I'm sure SnakeBoy or MicroJif will be along shortly, but my understanding is that Top Venting blank firing RIFs are allowable under the recognised defences to the VCRA and Front venting RIF's eg PAKs are prohibited and covered by Section 1 licenses. Happy to be corrected.
I'm sure SnakeBoy or MicroJif will be along shortly, but my understanding is that Top Venting blank firing RIFs are allowable under the recognised defences to the VCRA and Front venting RIF's eg PAKs are prohibited and covered by Section 1 licenses. Happy to be corrected.
In a nut shell forward venting blank fire pistols have a small M8 thread cut in the end of the barrel. This thread is for the fitting of an adaptor which will fire flares etc so technically even though made of magnesium instead of steel the barrels are able to discharge a round as such & were reclassified as firearms back in 2001. Top venting pistols are only permissible if the slide is painted in just about any colour but black (blue, green, orange, pink etc). Spray one of those black and you have modified an imitation firearm under the Violent Crime Reduction bill!
In the US it's just a gas gun and is not considered a firearm. The CCP is manufactured by Umarex in Arnsberg, not Walther, Ulm. Walther, the real Walther, does not make a stainless steel pistol.
Since when has a blank fire pak weapon been under section 1 of UK gun law as it is for rifled long barreled weapons ie rifles.
Blank weapons are unlicenced so long as they are in "Post Office Friendly" colours or in natural black if you can provide a defence agaist the VCR act. or so I'm lead to believe.
The gun I was referring to was front vented and allows you to fire flares and rubber self defence ammo, and in UK law is considered readily convertible and therefore falls under the section 1 firearm legislation.
UK permissable blank fire guns are different and need to be top vented amongst other things, you can own these if you are over 18 but they still have restrictions on use etc.
My point in my exchange was that what in some countries is considered a firearm isn't in others.
Ok I stand corrected except I will argue the section I think it's section 5 not 1 as these are hand guns not rifles so are classed as prohibited weapons.
Here is mine. Not a Walther, but a Manurhin in 7.65mm. I have the original brown grips as well. This has been slightly modified from factory Side lettering has been neutered, barrel crown angle adjusted, front strap stippled, and the action/trigger smoothed and lightened. Finished with Birdsong Black T.
No, we did all the work and metal prep for coating. The slide was the only thing milled that had lettering. It was in tough shape prior to that. I'll take a look at the barrel. I'm pretty sure the serial numbers and codes for Manurhin don't correspond to Walther though, or do they? I'll dig out the original cardboard box, as it might have info as well.
No, we did all the work and metal prep for coating. The slide was the only thing milled that had lettering. It was in tough shape prior to that. I'll take a look at the barrel. I'm pretty sure the serial numbers and codes for Manurhin don't correspond to Walther though, or do they? I'll dig out the original cardboard box, as it might have info as well.
All PP series pistols until 1986 were manufactured at Manurhin and trucked across the border to Ulm for final assembly and proofing. Serial numbers between Manurhin and Walther are mixed. From the serial number of your example it was manufactured in the early to mid '60's.
They would not have placed the date code anywhere other than the barrel hood if there was one, but you can check.
No, we did all the work and metal prep for coating. The slide was the only thing milled that had lettering. It was in tough shape prior to that. I'll take a look at the barrel. I'm pretty sure the serial numbers and codes for Manurhin don't correspond to Walther though, or do they? I'll dig out the original cardboard box, as it might have info as well.
All PP series pistols until 1986 were manufactured at Manurhin and trucked across the border to Ulm for final assembly and proofing. Serial numbers between Manurhin and Walther are mixed. From the serial number of your example it was manufactured in the early to mid '60's.
They would not have placed the date code anywhere other than the barrel hood if there was one, but you can check.
Your P99 is a second variation noted by the change in trigger. Serial numbering started at 001001 for the P99.
I too have a second variation. My original P99 was a first variation with the original trigger at serial number 001237. It was among the first P99's imported to the US back in '97.
My second P99 was the MI5 Limited Edition purchased from Earl at Earl's Repair Service in 1998. I do not remember if that was a first or second variation. It was kept in a wooden presentation box and didn't see much daylight.
I ran across it on Gunbroker last year and wrote to the seller to give him some history on that particular P99. I believe it sold for $3500.
Your P99 is a second variation noted by the change in trigger. Serial numbering started at 001001 for the P99.
I too have a second variation. My original P99 was a first variation with the original trigger at serial number 001237. It was among the first P99's imported to the US back in '97.
My second P99 was the MI5 Limited Edition purchased from Earl at Earl's Repair Service in 1998. I do not remember if that was a first or second variation. It was kept in a wooden presentation box and didn't see much daylight.
I ran across it on Gunbroker last year and wrote to the seller to give him some history on that particular P99. I believe it sold for $3500.
Actually it is a third variation P99. The first variant was 100% identical in appearance to the PAK. The second generation was identical in shape but with a closed scope rail & yours is the third variant with the flat front trigger guard without the lip or finger rest -{
I will have to get back with you about that after further research of my Walther library.
I have not read anything about a live firearm being compared to the PAK variant.
Well I shoot and collect the ruddy things, not read about them however in fairness to your library, if you have a copy of Walther Eine Deutsche Legende by Manfred Kersten the PAK P99 on page 211 is in fact a first generation firearm so even the ACTUAL weapons experts make mistakes. The V prefix serial number P99 on the cover is a second generation which Brosnan used on Tomorrow Never Dies, The World Is Not Enough and Die Another Day!
Pierce Brosnan's second generation screen weapon....ARCHIVED!
Asp9mmOver the Hills and Far Away.Posts: 7,541MI6 Agent
The First Gen P99 is uber rare. The second Gen is almost as rare. After that, the functionality may have gotten better, but the aesthetics got much worse. Walther invested enormously in the PAK development at the same time as they developed the full bore 9mm, that is why it has the features of the First Gen P99 and due to the costs poured into the R&D and tooling, hasn't changed at all since. Well marginally.
.................................
Asp9mmOver the Hills and Far Away.Posts: 7,541MI6 Agent
Your P99 is a second variation noted by the change in trigger. Serial numbering started at 001001 for the P99.
I too have a second variation. My original P99 was a first variation with the original trigger at serial number 001237. It was among the first P99's imported to the US back in '97.
My second P99 was the MI5 Limited Edition purchased from Earl at Earl's Repair Service in 1998. I do not remember if that was a first or second variation. It was kept in a wooden presentation box and didn't see much daylight.
I ran across it on Gunbroker last year and wrote to the seller to give him some history on that particular P99. I believe it sold for $3500.
Actually it is a third variation P99. The first variant was 100% identical in appearance to the PAK. The second generation was identical in shape but with a closed scope rail & yours is the third variant with the flat front trigger guard without the lip or finger rest -{
I will have to disagree with your categorization for the PAK and V series being a first variation. In the US and German collector world V series pre-production models and PAK models are not included as a consideration of first-second-third-etc., variations.
Furthermore, production serial numbering started with 001001 and that is the first variation.
I did indeed look at and read about the PAK and the V series.
The first live-fire P99's distributed by Walther was the first variation as I have indicated as having owned in a previous post. And the subsequent second variation I commented on with the replacement trigger that I currently own and that of another poster.
As collectors we will have to disagree on this I imagine. You might also want to check with Dieter Marschall and get his opinion. He is a member of the Walther Forums.
This just got better than the religion chat thread
It was either that.....or the priesthood
Asp9mmOver the Hills and Far Away.Posts: 7,541MI6 Agent
I wouldn't believe everything you read on Walther Forums. They still say the P5 Compact designation L102A1 was issued to 14 Intelligence and SAS. In truth, they never even saw these, and 99.9% weren't even issued or used by anyone and remained in stores unused until sold off to other markets back in the early 2000's. The truth is, they were bought by Royal Ordnance to supply the Fleet Air Arm, it never happened due to cut backs around the same time we sold H&K. Dumb move.
Your P99 is a second variation noted by the change in trigger. Serial numbering started at 001001 for the P99.
I too have a second variation. My original P99 was a first variation with the original trigger at serial number 001237. It was among the first P99's imported to the US back in '97.
My second P99 was the MI5 Limited Edition purchased from Earl at Earl's Repair Service in 1998. I do not remember if that was a first or second variation. It was kept in a wooden presentation box and didn't see much daylight.
I ran across it on Gunbroker last year and wrote to the seller to give him some history on that particular P99. I believe it sold for $3500.
Actually it is a third variation P99. The first variant was 100% identical in appearance to the PAK. The second generation was identical in shape but with a closed scope rail & yours is the third variant with the flat front trigger guard without the lip or finger rest -{
I will have to disagree with your categorization for the PAK and V series being a first variation. In the US and German collector world V series pre-production models and PAK models are not included as a consideration of first-second-third-etc., variations.
Furthermore, production serial numbering started with 001001 and that is the first variation.
I did indeed look at and read about the PAK and the V series.
The first live-fire P99's distributed by Walther was the first variation as I have indicated as having owned in a previous post. And the subsequent second variation I commented on with the replacement trigger that I currently own and that of another poster.
As collectors we will have to disagree on this I imagine. You might also want to check with Dieter Marschall and get his opinion. He is a member of the Walther Forums.
With respect...ARE YOU THICK!
If you have the book in question in your library & you have located the image in question you will see a first generation P99 illustrated by mistake as a PAK...this is fact. Compare it to any PAK images on the net & you'll see the difference. Look at the muzzle, the protruding or recessed return spring pin under the barrel, the rear sight element. The list is endless! The gun on the cover is a second generation. The version with the flat front trigger guard is the third variation. This has nothing to do with the trigger, it is the trigger guard itself which changed & there is a documented reason for this too! This is documented fact. Even Walther/Umarex themselves accidentally illustrated a first generation P99 in their own sales brochure for their HMSIS range....I've gotta go and lie down as you are giving me more of a headache than usual!
I wouldn't believe everything you read on Walther Forums. They still say the P5 Compact designation L102A1 was issued to 14 Intelligence and SAS. In truth, they never even saw these, and 99.9% weren't even issued or used by anyone and remained in stores unused until sold off to other markets back in the early 2000's. The truth is, they were bought by Royal Ordnance to supply the Fleet Air Arm, it never happened due to cut backs around the same time we sold H&K. Dumb move.
Comments
www.justgiving.com/inMemoryOfLewisCollins
www.helpforheroes.org.uk
In a nut shell forward venting blank fire pistols have a small M8 thread cut in the end of the barrel. This thread is for the fitting of an adaptor which will fire flares etc so technically even though made of magnesium instead of steel the barrels are able to discharge a round as such & were reclassified as firearms back in 2001. Top venting pistols are only permissible if the slide is painted in just about any colour but black (blue, green, orange, pink etc). Spray one of those black and you have modified an imitation firearm under the Violent Crime Reduction bill!
The gun I was referring to was front vented and allows you to fire flares and rubber self defence ammo, and in UK law is considered readily convertible and therefore falls under the section 1 firearm legislation.
UK permissable blank fire guns are different and need to be top vented amongst other things, you can own these if you are over 18 but they still have restrictions on use etc.
My point in my exchange was that what in some countries is considered a firearm isn't in others.
So there you go 007JB67, I would call Donk "something of an expert in this field" :v so would take his muse as definitive {[]
www.justgiving.com/inMemoryOfLewisCollins
www.helpforheroes.org.uk
anyone know how to find a date code for Maurhin?
Seems that Birdsong took care of that for you before he refinished it.
All PP series pistols until 1986 were manufactured at Manurhin and trucked across the border to Ulm for final assembly and proofing. Serial numbers between Manurhin and Walther are mixed. From the serial number of your example it was manufactured in the early to mid '60's.
They would not have placed the date code anywhere other than the barrel hood if there was one, but you can check.
I love pictures like this that show a few different props. Great work! -{
@OmegaBondWatches
***Vegas Bond is now OMEGA BOND WATCHES***
I too have a second variation. My original P99 was a first variation with the original trigger at serial number 001237. It was among the first P99's imported to the US back in '97.
My second P99 was the MI5 Limited Edition purchased from Earl at Earl's Repair Service in 1998. I do not remember if that was a first or second variation. It was kept in a wooden presentation box and didn't see much daylight.
I ran across it on Gunbroker last year and wrote to the seller to give him some history on that particular P99. I believe it sold for $3500.
Actually it is a third variation P99. The first variant was 100% identical in appearance to the PAK. The second generation was identical in shape but with a closed scope rail & yours is the third variant with the flat front trigger guard without the lip or finger rest -{
I have not read anything about a live firearm being compared to the PAK variant.
Well I shoot and collect the ruddy things, not read about them however in fairness to your library, if you have a copy of Walther Eine Deutsche Legende by Manfred Kersten the PAK P99 on page 211 is in fact a first generation firearm so even the ACTUAL weapons experts make mistakes. The V prefix serial number P99 on the cover is a second generation which Brosnan used on Tomorrow Never Dies, The World Is Not Enough and Die Another Day!
Pierce Brosnan's second generation screen weapon....ARCHIVED!
I too shoot and collect Walther's firearms. I'm not an armchair expert.
AJB is full of armchair experts and Asp9mm is the highpriest of them
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
And are you comfortable in yours ? :v
I don't need chairs for my arms, I'm not anywhere near as fat as you. But who is? Fatty
I will have to disagree with your categorization for the PAK and V series being a first variation. In the US and German collector world V series pre-production models and PAK models are not included as a consideration of first-second-third-etc., variations.
Furthermore, production serial numbering started with 001001 and that is the first variation.
I did indeed look at and read about the PAK and the V series.
The first live-fire P99's distributed by Walther was the first variation as I have indicated as having owned in a previous post. And the subsequent second variation I commented on with the replacement trigger that I currently own and that of another poster.
As collectors we will have to disagree on this I imagine. You might also want to check with Dieter Marschall and get his opinion. He is a member of the Walther Forums.
With respect...ARE YOU THICK!
If you have the book in question in your library & you have located the image in question you will see a first generation P99 illustrated by mistake as a PAK...this is fact. Compare it to any PAK images on the net & you'll see the difference. Look at the muzzle, the protruding or recessed return spring pin under the barrel, the rear sight element. The list is endless! The gun on the cover is a second generation. The version with the flat front trigger guard is the third variation. This has nothing to do with the trigger, it is the trigger guard itself which changed & there is a documented reason for this too! This is documented fact. Even Walther/Umarex themselves accidentally illustrated a first generation P99 in their own sales brochure for their HMSIS range....I've gotta go and lie down as you are giving me more of a headache than usual!