turbo and saves the world from nuclear power plant meltdowns in the books.

taity

Theres a party called Family First in Australia. Theyre pretty much those crazy Christians that no one pays attention to. I think bond would vote with them.