But his shiny car got sawed in half five seconds into a action scene and we had a burned out John Cleese as Llewellyn's replacement..... 8-)
We'll the second point is true enough, but then many of Bond's cars haven't come out of his adventures too well... The DB5 took a pasting in a Goldfinger and Skyfall; the Lotus sprung a leak in TSWLM and its replacement in FYEO came off even worse... The 750iL took a pasting in TND and the Astons took varieties of punishment in CR, TLD and DAD too -{
"How was your lamb?" "Skewered. One sympathises."
Thunderbird 2East of Cardiff, Wales.Posts: 2,820MI6 Agent
edited October 2014
Personslly I love TWINE.
I agree on some of the points raised. Renard is underused and we really don't get a full on hand to hand confrrontation between him and Bond that's detailed and memorable. His real name Victor Zokas is mentioned only once by M, and his key element is taunting Bond about using him. He seems oddly cold around Electra except when saying goodbye. All these elements are repeated with Silva in Skyfall.
Electra is a brilliant creation, and well played by Sophie Marceau, but some of her dialogue is iffy in places. Def the best female baddie for a long time (I see Onnatop as a henchwoman) and her screwed up psyche is sad and quite alarming. M is well used in the film as the story revolves around her past, without forgetting the film is centrally about Bond. (Skyfall abandoned that concern completely.) The less said about Denise Richards character the better. Classic miscasting of a character. On the other side of the coin, Robbie Coltraine shines in his scenes and brings some shrewd observations through his cheeky comments as Zhukovsky. It was great to see him back.
The legendery Desmond Llewellyn sadly makes his final appearance as Q and is as wonderful as always. John Cleese is a great R. It's only when his character is promoted in DAD it goes wrong. Salmon, Kitchen, Scott-Thomas and the always watchable Samantha Bond round out the office staff and do well. with both Robinson and Tanner present as well at R, this marks the largest office staff we have seen.
The action scenes are good, the Thames boat chase is great to watch and hasn't dated even though the Canary Wharf area of London has completely changed. The Q Boat itself is a fantastic creation, right up there with Little Nellie, The Boatus and the Acrostar. The ski sequence although brief is effective and the Parrahawks make an impact. (For once, no pun intended!) Only the sub sequence disappoints because at the end the hull splits in two and the propeller drops off like a poorly glued model kit! On the other side, clever use of Elean Donan Castle as MI6 Scotland, Castle Thane.
The script wobbles in places, and there are duff lines in the dialogue, (the audience at the Edinburgh Odeon groaned in dismay at the final line) but it's probably Brosnan's finest hour.
Bond - "Something I said?"
Q - " No! Something you destroyed! My fishing boat, for my retirement, away from you!"
This is Thunderbird 2, how can I be of assistance?
Your talking about the horrible Pink Panther Remakes Barbel?
Yes, spot on. Kevin Kline refused to play Dreyfuss in the sequel (he's been called "Kevin DeKline" because of the amount of roles he's declined) so Cleese replaced him.
I agree on some of the points raised. Renard is underused and we really don't get a full on hand to hand confrrontation between him and Bond that's detailed and memorable. His real name Victor Zokas is mentioned only once by M, and his key element is taunting Bond about using him. He seems oddly cold around Electra except when saying goodbye. All these elements are repeated with Silva in Skyfall.
Electra is a brilliant creation, and well played by Sophie Marceau, but some of her dialogue is iffy in places. Def the best female baddie for a long time (I see Onnatop as a henchwoman) and her screwed up psyche is sad and quite alarming. M is well used in the film as the story revolves around her past, without forgetting the film is centrally about Bond. (Skyfall abandoned that concern completely.) The less said about Denise Richards character the better. Classic miscasting of a character. On the other side of the coin, Robbie Coltraine shines in his scenes and brings some shrewd observations through his cheeky comments as Zhukovsky. It was great to see him back.
The legendery Desmond Llewellyn sadly makes his final appearance as Q and is as wonderful as always. John Cleese is a great R. It's only when his character is promoted in DAD it goes wrong. Salmon, Kitchen, Scott-Thomas and the always watchable Samantha Bond round out the office staff and do well. with both Robinson and Tanner present as well at R, this marks the largest office staff we have seen.
The action scenes are good, the Thames boat chase is great to watch and hasn't dated even though the Canary Wharf area of London has completely changed. The Q Boat itself is a fantastic creation, right up there with Little Nellie, The Boatus and the Acrostar. The ski sequence although brief is effective and the Parrahawks make an impact. (For once, no pun intended!) Only the sub sequence disappoints because at the end the hull splits in two and the propeller drops off like a poorly glued model kit! On the other side, clever use of Elean Donan Castle as MI6 Scotland, Castle Thane.
The script wobbles in places, and there are duff lines in the dialogue, (the audience at the Edinburgh Odeon groaned in dismay at the final line) but it's probably Brosnan's finest hour.
Bond - "Something I said?"
Q - " No! Something you destroyed! My fishing boat, for my retirement, away from you!"
I never knew that my preference of TWINE over TND was unpopular until participating in this forum, but I stick by it!
I disagree somewhat with the idea that Renard and Elektra are poorly defined characters. What some may see as poorly defined I see as layered and multi-dimensional. I like that I have some sympathy for Elektra because it fleshes her out as a real character. In fact, in a past post describing my distaste for TND I mentioned that the opposite is true for Carver - he is all evil, all the time, and sure that is fun to watch but not nearly as engaging. And Renard - come on. The look he gives when he's impaled at the end speaks volumes about the constant torture that he suffered, both physically and emotionally. Brosnan gives what is probably his best acting performance of all four films here, and when paired with Marceau and Carlyle, it's really gripping to watch. Add Coltrane as one of my favorite Bond sidekicks and you're in for a treat!
The action scenes are entertaining, though not among the best in the series, but I think this movie is more about characters than about action. Sure, there are weaknesses *cough* Christmas Jones *cough* but I can see past them. She's obviously easy on the eyes and while she gives what is probably among the worst acting performances in the series, her character is rather inconsequential so I can ignore it.
Honestly, I am more bothered by the M behind bars scene that reminds me too much of that one part of the Pirates of the Carribean ride where the prisoners are trying to bribe the dog to bring them the keys.
Always had mixed feelings with this film. I was looking forward to it when it came out. I enjoyed the PTS to a degree because they did it on the Thames and as much as I understood the reason they introduced the Q boat - they made it into just another throwaway cliched Q device. The scene where Brosnan straightens his tie in the middle of a harrowing action scene just made me cringe. It's as if the writer's are shouting out "Look at Bond being cool under pressure" - and it's what I would have expected Moore to do.
I really like the theme song and Kleinmans credit sequence using the oil images. The scenes in Scotland were also well done - except the 3d projection they did of Renard. It's just silly to me. That kind of tech is not only unnecessary in a film like this (it belongs in a Star Trek or Star Wars film not here), it gives me the impression it's taking place in the future instead of now. I liked all the performances except Richards. Not only was she miscast it seemed that the writers actually shoehorned in her character because they felt they were violating one of the golden EON rules if they had not - there had to be someone Bond had to end up in bed with at the end and they had to have a silly name. Here character brought zip to the film. What? Elektra King wasn't good enough?
The action scenes did seem as is they were going through the motions - because I never felt anyone was in any danger. They really missed a great opportunity with the ski attack. I liked the parahawks, but as usual with these films, they overblow it by sending more than just one or two. Why do they need to send in a fleet of any weapons to assassinate one or two people? If anything, it only makes the scenes less thrilling. It's as if it were another EON rule - Bond always has to take on a small army. It was really just an excuse to show off the inflatable survival jacket. When they showed that in the lab earlier - I knew immediately they were going to use it. Yes, we know that's the only reason they have the Q scenes, but it would nice if once they would show devices being tested, make a quip about it, then not have Bond use them in a way that you would not have expected. Or have him use one and it malfunctions - forcing him to find another way out of his predicament. Oh, I also hated the x-ray glasses. Nice for creating some puns but turning a fake novelty product into a Q device is just lazy writing and again, something I would have expected in a Moore entry.
I though the plot was fine and something even Fleming might have come up with. I don't think he would have made Elektra a lethal women. Bitter, revengeful, angry, seductive, yes. I think he would have kept Renard as the main villain and have had him use Elektra as a pawn to set up the pipeline sabotage. He would be the one that betrayed her and she would have been the one Bond had to save on the submarine. There would have been no need to kidnap M (which was just an excuse for the writers to give Dench more screen time) and they could have cut out the whole Richards character. I think Fleming would have also not made Renard sympathetic. I don't want to feel sorry for a Bond villain. They're supposed to be cold blooded killers we want to see get there just deserve. I thought Carlye was fine as the villain, he just should have not had any feelings - more like Largo and less like Roy Batty from Bladerunner.
It had the bones of being a good Bond entry, but the writers were still playing by the old EON rule book while trying to create something Fleming might have done and it just didn't mix.
I never knew that my preference of TWINE over TND was unpopular until participating in this forum, but I stick by it!
I disagree somewhat with the idea that Renard and Elektra are poorly defined characters. What some may see as poorly defined I see as layered and multi-dimensional. I like that I have some sympathy for Elektra because it fleshes her out as a real character. In fact, in a past post describing my distaste for TND I mentioned that the opposite is true for Carver - he is all evil, all the time, and sure that is fun to watch but not nearly as engaging. And Renard - come on. The look he gives when he's impaled at the end speaks volumes about the constant torture that he suffered, both physically and emotionally. Brosnan gives what is probably his best acting performance of all four films here, and when paired with Marceau and Carlyle, it's really gripping to watch. Add Coltrane as one of my favorite Bond sidekicks and you're in for a treat!
The action scenes are entertaining, though not among the best in the series, but I think this movie is more about characters than about action. Sure, there are weaknesses *cough* Christmas Jones *cough* but I can see past them. She's obviously easy on the eyes and while she gives what is probably among the worst acting performances in the series, her character is rather inconsequential so I can ignore it.
Honestly, I am more bothered by the M behind bars scene that reminds me too much of that one part of the Pirates of the Carribean ride where the prisoners are trying to bribe the dog to bring them the keys.
I feel like the only who LOVES Denise Richards in this film, i don't care that shes not a believable scientist, Brosnan isn't a believable secret agent, its part fantasy and she is incredibly sexy.
I'd wager that if you aren't the only one, you are one of very few!
I feel like the only who LOVES Denise Richards in this film, i don't care that shes not a believable scientist, Brosnan isn't a believable secret agent, its part fantasy and she is incredibly sexy.
I'd wager that if you aren't the only one, you are one of very few!
I don't LOVE her, but neither does she irritate me.
I feel like the only who LOVES Denise Richards in this film, i don't care that shes not a believable scientist, Brosnan isn't a believable secret agent, its part fantasy and she is incredibly sexy.
I'd wager that if you aren't the only one, you are one of very few!
I don't LOVE her, but neither does she irritate me.
I believe LOVEis the operative word here, my friend!
Comments
We'll the second point is true enough, but then many of Bond's cars haven't come out of his adventures too well... The DB5 took a pasting in a Goldfinger and Skyfall; the Lotus sprung a leak in TSWLM and its replacement in FYEO came off even worse... The 750iL took a pasting in TND and the Astons took varieties of punishment in CR, TLD and DAD too -{
I agree on some of the points raised. Renard is underused and we really don't get a full on hand to hand confrrontation between him and Bond that's detailed and memorable. His real name Victor Zokas is mentioned only once by M, and his key element is taunting Bond about using him. He seems oddly cold around Electra except when saying goodbye. All these elements are repeated with Silva in Skyfall.
Electra is a brilliant creation, and well played by Sophie Marceau, but some of her dialogue is iffy in places. Def the best female baddie for a long time (I see Onnatop as a henchwoman) and her screwed up psyche is sad and quite alarming. M is well used in the film as the story revolves around her past, without forgetting the film is centrally about Bond. (Skyfall abandoned that concern completely.) The less said about Denise Richards character the better. Classic miscasting of a character. On the other side of the coin, Robbie Coltraine shines in his scenes and brings some shrewd observations through his cheeky comments as Zhukovsky. It was great to see him back.
The legendery Desmond Llewellyn sadly makes his final appearance as Q and is as wonderful as always. John Cleese is a great R. It's only when his character is promoted in DAD it goes wrong. Salmon, Kitchen, Scott-Thomas and the always watchable Samantha Bond round out the office staff and do well. with both Robinson and Tanner present as well at R, this marks the largest office staff we have seen.
The action scenes are good, the Thames boat chase is great to watch and hasn't dated even though the Canary Wharf area of London has completely changed. The Q Boat itself is a fantastic creation, right up there with Little Nellie, The Boatus and the Acrostar. The ski sequence although brief is effective and the Parrahawks make an impact. (For once, no pun intended!) Only the sub sequence disappoints because at the end the hull splits in two and the propeller drops off like a poorly glued model kit! On the other side, clever use of Elean Donan Castle as MI6 Scotland, Castle Thane.
The script wobbles in places, and there are duff lines in the dialogue, (the audience at the Edinburgh Odeon groaned in dismay at the final line) but it's probably Brosnan's finest hour.
Bond - "Something I said?"
Q - " No! Something you destroyed! My fishing boat, for my retirement, away from you!"
Yes, spot on. Kevin Kline refused to play Dreyfuss in the sequel (he's been called "Kevin DeKline" because of the amount of roles he's declined) so Cleese replaced him.
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
I disagree somewhat with the idea that Renard and Elektra are poorly defined characters. What some may see as poorly defined I see as layered and multi-dimensional. I like that I have some sympathy for Elektra because it fleshes her out as a real character. In fact, in a past post describing my distaste for TND I mentioned that the opposite is true for Carver - he is all evil, all the time, and sure that is fun to watch but not nearly as engaging. And Renard - come on. The look he gives when he's impaled at the end speaks volumes about the constant torture that he suffered, both physically and emotionally. Brosnan gives what is probably his best acting performance of all four films here, and when paired with Marceau and Carlyle, it's really gripping to watch. Add Coltrane as one of my favorite Bond sidekicks and you're in for a treat!
The action scenes are entertaining, though not among the best in the series, but I think this movie is more about characters than about action. Sure, there are weaknesses *cough* Christmas Jones *cough* but I can see past them. She's obviously easy on the eyes and while she gives what is probably among the worst acting performances in the series, her character is rather inconsequential so I can ignore it.
Honestly, I am more bothered by the M behind bars scene that reminds me too much of that one part of the Pirates of the Carribean ride where the prisoners are trying to bribe the dog to bring them the keys.
And you've gotta love:
Bond: Where's M?
Elektra: Soon she'll be...everywhere!
http://www.ipetitions.com/petition/skyfall-bluray-doesnt-match
I really like the theme song and Kleinmans credit sequence using the oil images. The scenes in Scotland were also well done - except the 3d projection they did of Renard. It's just silly to me. That kind of tech is not only unnecessary in a film like this (it belongs in a Star Trek or Star Wars film not here), it gives me the impression it's taking place in the future instead of now. I liked all the performances except Richards. Not only was she miscast it seemed that the writers actually shoehorned in her character because they felt they were violating one of the golden EON rules if they had not - there had to be someone Bond had to end up in bed with at the end and they had to have a silly name. Here character brought zip to the film. What? Elektra King wasn't good enough?
The action scenes did seem as is they were going through the motions - because I never felt anyone was in any danger. They really missed a great opportunity with the ski attack. I liked the parahawks, but as usual with these films, they overblow it by sending more than just one or two. Why do they need to send in a fleet of any weapons to assassinate one or two people? If anything, it only makes the scenes less thrilling. It's as if it were another EON rule - Bond always has to take on a small army. It was really just an excuse to show off the inflatable survival jacket. When they showed that in the lab earlier - I knew immediately they were going to use it. Yes, we know that's the only reason they have the Q scenes, but it would nice if once they would show devices being tested, make a quip about it, then not have Bond use them in a way that you would not have expected. Or have him use one and it malfunctions - forcing him to find another way out of his predicament. Oh, I also hated the x-ray glasses. Nice for creating some puns but turning a fake novelty product into a Q device is just lazy writing and again, something I would have expected in a Moore entry.
I though the plot was fine and something even Fleming might have come up with. I don't think he would have made Elektra a lethal women. Bitter, revengeful, angry, seductive, yes. I think he would have kept Renard as the main villain and have had him use Elektra as a pawn to set up the pipeline sabotage. He would be the one that betrayed her and she would have been the one Bond had to save on the submarine. There would have been no need to kidnap M (which was just an excuse for the writers to give Dench more screen time) and they could have cut out the whole Richards character. I think Fleming would have also not made Renard sympathetic. I don't want to feel sorry for a Bond villain. They're supposed to be cold blooded killers we want to see get there just deserve. I thought Carlye was fine as the villain, he just should have not had any feelings - more like Largo and less like Roy Batty from Bladerunner.
It had the bones of being a good Bond entry, but the writers were still playing by the old EON rule book while trying to create something Fleming might have done and it just didn't mix.
I, too, prefer TWINE over TND. Especially because of the performances of Brosnan and Marceau.
I'd wager that if you aren't the only one, you are one of very few!
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
I believe LOVE is the operative word here, my friend!