Question: What level of 'fantastic' is TOO fantastic for a Bond Movie?

chrisisall

Fleming's books were rather fantastic in their day, yet real life (the Cuban Missile Crisis, the international space station, the simplistic yet evil genius of 9-11) and motion pictures (YOLT, Firefox, Bourne) have pushed the envelope of 'fantastic' to a degree arguably past what Fleming envisioned, IMO...

So my question: Should Bond movies be in step with the ramping up of real & imagined threats & technologies, or remain rooted in the man & his abilities to overcome more straightforward (albeit 'singular') individual/organizational challenges as in the novels?

Virgil37

I don´t know the exact quote, but I think Fleming himself said that Bond stories are very unlikely, but not impossible. Probably YOLT was the first time that they went beyond the possible. Brosnan movies had lots of examples.

Thunderpussy

I think unlike some action/thriller series Bond can change from serious
realistic stories to a more fantastic storyline as the audiance tatses change.
The big sets and "World domination " stories from the 60's are fun but
are products of their time. Fear of commies taking over the world and all that.
My personal choice for a Bond story would be as pointed out by Virgil37,
" Improbable but not impossible " . I do feel Bond needs a little Bit of
"Fantasticness" Might be a great villians lair, or a frighting Henchman,
or a plot which will kill millions or destroy the west, or simply some amazing
stuntwork that you wouldn't see in another film.
Sometimes it can be the locations, Many action movies are based in America,
While Bond tends to travel the world adding to the feel of something a cut above
the average action movie.
As for the si-fi elements as in YOLT and MR. So long as its introduced in a
natural way to help the story, I don't mind. When you watch any documentary
on modern warfare, what we think off as si-fi already exists, so why not use it.

Virgil37

Since 9-11 and with the financial crisis and stuff, I always say I feel as if I lived in a Bond movie, but the villain won... Somewhere inside a volcano there´s a guy with a white cat, looking at a set of big screens laughing uproariously, because they could not stop him...

chrisisall

Virgil37 wrote:

Since 9-11 and with the financial crisis and stuff, I always say I feel as if I lived in a Bond movie, but the villain won...

Well, in the previous movie, yeah. We don't know how THIS one will end yet, and then there's alawys the next one.... :007)

thesecretagent

Visually, the para-surfing and invisible car in DAD were too much for me. But let's not forget that Dr. No had a giant squid in Fleming's book. Bond was mean to be fantastical.

chrisisall

thesecretagent wrote:

Visually, the para-surfing and invisible car in DAD were too much for me. But let's not forget that Dr. No had a giant squid in Fleming's book. Bond was mean to be fantastical.

By that way of thinking, was not FRWL a weaker entry? )

(just pokin')

FelixLeiter ♀

I always like to approach the films with an attitude of 'it's fantasy and therefore anything can happen and I will accept that anything can happen', yet upon watching some I struggle to accept certain things. I want to buy into the fantasy but this can only go so far and it's things like DAD's invisible car that start to make it difficult.
I agree that so long as elements are explained appropriately then I can usually accept them. I still think of it as a fantasy series in some ways and am willing to let the series get away with more than I would in other films. As long as thing's aren't pushed too far, too unbelievable or infeasible, then I'd say anything goes

chrisisall

FelixLeiter007 wrote:

As long as thing's aren't pushed too far, too unbelievable or infeasible, then I'd say anything goes

Anything except Jaws turning into a good guy...

GordoLeiter

chrisisall wrote:

FelixLeiter007 wrote:

As long as thing's aren't pushed too far, too unbelievable or infeasible, then I'd say anything goes

Anything except Jaws turning into a good guy...

You can blame the kid fans of 007 for that, the director of Moonraker himself said he was pressured into making Jaws into a good guy.

James Suzuki

I thought it was funny as first at how Jaws and Bond started to wok together. But then later it was a down buzz. The EPIc jaws and all his fightrs with Bond I wanted to see something like the train fight in LALD or the scene at the end of DAF when Jaws comes back and he didn't become good. There would be an epic fight with Bond grabbinga gun and shooting Jaws once and for all!!!

GordoLeiter

I think its safe to say that turning a villian good in the Bond franchise does not work at all. I wonder how fans would react if they were to turn Blofeld into a good guy lol. I can see it now......

Bond fans all over the world at once : WHAT THE HELL WAS THAAAAAAATTT!!!!!!

FelixLeiter ♀

GordoLeiter wrote:

chrisisall wrote:

FelixLeiter007 wrote:

As long as thing's aren't pushed too far, too unbelievable or infeasible, then I'd say anything goes

Anything except Jaws turning into a good guy...

You can blame the kid fans of 007 for that, the director of Moonraker himself said he was pressured into making Jaws into a good guy.

Jaws finding love had already annoyed me. Drax shouldn't have let her come into space. I never bought Jaws becoming a good guy. He had already been portrayed as too much of a cold-blooded killer in TSWLM for me ever to accept it.
I blame the director for caving into pressure from kids - his own kids must have had him wrapped round their little fingers! I think it would have been far better if they had devised some magnificent way for Bond to kill Jaws (a mere physical fight could never have done it). A cool death would have made up ten fold for him remaining a bad guy

GordoLeiter

FelixLeiter007 wrote:

GordoLeiter wrote:

chrisisall wrote:

Anything except Jaws turning into a good guy...

You can blame the kid fans of 007 for that, the director of Moonraker himself said he was pressured into making Jaws into a good guy.

Jaws finding love had already annoyed me. Drax shouldn't have let her come into space. I never bought Jaws becoming a good guy. He had already been portrayed as too much of a cold-blooded killer in TSWLM for me ever to accept it.
I blame the director for caving into pressure from kids - his own kids must have had him wrapped round their little fingers! I think it would have been far better if they had devised some magnificent way for Bond to kill Jaws (a mere physical fight could never have done it). A cool death would have made up ten fold for him remaining a bad guy

According to the cartoon James Bond Jr, Jaws eventually goes back to his killer ways. So i take it his relationship with that nerdy chick didnt last too long lol.

James Suzuki

Yes... I wonder how the actress feels like now. After being a mencaing villain's girlfriend. Jaws was cool in TSWLM, how he snapped those chains with his teeth but in MR I felt like he went to the dogs.

chrisisall

To me, those are the two most fantastic, unbelievable things in the whole series, Jaws waxing goody two shoes & the PERFECTLY invisible car.

James Suzuki

Same here Chrissial

chrisisall

Rather than starting yet another new thread 8-) , I'll just ask here: What's your list of the most believable/least fantastic Bond movies?

I think it would be:
FRWL
TB
OHMSS
TLD
LTK
CR

Sound right?