Thoughts on Robert Brown as M?

heartbroken_mr_drax

I had a look for threads based on this, but couldn't find one, so sorry if it is a repeat

What does everything think of Robert Brown as M? He only did four films, and each of them, IMO are quite different performances. Bernard Lee and Judi Dench are more consistent.

I find that in OP and AVTAK that he's decent. He just gets on with the job and seems happy enough with Bond. I really enjoy his performance at Ascot - in particular his delivery of "Mayday".

I find that TLD and LTK that he goes off the boil a bit. His character becomes whiney in TLD and in LTK, he's just a dick to Bond really.

Everyone else?

CoolHandBond

He improves in every movie IMO and is absolutely terrific in LTK. He was a fine choice to follow the great Bernard Lee.

James Suzuki

I prefer him to Judi Dench to be honest.
1. Bernard Lee
2. Ralph Fiennes
3. Robert Brown
4. Judi Dench

They are all fantastic M's though and play the part well

Barbel

He was a fine actor and a good M, though overshadowed by the others.

The Wicker Man

I thought he did a good job. It must have been daunting having to follow on from Bernard Lee. I always preferred the earlier relationship between Bond and M, whether it be Bernard Lee or Robert Brown. M came across as a father figure to Bond but it always stayed professional. The warmth and respect between the characters was shown through a line of dialogue or a smile or even a certain look between them both. The overly personal relationship between M and Bond in some of the more recent films I am not as comfortable with for some reason.

Thunderpussy

I thought he was a bit lightweight , compared to other M's, but then
again they didn't give him much to do.

am747

heartbroken_mr_drax wrote:

in LTK, he's just a dick to Bond really

How is Bond supposed to go rogue? .... And later, Q was sent to assist Bond unofficially too. Q would not have brought the equipment to Bond w/o M's support

HatThrowingHenchman

am747 wrote:

heartbroken_mr_drax wrote:

in LTK, he's just a dick to Bond really

How is Bond supposed to go rogue? .... And later, Q was sent to assist Bond unofficially too. Q would not have brought the equipment to Bond w/o M's support

I think he's only a dick when he says to the guy not to shoot Bond because "there are too many people" - I never liked that line

am747

HatThrowingHenchman wrote:

am747 wrote:

heartbroken_mr_drax wrote:

in LTK, he's just a dick to Bond really

How is Bond supposed to go rogue? .... And later, Q was sent to assist Bond unofficially too. Q would not have brought the equipment to Bond w/o M's support

I think he's only a dick when he says to the guy not to shoot Bond because "there are too many people" - I never liked that line

That could be his way of stopping the people from shooting at Bond and also not appearing weak at tackling insubordination .... Don't forget that Bond was actually supposed to be in or on his way to Istanbul for a mission

HatThrowingHenchman

I know but it I'd have prefered it if he just said "don't shoot", it just sounds like he doesn't care for his agent at all

Thunderbird 2

Barbel wrote:

He was a fine actor and a good M, though overshadowed by the others.

Thunderbird Too.

Lee - The Angry Admiral. Only character that could make Sir Sean' Bond I'll at ease.

Brown - The Indignant Civil Servant. Affable, but airy, more taken aback than temperamental. Definitely the least ruffled of the M's in a crisis, indignant and witty, but more sensitive to political and diplomatic niceties. Effective, but without the heavyweight aspects of the others.

Dench.
- As Mawdsley. The Chess Queen. Tough, but flexible, sharp instincts, witty sense of humour, cold temper and demanded respect of those who doubted her. Plans a good long game. Knows how manipulate others, even against her own instincts.

- As Mansfield. Lady MacBeth. Tough, uncompromising, sarky humour, fiery temper, and made mistakes, which she was not forgiven for. A tragic character as she was too sure she was right, against evidence and advice.

Mallory. - The menacing M. Quiet, thoughtful, contemplative. Ominous when peeved. The most physical M of the lot, Mr Fiennes has given his character a neat twist by being the opposite of Mr Lee's Admiral. The office scene in SP ripples with tension and frustration between M-Malry and Bond.


It's funny, because Mr Brown's M was completely right for the mid to late eighties period. A time when the rise of bureaucracy and the public spoofing of the civil service mentality. (Spitting Image, Yes Prime Minister) Though just as compelling because he was such a damned good actor.

Honourable mention to James Fox in NSNA, as he too has that bureaucratic air, but with a very hot headed temper!

Matt S

James Suzuki wrote:

I prefer him to Judi Dench to be honest.
1. Bernard Lee
2. Ralph Fiennes
3. Robert Brown
4. Judi Dench

They are all fantastic M's though and play the part well

I think I'd rank them the same.

zaphod99

The Wicker Man wrote:

I thought he did a good job. It must have been daunting having to follow on from Bernard Lee. I always preferred the earlier relationship between Bond and M, whether it be Bernard Lee or Robert Brown. M came across as a father figure to Bond but it always stayed professional. The warmth and respect between the characters was shown through a line of dialogue or a smile or even a certain look between them both. The overly personal relationship between M and Bond in some of the more recent films I am not as comfortable with for some reason.

That quality you mentioned was evident despite the different Bonds with Lee, less so with Brown who was more than competent, but Lee 'nailed it' as I believe the young people have it

Agent Purple

This is how I think I'd rank the Ms:

1) Dench
2) Fiennes
3) Lee
4) Brown

heartbroken_mr_drax

I'm not ready to rank Fiennes yet, but I'm excited about the potential he has with how well he's already played the role.

1) Lee
2) Dench
3) Brown

Matt S

His relationship with Bond is the simplest. He's nothing more than a strict boss.

chrisisall

Matt S wrote:

His relationship with Bond is the simplest. He's nothing more than a strict boss.

I think you may be missing the subtitles... 8-)

Matt S

chrisisall wrote:

Matt S wrote:

His relationship with Bond is the simplest. He's nothing more than a strict boss.

I think you may be missing the subtitles... 8-)

When you compare him to the other three Ms, Brown's has the least depth. Sure there are subtleties, but it's not like the others. I still like him more than Dench.

chrisisall

Matt S wrote:

chrisisall wrote:

Matt S wrote:

His relationship with Bond is the simplest. He's nothing more than a strict boss.

I think you may be missing the subtitles... 8-)

When you compare him to the other three Ms, Brown's has the least depth. Sure there are subtleties, but it's not like the others. I still like him more than Dench.

Cool. -{

hehadlotsofguts

I liked it in LTK when he gives out to Moneypenny for the typos in the document she typed and his exasperated "you know him better than that, he'll go after Sanchez.

Speaking of LTK: Arranging to have Bond shot in Hemmingway House if he attacked him or his men when he takes away Bond's Licence to Kill wasn't exactly the smartest move. He stopped that one guy shooting Bond saying that there is too many people and there is a sniper with an unsilenced sniper rifle. Surely civillians would be able to hear it.

Gassy Man

Brown was my least favorite M -- stiff, stuffy, bland, unfriendly. I'd rank the Ms and follows:

1. Bernard Lee was, and I suspect, always will be the best. He was a like a stern and disapproving but still loving father who understood he had to keep his surrogate son, Bond, in line.

2. Judi Dench (Craig incarnation). She essentially was Bond's surrogate mother, inhabiting many of the qualities that Lee brought to the role, but with a modernist, feminine approach.

3. Ralph Fiennes. His Mallory essentially has the qualities that Lee brought to the role, though his M seems more pensive. It's a bit early to tell how great he will be, but so far, Fiennes is doing a terrific job.

4. Edward Fox. People complain about Never Say Never Again, but I thought quite a bit worked, including Fox as M. To some degree, he was a comic foil, but Fox never quite let it get that far, which still preserved his eccentric dignity.

5. Judi Dench (Brosnan incarnation). Some of it was the poor writing -- M dressing Bond down expertly and then suddenly getting ridiculously sentimental and telling him to come back alive -- and part of it was that she didn't have as much to do as the later one.

6. John Huston. It's true that in many ways the comic version of Casino Royale is a failure, but his M was not that terrible.

7. Robert Brown. He lacked Lee's warmth and personality. If Lee was the disapproving father, Brown was the intimidating neighbor.

Barbel

This may be of interest: http://www.ajb007.co.uk/topic/46640/best-m/

Unknown007

All the Actors/ Actress who have portrayed M (in both Offical Series and Unofficial Movies) have done it perfectly.......

Paperbill

I didn't care for him too much. Some really bad acting at times (note the end of TLD can't imagine why line)
For me Bernard Lee was the best and defined the role. JD did a great job and transitioned it well. For me the jury is still out on Ralph.

am747

Lee is the pioneer (first 11 films iirc), and Dench has played the role nicely in 7 films .... Brown probably has 4 films (and in those 4 films, he has limited screen time relatively speaking) and Fiennes is just starting out (but still gets more time on screen than Brown because of how the stories are written) so comparing these two with Lee and Dench is probably not apples to oranges

Brown also suffered because in the 80s, the focus appeared to be on optimizing the elements so more emphasis was on Bond, stunts, action, etc. It is hard to imagine how anyone playing M would have been able to impress much in the 80s films .... Even the Bond girls from the 80s are not that memorable except for OP, where the BG was one of the key focuses of the story

Matt S

am747 wrote:

Lee is the pioneer (first 11 films iirc), and Dench has played the role nicely in 7 films .... Brown probably has 4 films (and in those 4 films, he has limited screen time relatively speaking) and Fiennes is just starting out so comparing these two with Lee and Dench is probably not apples to oranges

I already like Fiennes better as M in 1.01 films than I liked Dench as either M. It's not her acting, but it's the way her character is written I don't like. I just can't take her seriously in CR with the poetry she recites to Bond.

am747

Matt S wrote:

am747 wrote:

Lee is the pioneer (first 11 films iirc), and Dench has played the role nicely in 7 films .... Brown probably has 4 films (and in those 4 films, he has limited screen time relatively speaking) and Fiennes is just starting out so comparing these two with Lee and Dench is probably not apples to oranges

I already like Fiennes better as M in 1.01 films than I liked Dench as either M. It's not her acting, but it's the way her character is written I don't like. I just can't take her seriously in CR with the poetry she recites to Bond.

That's personal preference though .... Objectively, it would be hard to compare Brown and rate Fiennes yet as who knows he may get limited role in future (unlikely but who knows)

Coming back to Brown - He also suffered because in the 80s, the focus appeared to be on optimizing the elements so more emphasis was on Bond, stunts, action, etc. It is hard to imagine how anyone playing M would have been able to impress much in the 80s films .... Even the Bond girls from the 80s are not that memorable except for OP, where the BG was one of the key focuses of the story

Matt S

am747 wrote:

Matt S wrote:

am747 wrote:

Lee is the pioneer (first 11 films iirc), and Dench has played the role nicely in 7 films .... Brown probably has 4 films (and in those 4 films, he has limited screen time relatively speaking) and Fiennes is just starting out so comparing these two with Lee and Dench is probably not apples to oranges

I already like Fiennes better as M in 1.01 films than I liked Dench as either M. It's not her acting, but it's the way her character is written I don't like. I just can't take her seriously in CR with the poetry she recites to Bond.

That's personal preference though .... Objectively, it would be hard to compare Brown and rate Fiennes yet as who knows he may get limited role in future (unlikely but who knows)

Coming to Brown - He also suffered because in the 80s, the focus appeared to be on optimizing the elements so more emphasis was on Bond, stunts, action, etc. It is hard to imagine how anyone playing M would have been able to impress much in the 80s films .... Even the Bond girls from the 80s are not that memorable except for OP, where the BG was one of the key focuses of the story

I wonder how much screen time Brown got in his four films compared to how much Fiennes got in SP. Over Fiennes two films, he certainly must have had a lot more screen time than Brown had in his four. Based on that, I think that's enough to be able to compare Fiennes.

am747

Matt S wrote:

I wonder how much screen time Brown got in his four films compared to how much Fiennes got in SP. Over Fiennes two films, he certainly must have had a lot more screen time than Brown had in his four. Based on that, I think that's enough to be able to compare Fiennes.

Again it would not be apples to apples as much of the Brown's time would be spent in giving orders / assignment to Bond, while Fiennes's M was also out in the field as his character was written nicely

For apples to apples comparison (objectively) would be Brown and Fiennes giving orders / assignments to Bond, which would be a pointless comparison

Fiennes role in SP where he took on C is one of the most brilliant roles written for M. Also as the acting M in SF, he decided to bend rules to help M. Only Dench has played such roles. While Lee also has had some minor problem solving to do .... I would give Fiennes one more film before I can start comparing him with Lee and Dench

heartbroken_mr_drax

Paperbill wrote:

Some really back acting at times (note the end of TLD can't imagine why line)

Good point, although those guys being held up at the airport is lazy writing. Even in the late 80s would you have been allowed on a plane with a sash of bullets around your body?!

CmdrAtticus

Having actually worked under British officers at certain times (from all three services) when I was stationed on a NATO base, I queried them about the Bond films and got some very interesting answers. They had read the novels and seen the films of course but what was interesting was that as much as they liked Lee as M, they more or less thought the actor himself never seemed to be of "officer" material. When I pressed them on this, they said he would be more convincing as an enlisted man and one of them referenced Lee's role as the sergeant in The Third Man. The always thought Trevor Howard made a more convincing officer (and would have made a great M). When I saw Brown play Adm Hargreaves in TSWLM I noticed that character and asked a couple of the officers about him and they agreed he would make a convincing M.

Interestingly, a couple of those officers reminded me of Brown and Howard and even spoke like them. I supposed that colored my perception of M in the films after that and when Brown began playing M I found him very convincing and started picturing him in the novels rather than Lee. So as much as I thought Lee was a good actor and did a good job in the role as the first M, I preferred Brown when he came aboard.