The Craig is back-thread has a link to the original The Local article, but for some reason there was little discussion. A Russian or an Arab villain seem to be over-used, but a Russian doesn't have to be an extreme nationalist or secret agent and an Arab doesn't have to be a jihadist. I don't think Hodge went in such an obvious direction.
The thread got closed because of a few clowns spouting their nonsensical opinions, not because of lack of news, or the state of production. And, of course, as soon as it closed, the above discussion-worthy news came in...
Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
My comments about MI6community were ment to be a little bit funny. I think what Said Taghmaui said was very interesting and worthy of some discussion even if he doesn't get cast.
I think what Said Taghmaui said was very interesting and worthy of some discussion even if he doesn't get cast.
Agreed, it's quite interesting news, even if I haven't seen the actor's work. Surprised there wasn't more discussion about it on the forums. Which way do they go? Russian or Middle Eastern? They could always pull a TLD, and have both. I'm excited for any of those outcomes, but most of all, I'd love a return to the Cold War-style Bond film again.
Always have an escape plan. Mine is watching James Bond films.
The casting call from when Boyle was still the director was for a Russian villan. Later he must have changed it to be an Arab character and cast Said Taghmaui. Now EON are uncertain if they want to stay with Taghmaui or change the character back to being a Russian, possibly played by Polish Thomasz Kot or an actor from Finland.
Does that sound reasonable?
Joking of course I've never been to the 'other place' .... As for any info, I take everything with a large pinch of salt (hence, my high blood pressure) and await some solid news from the horses mouth..... soon please!
The casting call from when Boyle was still the director was for a Russian villan. Later he must have changed it to be an Arab character and cast Said Taghmaui. Now EON are uncertain if they want to stay with Taghmaui or change the character back to being a Russian, possibly played by Polish Thomasz Kot or an actor from Finland.
Does that sound reasonable?
The casting call from when Boyle was still the director was for a Russian villan. Later he must have changed it to be an Arab character and cast Said Taghmaui. Now EON are uncertain if they want to stay with Taghmaui or change the character back to being a Russian, possibly played by Polish Thomasz Kot or an actor from Finland.
Does that sound reasonable?
Not worth talking about? (he said self-pityingly)
I think that the big questions on everyone's minds right now is who the director is going to be, will the release date be delayed, and is the Hodge script w/ rewrites the script? Once EON officially makes an announcement I think there will be much more interest regarding casting, etc and what the plot is.
I still think this is interesting. If they og for an Arab villan, will the female Russian character change nationality too? Getting an Arab woman to play a Bond girl might be difficult, even though Lebanon and Saudi Arabia offer very different work conditions for actresses.
I saw an article today where Danny Boyle discusses some of his ideas for his version of Bond25, including a couple that sound like they got used anyway
and since that website is full of slowloading junk, here's the text
Boyle said producers "just lost confidence" in his vision for Bond 25, set in present-day Russia and digging into 007's origins.
Danny Boyle has “No Time” for franchises following his exit from the 25th James Bond film that eventually became “No Time to Die.”
The director signed on for the project in 201 8 alongside longtime screenwriting partner John Hodge.
“I remember thinking, ‘Should I really get involved in franchises?’ Because they don’t really want something different,” Boyle told Esquire UK. “They want you to freshen it up a bit, but not really challenge it, and we wanted to do something different with it.”
Boyle later stepped away from the film, with rumors that producer Barbara Broccoli’s Eon Productions did not approve of Boyle’s alleged conclusion to kill off Bond, played by Daniel Craig. However, after Cary Fukunaga helmed the 2021 feature, Bond met the same demise.
Now, Boyle is detailing what his original plot entailed.
“Weirdly — it would have been very topical now — it was all set in Russia, which is of course where Bond came from, out of the Cold War,” the “Pistols” director explained. “It was set in present-day Russia and went back to his origins, and they just lost, what’s the word… they just lost confidence in it. It was a shame really.”
After watching “No Time to Die,” Boyle praised the use of screenwriter Hodge’s “wonderful” idea to incorporate Bond’s child. But Boyle sees no personal future in the franchise, saying, “I don’t think so,” as to whether he’d entertain helming the next iteration.
Still, Boyle pitched his casting choices for Bond, citing “I May Destroy You” breakout Paapa Essiedu or Robert Pattinson, noting “The Batman” actor “would be a great Bond.” Producers have also noted that Idris Elba, Tom Hardy, Henry Cavill, and Jacob Elordi are being considered for the role.
Bond production designer Mark Tildesley previously told Total Film that Boyle’s scrapped script was “extraordinary” and that while certain plot aspects weren’t entirely cohesive yet, Boyle should be in the mix for future Bond projects.
“Unfortunately Danny’s crazy, madcap ideas didn’t quite tie up with what [producers] Barbara [Broccoli] and Michael [De Luca] had planned,” Tildesley said. “It was definitely a good thing to do. Maybe another time though. I’m revving Barbara up to have another go with Danny. [He had] some extraordinary ideas, they just needed a little pulling together.”
Boyle, however, stands by his decision to not be involved in famed franchises, telling Metro at the time that the cursed production was the biggest turn-off to blockbusters.
“I learned my lesson that I am not cut out [for franchises], otherwise you’re digging in the same hole,” Boyle said. “I am better not quite in the mainstream franchise movies, is the honest answer. I learned quite a lot about myself with Bond, I work in partnership with writers and I am not prepared to break it up.”
This is very interesting. I suspected Boyle left because he didn't want the ending of NTTD Craig wanted, but it looks like I was wrong.
The topic of the script makes "torn from the headlines" today, but filming in Russia won't be possible in a long time. I wonder if elements of the script will end up in future movies?
A second origin story within a 5 film cycle with one actor? It is a shame to learn Mr Boyle's 'grand', 'madcap' idea' was so ill-conceived, generic and generally terrible. he's deluding himself over franchises being the issue.
I want to like him because he has done some great work but his treatment of Ewan McGregor, his treatment of John Lydon over the Sex Pistols series and these revelations...a director of diminishing returns.
yes I noticed that too. I had to google Michael Del Luca ... apparently a bigwig in MGM ... would he have anything to do with Bond25 behind the scenes? but we all know who the Michael is in the quote, and this author obviously does not.
I also notice the author is paraphrasing from an interview Boyle gave to Esquire UK, and the wrong Michael quote is coming from an article with Mark Tildesleyin Total Film. It seems to be recycled journalism. I didnt have time to track down the original interviews, but thought we'd want to see this because we've speculated in the past why Boyle left and this is the first time I'd seen him commenting on it or giving any hints what his version of the film might have been. If somebody else wants to dig deeper and find the Esquire UK and Total film interviews thatd be swell, theres hopefully more detailed and accurate info.
I read this on Bond Twitter but it makes no sense to me. Things were at a very advanced stage when Boyle quit, they were into casting weren't they? How come only then did they figure his ideas wouldn't work?
And how did they get the cast together for the script they did go for, with Madeleine Swann - how did they know the actress would even be available assuming she wasn't in Boyle's treatment? And if she had been, how could they take it as read she go with the new script presented?
It's possible another MGM bigwig suddenly stuck his oar in and vetoed it but I don't know.
I could be wrong, but I don't get the feeling the Boyle/Hodges script was an origin story. To me "set in present-day Russia and digging into 007's origins"means making a story in present day Russia in a cold war style and context that reminds us of the origins of the series. Am I barking up the wrong tree or does anyone agree with me?
thats how I read it too, TwoFour, back to thematic Roots
and other than that, and the two bits that made it into the film we saw, I dont see much actual info about what Boyle wanted to do. more about how Boyle fancies himself too good for franchise films. ah well, thought it was worth sharing, since we'd long speculated.
maybe...I probably got distracted by this in the article I read "What seems to have stalled things with Boyle’s vision for Bond’s final outing was wanting to confine the story to Russia and deliver an internal drama around Bond’s origins."
Maybe, maybe not. I don't think the overall plot can be used now anyway because of the current political situtaion, the Russian war in Ukraine and the new cold war. Ironic, isn't it? A plot about Bond and cold war can (maybe) not be shot because of cold war ....
It's possible the plot can be used if countries like Finland, Hungary and the Czeck republic is used as stand-ins for Russia, but my guess is the script will be canibalized for use in other Bond movies.
I don't believe for a single second that DBoyles script was so outlandishly different and controversial then the crap that was penned for NTTD. Boyle left because he thought that killing Bond off was an idiotic idea and didn't want to be a part of DCraigs final F-You to the franchise/character. I can totally see the temper tantrum DCraig might of had over the phone with Barbara as she was trying to get him to come back after Spectre being like "If I come back one last time, Barbara, then I need to be a co-producer and I am killing Bond the **** off so I never have to do this **** again". 🤣
I don't believe the Boyle script was outlandishly different. If so, why would EON sign on to it in the first place? Neither do I think EON was blackmailed into the NTTD ending. I actually believe it was naturally for CraigBond to both show the begining AND the end of that timeline and both Craig and EON saw it that way. However I do think Craig insisted on that ending, and being sure he wouldn't be asked the rest of his life if he was going to return as James Bond (like Connery) was important to him. This doesn't mean NTTD was a "F- You" from Craig to the Bond character and franchise. Craig always had a deep affection fro James Bond, even though his vison of Bond wasn't the same as all Bond fans.
Comments
Things got out of hand, it will be back in a few days.
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That's the difference between the two forums - things NEVER get out of hand here
It was the lack of.
Bond on the Box - Website | Twitter | Facebook | Instagram | LetterBoxd | YouTube
The Craig is back-thread has a link to the original The Local article, but for some reason there was little discussion. A Russian or an Arab villain seem to be over-used, but a Russian doesn't have to be an extreme nationalist or secret agent and an Arab doesn't have to be a jihadist. I don't think Hodge went in such an obvious direction.
Reasons, I no longer even visit the MI6 Forum. Too many
Clowns who know everything.
Agreed, it's quite interesting news, even if I haven't seen the actor's work. Surprised there wasn't more discussion about it on the forums. Which way do they go? Russian or Middle Eastern? They could always pull a TLD, and have both. I'm excited for any of those outcomes, but most of all, I'd love a return to the Cold War-style Bond film again.
In what way?
Does that sound reasonable?
Unlike here, which is clowns who know nothing
Joking of course
Not worth talking about? (he said self-pityingly)
I think that the big questions on everyone's minds right now is who the director is going to be, will the release date be delayed, and is the Hodge script w/ rewrites the script? Once EON officially makes an announcement I think there will be much more interest regarding casting, etc and what the plot is.
I saw an article today where Danny Boyle discusses some of his ideas for his version of Bond25, including a couple that sound like they got used anyway
Danny Boyle Details Scrapped Soviet James Bond Plot, Wants Paapa Essiedu or Robert Pattinson as 007
IndieWire, Samantha Bergeson may 10 2022
and since that website is full of slowloading junk, here's the text
Boyle said producers "just lost confidence" in his vision for Bond 25, set in present-day Russia and digging into 007's origins.
Danny Boyle has “No Time” for franchises following his exit from the 25th James Bond film that eventually became “No Time to Die.”
The director signed on for the project in 201 8 alongside longtime screenwriting partner John Hodge.
“I remember thinking, ‘Should I really get involved in franchises?’ Because they don’t really want something different,” Boyle told Esquire UK. “They want you to freshen it up a bit, but not really challenge it, and we wanted to do something different with it.”
Boyle later stepped away from the film, with rumors that producer Barbara Broccoli’s Eon Productions did not approve of Boyle’s alleged conclusion to kill off Bond, played by Daniel Craig. However, after Cary Fukunaga helmed the 2021 feature, Bond met the same demise.
Now, Boyle is detailing what his original plot entailed.
“Weirdly — it would have been very topical now — it was all set in Russia, which is of course where Bond came from, out of the Cold War,” the “Pistols” director explained. “It was set in present-day Russia and went back to his origins, and they just lost, what’s the word… they just lost confidence in it. It was a shame really.”
After watching “No Time to Die,” Boyle praised the use of screenwriter Hodge’s “wonderful” idea to incorporate Bond’s child. But Boyle sees no personal future in the franchise, saying, “I don’t think so,” as to whether he’d entertain helming the next iteration.
Still, Boyle pitched his casting choices for Bond, citing “I May Destroy You” breakout Paapa Essiedu or Robert Pattinson, noting “The Batman” actor “would be a great Bond.” Producers have also noted that Idris Elba, Tom Hardy, Henry Cavill, and Jacob Elordi are being considered for the role.
Bond production designer Mark Tildesley previously told Total Film that Boyle’s scrapped script was “extraordinary” and that while certain plot aspects weren’t entirely cohesive yet, Boyle should be in the mix for future Bond projects.
“Unfortunately Danny’s crazy, madcap ideas didn’t quite tie up with what [producers] Barbara [Broccoli] and Michael [De Luca] had planned,” Tildesley said. “It was definitely a good thing to do. Maybe another time though. I’m revving Barbara up to have another go with Danny. [He had] some extraordinary ideas, they just needed a little pulling together.”
Boyle, however, stands by his decision to not be involved in famed franchises, telling Metro at the time that the cursed production was the biggest turn-off to blockbusters.
“I learned my lesson that I am not cut out [for franchises], otherwise you’re digging in the same hole,” Boyle said. “I am better not quite in the mainstream franchise movies, is the honest answer. I learned quite a lot about myself with Bond, I work in partnership with writers and I am not prepared to break it up.”
Thanks for that, caractacus, but- Michael De Luca? Ms Bergeson has got her wires crossed somewhere.
This is very interesting. I suspected Boyle left because he didn't want the ending of NTTD Craig wanted, but it looks like I was wrong.
The topic of the script makes "torn from the headlines" today, but filming in Russia won't be possible in a long time. I wonder if elements of the script will end up in future movies?
A second origin story within a 5 film cycle with one actor? It is a shame to learn Mr Boyle's 'grand', 'madcap' idea' was so ill-conceived, generic and generally terrible. he's deluding himself over franchises being the issue.
I want to like him because he has done some great work but his treatment of Ewan McGregor, his treatment of John Lydon over the Sex Pistols series and these revelations...a director of diminishing returns.
yes I noticed that too. I had to google Michael Del Luca ... apparently a bigwig in MGM ... would he have anything to do with Bond25 behind the scenes? but we all know who the Michael is in the quote, and this author obviously does not.
I also notice the author is paraphrasing from an interview Boyle gave to Esquire UK, and the wrong Michael quote is coming from an article with Mark Tildesley in Total Film. It seems to be recycled journalism. I didnt have time to track down the original interviews, but thought we'd want to see this because we've speculated in the past why Boyle left and this is the first time I'd seen him commenting on it or giving any hints what his version of the film might have been. If somebody else wants to dig deeper and find the Esquire UK and Total film interviews thatd be swell, theres hopefully more detailed and accurate info.
I read this on Bond Twitter but it makes no sense to me. Things were at a very advanced stage when Boyle quit, they were into casting weren't they? How come only then did they figure his ideas wouldn't work?
And how did they get the cast together for the script they did go for, with Madeleine Swann - how did they know the actress would even be available assuming she wasn't in Boyle's treatment? And if she had been, how could they take it as read she go with the new script presented?
It's possible another MGM bigwig suddenly stuck his oar in and vetoed it but I don't know.
Roger Moore 1927-2017
I could be wrong, but I don't get the feeling the Boyle/Hodges script was an origin story. To me "set in present-day Russia and digging into 007's origins" means making a story in present day Russia in a cold war style and context that reminds us of the origins of the series. Am I barking up the wrong tree or does anyone agree with me?
thats how I read it too, TwoFour, back to thematic Roots
and other than that, and the two bits that made it into the film we saw, I dont see much actual info about what Boyle wanted to do. more about how Boyle fancies himself too good for franchise films. ah well, thought it was worth sharing, since we'd long speculated.
maybe...I probably got distracted by this in the article I read "What seems to have stalled things with Boyle’s vision for Bond’s final outing was wanting to confine the story to Russia and deliver an internal drama around Bond’s origins."
Point stands re John Lydon though.
Maybe, maybe not. I don't think the overall plot can be used now anyway because of the current political situtaion, the Russian war in Ukraine and the new cold war. Ironic, isn't it? A plot about Bond and cold war can (maybe) not be shot because of cold war ....
It's possible the plot can be used if countries like Finland, Hungary and the Czeck republic is used as stand-ins for Russia, but my guess is the script will be canibalized for use in other Bond movies.
I am reading this article and just shaking my head......
I don't believe for a single second that DBoyles script was so outlandishly different and controversial then the crap that was penned for NTTD. Boyle left because he thought that killing Bond off was an idiotic idea and didn't want to be a part of DCraigs final F-You to the franchise/character. I can totally see the temper tantrum DCraig might of had over the phone with Barbara as she was trying to get him to come back after Spectre being like "If I come back one last time, Barbara, then I need to be a co-producer and I am killing Bond the **** off so I never have to do this **** again". 🤣
I don't believe the Boyle script was outlandishly different. If so, why would EON sign on to it in the first place? Neither do I think EON was blackmailed into the NTTD ending. I actually believe it was naturally for CraigBond to both show the begining AND the end of that timeline and both Craig and EON saw it that way. However I do think Craig insisted on that ending, and being sure he wouldn't be asked the rest of his life if he was going to return as James Bond (like Connery) was important to him. This doesn't mean NTTD was a "F- You" from Craig to the Bond character and franchise. Craig always had a deep affection fro James Bond, even though his vison of Bond wasn't the same as all Bond fans.
To quote Q- "That's putting it mildly, 007".
It was.
Eon didn’t sign on to the Hodge script.