Bilbao outfit in Christie's auction

satanama

Hi

Many of you may have seen the Christie's "50 YEARS OF JAMES BOND THE AUCTION" catalog http://www.christies.com/salelanding/index.aspx?intSaleID=14884

You'll find the Bilbao tie, shoes & suit in pages 100-101. And I'm afraid that tie isn't black, sorry for those of you who already ordered it from Turnbull & Asser.

Does anyone here have this tie?

Iñaki

Matt S

satanama wrote:

Hi

Many of you may have seen the Christie's "50 YEARS OF JAMES BOND THE AUCTION" catalog http://www.christies.com/salelanding/index.aspx?intSaleID=14884

You'll find the Bilbao tie, shoes & suit in pages 100-101. And I'm afraid that tie isn't black, sorry for those of you who already ordered it from Turnbull & Asser.

Does anyone here have this tie?

Iñaki

The tie is navy and brown, as can be seen in the film. It was totally believable that the tie was black and those colours were just a reflection. I had asked the people at Turnbull & Asser on Jermyn Street about that tie and they assured me it was NOT black. The navy and brown in the Bilbao tie matches the navy and brown threads in the charcoal suit. But what about the tie in Azerbaijan with the grey pick-and-pick suit? That might still be black, and those who ordered it could still have possibly have a SA tie. I doubt it would be navy and brown since those colours wouldn't match that outfit in any way.

urhash

I remember Asp9mm's contact at the Jermyn St T&A at the time of filming had said it was black, so perhaps he was confused and referred to the Azerbaijan tie? Either way, the navy/brown color combination would have had to been a bespoke order by Hemming, as it was not among the standard OTR offerings of T&A.

urhash

P.S. I would be in favor of any effort to get T&A to make a bespoke version of the Bilbao tie...

satanama

I regard those guys at Jermyn St. T&A as salesmen. Their only interest is to have you buy their ties. I wouldn't trust them, I don't think they stay for long at one shop/store before moving to the next...

Iñaki

satanama

urhash wrote:

P.S. I would be in favor of any effort to get T&A to make a bespoke version of the Bilbao tie...

Urhash,

So would I, BUT first we need to contact the right person(s) at T&A for this, no those store front salesmen who tell you whatever in order to make a commission for them.

jonny-dh

I have the black version from the bespoke run a few years back, but I would love to get on board with getting this one made. Are we in agreement, though, that the black version is the correct Azerbaijan tie?

Matt S

urhash wrote:

I remember Asp9mm's contact at the Jermyn St T&A at the time of filming had said it was black, so perhaps he was confused and referred to the Azerbaijan tie? Either way, the navy/brown color combination would have had to been a bespoke order by Hemming, as it was not among the standard OTR offerings of T&A.

That's probably right. I'm a bit more confident that the Azerbaijan chevron tie is black since it still looks black under the bright sunlight. I know a number of tie patterns were designed, or at least modified, by Hemming. The way she coordinated her outfits was very interesting, though they often seemed forced. It's clear that Brosnan was dressed by a woman. But the Azerbaijan outfit is classic Bond.

I'm actually wearing a pocket handkerchief today that's a brown and navy pattern. It would be a great complement to the suit, though a suit, tie and pocket handkerchief that are all the same colour combination would be a but much.

Matt S

satanama wrote:

urhash wrote:

P.S. I would be in favor of any effort to get T&A to make a bespoke version of the Bilbao tie...

Urhash,

So would I, BUT first we need to contact the right person(s) at T&A for this, no those store front salesmen who tell you whatever in order to make a commission for them.

I would try James Cook. He's had some involvement with the series, in Die Another Day and Casino Royale, but he's familiar with the Bond clothes from before as well. Steven Quin might also be one to talk with.

Robert Gillotte in New York is also very knowledgable.

Bond Collectors' Weekends

I'm surprised people are collecting Bilbo's clothing on this forum... oh, wait, you did write "Bilbao" as in "teaser sequence in Spain". Sorry...

urhash

http://thesuitsofjamesbond.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/04/Brioni-Shoulders.jpg

This does look decidedly more black.

satanama

I've found this, that Bilbao Azerbayan tie doesn't look black to me. http://www.007-movie-props.de/catalogue/products.php?product=2972

Only 3898.00 EUR (inside EU incl. VAT)!!! They've taken off 30% off website prices!

jonny-dh

"The produce each design only ONCE. Because of the a tie from them goes for a retail price at about 450 GBP (more than 600$)." Uh-huh...

Matt S

satanama wrote:

I've found this, that Bilbao Azerbayan tie doesn't look black to me. http://www.007-movie-props.de/catalogue/products.php?product=2972

Only 3898.00 EUR (inside EU incl. VAT)!!! They've taken off 30% off website prices!

I think that's just the Bilbao tie. They say it was used in two different scenes, but that's probably just their guess. Judging from the way Lindy Hemming dresses Bond, it's very unlikely she would match a blue and brown tie to a black and white suit, and it's also unlikely she would reuse a tie. All of her outfits are meticulously planned (compared to Connery's more realistic way of dressing) and that tie just doesn't fit with the outfit like the rest of hers always do.

urhash

If you know the correct colors, you could probably ask T&A to make the tie in theory as a bespoke order. They had no problem making the black herringbone tie on request, even though that pattern was no longer in their standard line. Unfortunately that info isn't available and I doubt they will agree if you just say "Can you make the same tie as you made for Lindy Hemming that was used in.... etc" lol

Matt S

Looking at the Azerbaijan tie again, I'm not so sure it actually is black. Here's the navy and light brown chevron tie from Bilbao: http://i46.tinypic.com/28w13f9.png

And here's the chevron tie in Azerbaijan close up, and it looks like it's not black: http://i46.tinypic.com/s6oeis.png

But not close-up it looks solid black: http://i50.tinypic.com/muy2q8.png

Could it just be lighting?

Higgins

As ASP9mm is not here, I'll take his side a little.

Knowing him for a very long time, I am pretty sure that he knows his sources.
Though nobody is perfect and everyone makes mistakes, I'd be very surprised if that wrong info came from him.

urhash

I think only Lindy Hemming can solve this dilemma. )

satanama

http://www.ajb007.co.uk/post/542400/#p542400

welshboy78

Anybody seriously thinking of asking T&A for a limited rerun then??

Here is Meestas pic from another thread taken from the recent auction I believe

welshboy78

Matt S wrote:

Looking at the Azerbaijan tie again, I'm not so sure it actually is black. Here's the navy and light brown chevron tie from Bilbao: http://i46.tinypic.com/28w13f9.png

And here's the chevron tie in Azerbaijan close up, and it looks like it's not black: http://i46.tinypic.com/s6oeis.png

But not close-up it looks solid black: http://i50.tinypic.com/muy2q8.png

Could it just be lighting?

Hi Matt,

If that pic is a screenshot from the Azerbajan scene then im 100% certain it is the same tie as the Christies auction i.e. Navy with brown detailing tie. It looks pretty clear to me it has the same brown detailing

Matt S

welshboy78 wrote:

Matt S wrote:

Looking at the Azerbaijan tie again, I'm not so sure it actually is black. Here's the navy and light brown chevron tie from Bilbao: http://i46.tinypic.com/28w13f9.png

And here's the chevron tie in Azerbaijan close up, and it looks like it's not black: http://i46.tinypic.com/s6oeis.png

But not close-up it looks solid black: http://i50.tinypic.com/muy2q8.png

Could it just be lighting?

Hi Matt,

If that pic is a screenshot from the Azerbajan scene then im 100% certain it is the same tie as the Christies auction i.e. Navy with brown detailing tie. It looks pretty clear to me it has the same brown detailing

Maybe, but I have black ties that look like that under certain lighting. If it is the same tie, that means there's blue and brown in this suit too.

Bring Back Lazenby!

Hi Everyone

I own all the original TWINE ties and can confirm that the Bilbao tie and Azerbaijan tie are one and the same. The tie is what I would call a very large herringbone in a zigzag design, what some have called a chevron design. It is black and brown but, like all nice ties, can catch the light in interesting ways.

It's a long story which I won't go into here, but I was a loyal, long time customer of Turnbull & Asser. I used to have my shirts made by them and also collected all their 007 ties. Around the time TWINE was released in late 1999 I was diagnosed with cancer and the outlook wasn't good. Because I went to their Jermyn Street store so often, I became friendly with some of the staff there. After my diagnosis they were particularly kind to me and they arranged to keep aside for me one of each of the ties supplied to Lindy Hemming for TWINE.

Though I don't have them with me in Dubai (they are safely stored in a lock-up in west London) so cannot photograph them for you at present, from what I remember there were 5 ties in TWINE -

(1) The Bilbao PTS Tie (which reappears in Azerbaijan),

(2) The Thames Boat Chase PTS Tie (which Indy Magnoli has copied and T&A themselves have reissued),

(3) The Scotland Tie (a black knitted silk tie),

(4) What I would call the Azerbaijan Tie (which consists of small blue, red and yellow dots - Brosnan wears it in the scenes where the pipeline blows up), and

(5) The Baku Tie (which is red with small yellow spots, worn in the scene at the caviar factory where the Z8 is cut in half).

And there's a black bow tie worn a few times with an evening suit, of course.

I hope that helps a bit.

Matt S

Bring Back Lazenby! wrote:

Hi Everyone

I own all the original TWINE ties and can confirm that the Bilbao tie and Azerbaijan tie are one and the same. The tie is what I would call a very large herringbone in a zigzag design, what some have called a chevron design. It is black and brown but, like all nice ties, can catch the light in interesting ways.

It's a long story which I won't go into here, but I was a loyal, long time customer of Turnbull & Asser. I used to have my shirts made by them and also collected all their 007 ties. Around the time TWINE was released in late 1999 I was diagnosed with cancer and the outlook wasn't good. Because I went to their Jermyn Street store so often, I became friendly with some of the staff there. After my diagnosis they were particularly kind to me and they arranged to keep aside for me one of each of the ties supplied to Lindy Hemming for TWINE.

Though I don't have them with me in Dubai (they are safely stored in a lock-up in west London) so cannot photograph them for you at present, from what I remember there were 5 ties in TWINE -

(1) The Bilbao PTS Tie (which reappears in Azerbaijan),

(2) The Thames Boat Chase PTS Tie (which Indy Magnoli has copied and T&A themselves have reissued),

(3) The Scotland Tie (a black knitted silk tie),

(4) What I would call the Azerbaijan Tie (which consists of small blue, red and yellow dots - Brosnan wears it in the scenes where the pipeline blows up), and

(5) The Baku Tie (which is red with small yellow spots, worn in the scene at the caviar factory where the Z8 is cut in half).

And there's a black bow tie worn a few times with an evening suit, of course.

I hope that helps a bit.

Thanks for this information. I hope you are in good health now. As for the Bilbao tie, it was shown in the Christie's auction to be blue and brown chevron pattern (which is different from a herringbone in the way the ribs alternate). Perhaps it actually is different from the Azerbaijan tie, which could be the black and brown chevron?

The pipeline tie is not your tie, nor is it from Turnbull & Asser, since there is a visible Herbie Frogg label.

satanama

Bring Back Lazenby! wrote:

Hi Everyone

I own all the original TWINE ties and can confirm that the Bilbao tie and Azerbaijan tie are one and the same. The tie is what I would call a very large herringbone in a zigzag design, what some have called a chevron design. It is black and brown but, like all nice ties, can catch the light in interesting ways.

It's a long story which I won't go into here, but I was a loyal, long time customer of Turnbull & Asser. I used to have my shirts made by them and also collected all their 007 ties. Around the time TWINE was released in late 1999 I was diagnosed with cancer and the outlook wasn't good. Because I went to their Jermyn Street store so often, I became friendly with some of the staff there. After my diagnosis they were particularly kind to me and they arranged to keep aside for me one of each of the ties supplied to Lindy Hemming for TWINE.

Though I don't have them with me in Dubai (they are safely stored in a lock-up in west London) so cannot photograph them for you at present, from what I remember there were 5 ties in TWINE -

(1) The Bilbao PTS Tie (which reappears in Azerbaijan),

(2) The Thames Boat Chase PTS Tie (which Indy Magnoli has copied and T&A themselves have reissued),

(3) The Scotland Tie (a black knitted silk tie),

(4) What I would call the Azerbaijan Tie (which consists of small blue, red and yellow dots - Brosnan wears it in the scenes where the pipeline blows up), and

(5) The Baku Tie (which is red with small yellow spots, worn in the scene at the caviar factory where the Z8 is cut in half).

And there's a black bow tie worn a few times with an evening suit, of course.

I hope that helps a bit.

I (and quite a few others in this forum as well) would be very grateful if you could ever post here photographs of the Bilbao tie. Thanks a lot in advance,

Iñaki Aguirre

Bring Back Lazenby!

Yes, no problem.

I'll be back in the UK over Christmas so will arrange some photographs, in natural light, of all six of the TWINE ties.

Notwithstanding Matt S's point of view, I'm personally quite certain that the Bilbao and Azerbaijan ties are one and the same and that any apparent colour difference is really just down to how the light falls on it and what sort of colour filters are used during the filming of different scenes.

I am fascinated by Matt S's comment about a Herbie Frogg label being visible on the Pipeline Tie and would love to see a high definition screenshot of this. But my personal understanding remains that - as stated to me by James and the rest of the T&A staff in late 1999 - T&A supplied ALL the ties and sundries for TWINE, including the Pipeline Tie.

Incidentally, on page 12 of 'The Secret World of James Bond' published by Dorling Kindersley, there is a photograph showing three of the ties from TWINE (the Bilbao/Azerbaijan Tie, the Baku Caviar Factory Tie and the Pipeline Tie), rolled and sitting side-by-side. This photograph was used, at the time, on the T&A website and in T&A window displays. I feel this corroborates all the ties being sourced from T&A.

welshboy78

Bring Back Lazenby! wrote:

I am fascinated by Matt S's comment about a Herbie Frogg label being visible on the Pipeline Tie and would love to see a high definition screenshot of this..

Here you go, just took this from my blu ray rip - you can see the Herbie Frogg label - strange huh? Are you able to scan P12 of the book

toutbrun

welshboy78 wrote:

Bring Back Lazenby! wrote:

I am fascinated by Matt S's comment about a Herbie Frogg label being visible on the Pipeline Tie and would love to see a high definition screenshot of this..

Here you go, just took this from my blu ray rip - you can see the Herbie Frogg label - strange huh? Are you able to scan P12 of the book

Did we ever find that tie?

Matt S

Bring Back Lazenby! wrote:

Notwithstanding Matt S's point of view, I'm personally quite certain that the Bilbao and Azerbaijan ties are one and the same and that any apparent colour difference is really just down to how the light falls on it and what sort of colour filters are used during the filming of different scenes.

Have you seen the auction catalogue?
http://www.christies.com/lotfinder/memorabilia/the-world-is-not-enough-5602512-details.aspx

The Bilbao tie is stated to be navy and brown. And the picture posted earlier here is proof of that. If there was a black tie in the film it would have to be the Azerbaijan tie.

And I can confirm that the Frogg tie is in the book, though I am unable to scan it until later. For label reference, have a look at this tie on ebay:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Herbie-Frogg-of-Jermyn-Street-silk-tie-red-blue-white-flower-petal-pattern-/110984824962?pt=UK_Ties&hash=item19d7360882

Bring Back Lazenby!

Well, you're not wrong! That's definately a Herbie Frogg label.

Do you have a really high definition screenshot you could post so we could get a good close-up look at the pattern?

welshboy78

Bring Back Lazenby! wrote:

Well, you're not wrong! That's definately a Herbie Frogg label.

Do you have a really high definition screenshot you could post so we could get a good close-up look at the pattern?

The tie looks diff colour when,outside the pipe lol, will get a screenshot up!

Ps - sent you email