Lance Armstrong and doping
toutbrun
Washington, USAPosts: 1,501MI6 Agent
Does it matter if Lance Armstrong is doping? A lot of very credible doctors report once in a while that in their understanding, 95% of riders dope. So who cares if Lance is doping? He's still doing it, winning the TDF and riding his bike 8 hours a day.
Am I the only one who thinks doping isn't really that big of a deal? And what do you think these riders feel - they will always know that whatever they win they cheated and can't truly appreciate it - but if they didn't they couldn't compete because everyone is doing it?
Am I the only one who thinks doping isn't really that big of a deal? And what do you think these riders feel - they will always know that whatever they win they cheated and can't truly appreciate it - but if they didn't they couldn't compete because everyone is doing it?
If you can't trust a Swiss banker, what's the world come to?
Comments
I am of the opinion that it matters a lot if he and others do dope or not:
There are riders in the field like Jens Voigt who don't and they are simply being cheated by those who do!
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
That being said. Lance last won the Tour in 2005, and hasn't competed in the Tour for the last 3 years. I don't see any reason to continue to pursue charges at this point.
Cycling does appear slowly to be getting it's house in order. Team Sky are showing the way forward with their scientific approach to racing. Go Wiggo!
I am a big cycling fan. I hate to see the sports reputation tarnished by doping. I also hate that it seems that no one can win the Tour without being accused of doping. Wiggins will be accused of doping too and it’s a shame.
http://apbateman.com
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
Agreed. It's pretty widely understood at this point.
It was Landis and Hamilton, sorry
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
Two people who swore that they never doped and then admitted that they did. Not much credibility there. Now if Hincapie said Lance doped.....
Testing does work, it's getting more sophisticated all the time. Many riders have been caught, including Tour de France winners Floyd Landis and Alberto Contador. The best indicator that cycling is much cleaner now than anytime in the last decade or so comes from the time taken to climb the mountains. Certain mountains are used regularly on the Tour de France and it is taking approx five minutes longer on average to climb them now than a few years ago.
Well, it's always the same game: When they are active, they swear that they never doped. When they finish their career, they come out with the truth
It's a bit like with drugdealers. When they are active, they hardly admit what they are doing
And Armstrong has been proven of EPO in his urine from 1999 in 2005 and only escaped for formal reasons.
Let's wait until Hincapie throws the towel, we'll hear some interesting stories I bet
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
I doubt that testing really works. They only catch the stupidest riders immediately.
Good thing is that they keep the blood and urine samples and years later when the analysis methods are utd we see the truth (however riders like Armstrong object that the samples "have not been maintained competently" :v )
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
If you have the choice between not being a champion and being a champion with a bit of EPO, I'm not sure it's a choice.
And again, people see these drugs as if it does the work for them... I'll pay for your EPO, why don't you go ride the TDF?
So the biggest name in the sport, (as well as being one of the most famous soortsmen - ever) supposedly gives a positive test, yet the lab / testers don't think that it warrants proper procedure or practice?? Hmmmm. Seems more than a little odd to me.
They've been trying to nail Armstrong's hat on for years, yet to my knowledge there's no formal, undisputed positive test on record. A number of discredited riders are now willing to testify against him in order to avoid lifetime bans. As mentioned above, these guys lied about their own actions, so why believe them now??
Hand on heart my judgment is more than a tad clouded, as Lance is a huge hero to me, so I hope to god he's not guilty. Reading between the lines that my rose-tinted glasses allow there does appear to be smoke, however the witch hunt, quality of witnesses & methods adopted seem to be beyond comprehension to me.
And Armstrong only got away by accusing the lab for not having stored the sample properly.
Additionally after all scandals with EPO in training periods, blood transfusions before or after races and stuff, we have an idea how advanced doping works and it's very likely that the smart ones (and I consider Armstrong to be one of the smartest in the field) get away with it.
However, we'll know the truth in some years as testing methods improve as well
Armstrong used to have my utmost respect in the late 90s but I am not wearing my yellow LIVESTRONG bracelet for a very long time anymore and that's sad.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
In addition, if Armstrong is such a prolific drug taker, why in all these years has no bona-fide positive result emerged?? Yes there's masking agents & techniques, but surely there would have been some indisputable indication prior to this recent story?? I can't buy the fact that its been a cover up all along, as surely he's too big a name in the media world that someone would see the opportunity to try to cash in on??
IMO the wristband signifies so much more than Armstrong. To me it's a symbol of trying to beat a disease that affects too many & it's association with Armstrong has assisted in bringing it to the fore of people's minds. Like you've said though, it's very sad you don't feel you can wear it any longer.
After the EPO test was positive, Armstrong accused them for having stored the sample improperly which voids the entire test.
And as the lab could not prove that it has been stored properly the last 6 years, the case has dropped.
And I remember that after EVERY stage of the 2000 TdF, Armstrong dissapeared immediately intothe tour bus. he says, that he took a shower, many people say, that he's gotten himself prepared for the doping test.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
I'd just feel lame and guilty.
Many of the riders Lance had rode against in his Tour victories have been proven to be dopers, including Jan Ullrich. This raises two questions in my mind.
First, are they keeping all riders samples for 7 years and then retesting them. If we are going to have a level playing field they should.
Second, and more disturbing to me, is if great riders like Jan were competing against Armstrong while doping how did he beat them? Lets say doping gives you 5% better performance, and yet Lance beats his nearest rival by 2-3% Was Lance really 7-8% better than Jan Ullrich? Maybe, and I hope so, but in elite sports usually the best athlete is just a little better than his nearest rival.
He still keeps on telling that " he did not cheat anyone" when asked, if he doped which leaves him the escape path that if most of the other guys in the field doped, he did not cheat them by doing the same.
There is no 100% evidence that he doped but everything leads to his involvement in doping - same with Armstrong - who always was a step smarter than Ulrich.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
He was on chemo!
No matter what, Lance Armstrong edition of the Nikes Just Do It ads had IMHO the greatest impact. If I remember correctly it went something like: "According to the latest cancer statistics, Lance Armstrong is neither alive, nor is he competing in Tour de France. Just do It.
-Mr Arlington Beech
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
Disappointing, but not surprising.
I'd say that he realized that the end of his lies where near and now he's looking for an elegant way to get out of his own construction
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
I used to admire Armstrong for his incredible vita, for his passionate training quantities. I never admired Ulrich as he was simply lazy.
I know exactly how it feels when all this admiration falls into pieces.
On the other hand; I learned how Armstrong kind of occupied the UCI with all his influence and lawyers and how he treated many high-profile journalists when they tried to find out what really happened.
Armstrong fought the entire german and many parts of the european press in his last years in a way of a russian dictator only to prevent that the truth about him came out.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
The FULL article.
Lance Armstrong: Usada will reveal doping evidence
http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/cycling/19433990