ANGRY!! Spoiler alert.
ahoythere
Posts: 3MI6 Agent
Anyone else absolutely disgusted about the ending to NTTD? It's bad enough dealing with the unnecessary Felix storyline. Bond in retirement and having a family were areas where it was not needed to go to in the films enduring timeline in my opinion. I expected to walk out struggling to stomach that, but enjoying discussions about the pro's and con's of those scenes. I expected there would be discussions about having strong female roles as apposed to the usual, and again, enjoying discussions about the pro's and con's even though being in the pro column myself. But why on earth kill off 007? You were supposed to be the custodians of a well established story and franchise, you did not own it to kill it off. I know Bond will return, but you've spoiled something that although wasn't without its faults and needed to move along with the times, it was ours. Hang your heads in shame producers.
Comments
Nothing spoiled at all. In fact it was brilliant. I’m very happy 🙂 Well done to everyone involved 👏🏻
I assume it was DC condition on coming back, rubbish ending though.
But why? Bc Daniel wanted him dead? Did cancel culture want him dead? I agree, neither owned James Bond. It was a playful idea at first but now it seems like it makes the DC films somewhat pointless...
ahoythere, I've edited the title after it being suggested that it was a spoiler in itself. Hope you don't mind.
Not disgusted, just confused and in shock to a degree.
Broccoli is so enthralled with Daniel and so grateful to him for saving the franchise that she let Bond die with the end of his tenure.
The amazing fact is that they managed to keep it under wraps ! The audience I saw it with left in silence. It was powerful , emotional and bold and a fine performance from Daniel.
I think we will spend the next 4 years pondering 'where next and how'
I'm surprised that some are angry and shocked.
I have yet to see the film, but until COVID is by and large gone, I won’t be venturing to theaters. Alas, though, I am aware of the ending.
In fact, after seeing The Dark Knight Rises, I told friends that’s how Craig’s Bonds will end. Why, they asked. Because the films so obviously track with those Batman films.
If you remove Quantum of Solace and Spectre, the two weakest in the series, the three remaining line up perfectly. Casino Royale is Bond Begins, Skyfall is their version of the Joker, an orphan, and childhood trauma in a mansion, and NTTD ends with what is ostensibly the hero’s death. Sure, the details are not identical, but the basic character arc is the same.
So none of this surprises or angers me. It’s more a letdown because it feels like they’re emulating rather than originating.
That's another reason I wanted it to end with Spectre. But even Nolan didn't kill Bruce Wayne. He just retired Batman. Which is probably what he would do with a Bond series. End it with Bond and a girl in a raft like in Thunderball or You Only Live Twice. Daniel Craig's Bond series only had one good ending in Spectre. And they couldn't even keep that.
it's your opinion. and not all will agree - I thought the ending was overly sad and felt an odd way to end a Bond fim - having Dou Dou be in the end sequence to add some ambiguity would have made it more palatable
but it still didn't ruin the movie for me
I loved it. I was more upset that Quantum, Skyfall and Spectre seemed weak in comparison. IMO of course.
shellshocked sat there thinking no you dont do this too Bond i understand that he gave the biggest sacrafice a human can do for his love and family
have to admit i was quite moved and yes upset to see DCs Bond end like that
and im asking myself how are they going to come back from this ??? just start new over or do the same what they did to the starwars films ??
the film its self was quite a work and i dont think for a long time anything will touch it or come close to it being so good
I've Just got back from seeing it and I have to say I don't know how I feel. Why did they have to give the new 00 Bond's old number 007, only for her to give it back to him, all it did for me was cause me to grate my teeth for over half of the film.
"Do you expect me to talk? "No Mister Bond I expect you to die"
Because it generated a whole lot of publicity for the film.
Fair enough but as a long time Bond fan they didn't need to go there imo, and why not say what Bonds new number was when they re-instated him as a 00, it just didn't sit right with me at all.
"Do you expect me to talk? "No Mister Bond I expect you to die"
On the contrary, I think they did need to go there. It provided a "hook" and possibly- make that probably- attracted a lot of people who wouldn't otherwise have gone to see the film. Remember, there's a whole lot of stuff they just couldn't say upfront for fear of spoiling big surprises. This was something they could say- because, in the end, it didn't matter much.
The character arc of Craig's Bond is that of Fleming's from CR to YOLT. There are obvious differences, but it's essentially the same. It has never been done and it needed to be done. Kudos to Craig-Broccoli-Wilson-et al.
The good news for those in distress is that "James Bond will return".
I've just become too indifferent to the whole thing to be angry. I could never really take Craig seriously as Bond and most of his movies just felt like self-indulgent ego trips for him and the producers that really didn't hold up to close scrutiny of the stories they told. I absolutely abhorred the reboot and deconstruction of the character in Casino Royale and thought Quantum of Solace was a poorly shot, sloppily edited, depressing, drink all your problems away take on the character. While I enjoyed Sam Mendes' course corrections in Skyfall and Spectre (minus the silly Bond and Blofeld being adopted brothers of course) turning them into more recognizable entries, I had a feeling that the producers would try to pull off something outlandish and polarizing for his last outing. As such, the whole Bond is a daddy, Bond dies, and return to the deconstruction model never really surprised me one bit. It was perfectly in keeping with Barbara Broccoli and Craig wanting to turn Bond into a troubled, tragic character who won't make it out in the end. It is a 180 degree antithesis of everything that made Bond a cinematic success in the first place but also sadly predictable given the sensibilities of the people currently running the show and current trends in cinema. Coming out of a Bond movie used to be a fun, uplifting experience because you knew that no matter the odds he would always come out on top. Unrealistic for sure but I never went to a Bond movie for realism. These movies are just exhausting to sit thru and after the initial viewings I never have any desire to sit thru them again.
Depends on how one looks at it -- some argue that Bruce Wayne really does die and the rest is just wish fulfillment, the way Nolan usually ends his movies with a big question mark about how much of what you just saw was real and how much wasn't.
But let's say that they're using the novels as something of a template and not just mimicking Nolan's Batman movies. Then, in theory, Bond could return in the timeline, as he does after being presumed dead (though they already essentially did that with Skyfall). I haven't seen NTTD yet to say how definitive Bond's death is, but there's always an out with this kind of genre fiction.
I don't know if I'll ever be sure if killing James Bond was the right or wrong thing to do. But before Craig's tenure we were safe in the knowledge that M can't die, Leiter can't die and Bond absolutely can't die. In all future Bond movies (well, almost certainly not in the first two movies of a new Bond) we know ANYONE can die, even Bond himself. That takes away a "safety net" for the audience and will create an extra edge to Bond movies that was absent before.
Bruce Wayne definitely doesn't die. Fox finds the auto pilot fixed. And Alfred sees Bruce retired with Selina. Which is what Alfred wanted.
The ending of No Time to Die is on youtube. I slowed the frames down to see if there is wiggle room. Of course, they could do The Man with the Golden Gun novel for inspiration. I felt that was one of the weakest Fleming books last I read it. Still it's not beyond the lack of continuity in the current series. They couldn't even keep the story straight with the DB5 from Casino Royale to Skyfall and then Spectre.
But I don't know what actor or director would want to continue this story unless for a big paycheck. And then possibly have the supporting characters of No Time to Die either die or be in on not telling the new Bond about his history, if they use the story from the beginning of Man with the Golden Gun.
Even Christian Bale chimes in with his "interpretation" because people continue to debate the ending for any number of reasons, the least of which is Nolan's penchant for ambiguous endings.
https://collider.com/the-dark-knight-rises-ending-explained-christian-bale/
And there have been scores of articles and debates on how definitive the end is, this being just one:
https://yahoo-movies-uk.tumblr.com/post/123726177293/did-batman-die-at-the-end-of-the-dark-knight
But if they want to bring Craig back, they can find a way. And, who knows, in the next two, three, four years (this production company never seems to be in a hurry to make Bond movies), they might discover they either can't find a new Bond or don't want to. Craig's career may be flagging -- it's never been remarkable outside of Bond and a few other things -- and he's changed his mind again, especially if they figure out how to pay him.
One can only imagine the anger if Fleming came back and started banging on about killing Bond off in Thunderball, as he wanted to...
Fleming tried killing Bond off on more than one occasion. Only for Bond to return.
So, I watched the ending thinking "how are they going to get Bond out of this?" and I made all the usual comparisons with Nolan's Dark Knight Rises thinking, is Bond going to appear right at the end but, looking at the explosion from the missile strikes - totally unsurvivable!
It was a total shock to me but I made myself wait until the end of the credits for the reassuring message that appears. So where do future films go from here?
A reboot, definitely. It's a shame that M, Tanner, Moneypenny and Q will probably have to be recast as they were brilliant, but it is a complete blank slate. I will be keenly interested to see where it goes.
My only hope is that they root it in realism.
Exactly, although with very different motivations and levels of desire for resurrection at various points.
But even he tired of putting Bond through ‘his tricks’ and always skin of the teething it…and that resistance to staleness, to repetition, led to innovation in the novels which gave us some ‘shocking’ twists and, I believe enriched the character the novels and in the subsequent cherry picking have produced some of the best moments on screen both serious and comedic. I do wonder if Bond would have survived if he had…
is it shocking, yes, will I ever forget the first moment I saw it, no, is it what you hope for until the final second, no, but i guess I just find this notion of betrayal or destruction of legacy or of not having the ‘right’ to do this or implying that this is something that Daniel, Barbara and Michael cooked up inhaling the fumes from a cauldron of boiling Moonraker DVDs and not something that has always been in the dna of the character, well…
Could Craig’s Bond have survived…99.9% no and that’s clearly not the intent. But there are some miraculous real life survivals, not least from the last 20years world events, that could allow you to formulate some miraculous alternatives that don’t involve jumping sharks.
And, looking forward if you didn’t like the Craig era or you hated this film, or in fact loved them both this is actually a perfect moment for the franchise. because having watched it with several ‘civilian’ audiences people have belly laughed, gasped, cheered and cried. This isn’t a film people will forget and together with the 60th anniversary year coming up…there will be a lot of energy and discussion around the franchise for the next 15months at least. That should be exciting either if you’re in a state a genuine grief for a portrayal of a character you love that has been present for the vast majority of your adult life, or if you yearn for a return to one of the previous 5 interpretations.
There is now a freedom to do anything. Now is the perfect time for period remakes faithful to the novels - oh how I’d love Amazon to do a 1 season series with 90min bursts of all of them. They could return to stand alone mission films with one or many actors. They could get grittier, they could get Moore-er…they could combine all three with docu-drama and cast Elon Musk as himsel…I mean a villain!
It is interesting about the surrounding cast as they are excellent and it is a shame…although I was always sad Villiers never popped up in the background again.
To be fair Bond survived a few explosions in this one so maybe hiding behind a boulder would have provided a nice easy access route to Safin's escape vessel. All Bond villan's have an escape vessel right.
Eon would not have ended the film in this way if they did not have an idea how they would get out of it for the next movie, Craig or no Craig. For once I have faith in them.
I was also horrified to learn today of the end of the film. I am currently still on a "vacation mission" not far from Matera.
I am the same age as Daniel Craig, have bought all 007 outfits from the film (and complete) 😳
Maybe this is also the end of my activities as a Bond fan: I'm also too old, it's getting more and more expensive, it's no longer the 007 character as I got to know and appreciate him at your age. For 14 years, my brother and I visit the original locations of the Bond movies.
Maybe that should all stop now with the end of the film.
I look forward to the film now with mixed feelings.
R.I.P Mr Bond, James Bond
I am 48 years old and 007 was definitely a part of my life as well in more ways than i can describe in a post like this. I too felt like a chapter of my life ended with this film. It took me two days to recover a nice mood after i walked out of that theater but i am still thinking about it and consequentially myself.
I am sure that they will continue the franchise in a few years with someone new but this will be the first time in my life i will be older than Bond. That definitely changes things for me. :)
Another who has just got back from watching the film.
I'd mostly avoided spoilers on the movie but did see a comment somewhere saying Bond dies. Thought it would be a strange thing to do and it certainly was.
Film was good in places but it was no Skyfall, the best of the Craig era IMHO. The ending was poor and just puts too many questions into what next, watched right to the end of the credits and there was the 'James Bond Will Return' credits, which were very much like they used to do in the old films.
The storyline with child etc for me was a storyline that would have a huge impact on what a Bond movie is so perhaps they saw this is as the way to break the link by everyone thinking Bond was dead, it did puzzle me why he climbed to the top when staying in the concrete bunker would have given him a better chance, other than him not wanting to risk the family.
Which brings me to a big plot hole I felt existed.
The poison that kills all Spectre members via their DNA, and ultimately Blofeld, shouldn't that have killed Madeline as her Father was Spectre and had their DNA, as seen in the DNA search by Q on the ring in Spectre?
I was underwhelmed with the film. I'm a lifelong Bond fan (as I'm sure we all are on here) and am frustrated with how the film ended. As someone said above, these films are escapism and entertainment and that "survival" factor is crucial for the success and longevity of the franchise. Seems to me like they've listened to the possible 'cancel culture' we now live in, and didn't know what to do with Bond, so just killed him off.
Worth saying that I wholeheartedly agree that some of the earlier incarnations feature inappropriate behaviour towards women, acceptable at the time, and thankfully not any more - but there are ways to update the character without a spin-off from his daughter. I mean, what?!?! I have ZERO interest in watching "Bond, Mathilde Bond" wink at the camera as she saves the world from Uncle Blofeld's son. Utter tosh.
Craig was refreshing in some ways, but his power over Broccoli and the franchise has meant its demise. He always hated the character and made no bones in complaining about it. Boohoo Daniel, just leave then - oh no, that £30 Million pay check will keep you invested won't it? And now he's made his fortune and killed off one of cinema's greatest flawed heroes.
I'd be very interested to know HOW "James Bond Will Return". He's undeniably dead. Any survival from that would be silly, plus it would mean that we'd have to endure another film about his family. "Let's pack up the car kids and go camping..!" This is James Bond - he's an alcoholic, chauvinistic assassin. Yes, he has some serious issues, but there's something to learn from him, and some comedy in that...which is why he's been around so long. Now, thanks to Daniel Craig and the utterly lost producers, we've lost one of cinema's true greats. Cubby wouldn't have let this happen.
A very sad day.