Here's my POV... we just (in 1987) had Roger Moore's run come to an end. Just as Connery was the Bond of the 1960's, Roger Moore was the Bond of the 1970's (and early '80's but by then he was long in the tooth). The Bond films became comical farces (with two exceptions... TSWLM and FYEO) and even AVTAK was just a remake of Goldfinger. Moore was the Bond of my generation, but seeing him put the moves on Tanya Roberts was just creepy.
Interesting point about Dalton establishing himself in the third film. Personally, I think he nailed it the first time and wasn't really going to improve. LTK might have even been a slight step backwards due to some unfortunate slicked back hair. (someone here called it "Vampire Hair" i believe)
Still, having a 3rd would have made him more of a household name instead of an obscurity that only Bond connoisseurs seem to appreciate. I'm glad Lazenby only did one, but I wish Dalton could have had 4.
Okay, and I couldn't help but take offense to your line about putting the moves on Tanya as being "creepy." Roger could not have been more of a gentleman! He cooked her dinner, fixed her electricity, and slept in a chair all night with a shotgun. If anything he was more of an old-school noble John Wayne type hero in AVTAK.
Remake of Goldfinger? puh-lease. No more than Quantum of Solace was a remake of Goldfinger for featuring a girl covered in oil and damming the water supply to create a monopoly. Or Lewis Gilbert's TSWLM and MR basically being remakes of YOLT doesn't seem to bother anyone. I'd rather see Bond borrow from himself than other non-Bond films.
The scene in AVTAK most reminiscent of Goldfinger is obviously the business meeting in Zorin's blimp. However, instead of just plain copying it (like the above scene in QoS) they actually reworked it rather brilliantly. I mean, one reoccurring complaint about Goldfinger is why did Auric go to all the trouble of giving the big presentation only to gas the audience anyway? And why take time to kill Mr. Solo separately when he could have died inside with the rest of the gangsters?
Key differences between the two scenes:
1. The business man was very likable and polite. I felt really bad for him when he fell out of Zorin's airship. Unlike in Goldfinger, where Mr. Solo was an irritable thug who gained no sympathy from the audience. This is just one of many examples at how AVTAK does NOT soften the blow for casualties. Each death is taken pretty seriously.
2. Zorin does not waste a ton of time and resources disposing of the dude.
3. Zorin does not "pull a goldfinger" and drop the rest of the investors out of his airship.
Also, Mayday's switching allegiance at the end was far more believable than Pussy Galore and the controversial "judo match"
whoops, did I just go on another tangent defending A View to a Kill? sorry guys
It's very refreshing to have another devoted AVTAK supporter here And yes, I pretty much agree with all that you said. So many people think that AVTAK is a GF ripoff, but in the same sense, that would make TSWLM/MR a ripoff of YOLT... Bond films rip each other off all the time. I think it probably is the business scene that makes AVTAK stand out in people's minds more as a GF rip-off, but saying that, it's a great scene. AVTAK has plenty of unique things about it anyway - what other bond films have such a dramatic mine flood, and a fight atop one of the world's most famous landmarks?
I DO have a special place in my heart for AVTAK... when I say it was a remake of GF, I mean it was just in the same vein of GF... just as OHMSS was in the same vein of FRWL...
I DO have a special place in my heart for AVTAK... when I say it was a remake of GF, I mean it was just in the same vein of GF... just as OHMSS was in the same vein of FRWL...
Glad to hear it In terms of how it's similar to GF, it's just the plot, and when it comes to bond, plot doesn't really bother me too much... (as long as it's not too ridiculous anyway, like MR or DAD lol)
I love both of Dalton's Bond film's equally, but if i had to chose, I'd give the edge to 'Licence to Kill'
First off, because it was totally Dalton's film. TLD was as well, but still had a few soft Moore moments shoehorned in. LTK was wholly Dalton's take, and it shows.
The villain rocks. Franz Sanchez is the best villain the franchise has ever had, next to Blofeld. Why? Because they were the only two that have hit Bond on a personal level. Blofeld offed Bond's wife and Sanchez maimed his best friend and brought back all those nasty Tracy memories. But what sets him apart is that of all of them, he'd be the one I'd personally choose to work for. Unlike Largo, where if you p*ssed him off, you'd be fed to a shark, you could tell that 'ol Franz took care of his guys, until they turned on him, or he THOUGHT they turned on him.
Plus, LTK is hands-down the movie Diamonds Are Forever SHOULD have been. It wasn't entirely Connery's fault, because the script really doesn't give a proper notice to the events of the prior film, but Connery looks bored in "Diamonds Are Forever". The film has no spark in any of his scenes with Blofeld. In fact, if you didn't know Bond's wife was murdered in the film before, you wouldn't know it. I remember enjoying it when I first saw it out of sequence, and I still do enjoy it, but when I saw OHMSS, then watched DAF after, I was watching the scenes between the two and thinking to myself, "You remember this is the man who just murdered your wife, right?" Compared to "Licence to Kill", where Bond sees his fate projected to his best friend. It's not brushed under the rug here.
That's one of the things I love about "Licence to Kill". Dalton's Bond is certainly fueled by getting vindication for Felix, but it's apparent that Tracy is fueling his actions more than Felix. The whole garter scene is there for a reason, and it's telling that, while it seems fairly apparent that Della and Bond may have had a little something before she got with Felix, she has to be told by him that Bond's wife died. That's how raw the memory still is for Bond.
Also, we're given a strong hint to Bond's motivations in the scene with M. He's quick to brush of Bond's assertion that he owes it to Leiter by telling Bond Leiter knew the risks. Then Dalton fires back with "Did his WIFE?" M then pauses for a brief moment, and then shifts tactics to say he'll jeopardize MI-6. And at the end of the film, where the bleeding, suffering Dalton parks himself on the rock and looks as though he's about to cry....While I'm sure Bond's glad Sanchez is dead, I think his reaction of sorrow and relief comes down to the silencing of the guilt over Tracy's death, more than anything else.
You can't go wrong with either effort and Dalton is my #1 Bond, but LTK, despite some faults, has the edge.
I love both of Dalton's Bond film's equally, but if i had to chose, I'd give the edge to 'Licence to Kill'
First off, because it was totally Dalton's film. TLD was as well, but still had a few soft Moore moments shoehorned in. LTK was wholly Dalton's take, and it shows.
The villain rocks. Franz Sanchez is the best villain the franchise has ever had, next to Blofeld. Why? Because they were the only two that have hit Bond on a personal level. Blofeld offed Bond's wife and Sanchez maimed his best friend and brought back all those nasty Tracy memories. But what sets him apart is that of all of them, he'd be the one I'd personally choose to work for. Unlike Largo, where if you p*ssed him off, you'd be fed to a shark, you could tell that 'ol Franz took care of his guys, until they turned on him, or he THOUGHT they turned on him.
Plus, LTK is hands-down the movie Diamonds Are Forever SHOULD have been. It wasn't entirely Connery's fault, because the script really doesn't give a proper notice to the events of the prior film, but Connery looks bored in "Diamonds Are Forever". The film has no spark in any of his scenes with Blofeld. In fact, if you didn't know Bond's wife was murdered in the film before, you wouldn't know it. I remember enjoying it when I first saw it out of sequence, and I still do enjoy it, but when I saw OHMSS, then watched DAF after, I was watching the scenes between the two and thinking to myself, "You remember this is the man who just murdered your wife, right?" Compared to "Licence to Kill", where Bond sees his fate projected to his best friend. It's not brushed under the rug here.
That's one of the things I love about "Licence to Kill". Dalton's Bond is certainly fueled by getting vindication for Felix, but it's apparent that Tracy is fueling his actions more than Felix. The whole garter scene is there for a reason, and it's telling that, while it seems fairly apparent that Della and Bond may have had a little something before she got with Felix, she has to be told by him that Bond's wife died. That's how raw the memory still is for Bond.
Also, we're given a strong hint to Bond's motivations in the scene with M. He's quick to brush of Bond's assertion that he owes it to Leiter by telling Bond Leiter knew the risks. Then Dalton fires back with "Did his WIFE?" M then pauses for a brief moment, and then shifts tactics to say he'll jeopardize MI-6. And at the end of the film, where the bleeding, suffering Dalton parks himself on the rock and looks as though he's about to cry....While I'm sure Bond's glad Sanchez is dead, I think his reaction of sorrow and relief comes down to the silencing of the guilt over Tracy's death, more than anything else.
You can't go wrong with either effort and Dalton is my #1 Bond, but LTK, despite some faults, has the edge.
Dalton is without a doubt my favourite Bond but I don' know if that's because he's my favourite actor anyway. I'd watch anything that he was in I definitely agree that he should have done more than two. TLD just pips it for me but I love them both. I don't know; maybe I should just start a Timothy Dalton appreciation society? :x
"You were fantastic! We're free!"
"Kara, we're inside a Russian airbase in the middle of Afghanistan."
I don't know; maybe I should just start a Timothy Dalton appreciation society? :x
Dalton was better than Connery, and Craig as well. His Bond films, while not entirely perfect, rise to the top for me for his mere presence.
He made the Rocketeer pop with his bad guy Nevelle Sinclair; he made CHUCK season four shine with his Alexei Volkoff, his small role as Damien Drake in Loony Tunes Back In Action made the film worth owning...
I could go on... -{
To hell with that. To me, Dalton was a better Bond than Connery. Period. There. I said it. It's my choice. You can counter with Connery's suaver, cooler, etc. etc. Dalton wins it for me. His acting pops, and if I'd pissed him off, I wouldn't want to be in the same country as him, let alone the same room. Give me the dark Bond, give me the emotional Bond. And when he was with the ladies, you could tell he was with them for more than just to get his rocks off. No slapping a girl's arse for Dalton. He's macho, but way too classy for that.
I love Sean Connery, I really do. He's a great Bond. But after all the movies, and after all the books, Connery is 2nd best. And if my choice is between The Living Daylights and From Russia With Love, The Living Daylights wins. Always.
To hell with that. To me, Dalton was a better Bond than Connery. Period. There. I said it. It's my choice. You can counter with Connery's suaver, cooler, etc. etc. Dalton wins it for me. His acting pops, and if I'd pissed him off, I wouldn't want to be in the same country as him, let alone the same room. Give me the dark Bond, give me the emotional Bond. And when he was with the ladies, you could tell he was with them for more than just to get his rocks off. No slapping a girl's arse for Dalton. He's macho, but way too classy for that.
I love Sean Connery, I really do. He's a great Bond. But after all the movies, and after all the books, Connery is 2nd best. And if my choice is between The Living Daylights and From Russia With Love, The Living Daylights wins. Always.
And it's too bad most people think that just because someone's first, he's always best. ) Real Bonds don't need a hairpiece from film one. I know, I know, it's a low blow, but much like Dalton's Bond, I'm not afraid to headbutt, if need be.
To hell with that. To me, Dalton was a better Bond than Connery. Period. There. I said it. It's my choice. You can counter with Connery's suaver, cooler, etc. etc. Dalton wins it for me. His acting pops, and if I'd pissed him off, I wouldn't want to be in the same country as him, let alone the same room. Give me the dark Bond, give me the emotional Bond. And when he was with the ladies, you could tell he was with them for more than just to get his rocks off. No slapping a girl's arse for Dalton. He's macho, but way too classy for that.
I love Sean Connery, I really do. He's a great Bond. But after all the movies, and after all the books, Connery is 2nd best. And if my choice is between The Living Daylights and From Russia With Love, The Living Daylights wins. Always.
I don't know; maybe I should just start a Timothy Dalton appreciation society? :x
Dalton was better than Connery, and Craig as well. His Bond films, while not entirely perfect, rise to the top for me for his mere presence.
He made the Rocketeer pop with his bad guy Nevelle Sinclair; he made CHUCK season four shine with his Alexei Volkoff, his small role as Damien Drake in Loony Tunes Back In Action made the film worth owning...
I could go on... -{
I loved him in Chuck! Amazing in Cleopatra too and stole the show in the Informant.
"You were fantastic! We're free!"
"Kara, we're inside a Russian airbase in the middle of Afghanistan."
To hell with that. To me, Dalton was a better Bond than Connery. Period. There. I said it. It's my choice.
As someone who likes both Dalton and Connery ... I think to claim that Dalton's Bond is the best interpretation of the character without first analysing Connery's early performances is folly. Yes, Dalton has been regarded - quite rightly - as the "dark" Bond, the actor who has brought the true interpretation of Fleming's character onto the screen. But I'd argue he wasn't the first to do it. Bond's assassination of Professor Dent in Dr No as well as his dealing with the chauffeur, Mr Jones, was about as cold and as dark as anything Dalton had done. His fight with Grant in From Russia With Love is as rough and macho as you can get.
It's not because Connery was the first. It's because his portrayal of Bond in Dr No and From Russia With Love is as good as anything Dalton has done. And, for me, From Russia With Love is the best Bond film ever made. Period.
I'm a fan of the Fleming literary Bond first, and I firmly believe that the cinematic Bond should as closely as possible mirror the literary character. Dalton was absolutely superb in that regard. But so too was Connery's performance in the first two films.
To hell with that. To me, Dalton was a better Bond than Connery. Period. There. I said it. It's my choice.
As someone who likes both Dalton and Connery ... I think to claim that Dalton's Bond is the best interpretation of the character without first analysing Connery's early performances is folly. Yes, Dalton has been regarded - quite rightly - as the "dark" Bond, the actor who has brought the true interpretation of Fleming's character onto the screen. But I'd argue he wasn't the first to do it. Bond's assassination of Professor Dent in Dr No as well as his dealing with the chauffeur, Mr Jones, was about as cold and as dark as anything Dalton had done. His fight with Grant in From Russia With Love is as rough and macho as you can get.
It's not because Connery was the first. It's because his portrayal of Bond in Dr No and From Russia With Love is as good as anything Dalton has done. And, for me, From Russia With Love is the best Bond film ever made. Period.
I'm a fan of the Fleming literary Bond first, and I firmly believe that the cinematic Bond should as closely as possible mirror the literary character. Dalton was absolutely superb in that regard. But so too was Connery's performance in the first two films.
And it's too bad most people think that just because someone's first, he's always best. ) Real Bonds don't need a hairpiece from film one. I know, I know, it's a low blow, but much like Dalton's Bond, I'm not afraid to headbutt, if need be.
To hell with that. To me, Dalton was a better Bond than Connery. Period. There. I said it. It's my choice. You can counter with Connery's suaver, cooler, etc. etc. Dalton wins it for me. His acting pops, and if I'd pissed him off, I wouldn't want to be in the same country as him, let alone the same room. Give me the dark Bond, give me the emotional Bond. And when he was with the ladies, you could tell he was with them for more than just to get his rocks off. No slapping a girl's arse for Dalton. He's macho, but way too classy for that.
I love Sean Connery, I really do. He's a great Bond. But after all the movies, and after all the books, Connery is 2nd best. And if my choice is between The Living Daylights and From Russia With Love, The Living Daylights wins. Always.
I'm a fan of the Fleming literary Bond first, and I firmly believe that the cinematic Bond should as closely as possible mirror the literary character. Dalton was absolutely superb in that regard. But so too was Connery's performance in the first two films.
One cannot deny that, if one is being truthful IMO. I particularly like DN- the novels were the ONLY thing to rely on there... after FRWL they had a base from which they could leap off in new directions.
"As someone who likes both Dalton and Connery ... I think to claim that Dalton's Bond is the best interpretation of the character without first analysing Connery's early performances is folly. Yes, Dalton has been regarded - quite rightly - as the "dark" Bond, the actor who has brought the true interpretation of Fleming's character onto the screen. But I'd argue he wasn't the first to do it. Bond's assassination of Professor Dent in Dr No as well as his dealing with the chauffeur, Mr Jones, was about as cold and as dark as anything Dalton had done. His fight with Grant in From Russia With Love is as rough and macho as you can get.
It's not because Connery was the first. It's because his portrayal of Bond in Dr No and From Russia With Love is as good as anything Dalton has done. And, for me, From Russia With Love is the best Bond film ever made. Period.
I'm a fan of the Fleming literary Bond first, and I firmly believe that the cinematic Bond should as closely as possible mirror the literary character. Dalton was absolutely superb in that regard. But so too was Connery's performance in the first two films."
I agree that Connery echos Fleming's Bond in his first two outings very well, but Dalton gets a higher mark from me because of the emotion he brings to the role. Imagine the death of Saunders taking place with Connery in the role. There would be some sense of loss from Connery, but not at the same level brought to the table by Dalton. The raw rage Dalton allows to overtake him in that scene takes it to a level we've never seen in any of the Bond films prior. Not even when Bond found Kerim Bey in "FRWL" was Bond that affected by the death of an ally.
Again, this is personal taste, but I don't think the scene between Bond and Pushkin in the hotel room would crack with the same energy as it does with Connery as Bond. It still would be good, but Connery is cooler in the role of Bond. When I watched the scene played by Dalton the first time, I was genuinely wondering how it would turn out. We as an audience know that Bond's figured out he's being played, but the anger and ruthlessness he brings to the scene nevertheless make us wonder if Bond is indeed going to kill Pushkin anyway. For Dalton to be able to fool us into thinking he may pull the trigger after he's questioned killing Pushkin from the moment he got the assignment again takes some doing.
Connery's easily my second favorite Bond. There's no question about it. When I say Dalton is the best, it's because, I guess, I prefer the added emotion Dalton brings to it. Connery is a fantastic Bond, but his Bond isn't world-weary. It's presented in the Connery films that Bond maybe does like this jet-setting lifestyle a little bit. That's more of a sign of the scripting than Connery himself, because the scripts are presenting Bond as this cool guy who gets all the ladies and who guys want to be.
Dalton captures the Fleming Bond ideal closer for me because it seems like his is the Bond most poisoned by what he does. I can easily picture Dalton's Bond sitting alone at his flat after a mission trying to drink the demons of his actions into silence. Dalton's Bond is resigned to the fact that at some point, he's going to be retired in a mission. He's on the edge. His Bond is still cool, but he effectively conveys that maybe the price paid for him to be a 00 isn't quite what it's cracked up to be.
I just can't quite get that with Connery's Bond. I think he'd be more at home enjoying the night life in a casino with a beautiful girl on his arm. There's nothing wrong with that, it's just not quite my interpretation of Fleming's Bond.
And going back to the literary source, while it never would have worked on-screen, because Bond is supposed to be unflappable, I really think if they would have ever done the true Bond downfall from the books, where Bond literally goes to pieces after Tracy's death, becomes an alcoholic screw-up, and has to be saved from the chopping block by Psychiatrist Dr. James Molony, Timothy Dalton's incantation and acting would have been the best suited for the storyline. And I can easily picture a disheveled, weak-looking and brainwashed Dalton playing the opening scene in "The Man With the Golden Gun", having been programmed by the Russians to try and kill M.
I agree that Connery echos Fleming's Bond in his first two outings very well, but Dalton gets a higher mark from me because of the emotion he brings to the role. Imagine the death of Saunders taking place with Connery in the role. There would be some sense of loss from Connery, but not at the same level brought to the table by Dalton. The raw rage Dalton allows to overtake him in that scene takes it to a level we've never seen in any of the Bond films prior. Not even when Bond found Kerim Bey in "FRWL" was Bond that affected by the death of an ally.
Fair point. Connery's Bond did take his anger out on Romanova in the immediate aftermath of finding out about Kerim's death, though. He called her a liar and slapped her hard across the face. But you're quite right, it wasn't done as well as Dalton did after Saunder's death. The other side of the argument, however, is that as soon as Connery's Bond realised that Romanova was just as "in the dark" about this whole affair as he is, and that they're both pawns in a SPECTRE game of cat and mouse, there's not much reason anymore to remain angry at Romanova.
Again, this is personal taste, but I don't think the scene between Bond and Pushkin in the hotel room would crack with the same energy as it does with Connery as Bond. It still would be good, but Connery is cooler in the role of Bond. When I watched the scene played by Dalton the first time, I was genuinely wondering how it would turn out. We as an audience know that Bond's figured out he's being played, but the anger and ruthlessness he brings to the scene nevertheless make us wonder if Bond is indeed going to kill Pushkin anyway. For Dalton to be able to fool us into thinking he may pull the trigger after he's questioned killing Pushkin from the moment he got the assignment again takes some doing.
Being completely honest, I felt the same when I was watching Connery's Bond interrogate Mr Jones. The look on his face as soon as he found out that Mr Jones wasn't a legitimate Government House employee, and telling the Principal Secretary that he'd be "a few minutes late" suggests to me that he was thinking of ways to dispose of Mr Jones quietly. I think that if Mr Jones didn't take his own life, Connery's Bond would've done the job instead.
Dalton captures the Fleming Bond ideal closer for me because it seems like his is the Bond most poisoned by what he does. I can easily picture Dalton's Bond sitting alone at his flat after a mission trying to drink the demons of his actions into silence. Dalton's Bond is resigned to the fact that at some point, he's going to be retired in a mission. He's on the edge. His Bond is still cool, but he effectively conveys that maybe the price paid for him to be a 00 isn't quite what it's cracked up to be.
I just can't quite get that with Connery's Bond. I think he'd be more at home enjoying the night life in a casino with a beautiful girl on his arm. There's nothing wrong with that, it's just not quite my interpretation of Fleming's Bond.
And going back to the literary source, while it never would have worked on-screen, because Bond is supposed to be unflappable, I really think if they would have ever done the true Bond downfall from the books, where Bond literally goes to pieces after Tracy's death, becomes an alcoholic screw-up, and has to be saved from the chopping block by Psychiatrist Dr. James Molony, Timothy Dalton's incantation and acting would have been the best suited for the storyline. And I can easily picture a disheveled, weak-looking and brainwashed Dalton playing the opening scene in "The Man With the Golden Gun", having been programmed by the Russians to try and kill M.
Again, that's a fair point. You have no argument from me there. However, this side of Bond (unfortunately) wasn't explored in the films, and as a result, I guess we'll never know for certain if Connery could've pulled off these scenes just as effectively. I agree, however, that it is likely Dalton would do a better job portraying that side of Bond's character. As far as Bond's ruthless, cruel and dangerous streak, however, I think Connery's portrayal is easily the equal of Dalton's, both of whom are easily better than any other actor to have played James Bond, in my opinion.
To modify a quote from "TLD" Looks like we have the same top two, just at opposite ends.
BTW, I did watch FRWL last night, and you are correct, I'd forgotten about the scene where he "Interrogates" Tania after Kerim's death. Interestingly enough, Dalton gets to play a similar scene in "LTK" when thinks Pam is working with Sanchez, though it's a bit more ruthless.
I need to reacquaint myself with "Dr. No". It's been too long.
Watching "Dr. No" right now. Things to ponder.....
I doubt Bond would be able to tell Quarrel to "Fetch his shoes" nowadays.
No way the guy shouting orders from the boat telling them to come out actually sounds like that in real life.
They're shooting at Bond, Quarrel, and Honey Rider from the SS Minnow, as I live and breathe. And Bond already shot "The Professor", after he used his six.
Comments
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
It's very refreshing to have another devoted AVTAK supporter here
1 - Moore, 2 - Dalton, 3 - Craig, 4 - Connery, 5 - Brosnan, 6 - Lazenby
Glad to hear it
1 - Moore, 2 - Dalton, 3 - Craig, 4 - Connery, 5 - Brosnan, 6 - Lazenby
First off, because it was totally Dalton's film. TLD was as well, but still had a few soft Moore moments shoehorned in. LTK was wholly Dalton's take, and it shows.
The villain rocks. Franz Sanchez is the best villain the franchise has ever had, next to Blofeld. Why? Because they were the only two that have hit Bond on a personal level. Blofeld offed Bond's wife and Sanchez maimed his best friend and brought back all those nasty Tracy memories. But what sets him apart is that of all of them, he'd be the one I'd personally choose to work for. Unlike Largo, where if you p*ssed him off, you'd be fed to a shark, you could tell that 'ol Franz took care of his guys, until they turned on him, or he THOUGHT they turned on him.
Plus, LTK is hands-down the movie Diamonds Are Forever SHOULD have been. It wasn't entirely Connery's fault, because the script really doesn't give a proper notice to the events of the prior film, but Connery looks bored in "Diamonds Are Forever". The film has no spark in any of his scenes with Blofeld. In fact, if you didn't know Bond's wife was murdered in the film before, you wouldn't know it. I remember enjoying it when I first saw it out of sequence, and I still do enjoy it, but when I saw OHMSS, then watched DAF after, I was watching the scenes between the two and thinking to myself, "You remember this is the man who just murdered your wife, right?" Compared to "Licence to Kill", where Bond sees his fate projected to his best friend. It's not brushed under the rug here.
That's one of the things I love about "Licence to Kill". Dalton's Bond is certainly fueled by getting vindication for Felix, but it's apparent that Tracy is fueling his actions more than Felix. The whole garter scene is there for a reason, and it's telling that, while it seems fairly apparent that Della and Bond may have had a little something before she got with Felix, she has to be told by him that Bond's wife died. That's how raw the memory still is for Bond.
Also, we're given a strong hint to Bond's motivations in the scene with M. He's quick to brush of Bond's assertion that he owes it to Leiter by telling Bond Leiter knew the risks. Then Dalton fires back with "Did his WIFE?" M then pauses for a brief moment, and then shifts tactics to say he'll jeopardize MI-6. And at the end of the film, where the bleeding, suffering Dalton parks himself on the rock and looks as though he's about to cry....While I'm sure Bond's glad Sanchez is dead, I think his reaction of sorrow and relief comes down to the silencing of the guilt over Tracy's death, more than anything else.
You can't go wrong with either effort and Dalton is my #1 Bond, but LTK, despite some faults, has the edge.
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
"Kara, we're inside a Russian airbase in the middle of Afghanistan."
He made the Rocketeer pop with his bad guy Nevelle Sinclair; he made CHUCK season four shine with his Alexei Volkoff, his small role as Damien Drake in Loony Tunes Back In Action made the film worth owning...
I could go on... -{
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
Okay?
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
I love Sean Connery, I really do. He's a great Bond. But after all the movies, and after all the books, Connery is 2nd best. And if my choice is between The Living Daylights and From Russia With Love, The Living Daylights wins. Always.
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
"Kara, we're inside a Russian airbase in the middle of Afghanistan."
As someone who likes both Dalton and Connery ... I think to claim that Dalton's Bond is the best interpretation of the character without first analysing Connery's early performances is folly. Yes, Dalton has been regarded - quite rightly - as the "dark" Bond, the actor who has brought the true interpretation of Fleming's character onto the screen. But I'd argue he wasn't the first to do it. Bond's assassination of Professor Dent in Dr No as well as his dealing with the chauffeur, Mr Jones, was about as cold and as dark as anything Dalton had done. His fight with Grant in From Russia With Love is as rough and macho as you can get.
It's not because Connery was the first. It's because his portrayal of Bond in Dr No and From Russia With Love is as good as anything Dalton has done. And, for me, From Russia With Love is the best Bond film ever made. Period.
I'm a fan of the Fleming literary Bond first, and I firmly believe that the cinematic Bond should as closely as possible mirror the literary character. Dalton was absolutely superb in that regard. But so too was Connery's performance in the first two films.
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
It's not because Connery was the first. It's because his portrayal of Bond in Dr No and From Russia With Love is as good as anything Dalton has done. And, for me, From Russia With Love is the best Bond film ever made. Period.
I'm a fan of the Fleming literary Bond first, and I firmly believe that the cinematic Bond should as closely as possible mirror the literary character. Dalton was absolutely superb in that regard. But so too was Connery's performance in the first two films."
I agree that Connery echos Fleming's Bond in his first two outings very well, but Dalton gets a higher mark from me because of the emotion he brings to the role. Imagine the death of Saunders taking place with Connery in the role. There would be some sense of loss from Connery, but not at the same level brought to the table by Dalton. The raw rage Dalton allows to overtake him in that scene takes it to a level we've never seen in any of the Bond films prior. Not even when Bond found Kerim Bey in "FRWL" was Bond that affected by the death of an ally.
Again, this is personal taste, but I don't think the scene between Bond and Pushkin in the hotel room would crack with the same energy as it does with Connery as Bond. It still would be good, but Connery is cooler in the role of Bond. When I watched the scene played by Dalton the first time, I was genuinely wondering how it would turn out. We as an audience know that Bond's figured out he's being played, but the anger and ruthlessness he brings to the scene nevertheless make us wonder if Bond is indeed going to kill Pushkin anyway. For Dalton to be able to fool us into thinking he may pull the trigger after he's questioned killing Pushkin from the moment he got the assignment again takes some doing.
Connery's easily my second favorite Bond. There's no question about it. When I say Dalton is the best, it's because, I guess, I prefer the added emotion Dalton brings to it. Connery is a fantastic Bond, but his Bond isn't world-weary. It's presented in the Connery films that Bond maybe does like this jet-setting lifestyle a little bit. That's more of a sign of the scripting than Connery himself, because the scripts are presenting Bond as this cool guy who gets all the ladies and who guys want to be.
Dalton captures the Fleming Bond ideal closer for me because it seems like his is the Bond most poisoned by what he does. I can easily picture Dalton's Bond sitting alone at his flat after a mission trying to drink the demons of his actions into silence. Dalton's Bond is resigned to the fact that at some point, he's going to be retired in a mission. He's on the edge. His Bond is still cool, but he effectively conveys that maybe the price paid for him to be a 00 isn't quite what it's cracked up to be.
I just can't quite get that with Connery's Bond. I think he'd be more at home enjoying the night life in a casino with a beautiful girl on his arm. There's nothing wrong with that, it's just not quite my interpretation of Fleming's Bond.
And going back to the literary source, while it never would have worked on-screen, because Bond is supposed to be unflappable, I really think if they would have ever done the true Bond downfall from the books, where Bond literally goes to pieces after Tracy's death, becomes an alcoholic screw-up, and has to be saved from the chopping block by Psychiatrist Dr. James Molony, Timothy Dalton's incantation and acting would have been the best suited for the storyline. And I can easily picture a disheveled, weak-looking and brainwashed Dalton playing the opening scene in "The Man With the Golden Gun", having been programmed by the Russians to try and kill M.
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
What can I say. Some people speak Klingon. I speak Welsh Fleming.....
Sorry, Buffy fan. 8-)
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
Fair point. Connery's Bond did take his anger out on Romanova in the immediate aftermath of finding out about Kerim's death, though. He called her a liar and slapped her hard across the face. But you're quite right, it wasn't done as well as Dalton did after Saunder's death. The other side of the argument, however, is that as soon as Connery's Bond realised that Romanova was just as "in the dark" about this whole affair as he is, and that they're both pawns in a SPECTRE game of cat and mouse, there's not much reason anymore to remain angry at Romanova.
Being completely honest, I felt the same when I was watching Connery's Bond interrogate Mr Jones. The look on his face as soon as he found out that Mr Jones wasn't a legitimate Government House employee, and telling the Principal Secretary that he'd be "a few minutes late" suggests to me that he was thinking of ways to dispose of Mr Jones quietly. I think that if Mr Jones didn't take his own life, Connery's Bond would've done the job instead.
Fair point.
Again, that's a fair point. You have no argument from me there. However, this side of Bond (unfortunately) wasn't explored in the films, and as a result, I guess we'll never know for certain if Connery could've pulled off these scenes just as effectively. I agree, however, that it is likely Dalton would do a better job portraying that side of Bond's character. As far as Bond's ruthless, cruel and dangerous streak, however, I think Connery's portrayal is easily the equal of Dalton's, both of whom are easily better than any other actor to have played James Bond, in my opinion.
BTW, I did watch FRWL last night, and you are correct, I'd forgotten about the scene where he "Interrogates" Tania after Kerim's death. Interestingly enough, Dalton gets to play a similar scene in "LTK" when thinks Pam is working with Sanchez, though it's a bit more ruthless.
I need to reacquaint myself with "Dr. No". It's been too long.
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
I doubt Bond would be able to tell Quarrel to "Fetch his shoes" nowadays.
No way the guy shouting orders from the boat telling them to come out actually sounds like that in real life.
They're shooting at Bond, Quarrel, and Honey Rider from the SS Minnow, as I live and breathe. And Bond already shot "The Professor", after he used his six.