Fringe Bond opinions.

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  • 72897289 Beau DesertPosts: 1,691MI6 Agent
    How is this for "fringe" .....

    The only books that "count" were written by Ian Fleming, Aims, Benson and Gardner - forget 'um!

    The books were continued only because the Fleming estate wanted the $$$$ to continue!

    The other authors are no more a part of the Bond canon than the '67 Casino Royale is a "serious" Bond film.
  • JarvioJarvio EnglandPosts: 4,241MI6 Agent
    I've just thought of another fringe bond opinion of mine...

    I wish that NSNA never existed! May sound harsh, but I can't think of any less harsh way to put it!
    1 - LALD, 2 - AVTAK, 3 - LTK, 4 - OP, 5 - NTTD, 6 - FYEO, 7 - SF, 8 - DN, 9 - DAF, 10 - TSWLM, 11 - OHMSS, 12 - TMWTGG, 13 - GE, 14 - MR, 15 - TLD, 16 - YOLT, 17 - GF, 18 - DAD, 19 - TWINE, 20 - SP, 21 - TND, 22 - FRWL, 23 - TB, 24 - CR, 25 - QOS

    1 - Moore, 2 - Dalton, 3 - Craig, 4 - Connery, 5 - Brosnan, 6 - Lazenby
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,054MI6 Agent
    edited June 2007
    Five more fringe opinions from me:

    1)I consider the "I thought Christmas only comes once a year" line to be among the very best closing lines in the series.

    2)I consider the two worst Bond performances in the series to be the two Daltons (especially LTK) and in my ideal world, Dalton would not have been Bond.

    3)I love Q, Moneypenny and the formula itself. I don't think that the formula limits the Bond films; rather I think it allows the filmmakers to take Bond into new and wonderful directions whilst staying true to the world that is Bond. :007)

    In fact, I would argue that the Bond films and their formula have not been getting tired at all; DAD was just a horribly executed film.

    4)After Bond broke into M's apartment in CR, I can not believe that she didn't discipline him. (Speaking of which, where has HH gone? :D)

    5)I can not stand the reboot. X-(
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • JarvioJarvio EnglandPosts: 4,241MI6 Agent
    Dan Same wrote:
    5)I can not stand the reboot. X-(

    You're not the only one.

    I think CR is a good film, but I HATE the fact that it doesn't make sense in terms of continuity with the other Bond films.

    I can't stand the fact that it's Bond's first mission, as well as taking place AFTER the cold war, AFTER 9/11, and having modern devices like mobile phones in it. Yes I know it's not supposed to make sense in terms of continuity with the other Bond films - but I don't like this.

    I wish it would have made sense. I wish it would be like after the events of DAD, rather than before the events of DN.

    Because of this, CR seems to be in a completely different league to the rest of the Bond films. I get the impression that CR tries to imply that the other 20 Bond films don't matter!

    CR, for me, would be perfect if it was not Bond's first mission. I know lots of you will disagree though, especially those who are fans of the books. I don't read the books, so that's probably why I feel this way. I just grew up with the films.
    1 - LALD, 2 - AVTAK, 3 - LTK, 4 - OP, 5 - NTTD, 6 - FYEO, 7 - SF, 8 - DN, 9 - DAF, 10 - TSWLM, 11 - OHMSS, 12 - TMWTGG, 13 - GE, 14 - MR, 15 - TLD, 16 - YOLT, 17 - GF, 18 - DAD, 19 - TWINE, 20 - SP, 21 - TND, 22 - FRWL, 23 - TB, 24 - CR, 25 - QOS

    1 - Moore, 2 - Dalton, 3 - Craig, 4 - Connery, 5 - Brosnan, 6 - Lazenby
  • DAWUSSDAWUSS My homepagePosts: 517MI6 Agent
    Jarvio wrote:
    Dan Same wrote:
    5)I can not stand the reboot. X-(

    You're not the only one.

    I think CR is a good film, but I HATE the fact that it doesn't make sense in terms of continuity with the other Bond films.

    I can't stand the fact that it's Bond's first mission, as well as taking place AFTER the cold war, AFTER 9/11, and having modern devices like mobile phones in it. Yes I know it's not supposed to make sense in terms of continuity with the other Bond films - but I don't like this.

    I wish it would have made sense. I wish it would be like after the events of DAD, rather than before the events of DN.

    Because of this, CR seems to be in a completely different league to the rest of the Bond films. I get the impression that CR tries to imply that the other 20 Bond films don't matter!

    CR, for me, would be perfect if it was not Bond's first mission. I know lots of you will disagree though, especially those who are fans of the books. I don't read the books, so that's probably why I feel this way. I just grew up with the films.

    And it would have been easy to do so (keep CR in continuity with previous films and events)

    Gunbarrel, which opens to Uganda (or wherever the heck it is Le Chiffre and Mr. White make the transaction with the terrorist group), then we see Bond in Madagascar, where he kills the one guy outside the embassy. Begin main title theme.

    And with a few modifications to M's lines you would have a CR that fit movie continuity.
  • JarvioJarvio EnglandPosts: 4,241MI6 Agent
    Yep. And just doing that would make CR much, much better IMO.
    1 - LALD, 2 - AVTAK, 3 - LTK, 4 - OP, 5 - NTTD, 6 - FYEO, 7 - SF, 8 - DN, 9 - DAF, 10 - TSWLM, 11 - OHMSS, 12 - TMWTGG, 13 - GE, 14 - MR, 15 - TLD, 16 - YOLT, 17 - GF, 18 - DAD, 19 - TWINE, 20 - SP, 21 - TND, 22 - FRWL, 23 - TB, 24 - CR, 25 - QOS

    1 - Moore, 2 - Dalton, 3 - Craig, 4 - Connery, 5 - Brosnan, 6 - Lazenby
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,054MI6 Agent
    edited June 2007
    Jarvio wrote:
    Dan Same wrote:
    5)I can not stand the reboot. X-(
    You're not the only one.

    I think CR is a good film, but I HATE the fact that it doesn't make sense in terms of continuity with the other Bond films.

    I can't stand the fact that it's Bond's first mission, as well as taking place AFTER the cold war, AFTER 9/11, and having modern devices like mobile phones in it. Yes I know it's not supposed to make sense in terms of continuity with the other Bond films - but I don't like this.

    I wish it would have made sense. I wish it would be like after the events of DAD, rather than before the events of DN.

    Because of this, CR seems to be in a completely different league to the rest of the Bond films. I get the impression that CR tries to imply that the other 20 Bond films don't matter!

    CR, for me, would be perfect if it was not Bond's first mission. I know lots of you will disagree though, especially those who are fans of the books. I don't read the books, so that's probably why I feel this way. I just grew up with the films.
    I've spoken previously about why I hate the reboot, so I won't do that now, however I will say that IMO the reboot is completely unnecessary. DAD was horrible but much of the blame can surely be laid on the script and CGI. If Bond 21 (a non-rebooted Bond, preferably with Brosnan) had a much better script and vastly superior and less CGI, then I think it could have been amazing (which CR IMO wasn't.) I don't think a reboot was needed at all.
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • Colonel ShatnerColonel Shatner Chavtastic Bristol, BritainPosts: 574MI6 Agent
    1) You Only Live Twice was a superior Connery outing to Goldfinger and Thunderball.

    2) Roger Moore is a better actor than Sean Connery.

    3) The Living Daylights was the weakest Bond film in the last two decades, with a so-so Cold War plot and weak baddies.

    4) License to Kill was (outside of Casino Royale) the strongest Bond film in the last two decades, with a excellent revenge plot and charismatic baddies.

    5) Science fiction and fantasy themes has always been integral with James Bond from almost the onset.

    6) The Soviet Russians being the arch baddies has always been a Bond brainbug (perpetrated by the overrated GoldenEye).

    7) Moonraker was the strongest Bond movie of the 1970s.

    8 ) Tomorrow Never Dies and The World is Not Enough were better Brosnan outings than GoldenEye.

    9) Jaws getting a girlfriend and turning "good" in MR never bothered me, since Jaws was the ridiculous (but fun) character that he always was.

    10) Die Another Day was not ruined by sci-fi gadgets or ice palaces, but a weak and needlessly convoluted plot.
    'Alright guard, begin the unnecessarily slow moving dipping mechanism...'
  • GeorgiboyGeorgiboy Posts: 632MI6 Agent
    edited November 2007
    Here's some for you guys...

    1. I think Elliot Carver is one of the best villains of the series.

    2. I don't like CR and the whole idea of a reboot (Loeff probably hates me now).

    3. I absolutely hate Judi Dench as M.

    4. I do not like Daniel Craig as Bond {:) (now I know he hates me).

    5. I thought Moonraker was a great bond film.
  • Colonel ShatnerColonel Shatner Chavtastic Bristol, BritainPosts: 574MI6 Agent
    Georgiboy wrote:
    Here's some for you guys...

    1. I think Elliot Carver is one of the best villains of the series.

    Yeah, I don't understand the apathy or outright contempt for Elliot Carver either... ?:)

    Johnathan Pryce did a great job and Carver's plan made more sense than Trevelyan’s ("Oh, I'll steal billions in hard data from the Bank of England, then render it totally worthless by crashing the global economy! And why should I steal billions when I'm already a billionaire that has amassed endless resources with a massive crime syndicate, a armoured train, a private army numbering in the hundreds, a powerful general in my backpocket, and the largest radio dish in the world rising out of a artificial lake?! :D:s ).
    'Alright guard, begin the unnecessarily slow moving dipping mechanism...'
  • HigginsHiggins GermanyPosts: 16,619MI6 Agent
    I have only one word for fringe Bond opinions:

    JFF :))
    President of the 'Misty Eyes Club'.

    Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
  • HigginsHiggins GermanyPosts: 16,619MI6 Agent
    edited November 2007
    I quote Loeff as saying that Connery looked way older in NSNA than Moore did ever.

    I didn't say you said that....


    It has been me :)
    And it is absolutely correct! {[]
    President of the 'Misty Eyes Club'.

    Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
  • A7ceA7ce Birmingham, EnglandPosts: 656MI6 Agent
    'Fringe Bond opinions'

    Bond would not suit a fringe in my opinion; a left side parting with a short back should be fine
  • taitytaity Posts: 702MI6 Agent
    Dan Same wrote:
    4)After Bond broke into M's apartment in CR, I can not believe that she didn't discipline him. (Speaking of which, where has HH gone?

    After reading the books, that point really upset me. Fleming would NEVER have Bond break into M's house.
  • AlexAlex The Eastern SeaboardPosts: 2,694MI6 Agent
    Another unpopular opinion from me, I'm afraid to mention, is the much heralded Doctor Kaufmann from TND.

    With all due respect to the actor. (who passed away recently) And perhaps I'm biased since he made his first appearance in my teenage years as a space cadet in Fast Times At Ridgemont High, but I thought the whole German hitman scenerio was extremely comical. Stuttgart and all that ..

    Apologies to those who get a different vibe from it.
  • superadosuperado Regent's Park West (CaliforniaPosts: 2,656MI6 Agent
    edited November 2007
    taity wrote:
    Dan Same wrote:
    4)After Bond broke into M's apartment in CR, I can not believe that she didn't discipline him. (Speaking of which, where has HH gone?

    After reading the books, that point really upset me. Fleming would NEVER have Bond break into M's house.

    Yes, Bond succeeds at several stages of the mission, by breaking into M's apartment, using her laptop, and later again hacking into the MI6 network through her security access...does the end justify the means?

    If M in the course of the mission eventually grew to appreciate and value Bond's demonstrated ability to achieve outstanding results (proof of this, is that he got his job back after resigning), she should then adjust her standards and make room for Bond's unpredictability, which he repeatedly demonstrated within a brief period of time at the expense of her authority. It would call on her to take a blind leap of faith, the kind that goes against the nature of her character. However, what kind of leader does that make her? Does she think that the risks Bond brings to the table outweigh the threat to her organization's integrity?
    "...the purposeful slant of his striding figure looked dangerous, as if he was making quickly for something bad that was happening further down the street." -SMERSH on 007 dossier photo, Ch. 6 FRWL.....
  • JamesbondjrJamesbondjr Posts: 462MI6 Agent
    Alex wrote:
    Another unpopular opinion from me, I'm afraid to mention, is the much heralded Doctor Kaufmann from TND.

    With all due respect to the actor. (who passed away recently) And perhaps I'm biased since he made his first appearance in my teenage years as a space cadet in Fast Times At Ridgemont High, but I thought the whole German hitman scenerio was extremely comical. Stuttgart and all that ..

    Apologies to those who get a different vibe from it.

    I have always hated that scene. It actually makes me cringe.
    For me it is one of the hardest scenes to watch due to the performance of the actor.

    I have seen him in other things and he is a good actor, it was just a bit too hammy and over the top in my eyes
    1- On Her Majesty's Secret Service 2- Casino Royale 3- Licence To Kill 4- Goldeneye 5- From Russia With Love
  • Prince Kamal KhanPrince Kamal Khan Posts: 277MI6 Agent
    Here's a few...

    1)As good as his work in the first 3 Bond films was, Sean Connery's very best performance as Bond was in TB.

    2)Karin Dor's Helga Brandt is an underrated Bond villainess and a worthy follow up to Luciana Paluzzi's Fiona Volpe.

    3)Sean Connery's performance as "fat" Bond in DAF is actually quite enjoyable and one of my favorite Bond performances.

    4)TMWTGG features Moore's best performance as 007.

    5)As someone stated above, Britt Ekland gives a funny performance as Goodnight. The character was supposed to be a dingy blond hippy chick/comedy relief character and she played it well.

    6)Caroline Munro and Barbara Bach should have switched roles in TSWLM.

    7) MR is the most underrated film in the series. I fully concede it's goofy, OTT and unfaithful to Fleming but so were most of the 007 films made between 1967 and 1979, save OHMSS. It's the most enjoyable comedy/fantasy entry in the series.

    8)FYEO is a competently made but overrated Bond film that enjoys a reputation for being a great film more due to anti-MR sentiments than the film itself. If FYEO had come directly after OHMSS with no 1970s inbetween, I do not think it would be thought of as anything more than a decent, midrange entry.

    9)GE should've starred Timothy Dalton as Bond and Anthony Hopkins as Trevelyan as originally intended.

    10)Paris Carver should've been the main girl in TND instead of Wai Lin.
  • JennyFlexFanJennyFlexFan Posts: 1,497MI6 Agent
    edited November 2007
    Very interesting! I'm going to respond to these... :D

    1)As good as his work in the first 3 Bond films was, Sean Connery's very best performance as Bond was in TB.

    I'd have to disagree, I would say Connery hit his peak in GF and subsequently went on a downward spiral into YOLT.

    2)Karin Dor's Helga Brandt is an underrated Bond villainess and a worthy follow up to Luciana Paluzzi's Fiona Volpe.

    YES. YES. In fact, I'd say moreso. Fiona is very overrated and Brandt is terribly underrated. I'd also go so far as to say Helga outsexies Fiona and was terribly underused in YOLT. The movie would've been so much better if there was more of her.

    3)Sean Connery's performance as "fat" Bond in DAF is actually quite enjoyable and one of my favorite Bond performances.

    I also don't have THAT much of a problem with fat Bond, Connery's performance in DAF was fine. I'd also say 2/3 of Jill St. John's Tiffany Case was one of the best Bond girls ever.

    4)TMWTGG features Moore's best performance as 007.

    I'd say TSWLM, FYEO or AVTAK, but TMWTGG is an underrated performance of his, overshadowed by the fact it's just a pretty awful movie (IMO).

    5)As someone stated above, Britt Ekland gives a funny performance as Goodnight. The character was supposed to be a dingy blond hippy chick/comedy relief character and she played it well.

    Never cared much for Goodnight. She was a little bit too farcical for my taste. If they toned her down a little bit, I would've enjoyed her a lot more.

    6)Caroline Munro and Barbara Bach should have switched roles in TSWLM.

    I'd say have her play BOTH roles. Caroline Munro was so scrumptious I couldn't see Barbara Bach as Naomi. No one could pull off that outfit/sultry wink like Munro could. The other twist would be that Stromberg cloned XXX and turned her into Naomi.

    7) MR is the most underrated film in the series. I fully concede it's goofy, OTT and unfaithful to Fleming but so were most of the 007 films made between 1967 and 1979, save OHMSS. It's the most enjoyable comedy/fantasy entry in the series.

    Yes, I agree. MR is an underrated gem, (read Agent Sidewinder's post). The film really is genuinely entertaining and is merely knocked about for going into space. Moore does well, Lonsdale is an excellent villain, Chiles is an excellent Bond girl, Barry has a haunting score, one of the best in the series, the locations are beautiful, the space battle is riveting, etc. etc. The only problem here is Jaws turned into a cartoon and paired him up with Dolly. If he had been more like TSWLM Jaws, then people would enjoy MR A LOT more.

    8)FYEO is a competently made but overrated Bond film that enjoys a reputation for being a great film more due to anti-MR sentiments than the film itself. If FYEO had come directly after OHMSS with no 1970s inbetween, I do not think it would be thought of as anything more than a decent, midrange entry.

    I disagree. Sure it probably helped a lot that it came after MR, but since I'm one that genuinely likes MR, I enjoy FYEO thoroughly and even moreso than MR. FYEO was a good back-to-basics FRWL-esque Bond film that would've fit great after OHMSS, especially with the Tracy connection in the PTS.

    9)GE should've starred Timothy Dalton as Bond and Anthony Hopkins as Trevelyan as originally intended.

    I just... well, I'm sure everyone knows what my response to this would be. ;)

    10)Paris Carver should've been the main girl in TND instead of Wai Lin.

    I didn't like either. They should've toned down Wai Lin a lot more and it would've worked brilliantly or make another Natalya-esque character (or maybe just have Natalya ;) )

    I know another one of your opinions would be on AVTAK and making Alison Doody the main girl, something I'd wholly agree with but if that were the case, I'd want Brosnan in the role and NOT Dalton. (I'd never want him near Alison! ;) )
  • LazenbyLazenby The upper reaches of the AmazoPosts: 606MI6 Agent
    Here's a few...

    1)As good as his work in the first 3 Bond films was, Sean Connery's very best performance as Bond was in TB.

    I agree with this, although I would have to say that (for me) DAF and GF are a close second. TB is interesting because it seems to have been a nice alloy of the harder edged portrayal from the first 2 movies and the somewhat lighter one from GF. A good mix it was.
    3)Sean Connery's performance as "fat" Bond in DAF is actually quite enjoyable and one of my favorite Bond performances.

    Agreed! I just watched DAF the other night and was surprised at how much I enjoyed Connery's performance. Even though Moore is considered the "funny" Bond, I think Connery demonstrated in this picture that, when he wanted to be, he could be absolutely tops in this department. The "Don't tell me, you're Saint Peter" line kills me every time.
    4)TMWTGG features Moore's best performance as 007.

    I would give that honor to (surprise surprise) MR. I always found Moore kind of smarmy and disappointing in TMWTGG. Also, the one thing that gets me every time I watch that is how much I wish Lazenby was starring in it. The Q scene in that film is probably my favorite of the whole series.
    6)Caroline Munro and Barbara Bach should have switched roles in TSWLM.

    Totally agreed. The under-use of Naomi has to be one of the biggest wasted opportunities in franchise history (imho).
    7)MR is the most underrated film in the series. I fully concede it's goofy, OTT and unfaithful to Fleming but so were most of the 007 films made between 1967 and 1979, save OHMSS. It's the most enjoyable comedy/fantasy entry in the series.

    Indeed! (We've been over this before...) {[]
    8)FYEO is a competently made but overrated Bond film that enjoys a reputation for being a great film more due to anti-MR sentiments than the film itself. If FYEO had come directly after OHMSS with no 1970s inbetween, I do not think it would be thought of as anything more than a decent, midrange entry.

    Agreed. I have never been a huge fan of FYEO. I prefer Moore when he's playing to his strengths (ie., in more goofy/OTT films).
  • CasinoChris75CasinoChris75 Posts: 80MI6 Agent
    edited November 2007
    GoldenEye is Brosnan's worst. It takes too long to get started. Atleast TWINE had an interesting plot.

    Moonraker is one of the best in the series. Locations are used well. Moore is great. Drax is great. The special effects are very good, and the action scenes are memorable. The plot is clear and the Bond formula is perfected. A split second of a double taking pigeon hardly does any damage. The greatest thing about Bond is he can do anything, so why not put him in space?

    A View To A Kill is very good and not one of the worst. The scenes between Bond and Tibbett are nice. Stacey Sutton isn't bad and her scenes with Moore worked for me. The villians are good. No plot holes. Some nice action scenes. Moore is great despite old age. All in all, a pleasant and kind of fun film.
  • Honey RiderHoney Rider Posts: 211MI6 Agent
    edited November 2007
    I have three fringe opinions:
    1)I think that the biggest mistake the producers made recently, from an artistic point of view, is not casting Christian Bale. I think he would have been an incredible Bond. :D
    2)I think that 1967's CR, whilst pretty bad, is nowhere near as terrible as many people think it is.

    3)I think that FRWL is very overrated and, among 60's Connery films, was only superior to YOLT. I also think that DN was the second greatest Bond film of all time and I think that TB was nowhere near as good as either DN or GF.
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