The Battle of the Bonds in '83, what was it like?

Dutchfinger

The battle of the Bonds in 1983! I'm curious to hear some more stories on this from people who can remember expierences from this time, just to get a feel what it was like. (I wasn't born untill 1990)

Were NSNA and OP in fact in theatre's at exactly the same time? Did you go and see both movies, or just the Connery/ Moore one. Were you aware of the whole Kevin McClory story behind NSNA? What were the critics saying? Please share your expierences

chrisisall

Dutchfinger wrote:

The battle of the Bonds in 1983! I'm curious to hear some more stories on this from people who can remember expierences from this time, just to get a feel what it was like.

After MR, Moore was a joke to us. FYEO redeemed him quite a bit, but the former bad taste was still present. Then NSNA came out, and we all loved it because it was a return to Connery Bond (forget that the movie was a bit sub-par), and there was much rejoicing. In time though, a malaise settled in as we realized NSNA wasn't all that, and we resigned ourselves to the fact that movies like GF, TB & YOLT would never be made again.
1983, New York USA me & my fellow hardcore Bond fans specific tale.

James Suzuki

I wasn't born either....sorry, but I feel that some great stories can come up from this.
Whatever you may say, Roger Moore is betterthen Connery,IMHO, and Connery is really overrated and dated.
So, I would have enjoyed the whole Bond vs Bond thing, but I would of known in my mind what film would have come up on top.

chrisisall

James Suzuki wrote:

Whatever you may say, Roger Moore is betterthen Connery,IMHO, and Connery is really overrated and dated.
So, I would have enjoyed the whole Bond vs Bond thing, but I would of known in my mind what film would have come up on top.

Oh, in the end, OP made more at the box office- the general public seemed to prefer it to NSNA. And TODAY I own & enjoy OP a great deal, whereas I don't even own NSNA because I find it one great big bore.

James Suzuki

I wonder if something on those lines will happen again?

Dutchfinger

Octopussy is a way better film. However I still enjoy watching Never Say Never Again. It's not an official Bond movie of course so all of the Bond touches are missing. But I would dare to call it a better movie than Diamonds Are Forever.

Asp9mm

I was only a kid at the time and saw both. Didn't really understand at the time that they were two opposing studio releases, or actually knew they were. So when I saw NSNA I had no idea why it was missing all the traditional Bond elements like the gunbarrel, Q, M and other things I was expecting. It just seemed wrong. I didn't like it. Can't say I've warmed to it since either.

PMN

I saw both films at the cinema two or three times and thoroughly enjoyed them both.
I really can't remember there being any 'Battle of the Bonds'. Just a bonus for fans to
have two new Bond films in the same year. With hindsight, NSNA seems a bit dodgy now,
but it was brilliant at the time and , of course, miles better on the big screen than on video
or dvd which is how I suspect most people younger than myself ( and there's a lot of them ! )
will have seen it.

TonyDP

Dutchfinger wrote:

The battle of the Bonds in 1983! I'm curious to hear some more stories on this from people who can remember expierences from this time, just to get a feel what it was like. (I wasn't born untill 1990)

Were NSNA and OP in fact in theatre's at exactly the same time? Did you go and see both movies, or just the Connery/ Moore one. Were you aware of the whole Kevin McClory story behind NSNA? What were the critics saying? Please share your expierences

OP and NSNA did not go head to head at the movies (at least not in the USA). Originally they were both supposed to be summer films but while OP did premiere in June of 1983, NSNA's release date was pushed back to October. No formal reason was ever given but, just like today, the summer months were crammed with high profile movies and there was chatter that the filmmakers weren't confident about going head to head with Octopussy, Star Wars and other blockbusters.

In terms of box office performance, OP's summer release meant it had to go up against some big guns like Return of the Jedi; it never actually won a weekend box office battle but still raked in a ton of cash. NSNA opened at number one as it had no real competition but actually made less money overall

Personally, I found OP to be the far more entertaining movie of the two; there were aspects I didn't like (the Tarzan yell, as well as the gorilla and clown suits) but it felt like a big spectacle. NSNA by comparison looked like a made for TV movie at times with absolutely horrible performances, a terrible music score and a generally boring pace to the whole thing.

NSNA managed to milk a lot of publicity out of Connery's return but once the novelty of that fact wore off the luxury of time has allowed most people realize what a bad movie it actually was.

Higgins

Mc Clorys warhead bored James Bond fans for over 10 years as it was always announced and then did not come.
The german James Bond Fan Club obviously received money from the Mc Clory camp as suddenly there was a huge coverage of the NSNA activities - previously they (he) where pretty loyal to EON.

This all peaked in an "All times low" bashing article speading over 2 issues after Octopussy came into the cinemas in June 1983 here and praised Connery and the movie-to-become in an almost unbearable way.

NSNA started in jan. 1984 and the german James Bond Fanclub was bankrupt.

I enjoyed NSNA Pts (particularly the way they did the 007 logo) but the rest of the movie was cheap and boring.
Particularly the obviously small-engined bike, the Atari- battle which puts all MR space scenes into perspective, the poor soundtrack and the end chase on a horse where absolute downers - Connery was obviosuly bored.

I went 3 times to Octopussy in the cinema, limited myself to one ciewing for NSNA and did not feel the need to watch it again.

Napoleon Plural

Yeah, in the UK NSNA got pushed back to Christmas, a bad sign really. It seemed lacklustre in terms of publicity compared to OP, and got bumped into the inferior screen as it came out the same week as Jaws 3D.

It probably forced them to up their game with OP, but it seemed the Yanks were bigger on the whole return of Connery thing, because his films were showing more there on telly. In the UK, he seemed ancient history, in fact his films didn't get many viewings in the early 1980s, one reason why Dr No got a whopping 27m viewers when it got showed again around 1986 or so. That and the fact he wore a wig, and most of the viewers were young kids didn't bode well.

But I was dismayed to see how silly and daft the film was, no more serious than a Moore film imo but none of the spectacle. No great song to promote it either, though OP didn't do too well on this either. The title in retrospect had a classic ring to it, but is ambivalent and forgettable. Does it mean Never say 'never' again? In which case you've just said it. I didn't realise it meant Never say 'never again'...

BTW when I heard Connery was to return as Bond, from my Dad, I thought Sean and Cubby had buried the hatchet and he was back in Octopussy, and that Moore's salary demands had backfired because they wanted a more serious Bond!

ChromeJob

Emboldened by FYEO (despite a crappy score, some goofy "everyone's trying to kill Bond" nonsense), I went to see OP and that was IT ... I was DONE with Moore, EON, the whole thing. The jokey nonsense (Tarzan yell? using Barbara Woodhouse on a tiger?) made me cringe.

I knew all about the McClory kerfuffle (probably from my Brosnan book) and knew what we were in for: an aging Connery trying not to mock his previous performances, a predictable TB retread plot. Kim Basinger had a nice pictorial in Playboy, I think that's all I saw of it. Oh, I rented the VHS tape years later and was underwhelmed (I liked the humor of "Bond's getting too old" riff).

But by that point, both Moore and Connery were IMHO way too old to be playing a field agent who's supposed to be retired to desk duty at 45. I departed from paying any attention to Bond cinema, until TLD came out and I gave that a timid sniff.

Charmed & Dangerous

I remember the newspapers really talked it up and there seemed to be a slight bias towards Connery's return, perhaps because of Moore's lighter touch, which didn't sit well with older cinema goers.

But to us Bond fans, we didn't care, we were just delighted to have the joy of 2 Bonds in one year )

I remember really enjoying Octopussy and wondering if Never Say Never Again could live up to it. When I saw the PTS of NSNA I remember thinking 'wow, this is gonna be even better!'. And it was enjoyable, but it was clear that it lacked the polish of Eon's film. The John Barry music,the Bond theme, gun barrel sequence were all missing - and the cinematography felt a bit 'off'. However the script by Clement and Le Frenais was very witty and a highlight.

The best thing about it was Connery's performance, he was at his most urbane and self-deprecating, almost as if he'd taken a leaf out of Moore's book.

raptors_887

James Suzuki wrote:

I wonder if something on those lines will happen again?

Like Peirce Brosnan making another Bond movie? That would be cool.

superado

I was there, man!!!! That was a big deal of the two Bonds going head-to-head, but the release of one of them was postponed for a couple of months if I remember correctly. I watched both in the theater and I loved both. I wasn't out to decidedly determine which one was best, but back then in the days before the Internet, it was Starlog magazine that chronicled events of geek fandom like that, which I collected monthly. With the cold war still going on the plot of OP was very relevant despite the fantastic elements and the stunts were up to par with best Bond movies. NSNA was such an entertaining curiousity and the sight of Connery playing Bond again, even as an old gent, was such a treat; the whole movie was an opportunity to marvel at Connery doing the old things again in a variety of scenes. In summary, OP was fun Bondmania and NSNA was fantastic Connery-ania, the best of both worlds!

Napoleon Plural

Yeah, Starlog went big on it.

Moore Than

Napoleon Plural wrote:

Yeah, Starlog went big on it.

DOH! I threw away my copy some years ago when I had a clear out. What was I thinking? X-(

At the time, I lapped it all up getting all the information I could before seeing both the films at the cinema. For me, Octopussy is the better film by some distance, but it's to Sean Connery's credit that Never Say Never Again did so well at the box office. It showed how much he was still loved and admired as James Bond, even if he wasn't the James Bond of Thunderball.

Strangeways

I remember there was much coverage in the media and I'm sure I have kept a few newspaper articles as well as magazines. One in particular was a double page centre spread from one of the Sunday tabloids.

They did make a big deal about it initially, but then from memory, because NSNA was delayed until the autumn, I think that the whole "Battle" thing just drifted away.

My Mom grew up in 1960s Liverpool and saw The Beatles and other acts at The Cavern. Although she loves relaying stories to me of how she enjoyed the time, when you are being part of history and major historical events you aren't really aware of it until later. The same is true for the Battle of the Bonds year...we fans didn't realise how huge an entry in the Bond history books it would turn out to be. Don't feel bad that you threw your magazines away MooreThan.

BIG TAM

I seem to remember a lot of magazine & newspaper coverage. I was more excited about NEVER SAY NEVER AGAIN, but on release found its lack of 'Bond elements' (gunbarrel, Bond theme) off-putting. Curiously, this lack of tradition no longer bothers me. I soon came to the conclusion I preferred OCTOPUSSY. Connery lacked his dangerous edge & the whole film felt like a Roger Moore Bond without Roger Moore in it! A pity as NSNA had been touted as a return to more serious early '60s thrills. By contrast, it felt like more effort had been put into OCTOPUSSY & consequently - Tarzan yells, etc aside - it felt a more satisfying film.

As was mentioned on the EVERYTHING OR NOTHING documentary I think it proved conclusively that Connery's presence alone simply wasn't enough.

Blackleiter

It was enough for me!

BIG TAM wrote:

Connery's presence alone simply wasn't enough.

Thunderpussy

I do remember many of the Papers had stories about
The Battle of the Bonds, along with film Magazine spreads.
For Me there was No competition, I enjoyed OP but was
Bored watching NSNA.

Firemass

I've enjoyed reading the comments/memoirs. thanks for posting guys. '83 was before my time!

chrisisall

Firemass wrote:

I've enjoyed reading the comments/memoirs. thanks for posting guys. '83 was before my time!

Get this boy a bib. He needs his Mama.
(sorry, any chance to throw out my favourite lines from Westworld, don't you know... ) )

Sir Hillary Bray

It was a seminal time. I was 18, a southern California high school senior. In the US, the buildup for "dueling Bonds" came amidst a somewhat ballyhooed 20th annniversary of Dr. No in 1982. All the Bond films (which I first discovered 5 years earlier when I caught TSWLM on early pay-cable TV) were suddenly available in video stores -- Betamax, VHS, even video disc! After I graduated, I spent long hours in the summer of '83 renting each one, rigging up two VCRs, bootlegging my own copies (which I think I still have somewhere in my basement) and watching them again and again and again. To have both OP and NSNA, and their respective marketing blitzes, coming at the same time? Well, I was in heaven. Unlike some here, I had not soured on Moore. MR had been a disappointment, but FYEO was great. Connery, while my favorite Bond, just seemed too dated and old. I know Rog is older, but Sean's gray hair and lined face -- and how different he looked from his last time as Bond in DAF -- made me think of him as Grandpa Bond. Neither of the films lived up to the hype, but OP was clearly better. Back then, the "formula" meant more to me than it does now, and NSNA felt like a Bond film from a parallel universe -- which is, of course, exactly what it was.

ausbondfan

I wasn't there in 83 (About 8 years before my time) but looking back on it all it's a really cool concept. You have the man who made it all coming back in the role. They probably had the rights to the film that most would work around Connery's age the best also.

Roger had been playing the role of Bond for 10 years so Connery returning would of been a breath of fresh air in my opinion. As for the actual film I liked it, I rate it over Moonraker, Diamonds Are Forever and Die Another Day. Connery did seem to be going through the motions but Bassinger was pretty good as a Bond girl and the Bike scene I really enjoyed.

The best thing about the 83 Battle Of The Bonds? Every single Bond appeared playing the role. Roger was in Octopussy, Connery in Never Say Never Again and George Lazenby as "J.B" in "The Man From U.N.C.L.E" probably the last time ever that every single Bond will play a "Bond esque" character all in the same year.

Oh and I'd be all for another Battle of the Bonds. It'd probably have to be Brosnan Vs Craig but I think that could be appealing to the masses definitely.

jamesm123

Octopussy with Timothy Dalton minus Tarzan yell and monkey suit would have been great.

chrisisall

jamesm123 wrote:

Octopussy with Timothy Dalton minus Tarzan yell and monkey suit would have been great.

I can't argue with that. )