World Cup 2014

Strangeways

So....England are going to be there next summer.
Any Bond fans going to take advantage of a trip to Brazil to watch a match and soak up some locations in Rio and elsewhere in Brazil?

Napoleon Plural

I sense this is intended to be more a Brazil thread than a football thread, SW...

Ens007

Sounds like they're talking about it costing English fans around £9000 for the group stage alone. Think I'll stay at home & listen to a fishing match on the radio.

Nothing really beats being part of Fifa's global 'family'

The Domino Effect

It's a long way to go and a lot of money to spend to see us draw with Iceland and Honduras before losing to Iran in the final group stage match. :v

Thunderpussy

I loved the interview with one happy fan
" Well they did it and we're going " the reporter then asked " "will they go all the way ?"
answer "Nah " )

Higgins

The Domino Effect wrote:

It's a long way to go and a lot of money to spend to see us draw with Iceland and Honduras before losing to Iran in the final group stage match. :v

Usually we germans do that dirty job

The Domino Effect

Bondtoys wrote:

Usually we germans do that dirty job

I heard a rumour that you practice taking penalties even in the womb. Is that correct?

Higgins

We never had to

LoGabrielle

As usual, Ireland failed to book their spot. Maybe next time... ) Still can't wait though! Would love to go but can't at that time of the year

Napoleon Plural

Bumped into some Germans after their customary win last night. They had this jovial, benign attitude. Watching their team play probably feels like ordering a bratwurst and nice jug of beer, a happy event with an entirely expected outcome. "Ya, because we have the better team, no?" Whereas for English fans it has all the doom, despair mingled with hope like a fella on death row tucking into his last supper, half hoping a last-minute note of reprieve might be found in the fortune cookie.

Higgins

) ) ) yes, I feel for you.

J. Hart surprisingly was pretty good yesterday and you have to keep in mind that most of the good german players have been injured/on vacation.

If we had Özil, Khedira, Lahm, Müller in the team, yesterday's result would have been much different - and many more bratwurst orders on our end {[]

Good for your team that Goetze and Reuss had not their very best day yesterday though…..

AlphaOmegaSin

Bondtoys wrote:

We never had to

Remember to put Snow Tracks on your Tanks this Time if your facing Russia again

Higgins

It may sound arrogant, but the only teams that we have to fear a little - would be Italy and Spain.

But I am sure that they feel the same about us as well

AlphaOmegaSin

Napoleon Plural wrote:

Bumped into some Germans after their customary win last night. They had this jovial, benign attitude. Watching their team play probably feels like ordering a bratwurst and nice jug of beer, a happy event with an entirely expected outcome. "Ya, because we have the better team, no?" Whereas for English fans it has all the doom, despair mingled with hope like a fella on death row tucking into his last supper, half hoping a last-minute note of reprieve might be found in the fortune cookie.

I don't follow Football and I've never liked Sports, but who are we playing next?

Sir Miles

Bondtoys wrote:

Good for your team that Goetze and Reuss had not their very best day yesterday though…..

How much did Goetze cost again ? £35m was it ? And Reus will cost much the same when he transfers to the Premiership next season

Both are great talents...so are your African and Polish players

Germany are YEARS ahead of England in terms of football player development and I firmly believe this is down to how the Bundesliga operates - mainly its policy to not allow clubs to go into debt too much...

We have some great young talent coming through - some were even born in England - but its how much regular first team football these players get over the next two years...their path is often blocked into the first team by, decent enough, foreign players...

Higgins

As always - Sir Miles appears to be right - on the surface.

If you try to find a bit more substance, things are not so easy

1. Reus: I am pretty sure that he'll play another season in Dortmund at least and then meet Goetze in Munich
I have never seen him playing that bad as yesterday.

2. Goetze: He costed 37 million EUROS and half of Europe was behind him. And what does the amount have to do with anything that I've said? He was only playing 30% of what he can yesterday.

Now the "african and polish players":

3. Jerome Boateng: Born in Berlin, grew up in Berlin, speaks german with a Berlin accent - just like his brother Kevin Prince (who's a prick big time btw) - who chose to play for Ghana before his international carrer.
To me they are both german. period. They hava a ghanaese father and a german mother btw.

4. Lukas Podolski: Born in Poland, migrated to Germany when he was 2 and speaks german with a Cologne accent. Both parents are polish and he chose to play for Germany before the internaional carreer. Has always played in Germany before he went to the UK. I regard him as a german citizen and I know he does as well

5. Miroslaw Klose: born in Poland, father of german heritage, mother polish. Family moved to France when he was 3 and went to Germany when he was 8. Chose to play for Germany at the beginning of his carreer.
He's the only one whom I don't see 100% german because he speaks polish at home though his german is perfect with a "pfälzer" accent.

These constant " polish" and recently "african" comments are simply annoying and just pathetic!

German football never "bought" players from other countries, Fifa rules demand a decision from the players at the beginning of their carreer.

All mentioned players grew up here, have been educated here, went to german football colleges and there is nothing dodgy with them playing for us.

As for the success of the german national teams, there are different factors:

1. Joachim Löw: He's basically in charge since 2004 . Klinsman was more a manager than a coach. Under his reign, german football philosophy changed completely

2. 2006: The World Championship 2006 had a HUGE impact to many boys and girls to start playing football. Some of the now national players have been the kids at the beginning of the matches (dunno the english term).

3. Football academies: Part of the 2006 championship where new-opened academies in the major german cities. These are highly successfully in bringing new talents!

4. Budget: Like Sir Miles said, another factor is that german teams have to present a weighted budgets. Excessive debts are not allowed.

Thanks for listening

The Domino Effect

England will continue to be crap as long as the greed of club owners and the impatience of plastic fans continues. There are woefully fewer English players in the league than in any other major European league (ie Bundesliga, Serie A, La Liga, Eredivise etc). It's not that we don't or can't produce good young English talent anymore, it's that unless an English player is an absolute stand-out at age 16, they are not given the chance to develop at top clubs. There are good English players in the Championship and Div 1 & 2, but they'll never develop properly if not given the chance to be managed by the best and to play week-in week-out alongside the best. And sadly, most Prem clubs will not give them that chance when they can buy the finished article form overseas. If you use English goalkeepers as the example, until the creation of the Premier League, England always had one of the best 2 or 3 goalkeepers in the world. Along with Italy, Germany and the odd star from other countries, we consistently produced outstanding goalkeepers. A goalkeeper doesn't hit his prime until he's at least 27-28 which means it takes a long time to nurture a great goalkeeper before he becomes a solid number one. Sadly, my much hated 'greedy owners and impatient plastics' will no longer take the time and money to nurture a great 18 year old goalkeeper for 8-10 years when they can buy one from Poland or Czech - or even Spain given their current economic woes - who's the finished article. The same is true in every position.

I actually hoped we wouldn't qualify for the World Cup (after all, what's the point? We'll be eliminated in the first round in all likelihood...second round at best) because until things get desperate, changes won't be made. The changes have to come at club level yet owners don't give a toss about the national side, all they care about is the profit at their club. And, given that most of the owners of Prem clubs are no longer even British, why would they care about England? We need the return of the "Maximum 3 or 4" import days. I know the European Courts would rule against it, but I wouldn't be surprised if an exception was granted under some strange 'protection of national culture' ruling. Sadly, unless there's a great tide of outrage from the supporters, it will never happen and consequently England, Scotland, Wales, Northern Ireland and Ireland will continue to be crap...because all five are suffering.

And while I'm at it...let's outlaw coloured boots, Alice bands and cycle shorts; make smoking mandatory for players; re-introduce comb-overs; go back to 1980s mini-shorts for players; and allow any-and-all contact against goalkeepers shy of death.

Sir Miles

I mentioned the cost of Goetze purely because teams don't tend to pay that amount of money for poor players...just to emphasise the fact that he is a quality player, nothing else.
I can't see Munich buying Reus without selling a couple of midfielders first - they have enough quality players there for three teams....hence why I think he will probably end up in the EPL.
And for the record - I didn't watch yesterdays match so I have no idea who played well or played poorly...although I could probably guess

Now...where Bumtoys is wrong....

A player doesn't have to decide at the beginning of his career as to which national team he plays for...several factors come in to play first...obviously where they were born, their parents and grandparents nationality, where they spent their early career (ie academy years) and you can also qualify for a different nation if you have played there for five years (without playing a competitive match for any other national side) and change your nationality - passport, etc.

It appears that France, Spain and Germany have all had great success with their academy setups yet England, even with their far superior financial resources, seem to **** it up all the time...managers don't get time to settle into clubs anymore so they aren't interested in the youth setup...but there does appear to be a slight change with now...but English Academies are still packed with young foreign talent...my team (Liverpool) have had some success of late with bringing young players through...and there are some great prospects in the Under 21 and Under 18 teams...but many of them are foreign players...one kid to watch out for in the next five years is Jordan Rossiter, he captains the England Under 16's at present but plays in the Liverpool Under 21 team...fingers crossed.

Higgins

Sir Miles wrote:

I

Now...where Bumtoys is wrong....

A player doesn't have to decide at the beginning of his career as to which national team he plays for...

if Granny Miles puts the reading glasses on, she would see, that I have been speaking twice (and stopped then) about the beginning of the INTERNATIONAL career….

And yes, there are certain factors, but the player needs to choose which country he wants to play for when he can choose more than one - at the beginning of his INTERNATIONAL carreer.

welshboy78

As Mr Burns would say

"Like taking candy from a Baby" )

Sir Miles

Bondtoys wrote:

Sir Miles wrote:

I

Now...where Bumtoys is wrong....

A player doesn't have to decide at the beginning of his career as to which national team he plays for...

if Granny Miles puts the reading glasses on, she would see, that I have been speaking twice (and stopped then) about the beginning of the INTERNATIONAL career….

And yes, there are certain factors, but the player needs to choose which country he wants to play for when he can choose more than one - at the beginning of his INTERNATIONAL carreer.

Depends upon what you class as INTERNATIONAL career...a player can play for different national teams - as long as they qualify to do so - many players have turned out for one national side only to switch alliegiance later on...as long as it's not a competative match...

B-)

AlphaOmegaSin

Where we seem to Screw it up every time in Football, we excel in other Sports.

The Domino Effect

Sir Miles wrote:

Depends upon what you class as INTERNATIONAL career...a player can play for different national teams - as long as they qualify to do so - many players have turned out for one national side only to switch alliegiance later on...as long as it's not a competative match...

B-)

Correct, Sir Miles. I believe that until you play a full international at senior level, you have not committed 'for life'...so you can play for one (or more!) countries at various youth levels including U-21 and even a senior international as long as it's not competitive without actually committing to that country forever.

However, there are rumours afoot that would allow exceptions to this rule. And of course, the evil at the root of it is money. There have been suggestions that the rules will be loosened to permit players to represent countries where they currently reside (ie: not where they have citizenship or even residency) and even possibly that if they have played for one country less than an as-yet-stipulated number of times (ie: perhaps 10) and who have not represented that country in a previously as-yet-stipulated period of time (ie: perhaps 2 years) could play for a second country. The reasoning is to allow countries like Qatar and other 'developing' football nations to develop stronger national teams. It's ridiculous of course, as it means that one of the developing nations could buy their national team by actively recruiting anyone from anywhere in the world, much as some wealthy nations have done with Olympic athletes. I hope it is just a rumour as it would make international football very little different from club football, but with money/power-grabbing Sepp Blatter at the helm, anything's possible.

Higgins

So after Sir Miles attempt to drag me and the discussion into another field:

Why the mentioning of our "african" and "polish" players?
What's the purpose?
What do you want to imply?

Sir Miles

Bondtoys wrote:

So after Sir Miles attempt to drag me and the discussion into another field:

Why the mentioning of our "african" and "polish" players?
What's the purpose?
What do you want to imply?

Other than tweaking your nose ? )

Even the best teams 'borrow' from other nations....

Higgins

Sorry, Sir Miles.
That's lame!

And I ignore the "borrowing" comment.

Napoleon Plural

I was going to mention the similarity between my German friends that evening and Bondtoys, there was this quite benign spirit of, oh I don't know, not even one-upmanship... It reminded me of BT and his 'Ya, cos Dalton was not a very good Bond, as his films did not do well at the box office, no?'

Not that I disagree, mind... But it was strange to hear a footie fan deliver all this without an ounce of jeering malevolence or goading. Just stating a fact. It was like a jovial hospital consultant informing you that you have six months to live.

Sir Miles

Bondtoys wrote:

Sorry, Sir Miles.
That's lame!

And I ignore the "borrowing" comment.

I accept your apology.