Was it a good thing that Roger Moore stuck around for a bit too long?

JohnMasterson

I mean, think about it...If Timothy Dalton had actually done Roger's last three Bond films in the 1980's and gone on to do Licence to Kill in 1989, a lot of people would have looked back upon For Your Eyes Only and said, "James Bond is a hypocrite because in For Your Eyes Only he spoke of the Chinese saying, when you set out on revenge you must first dig two graves."

Blackleiter

I have a hard time believing that anyone would have paid much attention to that.

JohnMasterson wrote:

I mean, think about it...If Timothy Dalton had actually done Roger's last three Bond films in the 1980's and gone on to do Licence to Kill in 1989, a lot of people would have looked back upon For Your Eyes Only and said, "James Bond is a hypocrite because in For Your Eyes Only he spoke of the Chinese saying, when you set out on revenge you must first dig two graves."

JohnMasterson

Blackleiter wrote:

I have a hard time believing that anyone would have paid much attention to that.

JohnMasterson wrote:

I mean, think about it...If Timothy Dalton had actually done Roger's last three Bond films in the 1980's and gone on to do Licence to Kill in 1989, a lot of people would have looked back upon For Your Eyes Only and said, "James Bond is a hypocrite because in For Your Eyes Only he spoke of the Chinese saying, when you set out on revenge you must first dig two graves."

Yeah, you're right. Because all too often, most people don't pay much attention to anything at all.

AlphaOmegaSin

Well, I think Moore wanted to leave after Moonraker originally.

JohnMasterson

AlphaOmegaSin wrote:

Well, I think Moore wanted to leave after Moonraker originally.

Yeah and he also wanted to do Diamonds Are Forever, as well. But that might have been a retrospective sort of thing.

Silhouette Man

JohnMasterson wrote:

I mean, think about it...If Timothy Dalton had actually done Roger's last three Bond films in the 1980's and gone on to do Licence to Kill in 1989, a lot of people would have looked back upon For Your Eyes Only and said, "James Bond is a hypocrite because in For Your Eyes Only he spoke of the Chinese saying, when you set out on revenge you must first dig two graves."

Interesting observation, but then even in the novels FYEO is followed by Bond's revenge mission against Blofeld in YOLT. -{

Plus, I'm glad Moore stayed on as Bond - I'm a big Moore fan!

JohnMasterson

Silhouette Man wrote:

JohnMasterson wrote:

I mean, think about it...If Timothy Dalton had actually done Roger's last three Bond films in the 1980's and gone on to do Licence to Kill in 1989, a lot of people would have looked back upon For Your Eyes Only and said, "James Bond is a hypocrite because in For Your Eyes Only he spoke of the Chinese saying, when you set out on revenge you must first dig two graves."

Interesting observation, but then even in the novels FYEO is followed by Bond's revenge mission against Blofeld in YOLT. -{

Plus, I'm glad Moore stayed on as Bond - I'm a big Moore fan!

Good for you. We all have our favorite Bonds. And Roger is probably the closest the series has ever gotten to having a Cary Grant-type of actor, but personally I prefer the actual Cary Grant, myself. I really love North By Northwest, To Catch A Thief, Charade, and Howard Hawks' His Girl Friday. Because those movies are freaking AWESOME!!!!!! -{

chrisisall

JohnMasterson wrote:

"James Bond is a hypocrite because in For Your Eyes Only he spoke of the Chinese saying, when you set out on revenge you must first dig two graves."

That's one of the things I hated about that movie- I can't take ANY of Bond's comments on that subject seriously. Dalton would have merely not have uttered that nonsense.
"Stuff those lines! Go ahead, tell Cubby what you like, if he fires me I'll thank him for it."

JohnMasterson

chrisisall wrote:

JohnMasterson wrote:

"James Bond is a hypocrite because in For Your Eyes Only he spoke of the Chinese saying, when you set out on revenge you must first dig two graves."

That's one of the things I hated about that movie- I can't take ANY of Bond's comments on that subject seriously.

Well, to be honest, I believe that Roger was not exactly playing the same type of Bond that Connery and Lazenby had played before in the past. Roger was certainly the biggest difference between "Diamonds" and Live and Let Die, and I have a hard time imagining Sean Connery doing what Moore did in LALD.

Personally, I like to think that Roger Moore's Bond is almost like George Lazenby's, if Lazenby had gone soft and began to get better at telling jokes...But obviously they couldn't be anymore different in terms of age, physical appearance, and speaking voices.

Jarvio

I'm sure people would have definitely paid attention to that (the FYEO revenge line contradicting LTK). True, it doesn't seem like something that people would pay attention to... but seeing what people pay attention to on here, it's nothing )

I think TD would have done great in both FYEO and AVTAK. Out of the Moore films, those are the less comedy-driven IMO (True, they have some comedy, such as Bibi and california girls/fire truck chase), but overall they are the two darkest Moore films IMO, and TD would have fit in with them (except maybe the fire truck chase - possibly).

OP on the other hand, I just cannot picture TD in. This film was made for Roger. Imagine TD dressed as a clown - I can't picture it at all.

JohnMasterson

Jarvio wrote:

I'm sure people would have definitely paid attention to that (the FYEO revenge line contradicting LTK). True, it doesn't seem like something that people would pay attention to... but seeing what people pay attention to on here, it's nothing )

I think TD would have done great in both FYEO and AVTAK. Out of the Moore films, those are the less comedy-driven IMO (True, they have some comedy, such as Bibi and california girls/fire truck chase), but overall they are the two darkest Moore films IMO, and TD would have fit in with them (except maybe the fire truck chase - possibly).

OP on the other hand, I just cannot picture TD in. This film was made for Roger. Imagine TD dressed as a clown - I can't picture it at all.

Dalton in the Fire Truck/Police Chase and Dalton wearing a Clown Costume trying to warn people of a bomb, would have been like the lines of "funny," dialogue that Dalton had to put up with in The Living Daylights.

"Why didn't you learn to play the violin!?"

[Beat] "Salt erosion."

Jarvio

JohnMasterson wrote:

Jarvio wrote:

I'm sure people would have definitely paid attention to that (the FYEO revenge line contradicting LTK). True, it doesn't seem like something that people would pay attention to... but seeing what people pay attention to on here, it's nothing )

I think TD would have done great in both FYEO and AVTAK. Out of the Moore films, those are the less comedy-driven IMO (True, they have some comedy, such as Bibi and california girls/fire truck chase), but overall they are the two darkest Moore films IMO, and TD would have fit in with them (except maybe the fire truck chase - possibly).

OP on the other hand, I just cannot picture TD in. This film was made for Roger. Imagine TD dressed as a clown - I can't picture it at all.

Dalton in the Fire Truck/Police chase and Dalton wearing a clown costume trying to warn people of a bomb, would have been like the lines of "funny," dialogue that Dalton had to put up with in The Living Daylights.

"Why did you learn to play the violin!?"

[Beat] "Salt erosion."

I can see what you mean regarding the fire truck chase. It is a little silly, but not too much, and would kind of be in the same vein as that violin line you mentioned (I love the fire truck chase just for the record). And having said that, TLD does have that escape scene on the cello case, which is even sillier IMO.

I still can't imagine the clown scene with TD though, but would love to see it )

JohnMasterson

Jarvio wrote:

I still can't imagine the clown scene with TD though, but I would love to see it.

Timothy Dalton would probably look very angry X-( and extremely pissed off/frustrated that he has to wear a clown suit and that nobody is listening to him and taking him seriously. They're all laughing at him and it's making him look like this red angry face: X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-( X-(

JohnMasterson

The thing that I absolutely cannot imagine though is Timothy Dalton pretending to **** a much older Maud Adams in Octopussy.

chrisisall

Tim could have pulled ANYTHING off, even the clown thing. Although I thought Moore did it masterfully.

chrisisall

JohnMasterson wrote:

The thing that I absolutely cannot imagine though is Timothy Dalton pretending to **** a much older Maud Adams in Octopussy.

Okay...not that. 8-)

JohnMasterson

chrisisall wrote:

JohnMasterson wrote:

The thing that I absolutely cannot imagine though is Timothy Dalton pretending to **** a much older Maud Adams in Octopussy.

Okay...not that. 8-)

So, you agree with me that it would have been an awkward moment between a relatively young looking Dalton and a crusty looking Maud Adams?

Jarvio

JohnMasterson wrote:

chrisisall wrote:

JohnMasterson wrote:

The thing that I absolutely cannot imagine though is Timothy Dalton pretending to **** a much older Maud Adams in Octopussy.

Okay...not that. 8-)

So, you agree with me that it would have been an awkward moment between a relatively young looking Dalton and a crusty looking Maud Adams?

I agree that it would have felt awkward. But then again, it would have felt refreshingly different too. Whether the public in 1983 would have been ready for that change though I'm not sure.

chrisisall

JohnMasterson wrote:

So, you agree with me that it would have been an awkward moment between a relatively young looking Dalton and a crusty looking Maud Adams?

Dalton might have been able to make a believable thing of it, but...
please, the mental image is difficult.

JohnMasterson

chrisisall wrote:

JohnMasterson wrote:

So, you agree with me that it would have been an awkward moment between a relatively young looking Dalton and a crusty looking Maud Adams?

Dalton might have been able to make a believable thing of it, but...
please, the mental image is difficult.

I thought Maud Adams still looked good in Octopussy, but putting her next to Timothy Dalton would have made her look like his mother or his grandma.

But it couldn't have been as bad as Roger Moore and Grace Jones in the bed room in A View to a Kill......Oh, wait a minute! That would have been Dalton being forced to lay under Grace Jones if he had been in that movie!!!!! ;%

chrisisall

JohnMasterson wrote:

But it couldn't have been as bad as Roger Moore and Grace Jones in the bed room in A View to a Kill......Oh, wait a minute! That would have been Dalton being forced to lay under Grace Jones if he had been in that movie!!!!! ;%

THAT I could see him working out.

Jarvio

Yeah I can definitely see Dalton doing Grace Jones. The man clearly likes it rough!

James Suzuki

But if Dalton was in these films he would have asked for the silly and funny parts toned down.

JohnMasterson

Jarvio wrote:

Yeah I can definitely see Dalton doing Grace Jones. The man clearly likes it rough!

) Now that you mention it, I can almost see Timothy Dalton actually flipping Grace Jones back over and forcing her to lay on her back, but it's a very rough, blurry image in my head. I'm not sure that Grace Jones would actually accept being put flat on her back but I can almost imagine Dalton struggling for his preferred missionary position. ) ) )

Jarvio

JohnMasterson wrote:

Jarvio wrote:

Yeah I can definitely see Dalton doing Grace Jones. The man clearly likes it rough!

) Now that you mention it, I can almost see Timothy Dalton actually flipping Grace Jones back over and forcing her to lay on her back, but it's a very rough, blurry image in my head. I'm not sure that Grace Jones would actually accept being put flat on her back but I can almost imagine Dalton struggling for his preferred missionary position. ) ) )

Haha, well it would definitely happen in my book. The beauty of 'what ifs'

Jarvio

xboy614 wrote:

But if Dalton was in these films he would have asked for the silly and funny parts toned down.

Well I honestly can't see many silly parts in AVTAK really. The only things that spring to mind are california girls, the Tchaikovsky line, and the fire engine chase. Can't really think of much more.

Op though on the other hand has lots of silliness (Although for the record I love lots of the silliness in bond films)

chrisisall

JohnMasterson wrote:

) Now that you mention it, I can almost see Timothy Dalton actually flipping Grace Jones back over and forcing her to lay on her back

And more than that, but now we're getting into strange territory here, so I'll leave the Dalton Alpha-male stuff at that. )

Brosnan_fan

JohnMasterson wrote:

I mean, think about it...If Timothy Dalton had actually done Roger's last three Bond films in the 1980's and gone on to do Licence to Kill in 1989, a lot of people would have looked back upon For Your Eyes Only and said, "James Bond is a hypocrite because in For Your Eyes Only he spoke of the Chinese saying, when you set out on revenge you must first dig two graves."

If you feel very strongly about this, you would have to blame Cubby Broccoli, John Glen, Richard Maibaum and Michael G. Wilson for (inadvertently) putting this notion forward. They were the main people responsible for the stories and lines of both FYEO and LTK, so you can thank them for that.

My 2 cents' on the matter: It's not really worth pondering these things in the Bond films; if co-stars like Charles Gray and Joe Don Baker die in one film and come back in another, I don't worry about it.

Colonel Shatner

JohnMasterson wrote:

So, you agree with me that it would have been an awkward moment between a relatively young looking Dalton and a crusty looking Maud Adams?

No offense, but isn't Maud Adams roughly the same age as Timothy Dalton and so also relatively youthful back in the 1980s like Dalton?

James Suzuki

Colonel Shatner wrote:

JohnMasterson wrote:

So, you agree with me that it would have been an awkward moment between a relatively young looking Dalton and a crusty looking Maud Adams?

No offense, but isn't Maud Adams roughly the same age as Timothy Dalton and so also relatively youthful back in the 1980s like Dalton?

Shatner is right, just looked it up now, Dalton is older then Maud, Dalton is 68 Maud is 67

chrisisall

xboy614 wrote:

Dalton is 68

Suddenly, I feel very young.