Devil's Advocate, defending the indefensible ?

Thunderpussy

For discussion purposes, is it possible for anyone ( For fun) to defend some
Unpopular ideas. Let one discussion run for a day or so, then post another on an
Unpopular, film, character, script etc.

First up. Christmas Jones was a good character. ?

Most of the anti Jones arguments seem based around, Denise Richards being
far too beautiful to be a nuclear scientist, but surely this is based on the old
Greek legend idea, that women gave up intelligence for the gift of beauty. Which
Of course is just an old fable as many beautiful women are also highly intelligent.
Her costume is clearly based on " Laura Croft" strangely another strong female
character. Who regularly outwits her male opponents, in both mental and physical
tasks, while keeping her femininity.
So as a character, Christmas Jones fits perfectly in to Bond's world, a beautiful,
intelligent woman. Infact just the sort of woman Bond would be attracted to.

Any thoughts on defending Christmas ?

The Red Kind

Ha! Good fun. Okay I'll play along..

Christmas Jones was too young to be a nuclear physicist ? Why so? She's obviously extremely intelligent, there are loads of 20 something's, especially in the world of technology and science that are mind-blowingly smart. The fact she's young also means that she's probably keen to travel and see the world, take a position overseas rather than stateside.

She's physically fit and a good assistant to Bond during some technically difficult parts of the mission. Arguably, without her Renard would have won..

Let's get her back for Bond 25! More mature now and holding a senior position in a Nuclear Research Laboratory targeted by Blofeld.

{[]

Thunderpussy

Nice idea to get her back sadly though since the reboot, I don't
think she exists in Craig's Bond's world.

The Red Kind

Which is such a damn shame.. )

Barbel

So... Christmas only came once?

(runs and hides)

Thunderpussy

You are right to Hide !

zaphod99

Thunderpussy wrote:

Nice idea to get her back sadly though since the reboot, I don't
think she exists in Craig's Bond's world.

C'mon, surely anything is now possible in the Bon-diverse. It would be fun to fuse the timelines and collapse the separation...it would open up all sorts of possibilities...can you imagine the factions, schisms, rifts, and internecine war fair/ fun we could have. Also ( and this matters) she was gorgeous, ok not Plenty gorgeous, but close enough for government work in my view. Oh wait she might be a tad tall though |)

Thunderpussy

That would surely close the Einstein Rosen Bridge !
That can not be allowed This is utter madness, faction would
Attack faction. Moore fans fighting Dalton fans, it would be the
Craig wars all over again,

MilleniumForce

Christmas Jones wasn't that great of a character, played by Richards or not. She was poorly written, and all she does in the film is give out all the exposition. Seriously, how good would it have been if the only Bond girl in the film was also the villain?

I'll give you an example of the bad writing for her character:

Bond: What are you doing out here?
Jones: Avoiding questions like that.

I'm sorry, Christmas, but who the hell would be asking you those questions? The only reason anyone would ever ask here a question like that is because she IS out there. No one would question her about why she is somewhere if she wasn't where she was. So, no, she's not avoiding those questions. BECAUSE THOSE QUESTIONS WOULD NOT EXIST IF YOU WERENT THERE!!!!!!!

Thunderpussy

Some good points MF -{ but the idea is to play Devil's Advocate, and
Defend the indefensible . For fun, could you counter your own argument ?
As an exercise.

GoldHilding

We had a discussion on this for our TWINE podcast for Double Oz Seven. I was of the opinion that the same character played by another actress would have been half decent. Not great by any means, as she doesn't have an invested interest in the story and is mostly there to spout technical jargon, but I doubt she'd be hated if Teri Hatcher had played her instead of Richards.

Number24

As mentioned, Christmas is young for someone with a degree like that. In other words she must be very inteligent. But she shows her talent in the field of spycraft too, by hiding her inteligence so expertly
In adition to her job as conveyor of exposition, she has the traditional Bond girl job of eye candy. The importance of this job can't be overstated, and Christmas does a stellar job!

Thunderpussy

Is Christmas Jones attractive ? Can't say I ever noticed !
I have too much respect for her as a scientist.

Matt S

Looks have no bearing on intelligence. She's very smart, just immature. Her mind is ahead of her maturity, and that's not unrealistic. I know plenty of people who are like that.

HatThrowingHenchman

I don't understand why everybody is getting on about her?
there are so many elements that could be discussed, but it's always this

Thunderpussy

Wait untill you see my next discussion point

Napoleon Plural

I like the chemistry she has with Brosnan, and some of his good jokes, like when he puts on a Russian accent and does the language.

You may as well say that Bond is no kind of a secret agent, too ostensible with his tastes, too good looking and so on. Some seem to hate her cos she's American, and they get a bad rap in the films, it's as if Yanks are watching it thinking, well, she's like the annoying prom date I never had back at high school, whereas the European chicks would no doubt appreciate my finer qualities... )

Makes you wonder how they would have taken to Pussy Galore had she been the Texan of the GF novel rather than the rather haughty English Honor Blackman in the film.

Thunderpussy

Agreed, the Americans do like a British accent.

HatThrowingHenchman

Thunderpussy wrote:

Wait untill you see my next discussion point

keep me posted -{

Thunderpussy

"If I were to break the news to anyone it would be to you first. You know that,
But it's late, I'm tired and there's so much left to do. Goodnight Mr HTH"

( that's especially for Higgins, I know he loves a quote, just shoved in )

HatThrowingHenchman

Tomorrow's news today?

Barbel

Family friendly site, guys, keep it clean. Well, cleaner anyway. Several posts edited or deleted.

Number24

My post wasn't censured. I'm not sure if I should be relieved or offended )

BondJasonBond006

Number24 wrote:

My post wasn't censured. I'm not sure if I should be relieved or offended )

Mine was deleted, I was quoting Sterling Archer, I guess he is too naughty ) )

MilleniumForce

Thunderpussy wrote:

Some good points MF -{ but the idea is to play Devil's Advocate, and
Defend the indefensible . For fun, could you counter your own argument ?
As an exercise.

Hmmmm, ok. She was definitely attractive.................................no, that's all I can think of.

Thunderpussy

) she is indeed.

Charmed & Dangerous

No-one else could handle a PDA while hurtling through a pipeline on a 'pig' to defuse a nuclear bomb, with quite the same panache. For that alone Christmas ranks amongst the finest Bond girls. In fact, Denise chews up every scene that she's in.... making them a bit of a Christmas dinner, you might say...

Thunderpussy

On the subject of Christmas, you can be a bit of a "card" yourself ;%

Higgins

Who cares?
She looks absolutely gorgeous in those Lara Croft hotpants, I actually prefer her clearly over Angelina Jolie in that costume

Thunderpussy

You shouldn't be watching them, wearing that costume. :v

Higgins

) ) )