I'm still undecided about the look. A little too grungy for my tastes and the hands are clearly flesh-colored. We'll have to see how it fits into the finished movie (gotta keep remembering to say that).
NightshooterIn bed with SolitairePosts: 2,917MI6 Agent
I love that outfit though. The face is pretty strange but I think it could work. And it has looked slightly less grunge-y in other pics, so I'm not gonna worry.
RogueAgentSpeeding in the Tumbler...Posts: 3,676MI6 Agent
edited November 2007
Thanks for the link, Tony.
I like it actually...not Neal Adams' Joker from the comics which is my favorite but this incarnation fits well with Nolan's swelled sense of plausibility.
Looks good.
Mrs. Man Face: "You wouldn't hit a lady? Would you?"
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice isUNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
I much prefer the look from Empire. Wizard has Ledger looking like he's playing a horror film character.
"He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
I much prefer the look from Empire. Wizard has Ledger looking like he's playing a horror film character.
You know what the problem is with all these pictures of the Joker? He doesn't look or act funny in any of them. There has to be a humorous element to the character, even if it is darkly humorous. And I haven't seen that yet anywhere in the photos released so far or what I've read about his capers. Ledger just looks like a psycho with white makeup.
I also still don't get all the blotches on the face. Is that supposed to be his real skin showing thru the white makeup? I know Nolan is angling for a different look but I can't say that I care for it at all. I just can't get past the fact that his "white" skin is just makeup. Hopefully he gets bleached for real at some point in the film because if he just wears white makeup throughout, then that's a MAJOR departure from the book and would probably ruin the character for me.
Maybe it will work when I finally see it assembled and in motion. 8-)
RogueAgentSpeeding in the Tumbler...Posts: 3,676MI6 Agent
edited November 2007
Well I know the gist of why Nolan is taking this turn with the character and all isn't what it seems if my info is correct.
I understand it's normal to take it at face value but what Batman villian was truly honest-looking to the franchise?
Catwoman came the closest and that's it.
Burton's Penguin neither looked nor was portrayed as the one from the comics or the old tv shows. He was rather freakish & vulgar as a matter of fact. The one from the 90s cartoon was more spot on - polished and refined yet lethal. Even Burgess Meredith was better than DeVito's. That doesn't mean that I don't love BR because I do.
Schumacher's Riddler was played like - well - Jim Carrey. 8-) That's not the Nigma I know.
Don't even get me started on his Two-Face.
And as much as I LOVE Jack's version of Joker, his performance was a little too silly all the time, plus he was pot-gut. Joker's lean.
Also, Mr. Freeze doesn't make jokes. Was he ever done wrong.
Believe me, I want the look and attitude from the comics more than anyone here but you all know how these directors tick with this creative freedom.
The movie will do just fine.
Mrs. Man Face: "You wouldn't hit a lady? Would you?"
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice isUNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
You know what the problem is with all these pictures of the Joker? He doesn't look or act funny in any of them. There has to be a humorous element to the character, even if it is darkly humorous. And I haven't seen that yet anywhere in the photos released so far or what I've read about his capers. Ledger just looks like a psycho with white makeup.
I think that on the Empire cover, Joker does look like he has a sense of humour. That said, I'm rather disappointed that Ledger's Joker doesn't look at all like the Jokers I grew up with (TV show, Nicholson) at all. I loved the Joker from the TV show, and I'm a massive fan of Nicholson's Joker. I think he was brilliant. Althoigh Ledger is a very good actor, the one thing that is against him is that IMO neither Nicholson nor the Joker from the TV show looked like a cross between Michael Myers and your 'freak of the week.' (I'm referring mostly to the Wizard cover. Although I don't love his look on the Empire cover, I think that Joker's look on it isn't all that terrible.)
"He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
Tee HeeCBT Headquarters: Chicago, ILPosts: 917MI6 Agent
Now I like the Wizard pic.
Ledger's definitely got the look down. But what about the personality? Well, if it was indeed Ledger laughing in the teaser, then I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt.
I'm really anxious to see Ledger in character. Before I couldn't imagine Ledger playing the Joker. Now I can. From the beginning, Ledger seemed to be a peculiar choice. But sometimes the actor you least expect to play a certain character really surprises you. For instance, I thought Kelsey Grammer did a excellent job as The Beast in X3: The Last Stand.
I have a feeling Heath Ledger is destined for greatness as well...
"My acting range? Left eyebrow raised, right eyebrow raised..."
Well I know the gist of why Nolan is taking this turn with the character and all isn't what it seems if my info is correct.
I understand it's normal to take it at face value but what Batman villian was truly honest-looking to the franchise?
Just to be clear, I haven't read the script to B:TDK so my comments are just based on what I've seen and read so far. If Nolan has a few surprises up his sleeve, that's great.
Although, I have to disagree with you on the look of prior Batman villains. Other than Penguin, just about every other villain was instantly recognizable when compared to their 4 color counterparts. I know you didn't care for Tommy Lee Jones or Jim Carrey but at least they looked like they were supposed to most of the time. Same goes for Nicholson (other than the paunch, which we can't control) - he looked and acted the part, even if he did get carried away, and his big scheme (gassing Gotham for the fun of it and everyone dieing with a smile on their lips) was worthy of the Joker.
I guess my other problem is that I'm really tiring of the look that Nolan is bringing to these films. If I step back and think about it for more than a couple of minutes, I quickly get down on everything from the look of the Joker to Batman's Tron suit and other hardware to the mundane Gotham they all inhabit. The situations may be truer to the books than Burton's and Schumaker's movies but the appearance of the characters and the world they live in is just a hurdle I have a harder and harder time getting over. This is a movie, not real life. It's OK for Batman to have the black and yellow symbol on his chest and it's OK for him to drive a sleek batmobile.
It really ****es me off that John Favreau was able to give me an Iron Man who looked like he just jumped off the cover of one of his comics with seemingly no effort at all, while Nolan gives me a Batman where I can barely see the bat on his chest.
The situations may be truer to the books than Burton's and Schumaker's movies but the appearance of the characters and the world they live in is just a hurdle I have a harder and harder time getting over. This is a movie, not real life.
Indeed. One thing that annoys me about Nolan is that he seems to believe that in order for a film to be convincing, it must be 'realistic.' I think that's nonsence. Superman was extremely convincing to me, and was more so than the Paul Haggis film Crash. The reason is that although Superman wasn't realistic, it convinced me that it was realistic within the world that was the film. Crash did not convince me that it was realistic within any world.
I can believe in invincible aliens who fly, young men who attain the abilities of spiders, scientists who are as fast as lightning and a billionaire who dresses up as a bat and fight a criminal who loves to laugh. However what will make me believe is not how realistic these people are within our world but how realistic they are within their world. In order to do it, all it requires is good quality filmmaking and a director's belief in these people.
Exactly. I've mentioned this before, but I will be really disappointed if Bruce (a billionaire) can't get a sleek batmobile in The Dark Knight.
"He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
I'll dive into this one, as I know nothing about Batman...
I have an early neg review of Batman Begins on imdb. Lots of snippy fans did not find it 'helpful'... But yes, I found it too 'realistic' and it doesn't really work for me. But that's the action genre influence of Die Hard really... You either take it seriously or you end up with another Bruce film, The Fifth Element...
I found Jack's Joker to be always on the back foot with the Caped Crusader, like he was out of his depth and puzzled a lot of the time. Hope they keep to one villain this time. If I go see it.
"This is where we leave you Mr Bond."
Roger Moore 1927-2017
RogueAgentSpeeding in the Tumbler...Posts: 3,676MI6 Agent
Well I know the gist of why Nolan is taking this turn with the character and all isn't what it seems if my info is correct.
I understand it's normal to take it at face value but what Batman villian was truly honest-looking to the franchise?
Just to be clear, I haven't read the script to B:TDK so my comments are just based on what I've seen and read so far. If Nolan has a few surprises up his sleeve, that's great.
Although, I have to disagree with you on the look of prior Batman villains. Other than Penguin, just about every other villain was instantly recognizable when compared to their 4 color counterparts. I know you didn't care for Tommy Lee Jones or Jim Carrey but at least they looked like they were supposed to most of the time. Same goes for Nicholson (other than the paunch, which we can't control) - he looked and acted the part, even if he did get carried away, and his big scheme (gassing Gotham for the fun of it and everyone dieing with a smile on their lips) was worthy of the Joker.
I guess my other problem is that I'm really tiring of the look that Nolan is bringing to these films. If I step back and think about it for more than a couple of minutes, I quickly get down on everything from the look of the Joker to Batman's Tron suit and other hardware to the mundane Gotham they all inhabit. The situations may be truer to the books than Burton's and Schumaker's movies but the appearance of the characters and the world they live in is just a hurdle I have a harder and harder time getting over. This is a movie, not real life. It's OK for Batman to have the black and yellow symbol on his chest and it's OK for him to drive a sleek batmobile.
It really ****es me off that John Favreau was able to give me an Iron Man who looked like he just jumped off the cover of one of his comics with seemingly no effort at all, while Nolan gives me a Batman where I can barely see the bat on his chest.
Tony I agree with everything you've said...well...almost. But really the movie will be good and you'll enjoy it. And trust me, not everyone was fond of the past villian incarnations in those films...not just me. It didn't kill my joy for the mythos though and I still love those pictures with the exception of B&R. Most directors do not go fanboy all of the time to appease a small audience...now although that's true, it doesn't mean that I agree with it.
Do I want the yellow oval back? Yes. Would I prefer Jim Aparo Joker over Nolan's? Yes. Will these minor things return in future installments? Maybe, but I won't hold my breath.
I mean the Favreau defense you mounted is pretty much a moot point; there is only one way to approach Iron Man and that's the way he is. He shouldn't ever be some guy who glues pots and pans to his body to fight crime. )
You have to come out of the gates the right way since it's his first movie. Mess that up and you won't get another chance. Now SHATNER not being in a Star Trek movie..well... :v
Batman is a franchise that has continually staggered along cinematically on infusions for the last 40+ years. Every director in charge will bring his/her own vision of the character no matter how unpopular the altering is.
Now, my friend, and I do sincerely consider you that, if you go and see this picture next summer and you honestly do not like it, I promise you not only will I refund your onetime admission but draw the comic character of your choice in color! This offer only goes for you of course seeing that I could be up to my neck in s**# if it bombs and I tell everyone this. )
Mrs. Man Face: "You wouldn't hit a lady? Would you?"
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice isUNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
I'll dive into this one, as I know nothing about Batman...
I have an early neg review of Batman Begins on imdb. Lots of snippy fans did not find it 'helpful'... But yes, I found it too 'realistic' and it doesn't really work for me.
You need to be careful with comments like that Napoleon. If RogueAgent reads this he'll hunt you down and stick bamboo shoots under your fingernails.
But that's the action genre influence of Die Hard really... You either take it seriously or you end up with another Bruce film, The Fifth Element...
For a film that takes place in the "real world" I'd agree with you; that's probably part of the reason CR ended up looking the way it did. But Batman is something of a different animal. The notion of a man dressing up as a bat to fight crime is inherently unrealistic (sorry Rogue). If you start with that premise, realism has already been chucked out the window. That's why I think Nolan isn't necessarily the best person to do a batmovie; he really doesn't seem to get that concept.
I found Jack's Joker to be always on the back foot with the Caped Crusader, like he was out of his depth and puzzled a lot of the time. Hope they keep to one villain this time. If I go see it.
I think you're going to be disappointed in that regard. It's already common knowledge that in addition to the Joker, several other mob bosses play into the story. Not to mention...
Now, my friend, and I do sincerely consider you that, if you go and see this picture next summer and you honestly do not like it, I promise you not only will I refund your onetime admission but draw the comic character of your choice in color! This offer only goes for you of course seeing that I could be up to my neck in s**# if it bombs and I tell everyone this. )
DEAL! ) )
Rogue, I consider you a good friend as well so I promise that if I like B:TDK, I'll be sure to say as much. Heck, nobody will be happier than I if all my doubts and concerns are proven wrong.
Still, I need to think of what I'd want if the worst case scenario does come true. Ben Affleck as Daredevil? Mark Steven Johnson's Ghost Rider? Maybe Megan Gale as Wonder Woman. This will require some thought.
What an absolutely horrible look.This is the very BEST Nolan could come up with?Come on.For shame...
Maybe Heath Ledger's contract forbids the use of facial appliances that might alter his face and make it completely unrecognizable to the public.As it is,Heath looks like a cheap thug-a supporting character in a slasher film.If he was playing a character called The Clown or the Drug Addict, I wouldn't be annoyed.But he's supposedly playing The Joker...
Maybe as Tony suggests,Nolan believes that this woefully unfortunate look is simply in keeping with his "real world" take on Batman.You know: The Batman,that billionaire playboy-turned vigilante-who patrols Gotham City at night in a powerful automobile while dressed in an elaborate costume designed to make him resemble a gigantic bat.He's such a "real world" crimefighter.
In a perfect world, an actor who is a physical type similar to a young Conrad Veidt or Peter O'Toole would be playing The Joker.Someone perfectly willing to wear some Gwynplaine-inspired makeup,complete with appliances that would distort and elongate his face making him actually look like The Joker.He might even be bold enough to wear that famous purple zoot suit of the comics.What a shame such an individual isn't around.I think he'd be a huge improvement over what Ledger is offering.
A large part of The Joker is his unique image--and in that particular makeup Ledger just doesn't cut it for me.Arguments that using the traditional Joker look would somehow be "wrong" since Nicholson did it previously don't wash with me either.
The critics will probably love this movie and they'll very likely praise Ledger's "daring" look as The Joker.But the critics aren't always right.
RogueAgentSpeeding in the Tumbler...Posts: 3,676MI6 Agent
The critics will probably love this movie and they'll very likely praise Ledger's "daring" look as The Joker.But the critics aren't always right.
I guess I've just gone with the punches on this thing...I kind of knew all along that Nolan was keeping the look lowkey and Joker wasn't going to be the sensational & colorful villian that is immortalized on the comic pages as we are accustomed to.
That being said, I like this look because quite honestly, I was expecting a little worse from Nolan. I was expecting some jester from King Arthur days like on the card at the end of BB. )
Sorry you're still uneasy about this look, W.G. I'm slowly learning to suspend disbelief about disbelief when dealing with Nolan.
I've got a feeling that Ledger will be the best Joker by far even if he doesn't look the best. TDK will be very good. B-)
Mrs. Man Face: "You wouldn't hit a lady? Would you?"
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice isUNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
LoeffelholzThe United States, With LovePosts: 8,998Quartermasters
edited December 2007
I'd certainly have preferred a more 'traditional' Joker look, which IMRO Nicholson had---paunch aside (I never minded that; in fact, it had never occurred to me until I read this thread today!).
I'm not sure 'realistic' is the best way to describe Nolan's take on the Batman character and his world, since I find his interpretation of the mythos no less fantastical at its foundation. He's merely grounded it all in ostensibly 'real world' trappings---eschewing the Anton Furst 'Architect Gone Mad' look for a 'near-future' vision of Gotham City, for instance, and the timeless degradation of The Narrows---whilst populating this world with an instantly recognizable (and suitably obsessed) Bruce Wayne.
'Realistic'? Not to me. I'd call Nolan's take 'Underplayed Stylism.' For me, it certainly worked in BB...so I'll buy a ticket, and get in line to ride that ride again B-)
This incarnation of the Joker is very much in that vein, IMRO. It's a bit surprising (and undeniably disappointing, at first blush), but a couple of still photos won't shake my basic confidence in this creative team's ability to pull it off. What I've heard of Ledger's voice buttresses my confidence; his performance will be the thing
I'm certainly looking forward to it.
Check out my Amazon author page!Mark Loeffelholz
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
I'd certainly have preferred a more 'traditional' Joker look, which IMRO Nicholson had---paunch aside (I never minded that; in fact, it had never occurred to me until I read this thread today!).
And who would that be?
I'm not sure 'realistic' is the best way to describe Nolan's take on the Batman character and his world, since I find his interpretation of the mythos no less fantastical at its foundation. He's merely grounded it all in ostensibly 'real world' trappings---eschewing the Anton Furst 'Architect Gone Mad' look for a 'near-future' vision of Gotham City, for instance, and the timeless degradation of The Narrows---whilst inhabiting this world with an instantly recognizable (and suitably obsessed) Bruce Wayne.
'Realistic'? Not to me. I'd call Nolan's take 'Underplayed Stylism.' For me, it certainly worked in BB...so I'll pay a ticket, and get in line to ride that ride again B-)
This incarnation of the Joker is very much in that vein, IMRO. It's a bit surprising (and undeniably disappointing, at first blush), but a couple of still photos won't shake my basic confidence in this creative team's ability to pull it off. What I've heard of Ledger's voice buttresses my confidence; his performance will be the thing
I'm certainly looking forward to it.
Spoken like a true writer...but I do agree with the terminology, Loeff.
Mrs. Man Face: "You wouldn't hit a lady? Would you?"
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice isUNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
LoeffelholzThe United States, With LovePosts: 8,998Quartermasters
I'd certainly have preferred a more 'traditional' Joker look, which IMRO Nicholson had---paunch aside (I never minded that; in fact, it had never occurred to me until I read this thread today!).
Spoken like a true writer...but I do agree with the terminology, Loeff.
So be it, then: Underplayed StylismTM
Check out my Amazon author page!Mark Loeffelholz
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
NightshooterIn bed with SolitairePosts: 2,917MI6 Agent
Just want to say: I think you're all crazy. Ledger looks GREAT. Even BETTER in the Wizard pic.
And NP, you just have awful tastes in movies.
RogueAgentSpeeding in the Tumbler...Posts: 3,676MI6 Agent
edited December 2007
Here's an interview Al Roker had with the cast of TDK on the Today Show yesterday. No Ledger though.
There are some snippets of them actually filming the movie although many are in upheaval over The Joker's look, I'm really not feeling Batman's new outfit much. His cowl looks robotic and not in a good way... Could use a more draping cape but I guess we can all find complaints with this.
I'm sure that they were going for sleekness and comfort. But in my book, Nolan's 0 for 2 with the cowls. 8-) Clooney's first cowl still holds the title with me.
Ah, the media. . .they say it features Heath Ledger, and what picture do they show? Conrad Veidt from The Man Who Laughs! It's obvious some "researcher" just typed Heath Ledger + Joker into the Google image search and used the first pic that came up!
And did they have to play the theme from the TV show and have Al Roker doing the Batusi?
Comments
http://www.aintitcool.com/node/34907
I'm still undecided about the look. A little too grungy for my tastes and the hands are clearly flesh-colored. We'll have to see how it fits into the finished movie (gotta keep remembering to say that).
Thanks for the link, Tony.
I like it actually...not Neal Adams' Joker from the comics which is my favorite but this incarnation fits well with Nolan's swelled sense of plausibility.
Looks good.
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice is UNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
www.scottacademymartialarts.co.uk
This guy changes in every shot that I see... He still looks like half Joker/half Riddler with that vest thing going on.
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice is UNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice is UNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
You know what the problem is with all these pictures of the Joker? He doesn't look or act funny in any of them. There has to be a humorous element to the character, even if it is darkly humorous. And I haven't seen that yet anywhere in the photos released so far or what I've read about his capers. Ledger just looks like a psycho with white makeup.
I also still don't get all the blotches on the face. Is that supposed to be his real skin showing thru the white makeup? I know Nolan is angling for a different look but I can't say that I care for it at all. I just can't get past the fact that his "white" skin is just makeup. Hopefully he gets bleached for real at some point in the film because if he just wears white makeup throughout, then that's a MAJOR departure from the book and would probably ruin the character for me.
Maybe it will work when I finally see it assembled and in motion. 8-)
I understand it's normal to take it at face value but what Batman villian was truly honest-looking to the franchise?
Catwoman came the closest and that's it.
Burton's Penguin neither looked nor was portrayed as the one from the comics or the old tv shows. He was rather freakish & vulgar as a matter of fact. The one from the 90s cartoon was more spot on - polished and refined yet lethal. Even Burgess Meredith was better than DeVito's. That doesn't mean that I don't love BR because I do.
Schumacher's Riddler was played like - well - Jim Carrey. 8-) That's not the Nigma I know.
Don't even get me started on his Two-Face.
And as much as I LOVE Jack's version of Joker, his performance was a little too silly all the time, plus he was pot-gut. Joker's lean.
Also, Mr. Freeze doesn't make jokes. Was he ever done wrong.
Believe me, I want the look and attitude from the comics more than anyone here but you all know how these directors tick with this creative freedom.
The movie will do just fine.
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice is UNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
Ledger's definitely got the look down. But what about the personality? Well, if it was indeed Ledger laughing in the teaser, then I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt.
I'm really anxious to see Ledger in character. Before I couldn't imagine Ledger playing the Joker. Now I can. From the beginning, Ledger seemed to be a peculiar choice. But sometimes the actor you least expect to play a certain character really surprises you. For instance, I thought Kelsey Grammer did a excellent job as The Beast in X3: The Last Stand.
I have a feeling Heath Ledger is destined for greatness as well...
-Roger Moore
Just to be clear, I haven't read the script to B:TDK so my comments are just based on what I've seen and read so far. If Nolan has a few surprises up his sleeve, that's great.
Although, I have to disagree with you on the look of prior Batman villains. Other than Penguin, just about every other villain was instantly recognizable when compared to their 4 color counterparts. I know you didn't care for Tommy Lee Jones or Jim Carrey but at least they looked like they were supposed to most of the time. Same goes for Nicholson (other than the paunch, which we can't control) - he looked and acted the part, even if he did get carried away, and his big scheme (gassing Gotham for the fun of it and everyone dieing with a smile on their lips) was worthy of the Joker.
I guess my other problem is that I'm really tiring of the look that Nolan is bringing to these films. If I step back and think about it for more than a couple of minutes, I quickly get down on everything from the look of the Joker to Batman's Tron suit and other hardware to the mundane Gotham they all inhabit. The situations may be truer to the books than Burton's and Schumaker's movies but the appearance of the characters and the world they live in is just a hurdle I have a harder and harder time getting over. This is a movie, not real life. It's OK for Batman to have the black and yellow symbol on his chest and it's OK for him to drive a sleek batmobile.
It really ****es me off that John Favreau was able to give me an Iron Man who looked like he just jumped off the cover of one of his comics with seemingly no effort at all, while Nolan gives me a Batman where I can barely see the bat on his chest.
Indeed. One thing that annoys me about Nolan is that he seems to believe that in order for a film to be convincing, it must be 'realistic.' I think that's nonsence. Superman was extremely convincing to me, and was more so than the Paul Haggis film Crash. The reason is that although Superman wasn't realistic, it convinced me that it was realistic within the world that was the film. Crash did not convince me that it was realistic within any world.
I can believe in invincible aliens who fly, young men who attain the abilities of spiders, scientists who are as fast as lightning and a billionaire who dresses up as a bat and fight a criminal who loves to laugh. However what will make me believe is not how realistic these people are within our world but how realistic they are within their world. In order to do it, all it requires is good quality filmmaking and a director's belief in these people.
Exactly.
I have an early neg review of Batman Begins on imdb. Lots of snippy fans did not find it 'helpful'... But yes, I found it too 'realistic' and it doesn't really work for me. But that's the action genre influence of Die Hard really... You either take it seriously or you end up with another Bruce film, The Fifth Element...
I found Jack's Joker to be always on the back foot with the Caped Crusader, like he was out of his depth and puzzled a lot of the time. Hope they keep to one villain this time. If I go see it.
Roger Moore 1927-2017
Tony I agree with everything you've said...well...almost. But really the movie will be good and you'll enjoy it. And trust me, not everyone was fond of the past villian incarnations in those films...not just me. It didn't kill my joy for the mythos though and I still love those pictures with the exception of B&R. Most directors do not go fanboy all of the time to appease a small audience...now although that's true, it doesn't mean that I agree with it.
Do I want the yellow oval back? Yes. Would I prefer Jim Aparo Joker over Nolan's? Yes. Will these minor things return in future installments? Maybe, but I won't hold my breath.
I mean the Favreau defense you mounted is pretty much a moot point; there is only one way to approach Iron Man and that's the way he is. He shouldn't ever be some guy who glues pots and pans to his body to fight crime.
You have to come out of the gates the right way since it's his first movie. Mess that up and you won't get another chance. Now SHATNER not being in a Star Trek movie..well... :v
Batman is a franchise that has continually staggered along cinematically on infusions for the last 40+ years. Every director in charge will bring his/her own vision of the character no matter how unpopular the altering is.
Now, my friend, and I do sincerely consider you that, if you go and see this picture next summer and you honestly do not like it, I promise you not only will I refund your onetime admission but draw the comic character of your choice in color! This offer only goes for you of course seeing that I could be up to my neck in s**# if it bombs and I tell everyone this.
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice is UNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
You need to be careful with comments like that Napoleon. If RogueAgent reads this he'll hunt you down and stick bamboo shoots under your fingernails.
For a film that takes place in the "real world" I'd agree with you; that's probably part of the reason CR ended up looking the way it did. But Batman is something of a different animal. The notion of a man dressing up as a bat to fight crime is inherently unrealistic (sorry Rogue). If you start with that premise, realism has already been chucked out the window. That's why I think Nolan isn't necessarily the best person to do a batmovie; he really doesn't seem to get that concept.
I think you're going to be disappointed in that regard. It's already common knowledge that in addition to the Joker, several other mob bosses play into the story. Not to mention...
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0372784/usercomments-index?start=2350
Mine is the very last review there! 'Batman Bores – Again' {:)
Roger Moore 1927-2017
X-( X-( X-(
You are not of the body.....
SEIZE HIM!!!!!
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice is UNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
DEAL!
Rogue, I consider you a good friend as well so I promise that if I like B:TDK, I'll be sure to say as much. Heck, nobody will be happier than I if all my doubts and concerns are proven wrong.
Still, I need to think of what I'd want if the worst case scenario does come true. Ben Affleck as Daredevil? Mark Steven Johnson's Ghost Rider? Maybe Megan Gale as Wonder Woman. This will require some thought.
What did I tell you.
What an absolutely horrible look.This is the very BEST Nolan could come up with?Come on.For shame...
Maybe Heath Ledger's contract forbids the use of facial appliances that might alter his face and make it completely unrecognizable to the public.As it is,Heath looks like a cheap thug-a supporting character in a slasher film.If he was playing a character called The Clown or the Drug Addict, I wouldn't be annoyed.But he's supposedly playing The Joker...
Maybe as Tony suggests,Nolan believes that this woefully unfortunate look is simply in keeping with his "real world" take on Batman.You know: The Batman,that billionaire playboy-turned vigilante-who patrols Gotham City at night in a powerful automobile while dressed in an elaborate costume designed to make him resemble a gigantic bat.He's such a "real world" crimefighter.
In a perfect world, an actor who is a physical type similar to a young Conrad Veidt or Peter O'Toole would be playing The Joker.Someone perfectly willing to wear some Gwynplaine-inspired makeup,complete with appliances that would distort and elongate his face making him actually look like The Joker.He might even be bold enough to wear that famous purple zoot suit of the comics.What a shame such an individual isn't around.I think he'd be a huge improvement over what Ledger is offering.
A large part of The Joker is his unique image--and in that particular makeup Ledger just doesn't cut it for me.Arguments that using the traditional Joker look would somehow be "wrong" since Nicholson did it previously don't wash with me either.
The critics will probably love this movie and they'll very likely praise Ledger's "daring" look as The Joker.But the critics aren't always right.
I guess I've just gone with the punches on this thing...I kind of knew all along that Nolan was keeping the look lowkey and Joker wasn't going to be the sensational & colorful villian that is immortalized on the comic pages as we are accustomed to.
That being said, I like this look because quite honestly, I was expecting a little worse from Nolan. I was expecting some jester from King Arthur days like on the card at the end of BB.
Sorry you're still uneasy about this look, W.G. I'm slowly learning to suspend disbelief about disbelief when dealing with Nolan.
I've got a feeling that Ledger will be the best Joker by far even if he doesn't look the best. TDK will be very good. B-)
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice is UNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
I'm not sure 'realistic' is the best way to describe Nolan's take on the Batman character and his world, since I find his interpretation of the mythos no less fantastical at its foundation. He's merely grounded it all in ostensibly 'real world' trappings---eschewing the Anton Furst 'Architect Gone Mad' look for a 'near-future' vision of Gotham City, for instance, and the timeless degradation of The Narrows---whilst populating this world with an instantly recognizable (and suitably obsessed) Bruce Wayne.
'Realistic'? Not to me. I'd call Nolan's take 'Underplayed Stylism.' For me, it certainly worked in BB...so I'll buy a ticket, and get in line to ride that ride again B-)
This incarnation of the Joker is very much in that vein, IMRO. It's a bit surprising (and undeniably disappointing, at first blush), but a couple of still photos won't shake my basic confidence in this creative team's ability to pull it off. What I've heard of Ledger's voice buttresses my confidence; his performance will be the thing
I'm certainly looking forward to it.
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
Nicely put. B-)
And who would that be?
Spoken like a true writer...but I do agree with the terminology, Loeff.
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice is UNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
:v
So be it, then: Underplayed StylismTM
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
http://www.batman-on-film.com/TDK_bruce-new-batsuit_empiremag_11-29-07.html
I quite like it.
And NP, you just have awful tastes in movies.
There are some snippets of them actually filming the movie although many are in upheaval over The Joker's look, I'm really not feeling Batman's new outfit much. His cowl looks robotic and not in a good way... Could use a more draping cape but I guess we can all find complaints with this.
I'm sure that they were going for sleekness and comfort. But in my book, Nolan's 0 for 2 with the cowls. 8-) Clooney's first cowl still holds the title with me.
Check it out. It's pretty good:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=vFSIq2Tgp-8
Batman: "The Hammer Of Justice is UNISEX!"
-Batman: The Brave & The Bold -
And did they have to play the theme from the TV show and have Al Roker doing the Batusi?
I rather liked the idea that someone else had of Christopher Eccleston playing him.