I got the impression that Bond did not have *** with Solange, just as stated above.
However, dialog from the Director and DC - on one of the commentaries - indicated that by the time the scene cuts in on them, the deed HAD been done and they were gearing up for Round 2.
Watching Bond with Solange I always thought the phone call interupted them and as Napoleon Plural states Bond's trousers stay on,I could make a schoolboy joke about Bond as a trained Intelligence Officer being able to get in and out of places un-noticed,but i won't
"I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
Interesting thread, to which I would like to add my comments. Daniel Craig’s Bond has been the least lustful of all the Bond’s, which isn’t his fault; it is how the new Bond is being presented. Compare the following,
Connery slowly unzipping Miss Taro’s dress, to kill some time, which is after arriving early and finding her in just a towel, which he helps remove. Connery playfully rolling around in bed with Jill Masterson, and then later converting Pussy Galore in the barn. Connery taking Patricia Fearing into the steam room and then giving her a back rub with a mink glove. Connery later has a rather physical encounter with Fiona Volpe.
Lazenby collecting his reward for saving Tracy at the casino, then later sleeps with her in the barn after his escape from Piz Gloria.
Moore tricking Solitaire into sleeping with him. Moore sleeping with Maud Adams while Goodnight is in the closet. Moore sleeps with Corinne in MR to get information and then later goes around the world with Dr Goodhead. Moore sleeping with everyone in AVTAK
Dalton enjoys a nice boat ride with Pam Bouvier and then later sleeps with Lupe.
Brosnan seducing the psychiatrist sent to examine him in GE. Brosnan seducing the doctor in TWINE to get her to OK his return to duty. Later in TWINE Brosnan enjoys some passionate time with Electra. Brosnan having a very frisky evening with Jinx’s in DAD.
Craig, nothing to speak of in CR and only a very brief encounter with Agent Fields where we see a brief kiss of her back.
To me, there is no doubt the sexual escapades have decreased. Leaving two questions, why and is it important.
I will answer the second question first, yes it is important. It is part of Bond’s persona. I believe Connery’s and Brosnan’s Bond captured it best. When they slept with a woman, they didn’t just sleep with them, they made love to them. We saw passion, enthusiasm and joy. Connery and Brosnan conveyed the Fleming Bond. Fleming’s Bond would meet a woman and wonder what she would be like in bed. Fleming’s Bond would view a woman and then in clear detail analyze every inch of their form. Not in a crude manner, but in an admiring way. Bond loves women, he loves the way they look, the way they smell, the way they taste and he loves to make love to them. This should be captured in the cinematic Bond.
Now as to why Craig’s Bond does not convey this love of women, IMO it is because this is Barbara Broccoli’s Bond. She has taken firm hands on to the Bond franchise reigns and I believe she wants to downplay the sexual side of the character. I think her vision is Bond the warrior, Bond the raging bull, Bond the terminator. We literally have had shots of Bond breaking through a wall to get someone ala the Terminator. In CR instead of the beautiful Solange coming out of the water dripping wet, we get the bulked up Craig coming out of the water dripping wet.
Let me repeat, I blame none of this on Craig, I blame it on the folks that control the franchise, and I think they are making a mistake.
Well I too blame it on Babs Broccoli, but then really, credit is due because she alone championed Craig as Bond when none of us lot could see it, and Craig as Bond is MEGA....
The sex is hard to do (on screen I mean... ) ) because it's out of context, you don't see that so much in movies today whereas you did in most 1960s films - though ironically society is more promiscuous these days. I might cite an American puritan influence here.
Bourne, Bauer - the on the move, chase orientated action films since Die Hard and Terminator don't offer much chance for sex. check out Crank with Jason Stratham for an energetic exception.
Now as to why Craig’s Bond does not convey this love of women, IMO it is because this is Barbara Broccoli’s Bond. She has taken firm hands on to the Bond franchise reigns and I believe she wants to downplay the sexual side of the character. I think her vision is Bond the warrior, Bond the raging bull, Bond the terminator. We literally have had shots of Bond breaking through a wall to get someone ala the Terminator. In CR instead of the beautiful Solange coming out of the water dripping wet, we get the bulked up Craig coming out of the water dripping wet.
I gotta say Barry, this has got to be one of your best posts ever, and I couldn't agree more!!! I quoted my favorite part above, which is exactly how I feel about it as well!! Barbara has been very self indulgent, and I think it's time she get off that trip. He's just not that into you Babs.
LoeffelholzThe United States, With LovePosts: 8,998Quartermasters
...Which brings us full circle to my thought on page 1 of this thread:
If I were writing the script (please God!), I'd have Bond sleep with a minimum of four women in #23...including Moneypenny :v
Time to be on the job, 007...
"You can DO it!" - From various Adam Sandler flicks
Check out my Amazon author page!Mark Loeffelholz
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
Having just watched Casino Royale again.....I payed particular attention to this scene (can't think why ) ) and they definately have not slept with each other as, and I quote
Bond: The nature of his work?
Vesper: A mystery I'm afraid. I am also afraid you will sleep with me in order to get to him.
....and also, Solange is still in her dress, and with that kind of dress, once it's off, it would stay off - and I can't imagine they would both put their clothes back on if they had! )
She's worth whatever chaos she brings to the table and you know it. ~ Mark Anthony
I am also afraid you will sleep with me in order to get to him.
Trust Sexy Lexi to sort that one out for us!
{[]
I have to agree though. Where we have seen other Bond's in sexual persuit purely for pleasure, Craig's Bond simply hasn't had the time for it yet, with the sole exception of Fields.
His seduction of Solange is simply in the line of duty, wich can also be seen by the cool way he reacts when presented with her corpse.
I like to think that the days of Bond as a randy puppy dog are over.
It makes sense that he's sexually agressive, but it should fit ito the plot of the film. I liked the way QOS handled the charecter of "Fields", and did not regret that EON failed to include 10 minutes of bedroom gymnastics (ala "Watchmen")into the film.
It has yet to be observed that each of the women that DC's Bond sleeps with DIES! So cut the fellow some slack. I suspect in the next film that EON will again try to be different. That's something to look forward too.
I'd prefer the horney Bond be left to the days of Brosnan and Moore - it's just not cute these days.
Thunderbird 2East of Cardiff, Wales.Posts: 2,817MI6 Agent
edited March 2009
Hear hear!
Criags Bond is a ruthless and dangerous gentleman spy. It makes sense that he picks and chooses when its time for matress gymnastics. - There is a time and a place for everything. 007's antics with Fields prove that. Besides, Less romping on screen means more time for storyline and plot development. In this case it was a shame we had to have the welded on exposition from M. - "They'll do anything for you, won't they Bond?" Implying she knows more than she's saying about his past!
I liked the fact that Bond is the centrepiece in CR. It adds up because the producers knew that the new Bond had to prove something to everyone, and he did. (Both actor and character).
As for Ms Brocolli, she has to experiment! Along with her Stepbrother, she is continuing one of the longest most expensive and popular film franchises in the world. - It has to evolve in order to survive.
This is Thunderbird 2, how can I be of assistance?
This may be the best named thread so far! {[]
I think the number of notches on 007's bedpost in CR and QoS was very appropriate for the stories in the films. I also think Bond shoul have a more hedonistic lifestyle in future films, also for character arch reasons.
I also think Bond- film should become more racy.
Think about it: DN had a girl who admits to killing her rapist. In FRWL a woman has sex with Bond to help steal a coding machine. In GE Pussy Galore (!) and her flying circus are thinly weilded lesbians. DEF features gay asassins.
This was very racy and risky back then.
Why not try a bisexual Bond girl, with 007 fighting a lesbian for her affections? Or Bond having a threesome? Or casting a porn star like Tera Patrick or Jenna Jameson (I have of course never heard of any of them ever in my life) in a Bond film?
This is not just my ID thinking out loud.
I think Bond should take risks, not only in the action scenes, but also in the "love" scenes.
Much of this must be done cleverly, we'r not making a PG 18 movie (or whatever it's called) here!
I think Bond should take risks, not only in the action scenes, but also in the "love" scenes.
No safe sex then... :v
"Christ, I miss the Cold War."
LoeffelholzThe United States, With LovePosts: 8,998Quartermasters
edited March 2009
It's probably accurate to say that Craig-Bond's level of sexual escapades mirrors that of Fleming's (literary) Bond more than the other cinematic versions which have preceded him. For confirmation of this, find me the sex scene between Bond and Gala Brand in the MR novel
That said, I'm still hoping for a bit more in the way of recreational sex next time round :v
Check out my Amazon author page!Mark Loeffelholz
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
Sir MilesThe Wrong Side Of The WardrobePosts: 27,750Chief of Staff
That said, I'm still hoping for a bit more in the way of recreational sex next time round :v
Aren't we all, Loeffelholz !
Oh sorry, you meant Bond |)
Huh??? Oh... ;% ...yeah. Sure. That's what I meant :v Bond. Of course.
)
Check out my Amazon author page!Mark Loeffelholz
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
The whole point of the lack of sex is to emphasize the love between Vesper and Bond and to make it seem more genuine. If Bond was jumping on every piece of meat he saw as soon as their relationship ended, it wouldn't seem very genuine would it? Also, remember that the new DC Bond is an attempt to get away from the old ridiculous cliches that had been around since Connery, and lets just face it, in this day and age you can't just entice every woman you see into sleeping with you with a cheesy one-liner, even if you are James Bond
One more thing, remember, he's still learning the ropes :007)
So there's alot going on in this thread. IMO it's not that we want to have Bond sleep with a hundred girls before the end of the movie but I do think that the sexual tention is no longer there. In the first movies the death of Tracy is what shows him that falling in love is a waste of time. That if you get close to anyone than there is a chance of them getting killed. Felix Lighter is an example of that. So he gets to a point that woman are only good for one thing and once your done than that's that. Also in the bar sceen in TSWLM were XXX comments on Tracy and his reaction show that deep in side he will only ever love her.
As Far as DC's Bond and the girls, IMO is that BABS influance in the new movies. In CR where Bond and Cammille are rolling around on the floor, I would have put them in bed, she gets the call Bond gets up to order more bubbly and he leaves. Again just my opinion but I have to agree Bond is not going to be the womanizer he was before.
Bond: You don't think I enjoyed what we did this evening, do you? What I did tonight was for King and country! You don't think it gave me any pleasure, do you?
Fiona: But of course, I forgot your ego, Mr. Bond. James Bond, who only has to make love to a woman and she starts to hear heavenly choirs singing.
LoeffelholzThe United States, With LovePosts: 8,998Quartermasters
We'll just have to see what happens in #23...
Check out my Amazon author page!Mark Loeffelholz
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
So there's alot going on in this thread. IMO it's not that we want to have Bond sleep with a hundred girls before the end of the movie but I do think that the sexual tention is no longer there. In the first movies the death of Tracy is what shows him that falling in love is a waste of time. That if you get close to anyone than there is a chance of them getting killed. Felix Lighter is an example of that. So he gets to a point that woman are only good for one thing and once your done than that's that. Also in the bar sceen in TSWLM were XXX comments on Tracy and his reaction show that deep in side he will only ever love her.
As Far as DC's Bond and the girls, IMO is that BABS influance in the new movies. In CR where Bond and Cammille are rolling around on the floor, I would have put them in bed, she gets the call Bond gets up to order more bubbly and he leaves. Again just my opinion but I have to agree Bond is not going to be the womanizer he was before.
I agree that it is not really just about how many women Bond beds. What has been lacking for me both in QOS and to a lesser extent in CR is that kind of background glamour, and hell yes I'll say it cleaveage. You know the kind of thing, a woman glimpsed in the background, or a a subtle sense of recognition between Bond and a lady (a good example happens to be in CR between Bond and that very cute receptionist at the Hrbour club) All this contributes to a climate and sense of sexiness and glamour irrespective of the number of notches on our mans bed post
Comments
However, dialog from the Director and DC - on one of the commentaries - indicated that by the time the scene cuts in on them, the deed HAD been done and they were gearing up for Round 2.
Bond’s Beretta
The Handguns of Ian Fleming's James Bond
Roger Moore 1927-2017
Connery slowly unzipping Miss Taro’s dress, to kill some time, which is after arriving early and finding her in just a towel, which he helps remove. Connery playfully rolling around in bed with Jill Masterson, and then later converting Pussy Galore in the barn. Connery taking Patricia Fearing into the steam room and then giving her a back rub with a mink glove. Connery later has a rather physical encounter with Fiona Volpe.
Lazenby collecting his reward for saving Tracy at the casino, then later sleeps with her in the barn after his escape from Piz Gloria.
Moore tricking Solitaire into sleeping with him. Moore sleeping with Maud Adams while Goodnight is in the closet. Moore sleeps with Corinne in MR to get information and then later goes around the world with Dr Goodhead. Moore sleeping with everyone in AVTAK
Dalton enjoys a nice boat ride with Pam Bouvier and then later sleeps with Lupe.
Brosnan seducing the psychiatrist sent to examine him in GE. Brosnan seducing the doctor in TWINE to get her to OK his return to duty. Later in TWINE Brosnan enjoys some passionate time with Electra. Brosnan having a very frisky evening with Jinx’s in DAD.
Craig, nothing to speak of in CR and only a very brief encounter with Agent Fields where we see a brief kiss of her back.
To me, there is no doubt the sexual escapades have decreased. Leaving two questions, why and is it important.
I will answer the second question first, yes it is important. It is part of Bond’s persona. I believe Connery’s and Brosnan’s Bond captured it best. When they slept with a woman, they didn’t just sleep with them, they made love to them. We saw passion, enthusiasm and joy. Connery and Brosnan conveyed the Fleming Bond. Fleming’s Bond would meet a woman and wonder what she would be like in bed. Fleming’s Bond would view a woman and then in clear detail analyze every inch of their form. Not in a crude manner, but in an admiring way. Bond loves women, he loves the way they look, the way they smell, the way they taste and he loves to make love to them. This should be captured in the cinematic Bond.
Now as to why Craig’s Bond does not convey this love of women, IMO it is because this is Barbara Broccoli’s Bond. She has taken firm hands on to the Bond franchise reigns and I believe she wants to downplay the sexual side of the character. I think her vision is Bond the warrior, Bond the raging bull, Bond the terminator. We literally have had shots of Bond breaking through a wall to get someone ala the Terminator. In CR instead of the beautiful Solange coming out of the water dripping wet, we get the bulked up Craig coming out of the water dripping wet.
Let me repeat, I blame none of this on Craig, I blame it on the folks that control the franchise, and I think they are making a mistake.
The sex is hard to do (on screen I mean...
Bourne, Bauer - the on the move, chase orientated action films since Die Hard and Terminator don't offer much chance for sex. check out Crank with Jason Stratham for an energetic exception.
Roger Moore 1927-2017
I gotta say Barry, this has got to be one of your best posts ever, and I couldn't agree more!!! I quoted my favorite part above, which is exactly how I feel about it as well!! Barbara has been very self indulgent, and I think it's time she get off that trip. He's just not that into you Babs.
Time to be on the job, 007...
"You can DO it!" - From various Adam Sandler flicks
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
Bond: The nature of his work?
Vesper: A mystery I'm afraid. I am also afraid you will sleep with me in order to get to him.
....and also, Solange is still in her dress, and with that kind of dress, once it's off, it would stay off - and I can't imagine they would both put their clothes back on if they had!
Trust Sexy Lexi to sort that one out for us!
{[]
I have to agree though. Where we have seen other Bond's in sexual persuit purely for pleasure, Craig's Bond simply hasn't had the time for it yet, with the sole exception of Fields.
His seduction of Solange is simply in the line of duty, wich can also be seen by the cool way he reacts when presented with her corpse.
dear friend. I am sure, that you have to earn hard the entitlement to call Lexi that way.
Napoleon Plural can probably but you and me?
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
It makes sense that he's sexually agressive, but it should fit ito the plot of the film. I liked the way QOS handled the charecter of "Fields", and did not regret that EON failed to include 10 minutes of bedroom gymnastics (ala "Watchmen")into the film.
It has yet to be observed that each of the women that DC's Bond sleeps with DIES! So cut the fellow some slack. I suspect in the next film that EON will again try to be different. That's something to look forward too.
I'd prefer the horney Bond be left to the days of Brosnan and Moore - it's just not cute these days.
Bond’s Beretta
The Handguns of Ian Fleming's James Bond
Criags Bond is a ruthless and dangerous gentleman spy. It makes sense that he picks and chooses when its time for matress gymnastics. - There is a time and a place for everything. 007's antics with Fields prove that. Besides, Less romping on screen means more time for storyline and plot development. In this case it was a shame we had to have the welded on exposition from M. - "They'll do anything for you, won't they Bond?" Implying she knows more than she's saying about his past!
I liked the fact that Bond is the centrepiece in CR. It adds up because the producers knew that the new Bond had to prove something to everyone, and he did. (Both actor and character).
As for Ms Brocolli, she has to experiment! Along with her Stepbrother, she is continuing one of the longest most expensive and popular film franchises in the world. - It has to evolve in order to survive.
I think the number of notches on 007's bedpost in CR and QoS was very appropriate for the stories in the films. I also think Bond shoul have a more hedonistic lifestyle in future films, also for character arch reasons.
I also think Bond- film should become more racy.
Think about it: DN had a girl who admits to killing her rapist. In FRWL a woman has sex with Bond to help steal a coding machine. In GE Pussy Galore (!) and her flying circus are thinly weilded lesbians. DEF features gay asassins.
This was very racy and risky back then.
Why not try a bisexual Bond girl, with 007 fighting a lesbian for her affections? Or Bond having a threesome? Or casting a porn star like Tera Patrick or Jenna Jameson (I have of course never heard of any of them ever in my life) in a Bond film?
This is not just my ID thinking out loud.
I think Bond should take risks, not only in the action scenes, but also in the "love" scenes.
Much of this must be done cleverly, we'r not making a PG 18 movie (or whatever it's called) here!
No safe sex then... :v
That said, I'm still hoping for a bit more in the way of recreational sex next time round :v
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
Aren't we all, Loeffelholz !
Oh sorry, you meant Bond
Huh??? Oh... ;% ...yeah. Sure. That's what I meant :v Bond. Of course.
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
Bond never uses condoms. :007)
Pierce Brosnan
One more thing, remember, he's still learning the ropes :007)
As Far as DC's Bond and the girls, IMO is that BABS influance in the new movies. In CR where Bond and Cammille are rolling around on the floor, I would have put them in bed, she gets the call Bond gets up to order more bubbly and he leaves. Again just my opinion but I have to agree Bond is not going to be the womanizer he was before.
Fiona: But of course, I forgot your ego, Mr. Bond. James Bond, who only has to make love to a woman and she starts to hear heavenly choirs singing.
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
I agree that it is not really just about how many women Bond beds. What has been lacking for me both in QOS and to a lesser extent in CR is that kind of background glamour, and hell yes I'll say it cleaveage. You know the kind of thing, a woman glimpsed in the background, or a a subtle sense of recognition between Bond and a lady (a good example happens to be in CR between Bond and that very cute receptionist at the Hrbour club) All this contributes to a climate and sense of sexiness and glamour irrespective of the number of notches on our mans bed post