that way you don’t look like a doofus every 6 months and throw marketing money out the window.
The TV campaign hadn't started yet and they tapped the brakes before that money was spent.
Eon changing the date "every six months" (so, twice) in the face of COVID makes them the most restrained of the crowd; I'm not gonna google it for you, but Tenet kept kicking the can two weeks down the road. THAT blew up in their faces. Eon recognizing the problem early and moving it six months was optimistic; Tenet flinching every two weeks and trying to force people back into cinemas was irresponsible. I'll take the former.
So in April when nothing is better will they just stream the bloody film? Or will we spend the next 2 years the way we have spent the last 2: waiting every six months for a premier that is perpetually delayed! X-( This is why the years spent waiting for Craig and then chasing flashy directors is so costly. When you fail to control the things you should, you get burned even worse by the things you don’t control.
Just saw the Trailer in the Cinema (TENET) It was truly underwhelming. Grumpy Seydoux (again) Catatonic Waltz (again) 'Where's Bond ' (again) I swear he's even still wearing the same Chinos. Betrayal (again)...give me strength. I am really trying to look forward to a fitting final instalment for Craig but fear that this wont be it.
So 2021 22 ...dont really care. Of course I'll see it and do my very best to like it but really unenthused. They have run out of ideas. Only upside is that Daniel looks great and there are some nice light touches of humour that suit his style.
+1. The absolute worst part about another delay for me is that it delays a new Bond and a new direction for the franchise even further. Perhaps it will be a worse direction than the current one, but the Craig tenure has felt stale since 2015 and none of this is helping.
I agree with you, which is why I was really hoping for a tip top final outing. I still am, I really hope that I'm wrong.
Of that of which we cannot speak we must pass over in silence- Ludwig Wittgenstein.
that way you don’t look like a doofus every 6 months and throw marketing money out the window.
The TV campaign hadn't started yet and they tapped the brakes before that money was spent.
Eon changing the date "every six months" (so, twice) in the face of COVID makes them the most restrained of the crowd; I'm not gonna google it for you, but Tenet kept kicking the can two weeks down the road. THAT blew up in their faces. Eon recognizing the problem early and moving it six months was optimistic; Tenet flinching every two weeks and trying to force people back into cinemas was irresponsible. I'll take the former.
But my main point still stands: how long they wanna keep doing that? Setting a release date, ramping up the marketing campaign to full swing, release new material and then call it all off ~1.5 months prior.
I‘ve made the argument in late February and now it applies just as much: Who knows where the world will be in..., setting new release dates is purely Russian roulette.
There will be (or might even is already) a point reached, when they got to commit to a date with all consequences or delay it indefinitely.
I‘m not even only saying that for selfish reasons but I‘m genuinely curious as to how the cinema industry will survive this?
TENET was the only big release after lockdown (there weren’t many before) & it tanked like you mentioned.
that way you don’t look like a doofus every 6 months and throw marketing money out the window.
The TV campaign hadn't started yet and they tapped the brakes before that money was spent.
Eon changing the date "every six months" (so, twice) in the face of COVID makes them the most restrained of the crowd; I'm not gonna google it for you, but Tenet kept kicking the can two weeks down the road. THAT blew up in their faces. Eon recognizing the problem early and moving it six months was optimistic; Tenet flinching every two weeks and trying to force people back into cinemas was irresponsible. I'll take the former.
Especially considering every time Tenet made a shift, it got another round of bad press. Bond isn't getting bad press from this — and press is how most general audience people know a film is coming/is out.
If EON is forced to delay NTTD a couple of more timesit would be really bad, but I can't help chuckling a bit to myself imagineing hiw creative they would have to get in rebooting the promo machine yet another time )
Asp9mmOver the Hills and Far Away.Posts: 7,541MI6 Agent
that way you don’t look like a doofus every 6 months and throw marketing money out the window.
The TV campaign hadn't started yet and they tapped the brakes before that money was spent.
Eon changing the date "every six months" (so, twice) in the face of COVID makes them the most restrained of the crowd; I'm not gonna google it for you, but Tenet kept kicking the can two weeks down the road. THAT blew up in their faces. Eon recognizing the problem early and moving it six months was optimistic; Tenet flinching every two weeks and trying to force people back into cinemas was irresponsible. I'll take the former.
But my main point still stands: how long they wanna keep doing that? Setting a release date, ramping up the marketing campaign to full swing, release new material and then call it all off ~1.5 months prior.
I‘ve made the argument in late February and now it applies just as much: Who knows where the world will be in..., setting new release dates is purely Russian roulette.
There will be (or might even is already) a point reached, when they got to commit to a date with all consequences or delay it indefinitely.
I‘m not even only saying that for selfish reasons but I‘m genuinely curious as to how the cinema industry will survive this?
TENET was the only big release after lockdown (there weren’t many before) & it tanked like you mentioned.
The point is, no one cares. This Bond community doesn’t even make up 0.5% of the audience these films get. It’s only us few long term die hard fans that are getting disappointed, and even then, not that many of us considering. There are bigger worries at the moment, our daily lives and routines are gone, people’s jobs are gone or under threat. Who cares about a Bond film right now? Not a great many. I fully expect April to be cancelled too, but they have to book dates just in case it all works out. The backlog of films right now means that these dates will be fought over if not booked. So that’s why they keep on doing this. Cinema slot bookings are public knowledge.
.................................
superadoRegent's Park West (CaliforniaPosts: 2,656MI6 Agent
Yay, it’s back to April again!
"...the purposeful slant of his striding figure looked dangerous, as if he was making quickly for something bad that was happening further down the street." -SMERSH on 007 dossier photo, Ch. 6 FRWL.....
I know many of us are feeling a bit raw with EON and holding enmity toward them because of their history of long delays between films is understandable and to a point well deserved (especially with NTTD). However, EON/MGM/etc are not doing anything different than the rest of the industry when it comes to these big tentpole films (Mulan and Tenet being the exceptions) relative to the pandemic. IMO, I think there are folks who are so anxious to see NTTD that they would just like to see them put it out VOD but I also think there are some folks around here who want to see it out one way or another because they just want the Craig era to come to an end, not because they want to see NTTD. To each his own, but I just find it an interesting dynamic.
The Bond franchise, for me, is like the Prodigal Son. It can be away for an indefinite amount of time, but I will always welcome it if and when it comes back.
The Bond franchise, for me, is like the Prodigal Son. It can be away for an indefinite amount of time, but I will always welcome it if and when it comes back.
To extend your biblical metaphor, we are waiting for it to stop eating pig food and start making its way home!!!
“The scent and smoke and sweat of a casino are nauseating at three in the morning. "
-Casino Royale, Ian Fleming
According to BBC News today, Cineworld in the UK are threatening to shut down and directly blaming the non-release of NTTD for damaging their profits. https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-54407213
I saw this too and it’s exactly why I am angry with the decision. Not because “it’s just a movie” (my dad laughed when I said I was annoyed as he said he could not think of anything less relevant) but because I knew the cinemas were relying on this. Fair enough maybe the burden of getting people back to cinemas should not be a burden resting solely on NTTD but it was quite obvious without some kind of injection the cinemas were going to go bust and close. I was fearful that by the time they want to release it there would not even be a cinema to show it. A brave decision would have been to keep the date and that would have snowballed and led to people going back to the cinema and future releases. There is no guarantee that things will be any better and in fact I see people itching to go out not stay indoors anymore. People have lockdown fatigue. BTW ironically China is back to pre pandemic levels in terms of its economy and doing big movie ticket sales with The Eight Hundred. Sorry rant over....partly.
I saw this too and it’s exactly why I am angry with the decision. Not because “it’s just a movie” (my dad laughed when I said I was annoyed as he said he could not think of anything less relevant) but because I knew the cinemas were relying on this. Fair enough maybe the burden of getting people back to cinemas should not be a burden resting solely on NTTD but it was quite obvious without some kind of injection the cinemas were going to go bust and close. I was fearful that by the time they want to release it there would not even be a cinema to show it. A brave decision would have been to keep the date and that would have snowballed and led to people going back to the cinema and future releases. There is no guarantee that things will be any better and in fact I see people itching to go out not stay indoors anymore. People have lockdown fatigue. BTW ironically China is back to pre pandemic levels in terms of its economy and doing big movie ticket sales with The Eight Hundred. Sorry rant over....partly.
China can do that because they took this seriously and did not have people ignoring the virus/flaunting safety protocols.
I saw this too and it’s exactly why I am angry with the decision. Not because “it’s just a movie” (my dad laughed when I said I was annoyed as he said he could not think of anything less relevant) but because I knew the cinemas were relying on this. Fair enough maybe the burden of getting people back to cinemas should not be a burden resting solely on NTTD but it was quite obvious without some kind of injection the cinemas were going to go bust and close. I was fearful that by the time they want to release it there would not even be a cinema to show it. A brave decision would have been to keep the date and that would have snowballed and led to people going back to the cinema and future releases. There is no guarantee that things will be any better and in fact I see people itching to go out not stay indoors anymore. People have lockdown fatigue. BTW ironically China is back to pre pandemic levels in terms of its economy and doing big movie ticket sales with The Eight Hundred. Sorry rant over....partly.
China can do that because they took this seriously and did not have people ignoring the virus/flaunting safety protocols.
Not entirely true. At first they tried to surpress the reports of the pandemic and not the pandemic itself. Some of the dctors who reported Covid-19 first were told to shut up or go to jail. Later the Chinese govermnemt understood how serious the situation was and pit in place restrictions, many of them would be much harder to implement in a demcracy with human rights.
I hope the next Bond actor is secretly cast and much of the script done by the time of NTTD's released.
EON has never been that proactive. I've always wondered why they don't get started on the script of the next film, at least in outline form, while production/post production is going on. That way they'd have a finished script ready within a year for the next film.
I stand by my earlier position that the decision to postpone NTTD is both understandable and welcome, but at the same time my heart goes out to all those folk at Cineworld who are now going to be out of a job because the studios are holding back and the audiences aren't returning. It's sad what's happening to the industry, as to so many other sectors.
As for Bond post-Craig... I'm not sure that anyone in entertainment has properly worked out what kind of new stories we'll *want* to be told during/ after Covid, even in popular/ escapist genres.
Critics and material I don't need. I haven't changed my act in 53 years.
I stand by my earlier position that the decision to postpone NTTD is both understandable and welcome, but at the same time my heart goes out to all those folk at Cineworld who are now going to be out of a job because the studios are holding back and the audiences aren't returning. It's sad what's happening to the industry, as to so many other sectors.
As for Bond post-Craig... I'm not sure that anyone in entertainment has properly worked out what kind of new stories we'll *want* to be told during/ after Covid, even in popular/ escapist genres.
The parent company of Cineworld also owns Regal Cinema in the US. Regal may also temporarily close.
Torn on this. Disappointing, to be sure, but I was seriously considering NOT going to the cinema and waiting for a re-release further down the line / home media release. The other side being, would appreciate the merchandising machine launching for the Christmas season, which I would have deeply gone into. Oh well, time to save up some more money for April...
"Enjoy it while it lasts."
"The very words I live by."
Bond has nothing to do with people being scared to go to the cinema at the moment and they indisputably are - *insert exciting discussion about data bias demonstrated by the Guardian interviewing people at cinemas* . Hardly surprising given 15,000 covid cases were 'discovered down the back of the sofa' over the weekend in the UK and plans were leaked detailing criteria for all leisure industry venues being shut. Criteria many places, London included, are hurtling towards.
I would happily take a bet with Mr Bradshaw, Kermode and others - with winnings to charity - that come Nov 12th we're in lockdown circumstances that render all this rending of garments moot and would have seen NTTD forcibly suspended in the UK at least. (and I would hope to be wrong and a glad loser but I can read the weather as it stands now...)
Tenet did not fill cinemas to the capped capacity. No one seems to be screaming Marvel have killed cinema as they pulled the plug on numerous tentpoll franchise films. EON/Bond held their nerve longer than most which is why they're left in the firing line.
Also, as an employer in the UK, I know why they are doing it, but given furlough and JRS Government support there is a long conversation about reality of necessity for scale redundancies at the moment.
Bond has nothing to do with people being scared to go to the cinema at the moment and they indisputably are - *insert exciting discussion about data bias demonstrated by the Guardian interviewing people at cinemas* . Hardly surprising given 15,000 covid cases were 'discovered down the back of the sofa' over the weekend in the UK and plans were leaked detailing criteria for all leisure industry venues being shut. Criteria many places, London included, are hurtling towards.
I would happily take a bet with Mr Bradshaw, Kermode and others - with winnings to charity - that come Nov 12th we're in lockdown circumstances that render all this rending of garments moot and would have seen NTTD forcibly suspended in the UK at least. (and I would hope to be wrong and a glad loser but I can read the weather as it stands now...)
Tenet did not fill cinemas to the capped capacity. No one seems to be screaming Marvel have killed cinema as they pulled the plug on numerous tentpoll franchise films. EON/Bond held their nerve longer than most which is why they're left in the firing line.
Also, as an employer in the UK, I know why they are doing it, but given furlough and JRS Government support there is a long conversation about reality of necessity for scale redundancies at the moment.
Happy James Bond Day!
The tabs never seem to miss an opportunity to slag Bond. It's just scapegoating. Anyone with half a brain should be able to understand that the issue is the pandemic. It's no coincidence that case numbers are rising with the re-opening of indoor dining, bars, etc. I understand the tragic financial implications of the theaters being shut down or having no product but there are serious health implications. I think in some ways, the movie theater business is falling into a perverted version of "me too" seeing that the restaurants and bars are now doing business so why not us....we are safer. However, with streaming, cable and VOD along with the growing affordability of large screen, hi def TVs it is much easier for people to make a decision not to gamble with their health and go to a theater. Personally, I miss the experience of seeing films in a nice theater and still would much prefer to see NTTD in an IMAX theater but not until it's really safe (and that is also my personal approach to returning to eating in restaurants, etc).
I simply cannot second all if the „right move/ smart decision“-commentaries over on Instagram.
This is getting ridiculous, we‘ve got the 5th release date/ 4th postponement for this movie now.
EON is trying to sit things out, casually postponing the thing ever so close to the actual release.
Member Miles Messervy has said it quite correctly:
They waste to much time in between the movies, this time it was waiting forever and a day for DC to make his mind up and then the debacle with the directors.
Truth is: nobody knows where the world will be going in the forseeable future let alone April next year so it’s bloody optimistic of them to postpone it to then.
Pretty sure the average movie-goer/ casual Bond-fan will loose interest at a certain point.
They should really face the facts and come to terms with alternate ways of distribution!
smfh
Agreed 1000%. They've single handedly killed the reopening cinemas in the US by postponing again. If they keep this up, there simply won't be a cinema experience at all. It would be much smarter imo to do VoD followed by a "cinematic experience" WHEN POSSIBLE.. rather than throwing around stupid dates based on nothing at all but their hopes and dreams. This is all BEYOND ridiculous, and has been since the last delay.
People want and will pay for streaming.. Disney has been killing it with Mulan at $30.
My mind is still torn on this.
On one hand I appreciate they’re in this purely to make money, on the other hand I’m thinking about how much money do they need to make at a time like this?
Not releasing NTTD has all but killed UK (and probably us cinema). That’s a massive industry with 1000s of jobs.
All because MGM want to ensure they make an extra 100 million at the box office? I appreciate 100Million is a lot of money but it’s 100Million in profit to MGM vs 1000s of jobs and an entire industry.
It’s 100Million that, with some creative marketing, could be made up on the other end with VOD, Blue Ray, 4/8k releases, a directors cut, double bills...You name it.
As I say I’ve not made my mind up but I think at the heart of this is just greed.
Would there be calls for an extended Cinema run? Less people in theatres but spread over a period of time?
I really feel for all the people who stand to lose their jobs here.
Not releasing NTTD has all but killed UK (and probably us cinema).
Lets remember it's the pandemic, and not Bond that will have caused this. There is a good chance by release we may be faced with further restrictions, local, or even full lockdowns, in many places. I honestly think they have made the right call.... I don't think at this knife-edge point in time we should be encouraging any form of social gathering. We certainly would not be going, and most people I know feel the same, and are avoiding any possible risk. I'm not prepared to put my, or my families life at risk for a bloody film, no matter how much I want to see it.... and I really want to see it.
Maybe they should have considered VOD... I can't see things being better by April, though I desperately hope they are. If it's just about money I think they would get a great return on a digital distribution, and maybe encourage people to see it at a later date at a theatre. I would certainly pay to see it again in a cinema, when it is safe to do so.
Comments
The TV campaign hadn't started yet and they tapped the brakes before that money was spent.
Eon changing the date "every six months" (so, twice) in the face of COVID makes them the most restrained of the crowd; I'm not gonna google it for you, but Tenet kept kicking the can two weeks down the road. THAT blew up in their faces. Eon recognizing the problem early and moving it six months was optimistic; Tenet flinching every two weeks and trying to force people back into cinemas was irresponsible. I'll take the former.
I agree with you, which is why I was really hoping for a tip top final outing. I still am, I really hope that I'm wrong.
But my main point still stands: how long they wanna keep doing that? Setting a release date, ramping up the marketing campaign to full swing, release new material and then call it all off ~1.5 months prior.
I‘ve made the argument in late February and now it applies just as much: Who knows where the world will be in..., setting new release dates is purely Russian roulette.
There will be (or might even is already) a point reached, when they got to commit to a date with all consequences or delay it indefinitely.
I‘m not even only saying that for selfish reasons but I‘m genuinely curious as to how the cinema industry will survive this?
TENET was the only big release after lockdown (there weren’t many before) & it tanked like you mentioned.
IG: @thebondarchives
Check it out, you won’t be disappointed
Especially considering every time Tenet made a shift, it got another round of bad press. Bond isn't getting bad press from this — and press is how most general audience people know a film is coming/is out.
The point is, no one cares. This Bond community doesn’t even make up 0.5% of the audience these films get. It’s only us few long term die hard fans that are getting disappointed, and even then, not that many of us considering. There are bigger worries at the moment, our daily lives and routines are gone, people’s jobs are gone or under threat. Who cares about a Bond film right now? Not a great many. I fully expect April to be cancelled too, but they have to book dates just in case it all works out. The backlog of films right now means that these dates will be fought over if not booked. So that’s why they keep on doing this. Cinema slot bookings are public knowledge.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
To extend your biblical metaphor, we are waiting for it to stop eating pig food and start making its way home!!!
-Casino Royale, Ian Fleming
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-54407213
Oh dear...
"The spectre of defeat..."
China can do that because they took this seriously and did not have people ignoring the virus/flaunting safety protocols.
Not entirely true. At first they tried to surpress the reports of the pandemic and not the pandemic itself. Some of the dctors who reported Covid-19 first were told to shut up or go to jail. Later the Chinese govermnemt understood how serious the situation was and pit in place restrictions, many of them would be much harder to implement in a demcracy with human rights.
Wishful thinking
EON has never been that proactive. I've always wondered why they don't get started on the script of the next film, at least in outline form, while production/post production is going on. That way they'd have a finished script ready within a year for the next film.
As for Bond post-Craig... I'm not sure that anyone in entertainment has properly worked out what kind of new stories we'll *want* to be told during/ after Covid, even in popular/ escapist genres.
At this point it is an industry thing not a Bond thing.
I assume come December everyone will be blaming Dune for the death of cinema.
The parent company of Cineworld also owns Regal Cinema in the US. Regal may also temporarily close.
"The very words I live by."
This is becoming absolute horse manure now.
Bond has nothing to do with people being scared to go to the cinema at the moment and they indisputably are - *insert exciting discussion about data bias demonstrated by the Guardian interviewing people at cinemas* . Hardly surprising given 15,000 covid cases were 'discovered down the back of the sofa' over the weekend in the UK and plans were leaked detailing criteria for all leisure industry venues being shut. Criteria many places, London included, are hurtling towards.
I would happily take a bet with Mr Bradshaw, Kermode and others - with winnings to charity - that come Nov 12th we're in lockdown circumstances that render all this rending of garments moot and would have seen NTTD forcibly suspended in the UK at least. (and I would hope to be wrong and a glad loser but I can read the weather as it stands now...)
Tenet did not fill cinemas to the capped capacity. No one seems to be screaming Marvel have killed cinema as they pulled the plug on numerous tentpoll franchise films. EON/Bond held their nerve longer than most which is why they're left in the firing line.
Also, as an employer in the UK, I know why they are doing it, but given furlough and JRS Government support there is a long conversation about reality of necessity for scale redundancies at the moment.
Happy James Bond Day!
The tabs never seem to miss an opportunity to slag Bond. It's just scapegoating. Anyone with half a brain should be able to understand that the issue is the pandemic. It's no coincidence that case numbers are rising with the re-opening of indoor dining, bars, etc. I understand the tragic financial implications of the theaters being shut down or having no product but there are serious health implications. I think in some ways, the movie theater business is falling into a perverted version of "me too" seeing that the restaurants and bars are now doing business so why not us....we are safer. However, with streaming, cable and VOD along with the growing affordability of large screen, hi def TVs it is much easier for people to make a decision not to gamble with their health and go to a theater. Personally, I miss the experience of seeing films in a nice theater and still would much prefer to see NTTD in an IMAX theater but not until it's really safe (and that is also my personal approach to returning to eating in restaurants, etc).
Agreed 1000%. They've single handedly killed the reopening cinemas in the US by postponing again. If they keep this up, there simply won't be a cinema experience at all. It would be much smarter imo to do VoD followed by a "cinematic experience" WHEN POSSIBLE.. rather than throwing around stupid dates based on nothing at all but their hopes and dreams. This is all BEYOND ridiculous, and has been since the last delay.
People want and will pay for streaming.. Disney has been killing it with Mulan at $30.
https://deadline.com/2020/10/cobra-kai-tops-u-s-streaming-ratings-with-amazons-the-boys-and-disneys-mulan-breaking-up-netflix-party-1234589415/
Rather than cheering on the ridiculous cycle, we should all be petitioning EON to truly "do the right thing" and release the film.
On one hand I appreciate they’re in this purely to make money, on the other hand I’m thinking about how much money do they need to make at a time like this?
Not releasing NTTD has all but killed UK (and probably us cinema). That’s a massive industry with 1000s of jobs.
All because MGM want to ensure they make an extra 100 million at the box office? I appreciate 100Million is a lot of money but it’s 100Million in profit to MGM vs 1000s of jobs and an entire industry.
It’s 100Million that, with some creative marketing, could be made up on the other end with VOD, Blue Ray, 4/8k releases, a directors cut, double bills...You name it.
As I say I’ve not made my mind up but I think at the heart of this is just greed.
Would there be calls for an extended Cinema run? Less people in theatres but spread over a period of time?
I really feel for all the people who stand to lose their jobs here.
How much did they make? The link you provided, like Disney itself, offered no concrete revenue numbers.
Lets remember it's the pandemic, and not Bond that will have caused this. There is a good chance by release we may be faced with further restrictions, local, or even full lockdowns, in many places. I honestly think they have made the right call.... I don't think at this knife-edge point in time we should be encouraging any form of social gathering. We certainly would not be going, and most people I know feel the same, and are avoiding any possible risk. I'm not prepared to put my, or my families life at risk for a bloody film, no matter how much I want to see it.... and I really want to see it.
Maybe they should have considered VOD... I can't see things being better by April, though I desperately hope they are. If it's just about money I think they would get a great return on a digital distribution, and maybe encourage people to see it at a later date at a theatre. I would certainly pay to see it again in a cinema, when it is safe to do so.