Quantum vs. SPECTRE
Infernorhythm
Los AngelesPosts: 88MI6 Agent
I've noticed a lot of discussions on different Bond websites comparing Quantum to SPECTRE. Much of the conversation is that Quantum is nothing more than a SPECTRE expy, and if they had the rights, they would have called it SPECTRE. For me, that doesn't really work.
I have to applaud the filmmakers for making a far superior evil organization.
With all respects to Fleming, SPECTRE isn't really that great of an evil organization. If I recall, the Thunderball novel established that SPECTRE was far from a permanent organization, instead it was a one-off or short run operation. When the ransom plan failed, they split up. Blofeld went on to private run operations, at Piz Gloria and later Japan. SPECTRE was really nothing more than a plan, not so much an organization, concocted by a collection of villainous groups. Of course, in the films, SPECTRE lasted much longer, and was a far more permanent organization. An interesting thing about SPECTRE was how open they were. They were very much in the open, with public ransoms and operations.
Quantum on the other hand is far more devious, and IMHO, far scarier. They're a permanent group, and QoS gave the impression that they have been around for a while. They're CEOs and politicians, movers and shakers secretly exploiting nations and organizations for their own profit. One of the greatest ideas from QoS, even if it was never extrapolated on like so many of the concepts in it, was that Quantum would take different nations, use them, and then pretty much cast them aside when they were done. Haiti vs. Bolivia was a great idea. And they worked in secret. It was a brilliant idea, the secret back door deals and intimidation that made international decisions.
SPECTRE was a plot that got stretched into an organization by EON Films, but really never worked beyond their initial literary purpose. Quantum though, that is a genius, creepy idea that works very well with the modern Bond. I have a ton of problems with QoS, but I do hope the producers bring back Quantum again in some form in later films, because the concept is too good to abandon.
I have to applaud the filmmakers for making a far superior evil organization.
With all respects to Fleming, SPECTRE isn't really that great of an evil organization. If I recall, the Thunderball novel established that SPECTRE was far from a permanent organization, instead it was a one-off or short run operation. When the ransom plan failed, they split up. Blofeld went on to private run operations, at Piz Gloria and later Japan. SPECTRE was really nothing more than a plan, not so much an organization, concocted by a collection of villainous groups. Of course, in the films, SPECTRE lasted much longer, and was a far more permanent organization. An interesting thing about SPECTRE was how open they were. They were very much in the open, with public ransoms and operations.
Quantum on the other hand is far more devious, and IMHO, far scarier. They're a permanent group, and QoS gave the impression that they have been around for a while. They're CEOs and politicians, movers and shakers secretly exploiting nations and organizations for their own profit. One of the greatest ideas from QoS, even if it was never extrapolated on like so many of the concepts in it, was that Quantum would take different nations, use them, and then pretty much cast them aside when they were done. Haiti vs. Bolivia was a great idea. And they worked in secret. It was a brilliant idea, the secret back door deals and intimidation that made international decisions.
SPECTRE was a plot that got stretched into an organization by EON Films, but really never worked beyond their initial literary purpose. Quantum though, that is a genius, creepy idea that works very well with the modern Bond. I have a ton of problems with QoS, but I do hope the producers bring back Quantum again in some form in later films, because the concept is too good to abandon.
"You're both, what's the expression? Damaged goods."
Comments
I think Quantum is so interesting because they don't have armies of thugs or henchmen, they just have the right people in the right places. All the muscle they use is police or military ordered by the people they deal with like in this case, the CIA or men loyal to an ousted dictator. There is little to tie them in with and hence the reason it's a true shadow orginization.
I hope the film-makers don't solely concentrate on Quantum though, just keep it simmering for a couple of films down the line.
http://apbateman.com
Quantum seem hard to define and they're still very mysterious. How old are they? Who is their leader? What is their master plan? How deep have they infiltrated the governments and intelligence agencies?
Hopefully this all be answered but I had an idea for the master plan. I'll post it in the Bond 23 ideas thread.
Seriously now, this is a great thread. Quantum is by far the more superior organization. The whole "I've got nukes or a satellite capable of destroying New York" unless I get 1,000,000,000 dollars is just too far fetched.
However, high ranking leaders of industry and politicians etc. getting their resources together and creating a secret society for the sole purpose of making money for themselves makes complete sense. Hell, there's several conspiracy theorists out there that would argue that the exact thing is occurring in our world today. There's talk of secret organizations like the NWO, there's peopel that theorize the Iraq war with the US is all about oil control. So I tip my hat to the creators of Quantum -a villainous group that reflects the times we live in.
I see in future films that Bond will work his way up through the Quantum ranks and keep finding someone more powerful and cunning than the last. The greatest thing about Quantum is that it's not just a group of people, it's an ideal that these corrupt individuals share. You kill the leader of Quantum and the organization will still go on, they'll just appoint a new leader from the ranks. The possibilities for this group and Bond now are endless.
On the other hand, the whole conspiracy thing can seem a bit nuts and you never get to the bottom of it. It's like those people who have a thing about the Freemasons... It's not as emotionally uplifting as battling a straightforward villain you can defeat.
Roger Moore 1927-2017
Care to elaborate?
http://apbateman.com
SPECTRE was an external threat, a group of criminals who were attacking and threatening the West from the outside. Whereas Quantum's woven into the fabric of the very society Bond is trying to defend. M uncovers a high-ranking member of the conspiracy and it turns out he's a "special adviser to the Prime Minister" - what are you supposed to do when your enemy is your own boss?
It was a great concept, and I'm very much looking forward to seeing how they handle it.
Quantum came from the 2000s, a much murkier time, when public faith in government and intelligence is at an all time low, which makes "the enemy at the top" (like the Syndicate in X-files, Palpatine in the Star Wars prequels, Cobra in the new G. I. Joe movie) a bad guy of choice.
The reason? A gentleman by the name of Ernst Stavro Blofeld.
He was the face, character and menace of SPECTRE.
Until Quantum reveals the head man (or woman?) for Bond to go up against, comparisons are invalid. Bond (and the series) needs Quantum. And a new Blofeld.
The type of villian that makes men like Stromberg, Drax and Zorin feel like second-class upstarts. I'm talking big here, folks. Amateurs like Whittaker and Kristatos need not apply.
A big man with big plans. Remember when Goldfinger yells out:"EXCEPT CRIME!": that's the kind of vision that the series should demand of its villians. Bad-guys that are worthy to go up against the world's greatest secret agent.
Anybody who dismisses that Bond villians shouldn't be larger than life should take a serious read of Fleming. And quick.
He didn't write big villians. He wrote some of the BIGGEST villians in the history of fiction.
Bond deserves to go against up the world's smartest and toughest bad guys. Anything less is an insult to 007.
So far, so good for Quantum but I like my Bond villians face-to-face and, eventually, the curtain must rise on Quantum's big cheese.
And only then, will we know if Quantum deserves to be mentioned alongside SPECTRE.
"Of course, SPECTRE. Then it wasn't a Russian show, after all."
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
They've put the kibbosh on Bond 23, after all...
Roger Moore 1927-2017
SPECTRE is the stuff of legend, but when you call yourself the "SPecial Executive for Counter-intelligence, Terrorism, Revenge and Extortion" then yeah, you're not what one could call subtle about your evilness. Not knocking it, but it's a little cartoonish compared to Quantum - especially in the later Blofeld/SPECTRE era, when everyone seems to know about them and their increasingly OTT plots to destroy the world. SPECTRE was far more intimidating when it was a collection of suits led by a guy whose face we never see than it was when it consisted of henchmen in jumpsuits and wacky SciFi schemes.