Reaction To Terrorist Attacks in UK
Barbel
ScotlandPosts: 38,077Chief of Staff
This thread is in response to requests in the Rant Box https://www.ajb007.co.uk/topic/38423/the-rant-box/page/179/ for one dedicated to discussing the recent awful attacks on UK soil.
Please continue discussing these events here rather than in the Rant Box or Random Chat, and please don't allow arguments to become personal. You all know we won't hesitate to close the thread if that happens.
Please continue discussing these events here rather than in the Rant Box or Random Chat, and please don't allow arguments to become personal. You all know we won't hesitate to close the thread if that happens.
Comments
Remember the Simpsons episode with the living billboards : "just don't look"
Anyway , they died when no one payed attention to them and if those bandits get less exposure on TV I'll bet they'll be bummed.
The more TV exposure , the more we are scared of them.
"Ok, maybe opening a can of worms - but
Let's take people on the watch list say from Afghanistan, Egypt or Tunisia or even Saudi Arabia.
Even if you could deport them to their countries, wouldn't it be better to have them in a UK prison or German prison etc instead of deporting them with the chance that they'd 'come back' after some time?"
Don't let tax payers pay for prison time , have these people permanently banned from air travel and void their passports....everytime they try to return they get "return to sender" at airports.
On a first glance, I'd agree with you.
On a second thought - guess what would happen: The "main stream media" bashers such as Mr. Trump and other populists (you know the usual suspects) will accuse the press of holding back facts and speculate for their motives
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
..and let them commit their attacks against westerners and their weak governments then in their home countries?
Which means that moderate mid-east systems like Tunesia would fall and not for the better?
Terrorism can't be dealt with with national methods, the world is too globalised that we can outsource problems to where they have started.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
Not if the deliberate withholding of these criminal's names was an agreed policy.
Won't happen - unfortunately. In their eyes, everything media is corrupt and evil and they are taking every little chance to score and have their agenda reafirmed.
Look at Trump. He goes even so low to attack a major who's dealing with a severe terror attack!
So far about agreements....
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
Also with the keyboard warriors on the social media and stuff!
And then we have the CNNs (don't get me wrong - I appreciate and like CNN though not flawed) and Al Jazzeeras would report anyhow and will cash in with the ratings and clicks and the UK media would end up getting nothing while it would be reported anyhow.
Let's face it - they report because many people want to see it - no matter if we like it or not. And that's their job at the end of the day.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
You said
which I say would not be applicable if it was policy, ie Trump & co would have no grounds for accusing the press of holding back facts.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
Yes and Mr. Trump is well known to defend anything which has been done by the "political establishment". And even if he would agree (he would not!) when such a policy is in the making - we all know how often he substancially changes his mind in short time.
I understand what you mean my friend but in our times, that would end terrible!
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
That was the case, when media where the big tv stations and newspapers.
And if I remember correctly, such an agreement worked until 2 decades ago.
That all has changed because the other players don't obey to to those agreements anymore.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
I do believe that having the murderers' faces and names on the front page of national newspapers and in the TV headlines does more good for their "cause" than is necessary. Some feeble-minded idiots would enjoy such attention and seek to emulate them, and this is avoidable (at least to an extent).
At the end of the day, we see these faces on front page because the buyers want to see them - at least I did not hear of an important boycott from "us" because the MSM are doing so.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
In my opinion, our democracies are under attack.
And the media are the main targets - from Russia, from terrorists, our own governments (eg Trump) and from the populists.
And we are stupid enough to echo the stuff about "corrupt" "elitist" etc. media. We destroy our own freedom when we weaken the main press (even they make lots of mistakes). When the big media fall, what do we have to inform and educate ourselves?
The democracy attackers know this well and this is why Putin and Erdogan firstly targeted and streamlined the press and the rest (loss of civil right elimination of opposition etc.) came later. Trump is just following that path but has more powerful counterplayers - yet!
It all happened before and we are too ignorant/stupid/uneducated/uninformed to see the warning lights.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
I would agree it's not ideal, but then there is no ideal solution - just deport them and let their respective governments/regimes deal with them.
Deportation is not an answer, what about terrorists such as in the Manchester attack who was a British national? And why would we want to simply transfer the problem? A starting point should be those who have travelled to likes of Syria, they don't go there to sit around a shisha pipe talking about terrorism and the Western infidels! They participate in rape, murder, torture etc then come home to live next door to you and await instructions or prompts. These guys should be arrested at the airports or ports, their passports seized and taken immediately to a military run secure unit. And before the bleeding hearts start droning on about guantanamo bay or human rights, I'm not suggesting any form of torture, the results of which are notoriously unreliable. We know who these people are, but our legal system is impotent to deal with them.
Working through the rest of the 3000 strong list should become a priority, where such compelling intelligence exists a panel of 5 specialist judges can decide if a lethal force warrant is justified. This will not cause a mass joining of ISIS or a religious war as everyone is being protected including Muslims who live peacefully and abide the law, Bombs are not selective, they kill all in their path.
Further afield there should be an international team, who work together specifically to deal with the global terrorist threat, sharing intelligence and made up by multinationals possibly from nato members? .
I know terrorism feeds on and is completely reliable on media attention just like Kelly Brook is. But limits går media explosives is very difficult for practical and legal reasons. Keeping bombings secret was very difficult in WWII and completely impossible today. Keeping the identity of the terrorists hidden is not impossible, but very difficult and risky. What if someone in the muslim minority dies of an heart attack that day or even is one of the victims? Chances are the person and his family will be blamed for the attack in social media. That's just one of the reasons it can't be done. Ideally the press should show more restraint after terror attacks, but that's very difficult for a number of reasons.
I think the best we can hope for is that the press focus on the victims and not the terrorists after the verdict is decided by the courts, simply mentioning the terrorists and their names when strictly necessary.
My real friends here on AJN007 told me Chriscoop has hired a hitman (he sees it as poetic justice) to make me "disappear". I immediately hired my own and sent him after Chriscoop, because that justice would be poetic on a Shakespearean level.
Watch this space!
I mean executions, but it's academic as that sort of programme would never be implemented unfortunately. So we should discuss what actually does and can happen. The police delivered a spectacular response time to the London Bridge attack, though criticism has been levied by an ex officer who said air support wasn't forth coming as the nearest helicopter was in Oxfordshire. I don't see this as a problem as special forces had a helicopter up there within minutes. I think more use of military hardware and resources should be used in the fight back against terrorism. I also think the security services should be freed of red tape and fear of retribution if they make mistakes in tackling jihadists.
I'm reading and hearing a lot of " you can't do that or that won't work" but not a lot of what we should do.
Youve no chance 24! Im not sending a hitman, Im coming myself, and I'll bring your hitman with me.... Well a piece of him anyway. :v
I won't tell the Mods on AJN007 if you don't...
I'll just be following one of these to side of fjord thats in the shade
And looking for a tall man in a tight bunad
So basically you want Guantanamo in the UK?
It sounds tempting but GWB and Obama may tell you that their experiences with that path have not been good.
Imo the fact that Guantanamo existed, fuelled the conflict and brought many additional fighters for ISIS.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!