I think it is very strange that not much has been said against the spanish police violence. Yes this vote was illegal as the Spanish goverment says, but is that to then justify violence against ordinary people who took part in the vote? I fear that peoples are too obsessed with personality of politicians and trying to score points which are in many times not even relevent and miss things which they should be really paying attention to. Donald Trump bla bla while right under the nose violence is being used against people who are voting! I think every one in europe should be uneasy about this violence, if you are not careful it will come to you.
I am only making my point, i am not for or against Trump. All i keep in my mind is that he was elected in a free vote. I think because peoples in the west are so used to this they cannot realise what it is like to not have this right. This is good but what happens in Spain now must be a warning to us all that this freedom can be taken away more quickly than you can ever imagine if you do nothing to defend it.
You make a valid point, today after Mrs mays speech more attention is being given to her coughing, the joker who invaded the stage and a letter falling off the back board than to any policy plans or announcements. I believe it's known as dumbing down, news stories for the lowest common denominators
People queuing to vote, dragged by the hair, beaten and kicked off the street. ..... Hard
to believe that this would happen in a so called modern democracy. Like a Mafia movie,
I'm guessing the Spanish government wanted to send a message.
I'm also disappointed in the Spanish King, who seemed to happily read a government
prepared statement.
I think this will sadly lead to a new terrorist era in Spain, and so much for the protection
of the EU, who have remained very silent on the subject. Saying it's an internal problem.
"I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
I hope and actually believe the situation in Spain won't end in terrorism, but the government's action can lead to more violence on the streets. Very unwise.
There is a saying 'the silence is deafening' and I think this applies well to the EU and other countries. Of course we know that the vote was not legal and was not binding but to stand by and say nothing when citizens of a european country are attacked in this way? I may have missed some thing but i don't think the voters were rioting and causing violence and this made the police act to stop them? were they not only going out to vote?
For a goverment to order the attack of its peoples for voting in something they do not like brings back memories for me that i thought i would never see in europe.
If anything the vicious tactics of the Spanish authorities will only strengthen the resolve of the Catalonians, they should just have let the voters peacefully make their votes and rubbished the result, political sweeping under the carpet. Their aggressive stance has brought a spotlight onto the whole thing and has shown that even here in super civilised wealthy Europe with all our regulations and procedures and democracy we are not too far away from being beaten and shot at by the authorities for exercising civil liberties.
It is worrying what happened in Spain on Sunday, but we must keep in mind that the country is the youngest democracy in western Europe. The current democratic Constitution only a decade or so older than democracy in eastern Europe.
It is worrying what happened in Spain on Sunday, but we must keep in mind that the country is the youngest democracy in western Europe. The current democratic Constitution only a decade or so older than democracy in eastern Europe.
Yes but should we look for excuses for this behaviour? As i can see there can never be reasons for actions like this by any goverment against its peoples when they are not acting violently.There were many options for the spanish goverment but they chose the violent one.
What the Spanish police did on Sunday is inexcusable. My post was a reply to Chriscoop's post where he mentioned Europe. I don't think anything like this can happen in the UK, France, Belgium or any of the old democracies. Spain has revealed itself as an imature democracy. Not an excuse, but perhaps an explaination?
Please, i did not mean to sound harsh in any way and was not attacking you. I just think that there can be no excusesor explnation for this behaviour by the spanish goverment. I also think that it can happen anywhere if it is allowed.
There seems to be a plot today, to oust Theresa May as
Conservative leader I don't think it will succeed and
In my opinion, You'd have to be a nut case. To try it in the
Middle of Brexit talks.
"I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
I actually think she's the conservative Gordon Brown. In
That she seems very unlucky, at any staged event she
Just seems to have things fall down, or pull a face for a
Terrible photo.
"I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
Less than half of Catalonia's population voted in the referendum and most of the people who wanted to stay didn't vote. According to a normal poll 58.9% of citizens of the region want to stay in Spain. This makes the Spanish government's actions a week ago even more pointless and stupid.
Agreed the Spanish government looks like a bunch of thugs. They could have used all
The relevant statistics to show how little support there was. After the Illegal vote. In
Several ways they have justified many of the points the independence party were making.
"I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
They should!d give more power to the area, that way they would immediately counter many arguments,
And cause the independence movement to loose much support. An Iron fist, only makes martyrs and
Fuel for the Resentment of the "far away government" who doesn't care.
"I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
To be fair Spain gives more autonomy to regions (especially Catalonia and the Basque areas) than most countries. But Catalonia generates about 20% of the Spanish economy and should be a alowed to keep more of the tax revenues. The referendum should have been treated as a bad poll pro- Spain people didn't participate, in fact less than half of Catalons voted. They should have made the referendum irrelevant, instead they made it a bigger deal, beat up voters and radicalized many.
They should give the area as much control as possible, so when things go wrong they can point out,
It wasn't the government who did it but their own leaders. Then if everything goes well, the government
Can say " look how we listened and trusted you " aren't we the best of friends. Why would you ever want
To Leave.
"I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
.. Catalonia generates about 20% of the Spanish economy and should be a alowed to keep more of the tax revenues...
So does London and the South East, but it's a slippery slope to ask for more of the tax revenues for the highest contributing region...
Devolution is a bitter pill every way you look at it, it's just too political, here in the UK inept politicians have made great names for themselves out of such causes.. Catalonia is different, I'm lead to believe the Spanish government is far from fair with its dealings.
I don't think the Catalonian authorities are fair, either. They consider the result of the referendum "binding", ignoring the fact that most Catalans don't want independence.
Comments
You make a valid point, today after Mrs mays speech more attention is being given to her coughing, the joker who invaded the stage and a letter falling off the back board than to any policy plans or announcements. I believe it's known as dumbing down, news stories for the lowest common denominators
to believe that this would happen in a so called modern democracy. Like a Mafia movie,
I'm guessing the Spanish government wanted to send a message.
I'm also disappointed in the Spanish King, who seemed to happily read a government
prepared statement.
I think this will sadly lead to a new terrorist era in Spain, and so much for the protection
of the EU, who have remained very silent on the subject. Saying it's an internal problem.
For a goverment to order the attack of its peoples for voting in something they do not like brings back memories for me that i thought i would never see in europe.
Yes but should we look for excuses for this behaviour? As i can see there can never be reasons for actions like this by any goverment against its peoples when they are not acting violently.There were many options for the spanish goverment but they chose the violent one.
A wise choice, I think.
Conservative leader
In my opinion, You'd have to be a nut case. To try it in the
Middle of Brexit talks.
That she seems very unlucky, at any staged event she
Just seems to have things fall down, or pull a face for a
Terrible photo.
The relevant statistics to show how little support there was. After the Illegal vote. In
Several ways they have justified many of the points the independence party were making.
The independence movement.
And cause the independence movement to loose much support. An Iron fist, only makes martyrs and
Fuel for the Resentment of the "far away government" who doesn't care.
It wasn't the government who did it but their own leaders. Then if everything goes well, the government
Can say " look how we listened and trusted you " aren't we the best of friends. Why would you ever want
To Leave.
So does London and the South East, but it's a slippery slope to ask for more of the tax revenues for the highest contributing region...