Two things I'd change about the Climax and Ending (SPOILERS)

Absolutely_Cart

Climax

In the exploding MI6 building, instead of having to rescue Madeline, Blofeld gives Bond a choice. Blofeld tells Bond on the left side of the building Madeline is tied up and on the right side is a mega-computer selling leftover data acquired by the Nine Eyes program to terrorists. Either rescue Madeline (on the left wing of the building) or prevent the mega computer on the right wing of the building

This adds way more suspenses and makes Bond's choice more difficult.

Ending

Instead of Blofeld being captured, 8 (one for each tentacle) black cars full of armed Spectre men, scoop up Blofeld. As Bond tries to chase Blofeld, Hinx arrives, the helicopter fire spreads as it rains in the night, and they fight until Hinx is completely immolated.

Then Bond goes to MI6, they congratulate his success. And Madeline Swann shows up alive because she used a gadget she stole from Bond's car (earlier in the movie to escape the building).


I think my changes establish Hinx/Blofeld as much tougher characters, as well as make the movie a little more cerebral.

DutchJamesBondFan

The ending could be great, but you could also do something as that he went for Madeleine and Q tells him he already fixed the Nine Eyes program. I don't think Madeleine would like Bond to not choose her, on the other side, she did said she could hendle thinks herself.

Absolutely_Cart

DutchJamesBondFan wrote:

The ending could be great, but you could also do something as that he went for Madeleine and Q tells him he already fixed the Nine Eyes program. I don't think Madeleine would like Bond to not choose her, on the other side, she did said she could hendle thinks herself.

What I was implying was that even if Q shut down Nine Eyes in its nacency, they still were already able to siphon some data that would put innocent lives in danger.

I think "I said I could handle myself" with a smirky smile would be a great way to end it.

sniperUK

Use a feckin MANPAD or have southern QRA shoot the helicopter down.

Gassy Man

Absolutely_Cart wrote:

Climax

In the exploding MI6 building, instead of having to rescue Madeline, Blofeld gives Bond a choice. Blofeld tells Bond on the left side of the building Madeline is tied up and on the right side is a mega-computer selling leftover data acquired by the Nine Eyes program to terrorists. Either rescue Madeline (on the left wing of the building) or prevent the mega computer on the right wing of the building

This adds way more suspenses and makes Bond's choice more difficult.

Ending

Instead of Blofeld being captured, 8 (one for each tentacle) black cars full of armed Spectre men, scoop up Blofeld. As Bond tries to chase Blofeld, Hinx arrives, the helicopter fire spreads as it rains in the night, and they fight until Hinx is completely immolated.

Then Bond goes to MI6, they congratulate his success. And Madeline Swann shows up alive because she used a gadget she stole from Bond's car (earlier in the movie to escape the building).


I think my changes establish Hinx/Blofeld as much tougher characters, as well as make the movie a little more cerebral.

The first bit sounds too much like the situation with the girl in The Dark Knight -- Craig's Bonds plagiarize the Batman films too much already.

The second bit sounds rather complicated, and why would they congratulate Bond if Blofeld got away? While the ending right now is rather too much like the ending to, once again, The Dark Knight, it is rather more straightforward. The problem I have with it primarily is that it's just too small. Mendes thinks less is more and just doesn't understand the Bond concept in that.

Absolutely_Cart

I see what you mean about The Dark Knight (with both the Harvey/Rachel situation and the Prisoner's Dilemma on the ferries). Truth be told, my change in that climax isn't a complete game-changer - it's just damage control. What Mendes' chose was even more unoriginal and done before in movies hundreds of times, so what applies to my ending applies doubly to his.

The 2nd bit with the Bond girl not dying and actually being able to save herself as cleverly as Bond did, is, on the other hand, very refreshing. However, I do agree that M congratulating Bond on a not-fully-complete mission is giving him too much praise.

MilleniumForce

If we're talking about changing the ending (which I really like how it is), I would have bought Hinx back for a final confrontation, maybe having a quick fight in the Mi6 building, with Hinx dying in the explosion.

chrisisall

MilleniumForce wrote:

If we're talking about changing the ending (which I really like how it is), I would have bought Hinx back for a final confrontation, maybe having a quick fight in the Mi6 building, with Hinx dying in the explosion.

I REALLY liked that Hinx didn't show up for a curtain call (which I actually expected)- made the whole movie seem more realistic IMO.

Loeffelholz

chrisisall wrote:

MilleniumForce wrote:

If we're talking about changing the ending (which I really like how it is), I would have bought Hinx back for a final confrontation, maybe having a quick fight in the Mi6 building, with Hinx dying in the explosion.

I REALLY liked that Hinx didn't show up for a curtain call (which I actually expected)- made the whole movie seem more realistic IMO.

He'll be back in #25

chrisisall

Loeffelholz wrote:

chrisisall wrote:

MilleniumForce wrote:

If we're talking about changing the ending (which I really like how it is), I would have bought Hinx back for a final confrontation, maybe having a quick fight in the Mi6 building, with Hinx dying in the explosion.

I REALLY liked that Hinx didn't show up for a curtain call (which I actually expected)- made the whole movie seem more realistic IMO.

He'll be back in #25

I can accept that if it happens. -{

Loeffelholz

He's too awesome to not use again. And the payoff when he's seen again will be stellar B-)

MooseWithFleas

At the end when Blofeld is getting shot at in his helicopter, a very small part of me wanted him to get dropped down a smokestack

DaltonFan1

Loeffelholz wrote:

He's too awesome to not use again. And the payoff when he's seen again will be stellar B-)

Expect him to return in a wheelchair.

Loeffelholz

DaltonFan1 wrote:

Loeffelholz wrote:

He's too awesome to not use again. And the payoff when he's seen again will be stellar B-)

Expect him to return in a wheelchair.

) Doubtful. These uber-henchman-types are a sturdy lot. If there's no body, he's not dead.

chrisisall

MooseWithFleas wrote:

At the end when Blofeld is getting shot at in his helicopter, a very small part of me wanted him to get dropped down a smokestack

) ) ) ) ) ) ) ) )

Mcmadness

MooseWithFleas wrote:

At the end when Blofeld is getting shot at in his helicopter, a very small part of me wanted him to get dropped down a smokestack

I'LL BUY YOU A DELICATESSEN!!!

Barbel

) ) ) ) PMSL, Moose! Excellent!

Hold Command

MooseWithFleas wrote:

At the end when Blofeld is getting shot at in his helicopter, a very small part of me wanted him to get dropped down a smokestack

A very large part of me wanted the heli pilot to perhaps, I don't know fly upwards or left & right a bit?

I'm no firearms expert but I seem to think firing a PPK at a moving heli would be a tad more difficult.

Absolutely_Cart

A very large part of me wanted the heli pilot to perhaps, I don't know fly upwards or left & right a bit?

I'm no firearms expert but I seem to think firing a PPK at a moving heli would be a tad more difficult.

Or that dealing with Blofeld in general would be more difficult. This is BLOFELD we're talking about. A tyrant, a terrorist, and he's been nothing but dainty and gingerly the whole movie.

First words: He sincerely apologized for interrupting.
He doesn't put any of his men to death for failure.
He doesn't really hurt physically hurt anyone.
His origin story is because of petty daddy issues.
His chief motive in this movie is just to pester Bond.
His laboratory is able to die with one bullet.
His save-the-girl climax wasn't too difficult for Bond.
His helicopter is shot down so easily.
He isn't protected by any guards, despite being a big figure.
He begs Bond to "finish it".

Barbel

Quoting Absolutely Cart:

First words: He sincerely apologized for interrupting. He's understating his power; the room hushes when he enters.
He doesn't put any of his men to death for failure. Hinx's job application does that for him.
He doesn't really hurt physically hurt anyone. Bond isn't hurt by the torture?
His origin story is because of petty daddy issues. Agreed, thought that could have been better handled.
His chief motive in this movie is just to pester Bond....and gain control of the world's intelligence data.
His laboratory is able to die with one bullet. Like many of its predecessors. Standard trope.
His save-the-girl climax wasn't too difficult for Bond. Would have been for anyone else.
His helicopter is shot down so easily. Agreed.
He isn't protected by any guards, despite being a big figure. Yes he is!
He begs Bond to "finish it". Rather than face ignominious defeat.

("Ignominious" is a word I learned from FRWL ) )

Absolutely_Cart

> First words: He sincerely apologized for interrupting.
> He's understating his power; the room hushes when he enters.

Granted, but he was overall very polite in general. Not in a nasty passive-aggressive way like Hans Landa (from Inglourious Basterds) either. And Blofeld is essentially James Bond's Adolf Hitler. I'd expect him to act like more of a dictator.

> He doesn't put any of his men to death for failure.
> Hinx's job application does that for him.

Blofeld's just very lackadaisical, like a regular chairman. Hinx steals the show, does what he wants, and Blofeld doesn't assert any authority. There's no fear in the room.

> He doesn't really physically hurt anyone.
> Bond isn't hurt by the torture?

And that's pretty much it. We don't see him attack innocent people and the world at large world.

> His origin story is because of petty daddy issues.
> Agreed, thought that could have been better handled.

My idea was to make him a deceased CEO of a private military corporation which went bankrupt 20 years ago. Would've been better.

> His laboratory is able to die with one bullet.
> Like many of its predecessors. Standard trope.

I'm not so sure. Other bases in Bond history took a bit more work to dismantle.

> His save-the-girl climax wasn't too difficult for Bond.
> Would have been for anyone else.

I meant to say it wasn't a very original, challenging or cerebral climax like Skyfall's or Casino Royale's.

> He isn't protected by any guards, despite being a big figure.
> Yes he is!

I was expecting hundreds of Spectre soldiers to come out and save Blofeld. One does not just detain Blofeld that easily!

> He begs Bond to "finish it".
> Rather than face ignominious defeat.

I guess it's the context. We just met Blofeld, he was never dangerous or scary, he never had strong motives, he was hunted down easily and the last straw was him begging to Bond (instead of having a backup plan).

Barbel

No fear in that room??? The only two people who weren't afraid were Hinx and Blofeld (and I'm including Bond in that- his face says it all).

The base being easily blown up is just cinematic shorthand. We could have had a few shots of 007 rigging an explosive or whatever, but Mendes chose not to go into detail: he knows the place will blow, we know it too, and he goes for pace and speed since we're heading for the end chapters. Will watch that bit more closely next time to see if Bond fires at something labelled "Oxygen" or "High Explosive"!

Attacking the world at large: ESB takes responsibility for the events in the last 3 movies.

Thunderpussy

I always remember an interview with Bob Hoskins, on making the long good Friday.
In one scene with a few blokes hanging from meat hooks, he was giving it 100% all
Shouting and waving his arms etc.
He said after a few rehearsals, one of the extras a real eastend minor villain told him
That Real God fathers, don't even have to raise their voice in an argument. Everyone
Knows what you are capable of, Everyone knows who and what you must have done
To become leader. No one would question any order he gave.
So Bob said he changed how he would play the character. Same with Blofeld, he'd
Never have to raise his voice he would hold absolute power.
If I'd been at that meeting, I'd be needing new underpants after it. )

Absolutely_Cart

Waltz's character of Blofeld I'm talking about. Despite what the plot dictates, he's just not terrifying like Silva, as intimidating as Le Chiffre or as malicious like Greene was.

Im not against a subtle character. Hans Landa was subtle but dangerous and scary. Blofeld just wasn't scary.

Matt S

Absolutely_Cart wrote:

Waltz's character of Blofeld I'm talking about. Despite what the plot dictates, he's just not terrifying like Silva, as intimidating as Le Chiffre or as malicious like Greene was.

Im not against a subtle character. Hans Landa was subtle but dangerous and scary. Blofeld just wasn't scary.

A lot of it just seemed like ordinary sibling rivalry.

sniperUK

Barbel wrote:

The base being easily blown up is just cinematic shorthand. We could have had a few shots of 007 rigging an explosive or whatever, but Mendes chose not to go into detail: he knows the place will blow, we know it too, and he goes for pace and speed since we're heading for the end chapters. Will watch that bit more closely next time to see if Bond fires at something labelled "Oxygen" or "High Explosive"!

As with shooting down the chopper with one tiny .32 round, monumentaly stupid , even Scaramangas base exploding made 1000% more sense.

Thunderpussy

In movies everthing is explosive, if you threw a can of coke at a horse in
a movie, The horse would explode ) I accept that. movie science.
Same way a gun can hold 87 bullets before needing a reload.

MooseWithFleas

Barbel wrote:

) ) ) ) PMSL, Moose! Excellent!

I feel like half of us on here would disavow Bond forever and the other half would die of laughter

Mcmadness wrote:

MooseWithFleas wrote:

At the end when Blofeld is getting shot at in his helicopter, a very small part of me wanted him to get dropped down a smokestack

I'LL BUY YOU A DELICATESSEN!!!

In stainless steeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeel -{

Thunderpussy wrote:

In movies everthing is explosive, if you threw a can of coke at a horse in
a movie, The horse would explode ) I accept that. movie science.
Same way a gun can hold 87 bullets before needing a reload.

For those of us who grew up in the Brosnan era




Apologies for veering slightly off topic . I would have ditched the DB5 riding off into the sunset. It was a bit cheesy and they already gave a nod and brought back the DB5 in SF. I love some camp, but that moment didn't work for me.

Sir Miles

MooseWithFleas wrote:

I would have ditched the DB5 riding off into the sunset. It was a bit cheesy and they already gave a nod and brought back the DB5 in SF. I love some camp, but that moment didn't work for me.

I actually thought that was a great touch -{

Shatterfang

Here's even better: Delete everything in the London finale, and use that time to utilize a good volcano lair warzone finale. Enough of the choices, this isnt the Joker

Gassy Man

Absolutely_Cart wrote:

Waltz's character of Blofeld I'm talking about. Despite what the plot dictates, he's just not terrifying like Silva, as intimidating as Le Chiffre or as malicious like Greene was.

Im not against a subtle character. Hans Landa was subtle but dangerous and scary. Blofeld just wasn't scary.

I was never once scared of Silva. In fact, after being scared of Jarvier Bardem's character in No Country for Old Men, I was incredibly disappointed with how bland Silva was, both in concept and in performance. Had Bardem not been playing him, I would have dismissed the character outright as what he was -- a poor Joker clone.

On the other hand, early Blofeld was always been understated. In those Bonds, he was heard but not seen, never raised his voice, spoke in a disturbingly somnambulant but threatening way, and essentially knowingly satirized how a gentleman is supposed to behave. It wasn't until rat-eyed Donald Pleasance played him that he became a kind of histrionic caricature. Waltz essentially brought back the former while also trying to do a little of the latter. To me, the conference room scene was one of the better scenes in the film. The fear and tension from his minions is palpable, which makes Hinx all the more frightening since he doesn't seem afraid of Blofeld. When we can't hear what Blofeld is saying, we're in the same position as the minions, and that makes it all the more tense. Now, because this is a contemporary film, it wants to have its cake and eat it, too. So, while they don't go all out enough to truly make the scene scary, they also try to have some sense of understated menace. It more or less works.

I think Waltz was confined by Mendes' direction to underplay scenes -- this is a problem throughout his movies, as he thinks it is somehow more effective than "flair" -- but also because the script is rather weak.

So far, the only villains in the Craig film I've actually found menacing aside from Blofeld and Hinx were in Casino Royale.