more info on the Dr. No film holster

rednichols

I found this site originally while searching for other Bond info; and as a holster designer/maker it seemed clear that the Dr. No holster isn't well understood generally.

That's because, it would seem that copies of the Bond holster appear to have been made from stills from the film, rather than from original patterns (correct me if I'm wrong). And that would further be, because, in my view it's not well understood that the Dr. No holster is a fabric-and-suede redux, by a costume department, of a well known shoulder holster of the era: the circa 1950-1960 Heiser H185 shoulder holster.

It even appears that, rather than copying the Heiser made for the Walther (it was available for both both autos and revolvers), the film's costumers have copied what they had on hand instead, which was the common revolver version. The example I've included (see attached pics) is for a 2" small revolver; note how the Walther fits equally (improperly) in both it and the film version (which may have been for a longer barrel).

Note the significant design points at the arrows, including the adjustment point at the breast pocket area. I have intentionally shrunk my images to be roughly as small as the film stills I had available.

Gadget Meister

Just something to bear in mind is that the pistol physically used in DN was a Walther PP not a PPK* and, although not a huge difference, the PP has an overall length of 173mm as opposed to the PPK at 154mm. I think that it is fairly well known that the holster used was a fabricated prop and not a commercially available holster. -{

* Apart from the Dent assassination scene in which an FN Browning M1910 was used due to filming/prop constraints.

minigeff

I thought the PPK was also shorter in height to the PP by around half an inch Andy?

Didn't realise the PPK was an inch shorter in length too though. Guess you learn summat everyday.

MG

Gadget Meister

Absolutely right Jeff, PP 109mm & PPK 100mm in height. Again all of this will affect holster fit, but in this instance I believe the difference is in the height of the grip which will not affect this particular design of holster whereas the overall length will.

thespyboys11

Welcome to the forum "rednichols" Glad to have you providing insights on the props.
Looking forward to seeing more from you.
Ed

rednichols

Gadget Meister wrote:

I think that it is fairly well known that the holster used was a fabricated prop and not a commercially available holster.

Then you missed my point :-) which is that it is indeed based on a commercial holster; that is, if one wanted to make a replica, one would take apart an original Heiser, which is what they would've done; and make patterns therefrom. In other words, the holster was not designed for the film; its materials were simply changed. Who knows, perhaps even Heiser-Keyston-Lichtenberger did the work themselves; Keyston's core business by then was automotive upholstery.

Further, my other point is that the obvious poor fit to the pistol is not a product of a non-holster person designing the holster; but of choosing the wrong holster model to copy.

Donald Grant

Welcome Red, I have made copies of both the Dr. No holster and the Goldfinger holster. My pattern was based on a holster made for me by a professional holster maker at great expense. The holster made by the professional was based on both stills and information I obtained regarding one of the original film holsters. The holster made by the professional for me was not totally accurate which is why I made my own more accurate version based on his pattern. The copies I have made for fellow collectors are made as props only although I am knowledgeable about firearms, carry concealed everyday, and hone my shooting skills at least once a quarter.

I am conversant in what materials the original holster was made from and regularly get requests to make copies. Nevertheless, if you make this holster and it's good and accurate, I'll buy one.

DG

Donald Grant

Many people have attempted to make this holster. Here is one:

http://www.legendsinleather.com/mi6_mkii.html

It's not very accurate, but I like it. He also has another version on his website.

DG

Tecolote

The actual movie holster also held the Beretta M1934 that the "PPK"/PP replaces in the script as well as the FN 1910, so it had to pretty generic(as a lot of real holsters were at the time of filming). All it had to do was hold the gun for a scene; Connery never actually had to do any fast draw with it,although it may seem so during the Quarrel and Puss-feller scene all Connery really had to do was raise the Walther up into camera view.
Heiser was a very prominent holster maker in the States,with their Model 457 being suppplied to the FBI, and many of their designs were copied by other makers.
Somewhat OT,but still holster related: in the book DR NO Fleming describes the Berns-Martin as "Best worn insdie the trouser band to the left." Fleming may have got that idea from Chic Gaylord's G-2 Defender, which was an inside the waistband
design, which the B-M Triple Draw Lightnin' wasn't.

Regards,

Tecolote

rednichols

Tecolote wrote:

The actual movie holster also held the Beretta M1934 that the "PPK"/PP replaces in the script as well as the FN 1910, so it had to pretty generic(as a lot of real holsters were at the time of filming). All it had to do was hold the gun for a scene; Connery never actually had to do any fast draw with it,although it may seem so during the Quarrel and Puss-feller scene all Connery really had to do was raise the Walther up into camera view.
Heiser was a very prominent holster maker in the States,with their Model 457 being suppplied to the FBI, and many of their designs were copied by other makers.
Somewhat OT,but still holster related: in the book DR NO Fleming describes the Berns-Martin as "Best worn insdie the trouser band to the left." Fleming may have got that idea from Chic Gaylord's G-2 Defender, which was an inside the waistband
design, which the B-M Triple Draw Lightnin' wasn't.

Regards,

Tecolote

Pretty good on the history, though many companies of the era had waistband holsters besides Gaylord.

Wiki's link on this is as good as any:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Berns-Martin

Stills from the film, which may already be on this site:

rednichols

Donald Grant wrote:

I am conversant in what materials the original holster was made from and regularly get requests to make copies. Nevertheless, if you make this holster and it's good and accurate, I'll buy one.

DG

Indeed I'm in the middle of a Bond holster, but it's for the future, not the past. Contemporary design with a bit of tuxedo bling, better suited to Bond and his tux than the character has used in the past. For goodness' sake, in the last film he was scrabbling mags out of his jacket pocket.

Donald Grant

Tecolote wrote:

The actual movie holster also held the Beretta M1934 that the "PPK"/PP replaces in the script as well as the FN 1910, so it had to pretty generic(as a lot of real holsters were at the time of filming). All it had to do was hold the gun for a scene; Connery never actually had to do any fast draw with it,although it may seem so during the Quarrel and Puss-feller scene all Connery really had to do was raise the Walther up into camera view.
Heiser was a very prominent holster maker in the States,with their Model 457 being suppplied to the FBI, and many of their designs were copied by other makers.
Somewhat OT,but still holster related: in the book DR NO Fleming describes the Berns-Martin as "Best worn insdie the trouser band to the left." Fleming may have got that idea from Chic Gaylord's G-2 Defender, which was an inside the waistband
design, which the B-M Triple Draw Lightnin' wasn't.

Regards,

Tecolote

Yeah, the Berns-Martin Triple Draw was used as either a shoulder holster, or a hip holster in either regular draw or cross draw configuration. It was not used as an IWB holster.

7289

Here is the Berns-Martin Triple draw with a proper S&W Centennial Airweight ...



In later thrillers, OHMSS to be specific, Fleming describes Bond fitting a "stitched pigskin" holster inside his waistband after which he "clips" in the Walther. He is clearly describing something that exists solely in his imagination. While detail oriented Fleming was far from perfect in many descriptions.

rednichols ... that's a real good catch on the Heiser got any other pictures that show the entire rig?

rednichols

Heiser actually had two FBI holsters, these from Heiser's 1950 catalogue and the new-to-the-business John Bianchi's copies from his 1963 catalogue:






My own FBI design adopted in the 90s, submitted originally to client De Santis who won the original contract (there was another very different design of mine in the running, which was during the FBI's infamous "10mm light" adoption) has also been widely copied; though I think the others could have done better than to copy it stitch-for-stitch, there being so many other ways to leapfrog the Baker original from the 70s. The Galco copy is the best known of the following (one of my originals is shown as the one "in the white" (unfinished):













Only an expert could tell them apart.

Donald Grant

That's very interesting! One of the holsters I use is actually a russet Galco with a forward cant.

DG

Edit: 10mm light which became the .40 S&W.

Tecolote

rednichols: I mentioned Gaylord because Fleming was asked about his holsters in his 1964 Playboy interviewalthough I have no idea whether Fleming actually met Chic Gaylord. I suspect Fleming picked Berns-Martin more because the name sounded good (as does Walther PPK 7.65mm).
7289 here is a thread on the Colt Forum which shows the Heiser 185:
http://www.coltforum.com/forums/leather-accessories/53326-big-three-myres-heiser-lawrence-3-examples.html

Regards.

Tecolote

Asp9mm

rednichols wrote:

For goodness' sake, in the last film he was scrabbling mags out of his jacket pocket.

It's a sound and well proven method employed by our elite trained units. Mags carried in the jacket pocket create a weight that aids in moving aside your jacket quickly and keeps it out of the way when drawing your sidearm from a holster worn on that same side. It's a tactic used by the SAS, SBS, SRR and the old 14 company (DET), and an extremely effective combat proven tactic.

7289

Tecolote,

Fleming picked the Berns-Martin on the recommendation of Geoffrey Boothroyd, who had one made up for his customized S&W .38-200 revolver which appears on the original dust jacket of From Russia with Love.

Thanks for the Colt Forum link!

Tecolote

7289;
You're absolutely right. What I meant was that the holster he describes isn't a real Berns-Martin product, but sounds
more like one of Gaylord's IWB designs.

Regards,

Tecolote

david2b

hello
I would like james bond holster
as in the film Dr No.
or I can buy one
thank you

Tecolote

Since this thread has been somewhat revived, it's a good time to put up aanother link to the Colt forum, as it turns out Berns-Martin did indeed make an inside waistband holster, but they didn't catalog it:
http://www.coltforum.com/forums/leather-accessories/89844-just-found-berns-martin-iwb-det-spl-holster.html
As I asked over there:did Fleming know anything about it?

Regards,

Tecolote

ke02eww

david2b wrote:

hello
I would like james bond holster
as in the film Dr No.
or I can buy one
thank you

http://www.ebay.com/itm/JAMES-BOND-LEATHER-SHOULDER-HOLSTER-CONNERY-STYLE-GOLDFINGER-FOR-WALTHER-PPK-/131474364390?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e9c7b97e6

7289

The Berns Martin IWB holster is indeed interesting ... it bears a striking resemblance to a holster set up illustrated in Fairbain & Sykes Shooting to Live . In that fine work the authors also mention seeing "the Martin brothers" demonstrating their "front draw holsters" in San Diego, Callifornia.

From page 88 of Shooting To Live,



Like Bond's holster, this is worn "inside the trouser band on the left". It should be noted that Fleming trained at Camp X in Canada, and I believe the instructor there was Fairbairn ...

Those who study the fabric holsters should note the scene in Dr. No, when Connery draws the Browning 1910 from the holster when setting up the ambush of Professor Dent. It's obvious that the gun is held tightly in the scabbard as Big Tam has to overcome some resistance to remove the pistol? Some form of retention?

david2b

I am looking holster Dr No.

Tecolote

7289,you are likely onto something with the Fairbairn example. The revolver is drawn from a Colt New Service,likely a pre 1909 "Old Model" in .455 or .45 Colt, modified like a "Fitz Special" after J. Henry Fitzgerald of the Colt company who pretty much came up with type, although many others made the same modifications.If someone ever found that particular gun, it'd fetch a pretty penny. If I may add a couple more cuts from the same source:

showing the holster worn"to the left"

even though it labeled "shoulder holster" I suspect it was meant for the belly gun, as the bottom button or two of the vest are unbuttoned, and you'd need the vest to cover the gun in that position. and finally:

a Colt .45 automatic in a Heiser No. 126 holster (like the SOE type). If Fairbairn carried those two guns along with his Shanghai dagger,hilt down on his right side,he was pretty well equipped for a Shanghai night on the town.

As to your thought on retention of the FN in the Dent scene, I compared the FN, Walther PP, and M34 Beretta side by side,and if the holster fit the Walther, I doubt there was any real retention. Perhaps a simulated jerk and some Foley for the "snick" sound. BTW, I've always the silencer sounds in DR NO were cool sounding( even though real silencers don't sound likw that) but I'm pretty sure the recording is actually that of a car door slamming shut

Donald Grant

I've always loved the Fitz Special, and have seen various articles in gun magazines where people have had copies of it made. I've always considered the Geoffrey Boothroyd gun (on the cover of FRWL) his take on the Fitz Special.

DG

7289

Fairbairn does attribute the revolver in his book to "Fitz".

Boothroyd too was doing the "Fitz" when he rounded the butt of his .38-200, cut the barrel and the trigger guard. Boothroyd didn't bother bobbing the hammer though and his addition of adjustable sights is somewhat contrary to the concept. He was looking for speed and accuracy for his aerial shooting, and must have felt that the round butt and absent trigger guard provided that.

Somewhere back in the safe is a pretty well used .45 New Service with a bulged barrel waiting for the day it will be made into a "Fitz" special.

Tecolote

Fairbairn's son carried a "Fitz" also. The cutaway triggerguard gives me the willies, although I do know an old timer who still carries his Chief's Special so modified.
BTW, if you check out the Colt Forum thread I linked to there's a new photo of a slightly later version of Berns-Martin IWB,with an adjustable belt loop.

Regards,

Tecolote