You Only Live Twice vs. Octopussy

chrisisall

IMHO these are the two biggest, wildest OTT Bonds. TSWLM is clearly in the same class, but somehow I find these two to be the most raucous fun.
Both have the Barry magic. Both have evil organizations. Both have commando raids. Both are colourful & well photographed.
Unlike OP, YOLT has Ken Adam, some actual martial art on display & Sean Connery.
Unlike YOLT, OP has a fantastic villain (Jordan), a dazzling PTS, and some really cool cold-war spy stuff going on.

Which do you prefer, and why, please?

Thunderpussy

For me it has to be, OP. A more serious Bond from Moore, a great
Cold war story, some fantastic locations and some brilliant stunt
Sequences.

chrisisall

Thunderpussy wrote:

For me it has to be, OP. A more serious Bond from Moore, a great
Cold war story, some fantastic locations and some brilliant stunt
Sequences.

Yeah, it had it all. Even too much. But it's better to have more than you need than not enough, right? )
Take out the flute player gag & the Tarzan yell & it's a reasonably perfect film (I absolutely LOVE when he tells the tiger to siiiit!).

Absolutely_Cart

YOLT is more influential, but I enjoyed Octopussy better overall. It was really creative, full of action, the Faberge Egg plot was interesting too.

Thunderpussy

Yes, it had a couple of " cringe" moments, from the DVD extras
These are the sort of jokes John Glen loved.

Absolutely_Cart

"I'm from the British Secret Service. There's a BOMB IN THERE!!"
- Roger Moore (in a clown suit)

Thunderpussy

Still looked better than those tight Tom Ford suits ! )

chrisisall

Absolutely_Cart wrote:

YOLT is more influential, but I enjoyed Octopussy better overall. It was really creative, full of action, the Faberge Egg plot was interesting too.

A choice for me between YOLT & TSWLM is easy- YOLT. But Octopussy is such a delight... it's a tough choice... they're both such amazing fun.

Oh well, when in doubt, go to the babes. Aki vs. Octopussy.

YOLT wins! :007)

Blackleiter

chrisisall wrote:

Absolutely_Cart wrote:

YOLT is more influential, but I enjoyed Octopussy better overall. It was really creative, full of action, the Faberge Egg plot was interesting too.

A choice for me between YOLT & TSWLM is easy- YOLT. But Octopussy is such a delight... it's a tough choice... they're both such amazing fun.

Oh well, when in doubt, go to the babes. Aki vs. Octopussy.

YOLT wins! :007)

You are correct, sir! Of course, the guideline for this particular Bond fan is "when in doubt, go for Connery!"

chrisisall

Blackleiter wrote:

"when in doubt, go for Connery!"

I was attempting to leave that out of this equation for me to give Sir Roger a fair chance.... :007)

Blackleiter

chrisisall wrote:

Blackleiter wrote:

"when in doubt, go for Connery!"

I was attempting to leave that out of this equation for me to give Sir Roger a fair chance.... :007)

I get your point. That's the only way Rog would have a shot!

DieAnotherDay

YOLT takes it by a whisker. Despite Connery's lazy performance I still think it's a livelier, more epic film.

chrisisall

DieAnotherDay wrote:

YOLT takes it by a whisker. Despite Connery's lazy performance

I see it as Bond beginning burn out, similar to Dalton's take in his two.

I still think it's a livelier, more epic film.

Here we can agree.
Still, Op is so chock full of goodies, like a virtual Bond piñata! -{

DieAnotherDay

chrisisall wrote:

DieAnotherDay wrote:

YOLT takes it by a whisker. Despite Connery's lazy performance

I see it as Bond beginning burn out, similar to Dalton's take in his two.

I still think it's a livelier, more epic film.

Here we can agree.
Still, Op is so chock full of goodies, like a virtual Bond piñata! -{

I can easily get past Connery's slightly sub-par performance.

And yeah, even though OP isn't one of my favourite Rog films I do feel it does have some great moments. (PTS, Tuk Tuk chase, Bomb in the circus) And I also think old Rog is brilliantly charming in this film

chrisisall

Blackleiter wrote:

I get your point. That's the only way Rog would have a shot!

For a moment, thinking about all the Cold War stuff, the villains & Q in OP, I was really on the fence.
Then I remembered this scene...
http://youtu.be/XwTK7nMuFPg
:007)

Gassy Man

Ha, no comparison -- You Only Live Twice has more spectacle, imagination, toys, heart, and fun than Octopussy, which is at best a mid-range Bond.

chrisisall

Gassy Man wrote:

Octopussy, which is at best a mid-range Bond.

Really? I'd rate it fairly high due to the clown scenes at least- very tense stuff amidst the silly obviousness. But then, a Japanese Connery isn't dopey???

Gassy Man

chrisisall wrote:

Gassy Man wrote:

Octopussy, which is at best a mid-range Bond.

Really? I'd rate it fairly high due to the clown scenes at least- very tense stuff amidst the silly obviousness. But then, a Japanese Connery isn't dopey???

I saw Octopussy in the theater in 1983 and came out pretty disappointed. Some action sequences worked, but overall, the film felt empty and tired. It's certainly better than A View to a Kill, which apart from a good soundtrack, is probably the most forgettable Bond film.

Connery in yellowface is appalling, but not unusual for the time. Such casual racism against Asians still hasn't really caught on as a serious issue in the west. If they hadn't been so determined to make him look like some bizarre Japanese Frankenstein's monster, he might have been able to pass for someone of mixed race. But even with that and a few other offenses, You Only Live Twice is still easily the better of the two films.

Moore Than

Both high on entertainment value. You Only Live Twice is a guilty pleasure, Octopussy is a real pleasure. Octopussy scores higher in the action stakes. And scenes such as the auction, the backgammon, and Bond's confrontation with General Orlov. OP also has one of the best sequences in any Bond film, beginning when Bond disguises himself as a circus worker right through the confrontation with General Orlov and ending with the defusing of the bomb at the circus. Finally, one of Roger Moore's best performances as Bond versus Sean Connery's least impressive, in my opinion.

welshboy78

Moore Than wrote:

versus Sean Connery's least impressive, in my opinion.

You prefer DAD??

YOLT has great moments (love the fighting on the dock etc) however it also has some iffy bits even right at the start! I would rate it just above DAD

I really should watch Octopussy again - its been a while but I actually have it below AVTAK lol

Moore Than

welshboy78 wrote:

Moore Than wrote:

versus Sean Connery's least impressive, in my opinion.

You prefer DAD??

No, I prefer You Only Live Twice.

I particularly warm to the principle Japanese characters and locations, moments such as Bond's burial at sea, the fight in Osato's office, Ken Adam's sets, and especially John Barry's epic score. Whereas in Die Another Day, I do not particularly warm to any of the principle characters. There are a few memorable moments, such as the title sequence, Bond's entrance into the Hong Kong hotel, and the swordfight. The second half of the film is pretty much a write off for me, the low point of the series. Even something like the car chase on ice, which should have been great fun to watch, is spoilt somewhat by the editing. Don't want/need to see Jinx trying to break out at that moment.

welshboy78

Moore Than wrote:

welshboy78 wrote:

Moore Than wrote:

versus Sean Connery's least impressive, in my opinion.

You prefer DAD??

No, I prefer You Only Live Twice.

I particularly warm to the principle Japanese characters and locations, moments such as Bond's burial at sea, the fight in Osato's office, Ken Adam's sets, and especially John Barry's epic score. Whereas in Die Another Day, I do not particularly warm to any of the principle characters. There are a few memorable moments, such as the title sequence, Bond's entrance into the Hong Kong hotel, and the swordfight. The second half of the film is pretty much a write off for me, the low point of the series. Even something like the car chase on ice, which should have been great fun to watch, is spoilt somewhat by the editing. Don't want/need to see Jinx trying to break out at that moment.

Sorry mate (early here) I mean't do you prefer it to DAF (Diamonds Are Forever) with regards to Connerys performance

Whoops!

Moore Than

welshboy78 wrote:

Sorry mate (early here) I mean't do you prefer it to DAF (Diamonds Are Forever) with regards to Connerys performance

Whoops!

No problem.

Assuming it refers to Sean Connery's performance in You Only Live Twice. I prefer Sean Connery in Diamonds Are Forever. For me, he appears more interested, there is more spark. I tend to believe he adjusted his performance to suit the lighter tone of the film. My only criticism would be that he could/should have lost some weight.

welshboy78

Yes he was tubby!! They are two Connery films I rarely watch and loose interest the more the film progresses. I think YOLT shades it because of Japan and Connery still looks fairly good (before turning Japanese ) )

chrisisall

Connery was having too much fun in GF, TB & DAF. In YOLT he feels just right. Whether that was his intent or not as an actor doesn't matter to me.
Likewise, Moore had his most serious moments as Bond in Germany in OP. YOLT & OP are the two perfect big cinematic Bonds IMHO.

Blackleiter

chrisisall wrote:

Blackleiter wrote:

I get your point. That's the only way Rog would have a shot!

For a moment, thinking about all the Cold War stuff, the villains & Q in OP, I was really on the fence.
Then I remembered this scene...
http://youtu.be/XwTK7nMuFPg
:007)

I understand. Actually seeing The Man in action can be quite persuasive! :007)

Blackleiter

Gassy Man wrote:

Ha, no comparison -- You Only Live Twice has more spectacle, imagination, toys, heart, and fun than Octopussy, which is at best a mid-range Bond.

Bingo! {[]

M 'n' M

Interesting choice of films to compare as the screenplays are written /part written by - IMHO - the two best writers to work on bond - roald Dahl and george MacDonald Fraser . They added class, wit and character.

The best? Octopussy. Roger's most assured effort with a strong story , consistent action and an overall sense of glamour

chrisisall

M n M wrote:

Interesting choice of films to compare as the screenplays are written /part written by - IMHO - the two best writers to work on bond - roald Dahl and george MacDonald Fraser . They added class, wit and character.

Nice footnote- thanks!

AirJordanFan93

YOLT. Despite how bored Connery is and how haggard he looks I think its a much better movie. Now that might be because I love those first 5 Connery movies a whole lot but I think the first half of Octopussy isn't that great compared to the 2nd half.

chrisisall

AirJordanFan93 wrote:

YOLT. Despite how bored Connery is and how haggard he looks

Excuse me, I've kind of lost patience with people repeating these ridiculous tropes whilst not having recently viewed the actual film... 8-)