Even as a Moore fan it just has to be Avtak. Maybe it depends on the sequence you saw the films but avtak seemed a million miles away from lald or tswlm. Even Moonraker - which I hated in parts - was big and bold. Roger was just way too old and it was far too clear that his stunt doubles had larger parts than he did. So, at the time - and particularly after the suave fun of octopussy - bond just didn't seem to matter.
On reflection the film isn't as bad as I thought - but that's not much of a recommendation is it
Even as a Moore fan it just has to be Avtak. Maybe it depends on the sequence you saw the films but avtak seemed a million miles away from lald or tswlm. Even Moonraker - which I hated in parts - was big and bold. Roger was just way too old and it was far too clear that his stunt doubles had larger parts than he did. So, at the time - and particularly after the suave fun of octopussy - bond just didn't seem to matter.
On reflection the film isn't as bad as I thought - but that's not much of a recommendation is it
Haha...this is true! I felt the same way after writing what I did about LTK. However, as with that film, the villain is at least one redeeming factor. Sanchez is good. And I think Zorin is even better.
With that said, it is most painful to watch Moore in that film. I was fortunate to have spent the day with Ms. Roberts in Hollywood in 1982 on the set of Beastmaster. I was a senior in high school on a trip with four other students and our film making professor. While quite a forgettable movie, in and of itself, Ms. Roberts in costume with a black tiger by her side chatting with this high schooler while his camera snapped dozens of photos (and this was well before the digital day) ensured that I will never have really bad things to say about AVTAK
The movies reflect their times. They are the best the producers could come up with at the time. In 10-15 years from now, this forum will be full of new threads discussing how the Craig era was the worst for Bond movies,
Tand a new actor (probably with long hair and facial hair) will be all the rage for taking us closer to "the real Bond".
Only if the Broccolis lose control. I see a Bond with 'long hair' being laughed off the screen
Completely agree...I believe that, like Connery, Craig will definitely withstand the test of time and future Bonds.
I've offered wondered what will happen if the Broccolis lose control of the franchise...scary thoughts, indeed. But I'm with you in that I don't think we will ever see Bond deviate that much. Fifty years in and Craig is not that much different from Connery in many aspects.
First to answer your question, Roger Moore is my least favorite Bond and AVTAK is my least favorite Bond movie. Moore's take on Bond just isn't my cup of tea compared to all of the other actors, but that being said I still own all of his Bond films. That's because although I like Moore's films the least, there's still some enjoyment to be had in viewing them. Besides, as a Bond film fan I feel it's almost my duty to own every Bond film (even what I consider to be one of the worst films I've ever seen, period, Casino Royale '67).
As for Dalton and his films, I am a big fan of both. I think Dalton is the closest to the Bond I envision when I read the novels (although Connery is still my favorite), and both TLD and LTK are solid, hard-edged Bond movies that I enjoy quite a bit.
For me, Licence To Kill is a good solid hard-edged Bond film, The Living Daylights is a good solid standard Bond film. Perhaps, if Koskov and Brad Whitaker were more like Franz Sanchez then I might feel different.
Moore Not Less 4371 posts (2002 - 2007) Moore Than (2012 - 2016)
After watching Dalton's two films many times and the years have passed, my personal opinion of his performance has not changed. I thought he did his best to channel the Bond from the novels. The problem is, the novel Bond really is like Dalton. He's not the most charming or personable to be with, despite how Connery, Lazenby, Moore or Brosnan portrayed him. He's usually cold, direct, professional, and what little humor he has is on the dark, cynical side. The problem is that EON did not know how to evolve the scripts from the Moore years to Dalton's and Dalton was a serious stage actor, not a light TV/film actor such as Moore. He did not have the panache that the other actors had since he was trying to bring the character's brevity to the role. This blend just would not gel with the public. I agree with you about Craig, however, Craig was just damned lucky he got picked to do a Fleming novel and the public was now ready for the Bond of the novels. Had Dalton been given a film like CR, it would have been a better fit. So, although I understand your opinion of Dalton's performance, I put mine in context with what Dalton had to work with.
After watching Dalton's two films many times and the years have passed, my personal opinion of his performance has not changed. I thought he did his best to channel the Bond from the novels. The problem is, the novel Bond really is like Dalton. He's not the most charming or personable to be with, despite how Connery, Lazenby, Moore or Brosnan portrayed him. He's usually cold, direct, professional, and what little humor he has is on the dark, cynical side. The problem is that EON did not know how to evolve the scripts from the Moore years to Dalton's and Dalton was a serious stage actor, not a light TV/film actor such as Moore. He did not have the panache that the other actors had since he was trying to bring the character's brevity to the role. This blend just would not gel with the public. I agree with you about Craig, however, Craig was just damned lucky he got picked to do a Fleming novel and the public was now ready for the Bond of the novels. Had Dalton been given a film like CR, it would have been a better fit. So, although I understand your opinion of Dalton's performance, I put mine in context with what Dalton had to work with.
Thou almost persuadeth me Seriously, I appreciate your perspective...makes much sense to me. I've no doubt were Dalton cast in CR, QOS, or SK in place of Craig, especially considering the supporting players, that he would most likely shine brighter. This weekend I am going to give both Dalton films another viewing and see if I can't walk away slightly less cynical and more in line with what I used to think about him pre-Craig. Thanks, again, for the context.
Now, if you will pardon me, I must seriously contemplate repurposing my LTK CD as a beverage coaster...
You mean DVD? My dad gets them confused as well. )
Seriously though, this is the reason why I don't check AJB much lately…cuz whenver I do I get bummed out by these negative comments. I need to develop thicker skin and not get frustrated when someone bashes a favorite Bond film. (I do :x AJB)
My current 10 favorite:
1. GE 2. MR 3. OP 4. TMWTGG 5. TSWLM 6. TND 7. TWINE 8.DN 9. GF 10. AVTAK
Now, if you will pardon me, I must seriously contemplate repurposing my LTK CD as a beverage coaster...
You mean DVD? My dad gets them confused as well. )
Seriously though, this is the reason why I don't check AJB much lately…cuz whenver I do I get bummed out by these negative comments. I need to develop thicker skin and not get frustrated when someone bashes a favorite Bond film. (I do :x AJB)
After watching Dalton's two films many times and the years have passed, my personal opinion of his performance has not changed. I thought he did his best to channel the Bond from the novels. The problem is, the novel Bond really is like Dalton. He's not the most charming or personable to be with, despite how Connery, Lazenby, Moore or Brosnan portrayed him. He's usually cold, direct, professional, and what little humor he has is on the dark, cynical side. The problem is that EON did not know how to evolve the scripts from the Moore years to Dalton's and Dalton was a serious stage actor, not a light TV/film actor such as Moore. He did not have the panache that the other actors had since he was trying to bring the character's brevity to the role. This blend just would not gel with the public. I agree with you about Craig, however, Craig was just damned lucky he got picked to do a Fleming novel and the public was now ready for the Bond of the novels. Had Dalton been given a film like CR, it would have been a better fit. So, although I understand your opinion of Dalton's performance, I put mine in context with what Dalton had to work with.
After watching Dalton's two films many times and the years have passed, my personal opinion of his performance has not changed. I thought he did his best to channel the Bond from the novels. The problem is, the novel Bond really is like Dalton. He's not the most charming or personable to be with, despite how Connery, Lazenby, Moore or Brosnan portrayed him. He's usually cold, direct, professional, and what little humor he has is on the dark, cynical side. The problem is that EON did not know how to evolve the scripts from the Moore years to Dalton's and Dalton was a serious stage actor, not a light TV/film actor such as Moore. He did not have the panache that the other actors had since he was trying to bring the character's brevity to the role. This blend just would not gel with the public. I agree with you about Craig, however, Craig was just damned lucky he got picked to do a Fleming novel and the public was now ready for the Bond of the novels. Had Dalton been given a film like CR, it would have been a better fit. So, although I understand your opinion of Dalton's performance, I put mine in context with what Dalton had to work with.
Thou almost persuadeth me Seriously, I appreciate your perspective...makes much sense to me. I've no doubt were Dalton cast in CR, QOS, or SK in place of Craig, especially considering the supporting players, that he would most likely shine brighter. This weekend I am going to give both Dalton films another viewing and see if I can't walk away slightly less cynical and more in line with what I used to think about him pre-Craig. Thanks, again, for the context.
What I do when watching his films is try to focus on him trying to channel Fleming's Bond and blur out all the silly EON pastiche. It's obviously mainly effective in the scenes he is supposed to be serious and in danger. For example, the whole PTS sequence is something I could see Fleming's Bond doing. It becomes an EON Bond
when he lands on the yacht and makes the quip. Had Fleming wrote this, Bond would have just ended up in the water and had to swim to shore - no woman, no puns.
Comments
On reflection the film isn't as bad as I thought - but that's not much of a recommendation is it
Haha...this is true! I felt the same way after writing what I did about LTK. However, as with that film, the villain is at least one redeeming factor. Sanchez is good. And I think Zorin is even better.
With that said, it is most painful to watch Moore in that film. I was fortunate to have spent the day with Ms. Roberts in Hollywood in 1982 on the set of Beastmaster. I was a senior in high school on a trip with four other students and our film making professor. While quite a forgettable movie, in and of itself, Ms. Roberts in costume with a black tiger by her side chatting with this high schooler while his camera snapped dozens of photos (and this was well before the digital day) ensured that I will never have really bad things to say about AVTAK
Completely agree...I believe that, like Connery, Craig will definitely withstand the test of time and future Bonds.
I've offered wondered what will happen if the Broccolis lose control of the franchise...scary thoughts, indeed. But I'm with you in that I don't think we will ever see Bond deviate that much. Fifty years in and Craig is not that much different from Connery in many aspects.
As for Dalton and his films, I am a big fan of both. I think Dalton is the closest to the Bond I envision when I read the novels (although Connery is still my favorite), and both TLD and LTK are solid, hard-edged Bond movies that I enjoy quite a bit.
LTK and OP are in my top 5!
-{
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
You noticed! -{
I mirror this
Thou almost persuadeth me
You mean DVD? My dad gets them confused as well.
Seriously though, this is the reason why I don't check AJB much lately…cuz whenver I do I get bummed out by these negative comments. I need to develop thicker skin and not get frustrated when someone bashes a favorite Bond film. (I do :x AJB)
1. GE 2. MR 3. OP 4. TMWTGG 5. TSWLM 6. TND 7. TWINE 8.DN 9. GF 10. AVTAK
Hahaha! You got me...good catch
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
What I do when watching his films is try to focus on him trying to channel Fleming's Bond and blur out all the silly EON pastiche. It's obviously mainly effective in the scenes he is supposed to be serious and in danger. For example, the whole PTS sequence is something I could see Fleming's Bond doing. It becomes an EON Bond
when he lands on the yacht and makes the quip. Had Fleming wrote this, Bond would have just ended up in the water and had to swim to shore - no woman, no puns.