When was Fleming's Bond born?

James Suzuki

Was it 1924?
I always get confused what year it was.

Sir Miles

I don't think a year was ever given, or even worked out to any degree of satisfaction....

Thunderpussy

I think even Fleming changed it a couple of times.

Asp9mm

Pearson gave him 11 November 1920. Which is as close as you'll ever get to 'official'. Fleming never gave him an exact date, but Armistice Day was mentioned by Fleming as his day of birth.

James Suzuki

in the Author's Note of Boyd's Solo, he writes that, 'In line with Ian Fleming's Decision, James Bond was Born in 1924'

Asp9mm

Fleming never actually stated it was 1924, but it can be interpreted in the YOLT obituary that he gave a false age of 19 in joining up in 1941, although it was mentioned in a previous paragraph he was only 17. It's all rather loose, but, yes, as clear as you'll get to a definitive Fleming specified year.

Barbel

...which means that when he bought his Bentley in 1933 he was about 9 ) . Fleming had to shave years off Bond's age as the series progressed.

James Suzuki

Sounds like Fleming was not too fussed about Bond's early years.

Barbel

He wasn't too concerned about details- eg Mary Goodnight's hair changes colour, as does the light outside M's office. Initially Bond's dates more-or-less matched Fleming's own (hence his buying a car in 1933, when Fleming would have been 25) but Bond had to stay roughly the same age while time marched on.

AlphaOmegaSin

I don't think Bonds Date of Birth has ever really been that important an Issue -{

David Schofield

Yep, Fleming was into retconning years before it became the done thing.

Changes age a few times, changes nationality once. And, as I've pointed out before, post Connery he also loses mention of his blue eyes, comma of hair, and by YOLT is a considerably bigger bloke than he was at the time of FRWL.

) -{

James Suzuki

David Schofield wrote:

Yep, Fleming was into retconning years before it became the done thing.

Changes age a few times, changes nationality once. And, as I've pointed out before, post Connery he also loses mention of his blue eyes, comma of hair, and by YOLT is a considerably bigger bloke than he was at the time of FRWL.

) -{

I guess Bond was a bit of a Blank Slate. Fleming changes his character to suit the adventures he goes through.

7289

Fleming was a master of product placement and detail. But for the reader ... it's better not to study those snippets very carefully.

James Suzuki

7289 wrote:

Fleming was a master of product placement and detail. But for the reader ... it's better not to study those snippets very carefully.

You mean how he names the brands of Toiletries he uses etc? Smokes Ronson cigarettes and things like that.

7289

Precisely,

IF did a lot of his descriptions from memory, and sometimes he flubbed it. I doubt he ever imagined his work would ever be put to such scrutiny. Immensely talented he was a "casual" writer who wrote for the "casual" reader.

James Suzuki

7289 wrote:

Precisely,

IF did a lot of his descriptions from memory, and sometimes he flubbed it. I doubt he ever imagined his work would ever be put to such scrutiny. Immensely talented he was a "casual" writer who wrote for the "casual" reader.

Mm. Never thought of it like that. Would you also say that was how he projected himself on to JB. In many ways it was his fantasy. Bond was the man he wished he was. He had similar tastes in Food, alcohol used the same brands.

AlphaOmegaSin

His Description of Harlem in LALD always puts me in the Scene (Apart from the Racism) -{

7289

"Would you also say that was how he projected himself on to JB."

Absolutely! That would account for Bond buying a Bentley in 1933, when he was nine. I daresay Fleming was "inside the head" of Bond and other characters, like Vivienne Michel ... I doubt that other than quickly cobbling up a date for Bond's birthday or birth year "facts" like these were something he gave little thought to.

Overall, I think we fans "overthink" the details in Fleming's thrillers. We should learn to enjoy the inconsistences.

CmdrAtticus

I recall in one novel (MR?) Bond theorizing about how many years he had left before having to officially retire at 45. He then figured he'd have to have at least one to two tough missions each year until then and it ended up feeling like it would be too many for him to survive. It someone can find that passage and see what year that novel was published it should give a better idea of his age.

Asp9mm

CmdrAtticus wrote:

It someone can find that passage and see what year that novel was published it should give a better idea of his age.

That's assuming the event took place the same year as the books, which they don't as TSWLM and TB took place just weeks apart.

AlphaOmegaSin

The Time line of Bonds Age gets confusing around the End of the Gardner Novels/Start of the Benson Novels.

David Schofield

Asp9mm wrote:

CmdrAtticus wrote:

It someone can find that passage and see what year that novel was published it should give a better idea of his age.

That's assuming the event took place the same year as the books, which they don't as TSWLM and TB took place just weeks apart.

Not sure I'd agree TSWLM took place in 1959 like TB.

Though there is so much timeline contradiction in IF in doesn't really matter whether one sees dates differently from another reader

Thunderpussy

In my mind Bond is always about 35, and feels he
Should have brought more pants !

Barbel

CmdrAtticus wrote:

I recall in one novel (MR?) Bond theorizing about how many years he had left before having to officially retire at 45. He then figured he'd have to have at least one to two tough missions each year until then and it ended up feeling like it would be too many for him to survive. It someone can find that passage and see what year that novel was published it should give a better idea of his age.

It's MR, 1955. Bond is implied to be 37 by the math.

James Suzuki

Barbel wrote:

CmdrAtticus wrote:

I recall in one novel (MR?) Bond theorizing about how many years he had left before having to officially retire at 45. He then figured he'd have to have at least one to two tough missions each year until then and it ended up feeling like it would be too many for him to survive. It someone can find that passage and see what year that novel was published it should give a better idea of his age.

It's MR, 1955. Bond is implied to be 37 by the math.

That means he's 47 by TMWTGG

Asp9mm

David Schofield wrote:

Asp9mm wrote:

CmdrAtticus wrote:

It someone can find that passage and see what year that novel was published it should give a better idea of his age.

That's assuming the event took place the same year as the books, which they don't as TSWLM and TB took place just weeks apart.

Not sure I'd agree TSWLM took place in 1959 like TB.

That's what I said, they took place weeks apart in the same year. But the books were published in 1961 for TB and 1962 for TSWLM. So you can't go by publication dates. YOLT obituray is as close as you'll get to working out Bond's age according to Fleming. He'll be 91 this year

David Schofield

Asp9mm wrote:

David Schofield wrote:

Asp9mm wrote:

That's assuming the event took place the same year as the books, which they don't as TSWLM and TB took place just weeks apart.

Not sure I'd agree TSWLM took place in 1959 like TB.

That's what I said, they took place weeks apart in the same year. But the books were published in 1961 for TB and 1962 for TSWLM. So you can't go by publication dates. YOLT obituray is as close as you'll get to working out Bond's age according to Fleming. He'll be 91 this year

There is a school of thought among those that try make sense of any of this that while TB is defo dated 1959, TSWLM takes place in the first few weeks of the period covered by OHMSS, autumn 1961... -{

Thunderpussy

To be honest as it didn't seem to bother Fleming, I won't
Let it bother me.

AlphaOmegaSin

Me neither -{

7289

I believe if you add up the Bond Thrillers written after MR, Bond's calculations of his remaining adventures are correct.

Asp9mm

David Schofield wrote:

Asp9mm wrote:

David Schofield wrote:

Not sure I'd agree TSWLM took place in 1959 like TB.

That's what I said, they took place weeks apart in the same year. But the books were published in 1961 for TB and 1962 for TSWLM. So you can't go by publication dates. YOLT obituray is as close as you'll get to working out Bond's age according to Fleming. He'll be 91 this year

There is a school of thought among those that try make sense of any of this that while TB is defo dated 1959, TSWLM takes place in the first few weeks of the period covered by OHMSS, autumn 1961... -{

If TB took place in 59 then TSWLM can't be as late as Autumn 61. In TSWLM, Bond clearly says that he was working on the Thunderball case less than a year ago and he is in Canada mopping up a few loose ends, so TSWLM would at least have to be set in 1959 to early/mid 1960 as Thunderball took place in June 1959.