Timothy Dalton in an extended James Bond role
Wadsy
Auckland, New ZealandPosts: 412MI6 Agent
Good Day everyone. I have lately been reading around casting choices of James Bond as per each and every Bond film at the time, the 'ifs', the advantages and disadvantages. One thing that has been on my mind however, is casting choices throughout the 80's.
It was quite worthy of mentioning that it was only when the announcement of For Your Eyes Only came about, that Roger Moore had expressed a desire to stop playing James Bond as he was well into his fifties at the time. Timothy Dalton was their first choice as a potential replacement, with a few others being considered as well - such as Lewis Collins and Michael Billington. What I do know is this... Timothy Dalton did NOT like the way the Bond films were heading - probably referring to the camp, Bond into space, unrealistic gadgets and more from the previous film, and possibly even before Moonraker. Because Dalton declined, they pretty much had no choice but to stick with Roger Moore for a fifth performance to avoid any huge risks I guess.
In 1982, when Octopussy was on the way to being directed, Moore had again expressed a strong desire to depart the role, and hand it over to someone else. This time, James Brolin as well as Timothy Dalton had been placed as the main candidates. You know, if the abomination known as Never Say Never Again had never been released (thank you very much Kevin McClory), I am 90% certain Moore would not have returned, and the role would have been handed over to Dalton. Brolin may have been up there, but he was certainly not Timothy. Had Dalton replaced Moore with Octopussy, the film (and the next entry) would have been so different, I just cant help but imagine. This would have mean't that all Bond films of the 80's were serious, given that Eyes Only was already down-to-earth.
Having TD as James Bond for a total of four films, you have to wonder, how different would Octopussy and A View To A Kill be with a 37 year old actor taking over the role in '83? I always knew that AVTAK would probably be the best film in the entire series for me if they had stuck with the same plot, but changed some of the minor details. Looking at what we already have with Dalton with The Living Daylights and Licence To Kill, how would those films have impacted on viewers, considering that Dalton would already be a well-established Bond. Would the 6 year hiatus have been as severe as it was, or even there? Would Dalton have done 'The Property Of A Lady' in '91 and quit there with five films? I know this topic has been done to death, but I still think that he got the worst deal of all the actors.
It was quite worthy of mentioning that it was only when the announcement of For Your Eyes Only came about, that Roger Moore had expressed a desire to stop playing James Bond as he was well into his fifties at the time. Timothy Dalton was their first choice as a potential replacement, with a few others being considered as well - such as Lewis Collins and Michael Billington. What I do know is this... Timothy Dalton did NOT like the way the Bond films were heading - probably referring to the camp, Bond into space, unrealistic gadgets and more from the previous film, and possibly even before Moonraker. Because Dalton declined, they pretty much had no choice but to stick with Roger Moore for a fifth performance to avoid any huge risks I guess.
In 1982, when Octopussy was on the way to being directed, Moore had again expressed a strong desire to depart the role, and hand it over to someone else. This time, James Brolin as well as Timothy Dalton had been placed as the main candidates. You know, if the abomination known as Never Say Never Again had never been released (thank you very much Kevin McClory), I am 90% certain Moore would not have returned, and the role would have been handed over to Dalton. Brolin may have been up there, but he was certainly not Timothy. Had Dalton replaced Moore with Octopussy, the film (and the next entry) would have been so different, I just cant help but imagine. This would have mean't that all Bond films of the 80's were serious, given that Eyes Only was already down-to-earth.
Having TD as James Bond for a total of four films, you have to wonder, how different would Octopussy and A View To A Kill be with a 37 year old actor taking over the role in '83? I always knew that AVTAK would probably be the best film in the entire series for me if they had stuck with the same plot, but changed some of the minor details. Looking at what we already have with Dalton with The Living Daylights and Licence To Kill, how would those films have impacted on viewers, considering that Dalton would already be a well-established Bond. Would the 6 year hiatus have been as severe as it was, or even there? Would Dalton have done 'The Property Of A Lady' in '91 and quit there with five films? I know this topic has been done to death, but I still think that he got the worst deal of all the actors.
1. FYEO 2. OHMSS 3. LTK 4. FRWL 5. TLD 6. TSWLM 7. AVTAK 8. GF 9. MR 10. TB 11. OP 12. SF 13. DN 14. SP 15. LALD 16. GE 17. CR 18. YOLT 19. TWINE 20. TMWTGG 21. NTTD 22. TND 23. QOS 24. NSNA 25. DAD 26. DAF 27. CR '67
1. Dalton 2. Moore 3. Connery 4. Lazenby 5. Craig 6. Brosnan
1. Dalton 2. Moore 3. Connery 4. Lazenby 5. Craig 6. Brosnan
Comments
1. NEVER SAY NEVER AGAIN is not an abomination, as much as the fans would like to dismiss it as dross because it's outside the official series. The film did respectable business, was well received by the critics, and has many good things to recommend it, including a charming and unusually self-deprecating Connery and two of the best villains (Brandauer, Carrera) in any Bond movie, official or not.
2. "Thank you very much Kevin McClory" should really be "Thank you very much Ian Fleming." If Fleming had behaved in an ethical manner and given credit where it was due (to both McClory and Jack Whittingham), the THUNDERBALL court case would have never happened. Instead he let his arrogance get the better of him. Ultimately NSNA exists because of him.
3. I love OCTOPUSSY; it's one of my favorite Bond films. Dalton should have started with A VIEW TO A KILL.
Everything I said is in my opinion, not merely stating everyone's. Dalton had a good reason to start with A View To A Kill because looking back at casting, there was absolutely no reason for Roger Moore to continue playing James Bond. No other movie, an actor rejecting it because of the direction the series was heading or conflicts with another movie/series. Roger Moore had expressed a desire to retire from playing 007 at the announcement of both For Your Eyes Only and Octopussy, but was asked to keep playing as Dalton wasn't up with the series after Moonraker's style, and then with the latter, there was an unofficial Bond and they thought Moore would be best up against Connery. Roger Moore was signed on to do three movies, and from Moonraker his contract was renewed on a film to film basis.
With A View To A Kill, it could just be that they didn't want to go through the hassle of what they did with the previous two EON produced films. It's a shame, because while I already love A View To A Kill, it would have been better as Timothy Dalton's debut and seeing him up against Walken would have been excellent.
1. Dalton 2. Moore 3. Connery 4. Lazenby 5. Craig 6. Brosnan
Dalton would have made more sense taking over with FYEO. The film has that 70s/early 80s sense that Dalton fit, with his long face and blown-dray disco hair. Perhaps had he taken over then, the dreck that is OP and AVTAK would never have been made, and we could have just settled for GF doing that formula.
Face as Bond, up against Sir Sean in NSNA.
unfortunately we would lose the Moore/McNee (Templar/Steed) teamup, that wouldn't have made so much sense with Dalton playing Bond
I think all three of those latter Moore movies would have been better if they just resisted to urge to insert doubletakes and joke musical cues and firetruck chases, Moore was already changing his take on the character, but the stories were going in a direction that would have suited Dalton
IMO it's just another glorification of Dalton and a "what if he'd done more than 2" continuation of other threads.
If I recall correctly from the time, it was a big gamble - Moore saying that he'll quit and then getting shat over with money from Cubby to stay. In that context, I see the castings of Billington, Collins and Dalton - just to keep prices reasonable.
Remember, if EON really would have really wanted another actor, they could have done that from FYEO on - but they didn't.
Their Nr. 1 choice was Moore until he decided that his time had come.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
The name is HIGGINS! X-(
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
1. Dalton 2. Moore 3. Connery 4. Lazenby 5. Craig 6. Brosnan
If Dalton did a few more films in the style of TLD then I'd be happy, any more of the LTK dog's-breakfasts and the 80s Bonds would've been far worse.
I am also unsure that with minor tweaks to AVTAK that it would've been received better. Most people point out Moore's age - but as much as I adore AVTAK - there's also something else not quite "bang-on" with the film that I can never put my finger on. Perhaps that it lacks a level of fun (something that TLD does well) similar to LTK...
"Better make that two."
Do you have anything to back this up or is that pure speculation?
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
particular the chase scene across the frozen lake and the cello case ride across the border
whereas License to Kill could never have been done by Moore
what other elements of the last three Moore films would have to be changed to suit Dalton's style? A View To A Kill was already getting pretty bloody, we know Moore himself had issues with all the casual slaughter
I think of James Dean playing an older version of his character, Jet Rink in Giant, which makes me wonder how he would have handled age-appropriate roles had he lived older. Similarly though, I think Lazenby did a great job for a guy with no leading man, let alone feature film experience, who as a young guy, beautifully executed an older character beyond his own age and maturity level; in comparison, Dalton could have given it a good run to take on Bond at an earlier age.
The other consideration is how he would've done in the US market. Moore did continue the escapist, almost caricature British element that the US audiences adored. He carried the US market until OP - TLD and LTK crashed and burned there.
One must also consider how gritty, non-campy films would've competed with the big blockbuster B type movies released in the late 70s too.
"Better make that two."
Wouldn't Michelle Pheiffer had been a fantastic Kara Milovy? At the time she had just finished Ladyhawk. That movie bombed and Scarface was two years earlier. She wasn't a superstar yet. She's one of the most beautiful women in the world and a damn fine actress.
And I think Elle MacPherson could easily have played the girl in the boat in the PTS:
Yes, Moore should've stepped away after FYEO, but TPTB at Eon couldn't pass up the chance to pit their Bond against a returning Connery Bond. That said, I like Octopussy. Moore is in his mid 50s yes, but the film has him in a series of nonstop action scenes and Moore is so energized throughout the whole affair, that you don't mind that joining "Jolly Roger" for this adventure. OP should've been his last, but Moore said he had such a good time doing it, that he felt he had one more in him.
Y'know , it could've been interesting if Streep was Amasova (remember she was unknown in '76) and Broccoli prolly would've accepted her fee unlike the actress who wanted too much money.
of the literary Bond to screen. Admittedly not to everyone's taste, after all Sir Roger was a
hard act to follow.
Hopefully you'll have an enjoyable afternoon.
I tried to read casino royal but my reading of English is not good enough so I only read some of it. I liked all the James Bond actors I have seen so far and hope I will like Timothy Dalton also.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
What else would Moore have done for that kind of money? He was Bond and Bond was him, there were no other options.
Roger Moore 1927-2017