If Dalton was in FYEO

JimmyBond0129JimmyBond0129 United States Posts: 263MI6 Agent
edited April 2009 in General James Bond Chat
Do you think it would be Timothy Dalton's best Bond film? I think it would probably be better than The Living Daylights but I don't know if it would be his best.
"I admire your courage, Miss?..." "Trench, Sylvia Trench."

"I admire your luck, Mister?..." "Bond, James Bond."
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  • Tilly Masterson 007Tilly Masterson 007 UKPosts: 1,472MI6 Agent
    I honestly can't imagine him in FYEO!

    Bizarre!
  • JimmyBond0129JimmyBond0129 United States Posts: 263MI6 Agent
    edited May 2009
    Tilly Masterson 007 wrote:
    I honestly can't imagine him in FYEO!

    Bizarre!

    That's one of the reasons why I don't like Roger Moore besides being too old for the part I think he outstayed his welcome. Moore should've hung up his shoulder holster after Moonraker.

    I think Tim Dalton should've been the go to guy for Bond back in the 1980's. :)
    "I admire your courage, Miss?..." "Trench, Sylvia Trench."

    "I admire your luck, Mister?..." "Bond, James Bond."
  • PeppermillPeppermill DelftPosts: 2,860MI6 Agent
    edited April 2009
    Do we really have to blame Roger Moore for staying too long? He was practically begged to stay on for FYEO, OP and AVTAK. He had one picture deals at that time, so Cubby could have had another actor play Bond any time he wanted, but they really wanted Moore to come back, and back, and back. Can you really blame someone for taking the deal when everybody is screaming for your return? The money was good and as far as I know, being an actor is still a profession. Roger Moore has said often enough that he got "a bith long in the tooth with playing Bond because it got really hard to find bad guys old enough to be punched knock-out by him." But MGM kept coming back to him and so he stayed on. :007)

    On topic.
    IMHO Roger Moore was great in FYEO and OP. AVTAK was too much I guess, but maybe with a better Bondgirl it could have been a good movie (JJAAAAAAAAAAAAAMMMMMMMMMMMMEEEEEESSSSSSSS SSAAAAAVVVVEEE MMMEEEE!!!!). If they had turned to Dalton earlier they would have had to change the entire feel of the movies, Dalton would have had other scripts to work with. It is hard to picture Dalton in a Moore movie.
    1. Ohmss 2. Frwl 3. Op 4. Tswlm 5. Tld 6. Ge 7. Yolt 8. Lald 9. Cr 10. Ltk 11. Dn 12. Gf 13. Qos 14. Mr 15. Tmwtgg 16. Fyeo 17. Twine 18. Sf 19. Tb 20 Tnd 21. Spectre 22 Daf 23. Avtak 24. Dad
  • JimmyBond0129JimmyBond0129 United States Posts: 263MI6 Agent
    edited April 2009
    Peppermill wrote:
    Do we really have to blame Roger Moore for staying too long? He was practically begged to stay on for FYEO.

    It is hard to picture Dalton in a Moore movie.

    Well Roger Moore didn't have to come back he could've been very insistant on quiting, and they could've completely rewrote the plot of For Your Eyes Only to Timothy Dalton's liking.
    "I admire your courage, Miss?..." "Trench, Sylvia Trench."

    "I admire your luck, Mister?..." "Bond, James Bond."
  • Mister WhiteMister White The NetherlandsPosts: 814MI6 Agent
    FYEO was a script for a harder Bond, the way Dalton played him as well. But at that time dalton would have been too young for the role.

    I'm not a very big fan of Moore, but I can't blaim him for coming back. At that time it was what people wanted to see.

    The atmosphere of the early eighties wasn't ready for Dalton's gritty portrayal of Bond anyway. It is only now that he finally gets the appreciation he deserves.
    "Christ, I miss the Cold War."
  • Sweepy the CatSweepy the Cat Halifax, West Yorkshire, EnglaPosts: 986MI6 Agent
    Mister White wrote:
    FYEO was a script for a harder Bond, the way Dalton played him as well. But at that time dalton would have been too young for the role.

    35 isn't too young to play Bond.
    207qoznfl4.gif
  • Mister WhiteMister White The NetherlandsPosts: 814MI6 Agent
    Sweepy the Cat wrote:
    Mister White wrote:
    FYEO was a script for a harder Bond, the way Dalton played him as well. But at that time dalton would have been too young for the role.

    35 isn't too young to play Bond.

    It's not too young now, but at the time people were used to seeing a Bond that was well into his fifties... 8-)
    "Christ, I miss the Cold War."
  • Suave AgentSuave Agent Posts: 50MI6 Agent
    edited April 2009
    JimmyBond0129 wrote:
    Tilly Masterson 007 wrote:
    I honestly can't imagine him in FYEO!

    Bizarre!

    That's one of the reasons why I don't like Roger Moore besides being too old for the part I think he outstayed his welcome. Moore should've hung up his shoulder holster after Moonraker.

    I think Tim Dalton should've been the go to guy for Bond back in the 1980's.:007)

    I rank Moore the worst Bond just from the way he dressed to the way that he displayed Bond as being unrealistic at all times.
    He would constantly be unharmed, also I know it was not his fault but Moonraker was terrible storyline especially with the space station that I can forgive him for.

    People target Lazenby as a flop but I think he was a better Bond then Moore-(this statement will cause a riot on these forums.)

    Dalton I think was the closest thing to Daniel Craig in the way that he represented a Bond that gets hurt emotionally, such as when Felix is captured and bitten by the shark he is hurt and goes on a similar rampage to Daniel Craig in QOS, acting without considering the consequences of his actions.

    Furthermore Dalton has a similar appearance to Brosnan so I liked how Brosnan followed.
  • shaken66shaken66 california usaPosts: 155MI6 Agent
    Speaking as one who saw the films when first released in the 70's and 80's, say what you will (or won't) about Sir Roger's acting, he displayed a certain charm that neither Lazenby or Dalton (who I like in his films) possessed and was perfect for its time. As much as I enjoy OHMSS as a story and film (and Diana Rigg, oh God!) I find GL very monotone, though I do think he may have developed given the chance. FYEO is one of my favorite Bond films just after a couple of SC's classics and DC's, and when Carole Bouquet says the movie title - last line... gulp! :)
    "How did he die?"
    "Your contact?" "Not well."
  • zaphodzaphod Posts: 1,183MI6 Agent
    Although not a fan of Moore I agree that the blame is due to a very lazy Eon rather than to the actor who continues to accept a role.While despite the drops in quality the films still raked in the cash Eon were content to continue.
  • LoeffelholzLoeffelholz The United States, With LovePosts: 8,998Quartermasters
    edited April 2009
    I think FYEO would have been an absolutely perfect time for Dalton to have stepped into the tux; it would have given him a nice run in which to develop his portrayal. Perhaps it might have kept a couple of my less favourite scenes---the hockey rink assault, for one :# ---out of the picture.

    Similar,y, for Roger Moore, I think MR would have been a perfect swan song---a serendipitous time for him to have stepped away from what was a very successful four-film run, at the height of his game. Sadly, however, it wasn't to be.
    Check out my Amazon author page! Mark Loeffelholz
    "I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
    "Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
  • AlexAlex The Eastern SeaboardPosts: 2,694MI6 Agent
    Happily for me he did stay on.

    I think FYEO's an amazing piece of pre-CGI entertainment with a light hearted actor throwing in a dirty performance and proving he simply wasn't a one trick pony. Moore's Bond was gregarious and cold hearted all in one. Had mega star quality charm to add to the proceedings, and never showed a trace of dourness. He was a larger then life Bond and was very popular.

    There are fewer things better then Moore nodding to the opponent during the country chase or telling General Gogol off at the finale. Much as I like Dalton, I'm very thankful Roger Moore accepted those offers.
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,054MI6 Agent
    Alex wrote:
    Happily for me he did stay on.

    I think FYEO's an amazing piece of pre-CGI entertainment with a light hearted actor throwing in a dirty performance and proving he simply wasn't a one trick pony. Moore's Bond was gregarious and cold hearted all in one. Had mega star quality charm to add to the proceedings, and never showed a trace of dourness. He was a larger then life Bond and was very popular.

    There are fewer things better then Moore nodding to the opponent during the country chase or telling General Gogol off at the finale. Much as I like Dalton, I'm very thankful Roger Moore accepted those offers.
    I completely agree. :D Putting aside my dislike of Dalton's Bond, I thought Moore was superb in FRWL. I also thought it was a great improvement over the fun, but enormously flawed MR.
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • Sweepy the CatSweepy the Cat Halifax, West Yorkshire, EnglaPosts: 986MI6 Agent
    Dan Same wrote:
    Putting aside my dislike of Dalton's Bond, I thought Moore was superb in FRWL.

    ?:)
    207qoznfl4.gif
  • BarbelBarbel ScotlandPosts: 37,863Chief of Staff
    Dan Same wrote:
    I thought Moore was superb in FRWL.

    ... though not as good as Connery in FYEO. :007)
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,054MI6 Agent
    edited April 2009
    Sweepy the Cat wrote:
    Dan Same wrote:
    Putting aside my dislike of Dalton's Bond, I thought Moore was superb in FRWL.

    ?:)
    I hate Dalton's Bond. He's by far my least favourite Bond. I'll be happy to expand if asked, but the major reasons are that I think he was incredibly serious to the point of being boring and I think he lacked a personality. A great guy and a talented actor; however I truly disliked his Bond and IMO his two performances were the worst in the entire series (with LTK being the worst of the worst.)
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,054MI6 Agent
    Barbel wrote:
    Dan Same wrote:
    I thought Moore was superb in FRWL.

    ... though not as good as Connery in FYEO. :007)
    True, but couldn't one say that about every Bond film? :D
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • Sweepy the CatSweepy the Cat Halifax, West Yorkshire, EnglaPosts: 986MI6 Agent
    Dan Same wrote:
    the major reasons are that I think he was incredibly serious to the point of being boring

    Come on, the cello-sledging, swordfish-fighting Bond wasn't that bad :))

    I always saw Dalton as a more Bond-like version of Craig LOL
    207qoznfl4.gif
  • BarbelBarbel ScotlandPosts: 37,863Chief of Staff
    Dan Same wrote:
    Barbel wrote:
    Dan Same wrote:
    I thought Moore was superb in FRWL.

    ... though not as good as Connery in FYEO. :007)
    True, but couldn't one say that about every Bond film? :D

    Very true, but I think you've missed the point in both Sweepy's post and mine- take a closer look at the last few posts, Dan!

    Seriously, I think FYEO (sic) features Moore's best 007 performance. Being of an age to have caught the film on its release, I remember the pleasure of seeing genuine Fleming material on screen for the first time in ages. Any faults the film may have (the score- title song excepted-, the slightly too long action sequences) aren't Moore's doing, and as stated above his star quality and often underrated acting skills shine through here.
  • BarbelBarbel ScotlandPosts: 37,863Chief of Staff
    Sweepy the Cat wrote:
    Come on, the cello-sledging, swordfish-fighting Bond wasn't that bad :))

    I always saw Dalton as a more Bond-like version of Craig LOL

    Hey, nail on the head, Sweeps!
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,054MI6 Agent
    Barbel just Pmed me to let me in on the joke. :)) It certainly puts Sweepy's and Barbel's replies in a new light. :D I'll respond to Sweepy's reply but I will also re-respond to Barbel's original reply. I can't believe that I didn't get the joke. ;%
    Sweepy the Cat wrote:
    Come on, the cello-sledging, swordfish-fighting Bond wasn't that bad :))
    There were a couple of okay action sequences in TLD (such as the fight at the back of the plane) but none were particularly memorable IMO, and nor did they distract me from what I regard as a horrible performance.

    To be honest, there were a few Dalton moments I do like (such as the killing of Sanchez in LTK), and I love that Dalton loved playing Bond, but there's a reason I generally stay away from 'Dalton appreciation' threads. ;)
    Sweepy the Cat wrote:
    I always saw Dalton as a more Bond-like version of Craig LOL
    Considering I don't particularly like Craig, that's not exactly a compliment IMO. ;)
    Barbel wrote:
    Dan Same wrote:
    I thought Moore was superb in FRWL.

    ... though not as good as Connery in FYEO. :007)
    :)) That's a good one. :D
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • BarbelBarbel ScotlandPosts: 37,863Chief of Staff
    Dan Same wrote:
    Sweepy the Cat wrote:
    I always saw Dalton as a more Bond-like version of Craig LOL
    Considering I don't particularly like Craig, that's not exactly a compliment IMO. ;)

    Agreed; I'm not a Craig admirer, and saying that Connery/Lazenby/Moore/Dalton/Brosnan (hell, add in Nelson/Niven/Holness/Jayston/Stephens as well if you like- well, maybe not Stephens :D) is more Bond-like than Craig is for me self-evident. I'd phrase it as "I always saw Craig as a less Bond-like version of Dalton".
  • LoeffelholzLoeffelholz The United States, With LovePosts: 8,998Quartermasters
    I'll concede that FYEO features one of Moore's better performances---it's just that it led to OP, and then AVTAK :#

    FYEO was written for a new actor, which I think is why some excellent Fleming elements---plus the PTS callback to Bond's status as a widower---were used, and they should have gone with the new actor. Moore's creakiness first began to manifest itself in MR; by FYEO it was worse. After that... :(
    Check out my Amazon author page! Mark Loeffelholz
    "I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
    "Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
  • christothemanchristotheman AustraliaPosts: 254MI6 Agent
    Cubby Broccoli offered Dalton the role of bond mid roger-moore's era as bond, Dalton refused saying he was too young for the role.
    "Another time, Another Place"
  • Dan SameDan Same Victoria, AustraliaPosts: 6,054MI6 Agent
    Barbel wrote:
    Dan Same wrote:
    Sweepy the Cat wrote:
    I always saw Dalton as a more Bond-like version of Craig LOL
    Considering I don't particularly like Craig, that's not exactly a compliment IMO. ;)
    Agreed; I'm not a Craig admirer, and saying that Connery/Lazenby/Moore/Dalton/Brosnan (hell, add in Nelson/Niven/Holness/Jayston/Stephens as well if you like- well, maybe not Stephens :D) is more Bond-like than Craig is for me self-evident. I'd phrase it as "I always saw Craig as a less Bond-like version of Dalton".
    :D {[]
    "He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
  • Napoleon PluralNapoleon Plural LondonPosts: 10,467MI6 Agent
    Loeffelholz wrote:

    FYEO was written for a new actor, which I think is why some excellent Fleming elements---plus the PTS callback to Bond's status as a widower---were used

    And also maybe accounts for its formulaic nature, as with CR and LALD, both debuts. It's like: sea, sand and sex and straightforward plot to bed in the new bloke, but this backfires when old guy returns and it's nothing new to see...
    "This is where we leave you Mr Bond."

    Roger Moore 1927-2017
  • AlexAlex The Eastern SeaboardPosts: 2,694MI6 Agent
    What a drag.

    It's a shame I can't post anything positive anymore on a film I admire.
  • Napoleon PluralNapoleon Plural LondonPosts: 10,467MI6 Agent
    Why not Alex? ?:) Cos you've run out of nice things to add? :p

    As good as Moore's 'dirty performance' is, we'd all rather see Carol Bouquet's 'dirty performance'! :D
    "This is where we leave you Mr Bond."

    Roger Moore 1927-2017
  • JimmyBond0129JimmyBond0129 United States Posts: 263MI6 Agent
    edited May 2009
    What the hell are you talking about? Sean Connery was in From Russia With Love not Roger Moore.
    "I admire your courage, Miss?..." "Trench, Sylvia Trench."

    "I admire your luck, Mister?..." "Bond, James Bond."
  • LoeffelholzLoeffelholz The United States, With LovePosts: 8,998Quartermasters
    edited May 2009
    Alex wrote:
    What a drag.

    It's a shame I can't post anything positive anymore on a film I admire.

    I wouldn't say that at all, as I thought your defence of FYEO was ably-executed and well-written. I even agree (mostly) with your points; FYEO was an effective course correction for Bond after bringing him back from outer space. I enjoyed the cold-war underpinnings of the story, and the welcome (overdue) return of Fleming to the proceedings---and, unlike many, I'm a fan of the Maggie/Denis Thatcher bit at the end ( :)) :)) :)) ). I rank FYEO 17th overall, but this speaks more to my affection for the 16 films above it than it does to any negative feelings I have for FYEO.

    I'm just not a Moore admirer (as James Bond)---although there's no denying his popularity, charm or star quality---so naturally I'd have preferred to see Dalton (or anyone) take a shot at it.

    I think a degree of dourness is extremely Flemingesque...and therefore Bondian, which is why I consider Moore's work in The Wild Geese my favourite of his performances. If only he'd played Bond like that...
    Check out my Amazon author page! Mark Loeffelholz
    "I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
    "Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
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