Live And Let Die classification
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Posts: 45MI6 Agent
It's a thing I've always thought about but never brought up on any 007 forums or discussed at length with any Bond enthusiasts, not many on the streets out there actually, but,
I sometimes have thought that Moore's first 1973 feature in Live and Let Die should of been classified as a '15' certificate
I remember the first few times I saw it (obviously younger then), but there really seemed to be an ominous tone throughout the movie and there was more than one occasion when I thought 'this isin't a kids movie'
The early scenes in a crime ridden 70s New York and the threatening appearance of Mister Big (kananga wasn't so intimidating), the Voodoo/Tarot cards and drugs background seemed more fitting to a more mature audience than younger children
I always remember watching it years back and there was always an uncomfortable feel to it, although the re-appearance of JW pepper and the police chases in Louisiana were a welcome relief
First use of "****" in a James Bond movie, unusual for 1973 and some rather derogatory language for both colored people and whites too sometime, but looking back it seems a bit tame now
all told, I never thought this should of been a parental guidance and certainly if '12' certificates had been available at the time it should of been given, even now, given the chance it still remains a PG but by todays standards probably seems tame compared to the recent Danny Craig releases.
but years back I always remember being unsettled by this movie and didn't feel it was appropriate for younger kids
I sometimes have thought that Moore's first 1973 feature in Live and Let Die should of been classified as a '15' certificate
I remember the first few times I saw it (obviously younger then), but there really seemed to be an ominous tone throughout the movie and there was more than one occasion when I thought 'this isin't a kids movie'
The early scenes in a crime ridden 70s New York and the threatening appearance of Mister Big (kananga wasn't so intimidating), the Voodoo/Tarot cards and drugs background seemed more fitting to a more mature audience than younger children
I always remember watching it years back and there was always an uncomfortable feel to it, although the re-appearance of JW pepper and the police chases in Louisiana were a welcome relief
First use of "****" in a James Bond movie, unusual for 1973 and some rather derogatory language for both colored people and whites too sometime, but looking back it seems a bit tame now
all told, I never thought this should of been a parental guidance and certainly if '12' certificates had been available at the time it should of been given, even now, given the chance it still remains a PG but by todays standards probably seems tame compared to the recent Danny Craig releases.
but years back I always remember being unsettled by this movie and didn't feel it was appropriate for younger kids
Comments
But seriously folks, when was the time when it became wrong to say 'colored'. I know it is, but from a historical persepctive I'm interested, as it used to be the NAACP - National Association for the Advancement of Colored People.
Roger Moore 1927-2017
Bond girl Seymour has to be up there in the Top 3 with Andress and Bach
still remember being scared years back by the scarecrows with rotating heads
I think the Voodoo theme best of all encapsulated any fear or bad thinking about what went on, but as stated there was some worthwhile moments of humor here and there to smooth over any rising tensions
Paul McCartney and Wings put together one of the best theme tumes ever, but the end bit with the Baron laughing away on the front of the train could of been left out, that wasn't scary, just looked damn stupid
Moore should of been involved before this really, but was involved in other projects. Rumor has it that one Clint Eastwood was even invited to play the role but he politely declined. 8-)
Lald has always been one of my favourite films, and I forgive it's 1970's feel that cmdratticus sums up nicely. It is nearly 40yrs old after all....!
I've just returned from new Orleans, where I went on a voodoo tour of the city and have to say i found the religion fascinating.
Baron samedi is only one of the lua (l'wa) spirits of louisiana and Haitian voodoo, operating between the two worlds, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loa and I thought the film utilised this well - menacing but also fascinating.... Never quite vaudeville....
Decide for yourself if the train-ending is farcical.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gX3wGWHRlXQ&feature=youtube_gdata_player
Who didn't love the mechanised scarecrow heads that shoot poor Rosie....
Mr Big uses the power of the tarot which he believes in, for himself, yet clearly uses the terror and menace of the religion as a shield to his activities, in a similar way to Dr No and the "dragon".....
Also, note it came out alongside the excellent Shaft series of movies and you can see traces of their influence in the film - shades of Bourne today, only 40yrs ago?....
Finally, thank goodness we've all ( mostly....) moved on from those debilitating times, where the word colour / color itself was abused...
After all it's actions that speak louder, never truer than today....
Semper fi.
KKK Recycling Scheme
Roger Moore 1927-2017
DN PG
FRWL PG
GF M15+
TB PG
YOLT PG
OHMSS PG
DAF M15+
LALD PG
TMWTGG PG
TSWLM M15+
MR PG
FYEO M15+
OP PG
AVTAK M15+
TLD PG
LTK M15+
Interestingly when they used to be shown on TV around the same time I purchased my videos the people at the broadcast station followed the same classifications except LALD which they clearly advertised as an M15+ movie.
hardly any difference between them, apart from a scene with Onatopp and Natalya when the plane crashes and some extended highlights in the Bean/Brosnan fight at Cuba location
but I can't agree with
Goldfinger for over 15's, eh?
Diamonds are Forever, hardly going to scare kids IMO
Spy Who Loved Me, again, nowhere near a 15
and A View To A Kill, another 15?
really?
that did raise a snigger
I think really, at the time of release, only 1973's LALD and 1989's License to Kill actually are deserving of a '15' certificate, oh, and while I'm at it, Casino Royale too, that was more brutal than usual Bond escapades.
Will the day ever arrive when 007 warrants an '18' rating, never say never, but it won't be in our lifetimes
Amen indeed brother!....
Funny nap.... The pointy hat has always had a slightly different meaning to me... With a D on it....
But one can never get enough of the fingerbobs....sort of clangers before space travel..
On the Certs - nice list wint and Kidd far out... Really useful - puts it into context nicely...
We'd all have issues with some or all of them now, but we often forget the comtemporary influence.... Some films came out in the middle of "storms" which offered little leniency irrespective of the actual film...sign of the times....
However DFG.... Daf got it's cert because of the bikini throttling segment - violence against women was being trodden pretty hard and that scene is often clipped for tv.. Clealy a film is certified in its entirely ( or re-cut) and as such I understand why daf got bopped...
Again gf is often saddled with the pussy-luggage - even today... In the age of RAP Go figure....
I think there were fewer classifications in the 1960s/1970s and if these films were released today (or re-released as DVDs) some of them would move upo the ratings scale - just like GE went from a 12 to a 15 thanks to the Xenia headbutt scene.
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
Agreed. "Coloured" is old hat, just like the offensive "negro" and "nigger". I've heard it said that even calling someone "black" is deemed offensive nowadays, too. Though I can't see why really. What other term are we meant to use, pray tell? It's political correctness gone mad...as Stewart Lee would say.
No, I was told it in conversation. The person said, "Don't say black, that's racist - you say coloured now." Odd, I thought. 8-)
I agree on Dr Kanga being black - it doesn't matter to me at all. It's a refreshing change, in fact. I'd really love to see another black James Bond villain at some point, especially as Leiterr and Moneypenny are now black in the Daniel Craig films. I agree wholeheartedly on the Kananga black villain plot - it's rather like the German newspaper that refertred to "...the Jew Malcolm Rifkind" in the early 1990s and deservedly got much flak for it. Human beings first. Races/religions/creeds second. That's my thoughts.
And while we're on the subject, I think I'll renew my request for Idris Elba as the next Bond villain. I think he would be an interesting and formidable match for Craig's Bond (or any Bond for that matter!) Anybody got a number for Mike or Babs? :007)
:v
In the next century, the idea of calling someone "black" or "white" will seem so quaint, I conjure.
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
I think Michael Jackson's got there before you with 'Black or White' (1991).
Yeah, I think Zadie Smith made a similar point, the long suffering feeling when, as a black person, you're reading a book and a new character is introduced, and it's spelt out that they're black... like, yeah, and?
It is a strange perspective from a white person's pov to read that. But sometimes it is relevant in a way, if the person also has built up an identity around his or her colour, in terms of their culture and way of relating to the world. Less so in the US arguably, though not always. Of course, what people overlook is that colour is often imbued with nationality too, so it does come with those characteristics too, so to call someone 'black' might be a lazy, half-assed way of saying they're African or Caribbean. You wouldn't get flack for calling someone 'German' or 'French'... the whole race issue is debated in a very simplistic way, almost begging for misunderstanding or accusations of unPCdom.
Roger Moore 1927-2017
Oh that's rubbish, totally wrong. Alan Hanson, football pundit, got into trouble for using that word 'coloured' on Match of the Day, quite funny as he was badmouthing racism at the time! It's not intentionally insulting usually, and I can follow the logic of it making more sense, in that often 'black' folk are not literally black anyway! I mean Barack Obama is as close to being white as he is to being wholly black in colour! But you know, if it is found offensive, then you know, end of, we use another word.
Roger Moore 1927-2017
As Michael Jackson said in his Martin Bashir interview in 2003, black people were called coloured people as they come in many different shades of colour. He's right, of course. Personally, I'll stick with using "black" and "white".
but i see them as men ,now you mention it .
As for that poster I mentioned, he appeared to feel a bit contrite after I called him out, and I believe he learned a little something from our discussion. Which is a good thing, because we can all benefit by learning from each other.
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS