There really aren't any. Some complain that Dalton's wardrobe isn't dressy enough. I love it. It definitely feels more like how Bond dresses from the novels. The only one element I would have welcomed would have been another John Barry score, but otherwise the film is fairly near 100% perfect for me.
In some ways the clothes are closer to Fleming and in some ways they are further. The casual shirts with pockets are similar to what Fleming wore himself. The simplicity of the outfits was very Flemingesque, as were the moccasins that Bond wears in the film.
The oversized fits of everything and the flashy Italian cuts of the suits are very far from what the literary Bond would have worn, and that's the big problem with the wardrobe. Fleming's Bond would not have been wearing clothes that could better fit a 100-kg man. The clothes were sourced in America, and that's not where Fleming's Bond would have purchased all of his clothes. Fleming's Bond was into luxurious shirts (whether formal or casual), and that's not reflected in Licence to Kill's wardrobe.
I think that was probably more down to the fashion of the 80's at the time. Everything was baggy back then. I reckon some of those shirts that Daton wore were fairly luxurious though. I doubt they would have been shirts from Debenhams.
The shirts that he wears with the suits are not high-end shirts. They look like they're from Macy's or the like. They have all the hallmarks of standard American shirts. The suits are high-end, but they're too flashy for Bond and not what Fleming's Bond would have worn. Most English tailors never went in for the latest fashions. Someone like Bond would not have dressed like that. Hence why Connery's Bond never went in for the latest stuff and only hinted at it.
- Dalton turns in another very good if not quite Bondian performance. He still seems the "Shakespeare Bond."
- Some very Fleming-esque moments -- the bit where he's outside of the casino lining up the shot and later being interrogated by another British agent (one of the few times we meet one in the modern era who actually has presence).
- A few good stunts.
- While it was nice to see David Hedison again, he just seemed "past it" for the role.
Cons:
- Miami Vice, by then, had been doing the same thing every week for five years.
- A terrible soundtrack except for the title song and occasion Bond theme iteration.
- Carey Lowell.
- Taliso Soto.
- Priscilla Barnes.
- Wayne Newton.
- Q in the field.
- M in the field.
- The film still can't decide if it wants to be hard hitting and scary or rather campy.
In some ways the clothes are closer to Fleming and in some ways they are further. The casual shirts with pockets are similar to what Fleming wore himself. The simplicity of the outfits was very Flemingesque, as were the moccasins that Bond wears in the film.
The oversized fits of everything and the flashy Italian cuts of the suits are very far from what the literary Bond would have worn, and that's the big problem with the wardrobe. Fleming's Bond would not have been wearing clothes that could better fit a 100-kg man. The clothes were sourced in America, and that's not where Fleming's Bond would have purchased all of his clothes. Fleming's Bond was into luxurious shirts (whether formal or casual), and that's not reflected in Licence to Kill's wardrobe.
I think that was probably more down to the fashion of the 80's at the time. Everything was baggy back then. I reckon some of those shirts that Daton wore were fairly luxurious though. I doubt they would have been shirts from Debenhams.
The shirts that he wears with the suits are not high-end shirts. They look like they're from Macy's or the like. They have all the hallmarks of standard American shirts. The suits are high-end, but they're too flashy for Bond and not what Fleming's Bond would have worn. Most English tailors never went in for the latest fashions. Someone like Bond would not have dressed like that. Hence why Connery's Bond never went in for the latest stuff and only hinted at it.
This surprises me, as I know Dalton was big on detail in getting the small things right to make the character look like Fleming Bond. I would have the thought the shirts would have at least been Sea Island cotton?
I like LTK a good deal, but still think it suffered from budgetary constraints which made it look and feel,like Bond on the cheap. Dalton is superb (apart from the oft cited 'Dracular' hair) Q in the field felt like Moore era Bond and . Ms, Soto is in contention for worst Bond girl acting. It is schizoid in nature and confused about its own purpose.
Of that of which we cannot speak we must pass over in silence- Ludwig Wittgenstein.
LTK is one of my favourite films in the franchise. Its up there with GF and OHMSS.
Dalton is at his best here, in the closest screen adaptation of the Fleming Bond from the novels. He certainly did his research with the character when taking on the Bond role, but boy does it show here. Humourless, violent, driven. This is Bond at his most badass. Forget what came later with Craig. This is the real deal, right here.
Even Maibaum and Wilson come up trumps here with the script also, in a storyline and scenes that Fleming himself would have been proud. The film unfolds and feels like a Fleming book, helped massively by scenes and characters taken directly from the books, but Maibaum knew his Fleming, and this feels as close to the novels as OHMSS or FRWL.
Glen's direction is not too flashy, workmanlike but serious and rather violent at times, which again helps drive the Fleming tone along, in the best of the films Glen directed. This would be his last one, but by now he had crafted and perfected his art for the benefit of the film.
Sanchez is one of the best villains in the series, and I heard a rumour he was based loosely on Scaramanga. They both share the same initials, and once Bond goes undercover as a kind of personal bodyguard to get close to his man, it definitely echoes the novel TMWTGG.
`You earned it, you keep it, old buddy!'.....`Don't you want to know why?' The dialogue is brilliant, sharp Flemingesque. This is still the closest we have seen to Fleming's Bond in all his glory on screen. It's a damn shame Dalton would never do any more.
Cons
There really aren't any. Some complain that Dalton's wardrobe isn't dressy enough. I love it. It definitely feels more like how Bond dresses from the novels. The only one element I would have welcomed would have been another John Barry score, but otherwise the film is fairly near 100% perfect for me.
Wow, this is like reading something I wrote! -{ Obviously I agree 100%.
Cons:
No glamour or style
Poor use of locations
Bond is a professional, rogue or otherwise, so his actions make no sense.
Any film as relentlessly grim as this needs its lighter moments, but the humour falls hopelessly flat.
Badly directed
No iconic moments, and no iconic dialogue (apart from Davi's 'like a leedle bird')
Lupe
Exploding head
Timothy Dalton
LTK is one of my favourite films in the franchise. Its up there with GF and OHMSS.
Dalton is at his best here, in the closest screen adaptation of the Fleming Bond from the novels. He certainly did his research with the character when taking on the Bond role, but boy does it show here. Humourless, violent, driven. This is Bond at his most badass. Forget what came later with Craig. This is the real deal, right here.
Even Maibaum and Wilson come up trumps here with the script also, in a storyline and scenes that Fleming himself would have been proud. The film unfolds and feels like a Fleming book, helped massively by scenes and characters taken directly from the books, but Maibaum knew his Fleming, and this feels as close to the novels as OHMSS or FRWL.
Glen's direction is not too flashy, workmanlike but serious and rather violent at times, which again helps drive the Fleming tone along, in the best of the films Glen directed. This would be his last one, but by now he had crafted and perfected his art for the benefit of the film.
Sanchez is one of the best villains in the series, and I heard a rumour he was based loosely on Scaramanga. They both share the same initials, and once Bond goes undercover as a kind of personal bodyguard to get close to his man, it definitely echoes the novel TMWTGG.
`You earned it, you keep it, old buddy!'.....`Don't you want to know why?' The dialogue is brilliant, sharp Flemingesque. This is still the closest we have seen to Fleming's Bond in all his glory on screen. It's a damn shame Dalton would never do any more.
Cons
There really aren't any. Some complain that Dalton's wardrobe isn't dressy enough. I love it. It definitely feels more like how Bond dresses from the novels. The only one element I would have welcomed would have been another John Barry score, but otherwise the film is fairly near 100% perfect for me.
Agreed. While I don't rate it quite as highly as Goldfinger or On Her Majesty's Secret Service, there's no doubt that Licence to Kill is one of my favourite films, and Dalton executed his role as Bond perfectly. With Dalton, Bond had become dangerous again, just like he was in the novels. While I can't rate it higher than the Fleming novel adaptations of the early films, this film, as an original story, has encapsulated Fleming's Bond exceptionally well. That's what I look for in a Bond film, and that's why Licence to Kill is brilliant.
As for the common complaint that it's "too dark" - I don't think there's such a thing as far as a Bond film is concerned. I don't think this film is any darker than the tone found in most Fleming novels.
Probably the Bond film I have watched the least. It has too much of a Miami Vice feel to me. A show I loved btw, but Crockett was a lot cooler than this James Bond.
Pro's
- Robert Davi is a great villain
- del Toro a good henchman
- Nice to see Q in the field and have a substantial bigger role than normal.
Con's
- Production values are low. It has the feeling of a TV movie
- Isthmus City I never understood. Why a fake city/country?
- Talisa Soto although gorgeous, is a horrible actress
- It misses all the class of a 007 movie. Despite the obligatory casino scene.
Sorry guys, I know this movie has a lot of fans, but it just doesn't do it too me. It lacks fun, sense of humor, class.... at least to me.
If ya mix Fleming's Bond with the best of Miami Vice, Scarface, and Lethal Weapon, you get a movie as awesome as this.
Cons:
.The slow motion and sound effects during the PTS.
."I love James so much".
.Leiter being happy at the end.
Pros:
.Everything else. I luv this movie so much.
.Dalton is badass.
.One of the best groups of villains in the series.
.Pam and especially Lupe.
.I love the settings in Florida and Mexico.
.The harder score. Like both songs as well.
.Great action.
.THAT TRUCK CHASE.
Even the flaws i love. Should've kept the deleted scenes though.
LTK is one of my favourite films in the franchise. Its up there with GF and OHMSS.
Dalton is at his best here, in the closest screen adaptation of the Fleming Bond from the novels. He certainly did his research with the character when taking on the Bond role, but boy does it show here. Humourless, violent, driven. This is Bond at his most badass. Forget what came later with Craig. This is the real deal, right here.
Even Maibaum and Wilson come up trumps here with the script also, in a storyline and scenes that Fleming himself would have been proud. The film unfolds and feels like a Fleming book, helped massively by scenes and characters taken directly from the books, but Maibaum knew his Fleming, and this feels as close to the novels as OHMSS or FRWL.
Glen's direction is not too flashy, workmanlike but serious and rather violent at times, which again helps drive the Fleming tone along, in the best of the films Glen directed. This would be his last one, but by now he had crafted and perfected his art for the benefit of the film.
Sanchez is one of the best villains in the series, and I heard a rumour he was based loosely on Scaramanga. They both share the same initials, and once Bond goes undercover as a kind of personal bodyguard to get close to his man, it definitely echoes the novel TMWTGG.
`You earned it, you keep it, old buddy!'.....`Don't you want to know why?' The dialogue is brilliant, sharp Flemingesque. This is still the closest we have seen to Fleming's Bond in all his glory on screen. It's a damn shame Dalton would never do any more.
Cons
There really aren't any. Some complain that Dalton's wardrobe isn't dressy enough. I love it. It definitely feels more like how Bond dresses from the novels. The only one element I would have welcomed would have been another John Barry score, but otherwise the film is fairly near 100% perfect for me.
Wow, this is like reading something I wrote! -{ Obviously I agree 100%.
Seconded, chrisisall! -{
"The tough man of the world. The Secret Agent. The man who was only a silhouette." - Ian Fleming, Moonraker (1955).
Sanchez is a really scary villain. The idea of Bond exploiting Sanchez's paranoia for the loyalty of his men, was ingenious!
Dario is an amazing henchman! One of the cruellest henchman in the series and Benicio Del Toro played him brilliantly!
The score from Michael Kamen. I liked the use of the Spanish guitar.
Lupe Lamora and Pam Bouvier, are hot! :x
There are times when Bond is in real peril. The conveyor belt scene, is an example.
Cons
The film looks like a TV film.
The soap opera style love triangle is annoying
Dalton's accent is all over the place! It's Northern during the scene in Sanchez's mansion and full blown Welsh, during the conveyor belt scene. I found it distracting.
Exploding head.
Have you ever heard of the Emancipation Proclamation?"
I really enjoyed rewatching LTK after years of finding it average. There's little to dislike about this film. The entire cast, bar one or two bit players, is fantastic. The story is unique and enjoyable and I love the use of material from LALD the novel as well as the harder edged Bond. I particularly enjoyed the bar scene, Bond working with Sharky, when Pam cons Professor Joe Butcher, and the greater use of Q. Both of Pam and Lupe are great Bond girls too. I never really liked Kamen's score in the past but for the most part it's really good. I just feel his action cues are average and his use of the Bond theme in them feels awkward. The opening and ending songs are probably the best in the series too. LTK is a fantastic film that has jumped from 19 to 9 in my rankings. Dalton really should have done more Bond films. He's a fantastic 007.
I really enjoyed rewatching LTK after years of finding it average. There's little to dislike about this film. The entire cast, bar one or two bit players, is fantastic. The story is unique and enjoyable and I love the use of material from LALD the novel as well as the harder edged Bond. I particularly enjoyed the bar scene, Bond working with Sharky, when Pam cons Professor Joe Butcher, and the greater use of Q. Both of Pam and Lupe are great Bond girls too. I never really liked Kamen's score in the past but for the most part it's really good. I just feel his action cues are average and his use of the Bond theme in them feels awkward. The opening and ending songs are probably the best in the series too. LTK is a fantastic film that has jumped from 19 to 9 in my rankings. meDalton really should have done more Bond films. He's a fantastic 007.
*Thumbs up* Great post.
LTK is also in my top 10 as well.
I've heard several stories as to why LTK wasn't the BO hit previous Bond films. Was it really the Lethal Weapon and Die Hard movies that muscled James Bond out of the game? I also heard stories of MGM's financial troubles at the time that put the Bond on ice for a few years.
I believe our friend Higgins has access to all sorts of Venn diagrams, pie charts and so on* to illustrate the financial performance of LTK- perhaps he might drop in here and give us the benefit of his deep knowledge of the situation.
I really enjoyed rewatching LTK after years of finding it average. There's little to dislike about this film. The entire cast, bar one or two bit players, is fantastic. The story is unique and enjoyable and I love the use of material from LALD the novel as well as the harder edged Bond. I particularly enjoyed the bar scene, Bond working with Sharky, when Pam cons Professor Joe Butcher, and the greater use of Q. Both of Pam and Lupe are great Bond girls too. I never really liked Kamen's score in the past but for the most part it's really good. I just feel his action cues are average and his use of the Bond theme in them feels awkward. The opening and ending songs are probably the best in the series too. LTK is a fantastic film that has jumped from 19 to 9 in my rankings. Dalton really should have done more Bond films. He's a fantastic 007.
Thing is I don't disagree with any of this. AVTAK is in a similar boat with me, it's generally derided and not a publicly popular film, yet I enjoy many aspects of it and find they still made a great Bond film. Despite that, I understand why it's not popular or well received. There's still something not right with the film.
LTK, like AVTAK suffers from either too much grit, inconsistency in storytelling or just a ho-hum and long in the tooth feel to it. Dalton is good, but not quite right and the films needed a reboot.
Barbel is quite right to provide all sorts of links, LTK and Dalton seem to be the most prolifically discussed point on here? And IcePak - don't forget to post your new top 20 rankings in the ultimate thread!!!
[
I've heard several stories as to why LTK wasn't the BO hit previous Bond films. Was it really the Lethal Weapon and Die Hard movies that muscled James Bond out of the game? I also heard stories of MGM's financial troubles at the time that put the Bond on ice for a few years.
There is a popular approach, that moviegoers in the 80s had to pick one out of the big releases and thus the big movies cannibalised each other.
I don't follow that! In my opinion, the upcoming Of Leathal weapon and others would have raised interest in cinema in general to all competitors would have benefitted from a better market.
Just one example: You have a normal food market with one high end shop.
If they decide to move to a high-end market (in London that would be Borrough's Market for example) it could be good for them instead of fearing to be cannibalised by the competitors. If their product is good - they will succeed in an upscale market.
The same should have happened with a decent Bond. Raiders, Leathal weapon and Die Hard succeeded - why not Bond as the big player in that field?
President of the 'Misty Eyes Club'.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
Comments
The shirts that he wears with the suits are not high-end shirts. They look like they're from Macy's or the like. They have all the hallmarks of standard American shirts. The suits are high-end, but they're too flashy for Bond and not what Fleming's Bond would have worn. Most English tailors never went in for the latest fashions. Someone like Bond would not have dressed like that. Hence why Connery's Bond never went in for the latest stuff and only hinted at it.
- Dalton turns in another very good if not quite Bondian performance. He still seems the "Shakespeare Bond."
- Some very Fleming-esque moments -- the bit where he's outside of the casino lining up the shot and later being interrogated by another British agent (one of the few times we meet one in the modern era who actually has presence).
- A few good stunts.
- While it was nice to see David Hedison again, he just seemed "past it" for the role.
Cons:
- Miami Vice, by then, had been doing the same thing every week for five years.
- A terrible soundtrack except for the title song and occasion Bond theme iteration.
- Carey Lowell.
- Taliso Soto.
- Priscilla Barnes.
- Wayne Newton.
- Q in the field.
- M in the field.
- The film still can't decide if it wants to be hard hitting and scary or rather campy.
I love LTK, but I also love to hate it and this point sums it up - it's inconsistent - it doesn't know what it is!
"Better make that two."
We all have the same top four. -{
This surprises me, as I know Dalton was big on detail in getting the small things right to make the character look like Fleming Bond. I would have the thought the shirts would have at least been Sea Island cotton?
No real surprise as they ARE the top 3
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
Tanker chase
Benecio del Torro
Robert Davi
Cons:
No glamour or style
Poor use of locations
Bond is a professional, rogue or otherwise, so his actions make no sense.
Any film as relentlessly grim as this needs its lighter moments, but the humour falls hopelessly flat.
Badly directed
No iconic moments, and no iconic dialogue (apart from Davi's 'like a leedle bird')
Lupe
Exploding head
Timothy Dalton
Agreed. While I don't rate it quite as highly as Goldfinger or On Her Majesty's Secret Service, there's no doubt that Licence to Kill is one of my favourite films, and Dalton executed his role as Bond perfectly. With Dalton, Bond had become dangerous again, just like he was in the novels. While I can't rate it higher than the Fleming novel adaptations of the early films, this film, as an original story, has encapsulated Fleming's Bond exceptionally well. That's what I look for in a Bond film, and that's why Licence to Kill is brilliant.
As for the common complaint that it's "too dark" - I don't think there's such a thing as far as a Bond film is concerned. I don't think this film is any darker than the tone found in most Fleming novels.
Cons? I didn't like Gladys Knight's theme song.
Pro's
- Robert Davi is a great villain
- del Toro a good henchman
- Nice to see Q in the field and have a substantial bigger role than normal.
Con's
- Production values are low. It has the feeling of a TV movie
- Isthmus City I never understood. Why a fake city/country?
- Talisa Soto although gorgeous, is a horrible actress
- It misses all the class of a 007 movie. Despite the obligatory casino scene.
Sorry guys, I know this movie has a lot of fans, but it just doesn't do it too me. It lacks fun, sense of humor, class.... at least to me.
1. Connery 2. Craig 3. Brosnan 4. Dalton 5. Lazenby 6. Moore
If ya mix Fleming's Bond with the best of Miami Vice, Scarface, and Lethal Weapon, you get a movie as awesome as this.
Cons:
.The slow motion and sound effects during the PTS.
."I love James so much".
.Leiter being happy at the end.
Pros:
.Everything else. I luv this movie so much.
.Dalton is badass.
.One of the best groups of villains in the series.
.Pam and especially Lupe.
.I love the settings in Florida and Mexico.
.The harder score. Like both songs as well.
.Great action.
.THAT TRUCK CHASE.
Even the flaws i love. Should've kept the deleted scenes though.
10/10 -{
Seconded, chrisisall!
Sanchez is a really scary villain. The idea of Bond exploiting Sanchez's paranoia for the loyalty of his men, was ingenious!
Dario is an amazing henchman! One of the cruellest henchman in the series and Benicio Del Toro played him brilliantly!
The score from Michael Kamen. I liked the use of the Spanish guitar.
Lupe Lamora and Pam Bouvier, are hot! :x
There are times when Bond is in real peril. The conveyor belt scene, is an example.
Cons
The film looks like a TV film.
The soap opera style love triangle is annoying
Dalton's accent is all over the place! It's Northern during the scene in Sanchez's mansion and full blown Welsh, during the conveyor belt scene. I found it distracting.
Exploding head.
" I don't listen to hip hop!"
Seriously though, the "BULLSHIT" from Pam balances it out.
8. TMwtGG 9. AVtaK 10. TSWLM 11. SF 12. LtK 13. TND 14. YOLT
15. NTtD 16. MR 17. LaLD 18. GF 19. SP 20. DN 21. TB
22. TWiNE 23. DAD 24. QoS 25. DaF
LTK is also in my top 10 as well.
I've heard several stories as to why LTK wasn't the BO hit previous Bond films. Was it really the Lethal Weapon and Die Hard movies that muscled James Bond out of the game? I also heard stories of MGM's financial troubles at the time that put the Bond on ice for a few years.
I believe our friend Higgins has access to all sorts of Venn diagrams, pie charts and so on* to illustrate the financial performance of LTK- perhaps he might drop in here and give us the benefit of his deep knowledge of the situation.
* See this page: https://www.ajb007.co.uk/topic/43401/what-if-dalton-had-taken-over-from-fyeo-onwards/page/3/
Thing is I don't disagree with any of this. AVTAK is in a similar boat with me, it's generally derided and not a publicly popular film, yet I enjoy many aspects of it and find they still made a great Bond film. Despite that, I understand why it's not popular or well received. There's still something not right with the film.
LTK, like AVTAK suffers from either too much grit, inconsistency in storytelling or just a ho-hum and long in the tooth feel to it. Dalton is good, but not quite right and the films needed a reboot.
Barbel is quite right to provide all sorts of links, LTK and Dalton seem to be the most prolifically discussed point on here? And IcePak - don't forget to post your new top 20 rankings in the ultimate thread!!!
"Better make that two."
I agree, Barbel would have made a good Bond.
1. GE 2. MR 3. OP 4. TMWTGG 5. TSWLM 6. TND 7. TWINE 8.DN 9. GF 10. AVTAK
There is a popular approach, that moviegoers in the 80s had to pick one out of the big releases and thus the big movies cannibalised each other.
I don't follow that! In my opinion, the upcoming Of Leathal weapon and others would have raised interest in cinema in general to all competitors would have benefitted from a better market.
Just one example: You have a normal food market with one high end shop.
If they decide to move to a high-end market (in London that would be Borrough's Market for example) it could be good for them instead of fearing to be cannibalised by the competitors. If their product is good - they will succeed in an upscale market.
The same should have happened with a decent Bond. Raiders, Leathal weapon and Die Hard succeeded - why not Bond as the big player in that field?
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
It always has- for more than 60 years now....
Afraid I'm overage now even for AVTAK....