Long Barreled Colt from the novels.

0013

A thought occured to me. If Bond had a long barreled Colt wouldn't it be easier to use with a supressor?

Just my side thought after the Walther discussion.

Cheers

0013

7289

Hanging a "can" on a Colt 1911 is difficult because of the way the slide and barrel unlock after firing. A heavy cylinder on the end of the barrel would probably cause the weapon to jam. A silencer could be mounted if it were attached to the slide via the barrel bushing, that would allow the barrel to move normally.

Movie 1911's are converted to a straight "blowback" or unlocked operation for use with low powered blanks. They can then be fitted with all kinds of fancy acesssories that look good on screen, but are not "real world".

Literary Bond's "long barreled .45 Colt Special" was his long range gun. He felt that with it he could take out car tyres at 100 yards. Bond never gets to use it for that purpose because his Bentley is always wrecked before th Colt can be employed. He does get to put this pistol to use against Russian spies in "From a View to a Kill", but nearly gets killed when he fails to take the safety off while holding a prisoner at bay.

Silencers seem to be of some interest right now, but there use in Bond Thrillers was really liimited. Bond's silenced pistol was the .25 Beretta. The real life Geoffrey Boothroyd, wrote to Fleming and was very critical of both the Beretta and the use of the silencer. In Boothroyd's opinion the Beretta was very unpowered and a sillencer was unecessary, because in real life most people could not tell a guunshot from a door slam. Boothroyd would use .45 caliber blanks to blow out the candles of his birthday cake - and was never reported to the police by his neighbors!

After "From Russia with Love" in which Bond is brought to deaths door by Rosa Klebb, all because his Beretta and silencer got wrapped up in his clothing, Bond never again screws a silencer into the muzzle of his pistol.

The movies are something else, and as long as something looks nice and dramatic, it's used. Unlike Fleming, the films make little effort to be "real". For more on literary Bond's guns:

http://jamesbond.ajb007.co.uk/handguns-of-james-bond/

thesecretagent

I've read the novels and have never worked out if Bond's long barelled colt is actually a .45 1911, or a revolver chambered for .45 long colt. Any ideas anyone?

As to the initial question - if Bond's weapon is indeed a 1911, then some floating barrel autos suffer from use of a sound moderator because the barrel is forced down and the integrity of the slide can be at issue, but not all semi-auto models do. The Browning HP35 for instance works well with a silencer, has the same floating barrel design as the 1911 (and the same designer after all). I haven't personally seen or used a silenced 1911, but I can vouch for the HP35 and it is very similar in design.
If Bond's .45 was a revolver, then silencers are pretty limiting because of the gap between the cylinder and the barrel. Shrouds can be fitted for a very effective silent weapon and I've seen French special forces do this to .357 magnum Smith & Wessons, but reloading is a seriously time related issue.

7289

"I've read the novels and have never worked out if Bond's long barelled colt is actually a .45 1911, or a revolver chambered for .45 long colt. Any ideas anyone?"

Bond's .45 is a 1911 design, at the risk of repeating - check out this article. ( I wrote it - even though the author is now listed as SICO )


http://jamesbond.ajb007.co.uk/handguns-of-james-bond/

Loeffelholz

7289 wrote:

Bond's .45 is a 1911 design, at the risk of repeating - check out this article. ( I wrote it - even though the author is now listed as SICO )

Still an excellent article, 7289...and that happened with all my articles as well... ?:)

7289

Thanks Loeff's!

Glad to hear I'm not alone ... I think?

0013

I read the article, and being a 1911 fan myself, I would go with it. I only mention it because as part of the research for my novel I came across a couple of books on silencers.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/Workbench-Silencers-Art-Improvised-Designs/dp/0873648951
http://www.amazon.com/More-Workbench-Silencers-George-Hollenback/dp/087364994X

Now I must stress, I read these PURLEY for research purposes for my novel, which is about a hitman, not because I was planning to become one. So anyone with that kind of mentalitly, I advise you don't think that way either.

But they are on Scribd. Which is where I read them.

And on them, is a long barreled 1911 Colt onto which a supressor was built. It is a normal 1911 with the barrel from one of those long slide guns. You know, the one in the first Terminator movie

And that combined with the excellent article at http://jamesbond.ajb007.co.uk/handguns-of-james-bond/ made me think
Hm, maybe Bond could use it as an improvised silent weapon, if he got the parts which as these books it's a lot easier than you'd think.

Now I KNOW for a fact this wasn't in Flemings mind when he wrote it, the Long Barreled Colt was the car gun and that was it.But it may give us a realistic reason WHY the Colt was long barreled in the first place.

Its one of those coincidedces but it made sense at the time.


0013

thesecretagent

7289 wrote:

"I've read the novels and have never worked out if Bond's long barelled colt is actually a .45 1911, or a revolver chambered for .45 long colt. Any ideas anyone?"

Bond's .45 is a 1911 design, at the risk of repeating - check out this article. ( I wrote it - even though the author is now listed as SICO )


http://jamesbond.ajb007.co.uk/handguns-of-james-bond/

Thanks for that - good article by the way.

I must have missed the reference to the safety, that would be the clue some of us have been looking for.

Mr_Ice

It is indeed the only clue. I didn't read the short stories until much later in life, so I always saw the car gun as a single action Army Colt for some reason. I remember reading the scene where he puts the goggles on and cranks down the windshield on the Bentley: oh MAN that was good stuff. I was so disappointed when he didn't get to actually shoot something with the .45. After I read 7289's article a while ago, I re-read the scene. Yes, in fact I wanted Bond to shoot something with the 1911 just as much.

-{

7289

Thanks for the compliments on the article!!!

One thing I always loved about Fleming was his grand imagination when it came to Bond's hardware. From the lowly .25 Beretta to the mysterious long barreled Colt, each choice was imaginative and different!

Let's not forget that back when Fleming first penned his thrillers it was extremely rare that an author would be so specific when describing firearms. I am sure of one thing, if Fleming described a weapon, it was something he once saw or handled. It may be that certain details like "sawn" barrels, long barrels and sharpened firing pins are imaginary - but Commander Fleming was up to his neck in secret operations during and perhaps after WW2. So I'd would never be quick to dismiss IF's observations - not that anyone here has done so.

For you fans of the Colt, a silenced version does appear in the film Dr. No in the hands of one of the "Three Blind Mice" and later in the clutches of Professor Dent. Only when the Professor wields the Colt, Bond identifies it famously as a "Smith & Wesson, and you've had your six..."

I don't think anyone ever claimed the films were infallible!

thesecretagent

7289 wrote:

Thanks for the compliments on the article!!!

One thing I always loved about Fleming was his grand imagination when it came to Bond's hardware. From the lowly .25 Beretta to the mysterious long barreled Colt, each choice was imaginative and different!

Let's not forget that back when Fleming first penned his thrillers it was extremely rare that an author would be so specific when describing firearms. I am sure of one thing, if Fleming described a weapon, it was something he once saw or handled. It may be that certain details like "sawn" barrels, long barrels and sharpened firing pins are imaginary - but Commander Fleming was up to his neck in secret operations during and perhaps after WW2. So I'd would never be quick to dismiss IF's observations - not that anyone here has done so.

For you fans of the Colt, a silenced version does appear in the film Dr. No in the hands of one of the "Three Blind Mice" and later in the clutches of Professor Dent. Only when the Professor wields the Colt, Bond identifies it famously as a "Smith & Wesson, and you've had your six..."

I don't think anyone ever claimed the films were infallible!

Check that scene - Bond is actually using a silenced Browning as well, and not a walther. It's another example of inaccuracy within the film industry involving weaponry.

0013

thesecretagent wrote:

Check that scene - Bond is actually using a silenced Browning as well, and not a walther. It's another example of inaccuracy within the film industry involving weaponry.

Yes, an FN 1910, in .32ACP, they are apparently well suited to taking a suppressor.

Also, it's a smaller version of the FN1903, as Bond used in Licence Renewed.

Mark Hazard

0013 wrote:

thesecretagent wrote:

Check that scene - Bond is actually using a silenced Browning as well, and not a walther. It's another example of inaccuracy within the film industry involving weaponry.

Yes, an FN 1910, in .32ACP, they are apparently well suited to taking a suppressor.

Also, it's a smaller version of the FN1903, as Bond used in Licence Renewed.

From my discussions/correspondense with the late Geoffrey Boothroyd, the suppressed FN also operated better than the suppressed PPK when used for firing blanks repeatedly - hence the change.

Tecolote

When I first read the books a long time ago I assumed the "long barreled Colt .45" meant a New Service or M1917,since 1911s with extended barrels were very,very rare.
Regarding suppressors, the CIA had a suppressor w/ barrel kit for the Walther P38 back in the day, a with a reminder to pick up the ejected shells if possible...
As to the FN 1910 in Dr.No, the only firearm I can absolutely be sure that was blank adapted
was Dent's 1911,which clearly cycles all the way to slide lock in the scene.When Bond shoots Dent with FN ,there is a cut between shots, and I have honestly never been able to tell whether than FN actually cycled or not. Does anybody know for sure?

Regards,
Tecolote

Asp9mm

The FN had a silencer that was secured by a solid bar right into the chamber. It doubt, due to this, that it could cycle blanks.

thesecretagent

He does kind of just pull it out without twisting, it looks to me like a prop guy's vision of a silencer, I'm surprised Dent wasn't simply impaled with it on the first shot.

Reminds me of a club I was shooting at once. It was a pick & mix of weapons and ordanance, and I was using a semi-auto .22 rifle on pop-up targets, when there was an almighty puff of smoke further down the line and this spiralling blur headed towards the target. A muzzle loader with a flintlock musket had left the tamping rod in the barrel and it was launched like some kind of gunpowder powered spear. I love civillian-run ranges the best...