Well, since they are dropping everything else, why'd they keep Mathis? Bond doesn't even go into France anymore and I can't find a good reason why a French agent would go to Prague or the Bahamas.
Well, since they are dropping everything else, why'd they keep Mathis? Bond doesn't even go into France anymore and I can't find a good reason why a French agent would go to Prague or the Bahamas.
Because he is one of the most interesting characters in the entire sequence. Because CR the novel implied Mathis' experience and Bond's recognition of his influence.
Well, I would include him in the screenplay. We just can't be sure whether he is or he isn't in the film ...
Oh yeah, I forgot (or at least I try to forget) the whole Bond Begins stuff. But Mathis is still a French agent working in French territory - having him outside France would be just meaningless. If his country is not involved in the scheme (as in the novel), the appearance would be superfluos. But if the Bond Begins nigtmare manifests (oh God, help me), I can see a similar 'native agent' either in Prague or in The Bahamas filling in for a similar role.
Oh yeah, I forgot (or at least I try to forget) the whole Bond Begins stuff. But Mathis is still a French agent working in French territory - having him outside France would be just meaningless. If his country is not involved in the scheme (as in the novel), the appearance would be superfluos. But if the Bond Begins nigtmare manifests (oh God, help me), I can see a similar 'native agent' either in Prague or in The Bahamas filling in for a similar role.
I don't state that you can't cram Mathis into the storyline... It's just that he won't fit in as naturally as let's say on the French Riviera. The essence of Mathis is that he is French and that he is an expert on all things related to his country. Felix Leiter is the one who always travels and pops up wherever Bond is going - Mathis is in France and isn't a world-travelling super-snoop looking for second-grade terrorists. Of course in the times when M follows Bond everywhere like somekind of hound dog, nothing is impossible - but it's not really good either.
I could buy Mathis as more of a Bond-type agent, going where he's needed. Maybe he's stationed where the story plays out? Options like what we're discussing don't seem too far from center, IMO (less so than making Vesper Bond's equal, lol).
Geeze-Louise, does everything involved with this film have to turn into a flashpoint? In every Bond film, Bond has allies, so why not assume that Mathis will be one of them? Even if they move the location from France, there may indeed be a reason for a French agent to be involved. There were also rumors that David Suchet would be involved in the film: we all assumed he'd be Le Chiffre, but since that's been denied, maybe he's been pegged to play Mathis? Sheesh, what's next? People complaining about the manufacturer of the light bulbs they'll use to light the sets?
Geeze-Louise, does everything involved with this film have to turn into a flashpoint? In every Bond film, Bond has allies, so why not assume that Mathis will be one of them? Even if they move the location from France, there may indeed be a reason for a French agent to be involved. There were also rumors that David Suchet would be involved in the film: we all assumed he'd be Le Chiffre, but since that's been denied, maybe he's been pegged to play Mathis? Sheesh, what's next? People complaining about the manufacturer of the light bulbs they'll use to light the sets?
Good Post Hardy,
I agree about the constant bickering and "in your face" posts. Which is why I have been posting less.
Now about Mathis, I am no expert, but I would think he is involved, he is a main character in the book and we have heard (among other things) that they will be somewhat faithful to the book.
Just because they are filming in locations other than France, doesn't mean that it won't be France on screen. Everyone can now tell me how I know nothing.
Couldn't Mathis be Czech? Is that so inconceivable? Or perhaps there will be someone who is Mathis, but has a Czech name (if you see what I mean)?
I doubt Mathis will be in it however, as I'm sure Vesper has been expanded to assume his role as well. If you read the novel, her role is pretty minimal - she's just an assistant; making her Mathis (as indeed CR54 did!) would enable her to assume a larger role.
Couldn't Mathis be Czech? Is that so inconceivable? Or perhaps there will be someone who is Mathis, but has a Czech name (if you see what I mean)?
I doubt Mathis will be in it however, as I'm sure Vesper has been expanded to assume his role as well. If you read the novel, her role is pretty minimal - she's just an assistant; making her Mathis (as indeed CR54 did!) would enable her to assume a larger role.
What you say is possible, but I hope it doesn't occur. Mathis is French and should be French. Why would we have to make him Czech. It's the magic of moving pictures, Canada is the U.S. in many pictures, Spain was Cuba in DAD and France can be anywhere.
As for Vesper, I repeat my often repeated hope, Vesper is not an action hero. Don't make her one.
They may well be using Prague or Italy or both to double for it, after all it doesn't exist anyway and they often use different locations to double for elsewhere.
Just because they are shooting in Prague and Italy doesn't at all mean the films plot will be set in those places, not at all.
Thats what I thought. Surely Prague/Italy filming locations could double as France.
Ah, I'd be disappointed. It's like travelling to Johannesburg to shoot scenes doubling for Cardiff. I feel Prague is too unique looking city to fill in for a stock fantasy town. Of course they could just axe Prague as an in-film location and use its great studio system, but not the actual town. Which would be a horrible waste, if you ask me.
Couldn't Mathis be Czech? Is that so inconceivable? Or perhaps there will be someone who is Mathis, but has a Czech name (if you see what I mean)?
I doubt Mathis will be in it however, as I'm sure Vesper has been expanded to assume his role as well. If you read the novel, her role is pretty minimal - she's just an assistant; making her Mathis (as indeed CR54 did!) would enable her to assume a larger role.
What you say is possible, but I hope it doesn't occur. Mathis is French and should be French. Why would we have to make him Czech. It's the magic of moving pictures, Canada is the U.S. in many pictures, Spain was Cuba in DAD and France can be anywhere.
As for Vesper, I repeat my often repeated hope, Vesper is not an action hero. Don't make her one.
I don't think increasing Vesper's role automatically makes her an action hero character. She didn't have much to do in the novel that would amount to very much screen time, I hope they give her something more to do...just not with machine guns.
I think there are some Czech locations around Prague which are lesser known and very unique and beautiful (Aren't they scouting in a spa town nearby?).
As I understand it, the surrounding area of Prague will be used for location filming including the spa town that you were referring to. And it is Karlovy Vary.
I think there are some Czech locations around Prague which are lesser known and very unique and beautiful (Aren't they scouting in a spa town nearby?).
As I understand it, the surrounding area of Prague will be used for location filming including the spa town that you were referring to. And it is Karlovy Vary.
very good example. Anyway since they're filming over here too there are a lot of Italian towns which are even more similar to France than Czech towns (for obvious reasons, since we're sharing borders! )
It wouldn't be much of a problem to recreate the ambience of a French town here.
There are plenty of towns in the Piedmont region (Where I was born) and in Tuscany that look a lot like France.
Although I still hope they go to Sorrento and Positano and Costiera Amalfitana to film a fantastic car chase scene!!
"Are we on coms?" (if you don't know where this is from... you've missed some really good stuff! )
If they fancied doing the old re-casting of an old Bond actor in a new role I think Michael Lonsdale would be superb
Michael Lonsdale is a very good actor indeed. I enjoyed his rather cold, deadpan portrayal of Hugo Drax in Moonraker. And yes, he was first rate in The Day Of The Jackal.
However, I would prefer that Eon do not re-cast old actors/actresses in new roles. But having said that, I am not bothered (for example) by Maud Adams portraying two different characters in two seperate Bond films. So, what do I know?
I suspect he will be proven innocent, only to die in the next film.
I believe he'll turn out to be innocent as well. Because the more and more I think about it, the more I believe LeChiffre's kidnapping of Vesper wasn't staged but real -- he thought she had double-crossed him and given Bond the extra $5 million to buy back in, not knowing that it was Leiter. If Mathis had been on LeChiffre's payroll, he would have tipped off LeChiffre about Leiter staking Bond, I think. That would also help explain why LeChiffre felt he had to tell Bond that Mathis was his friend: he didn't want him to suspect that his girlfriend had in fact betrayed him.
NightshooterIn bed with SolitairePosts: 2,917MI6 Agent
HH, I'm confused. I thought Le Chiffre kidnapped Vesper to lure Bond, and he wanted the password from Bond. What is this about being crossed?
I suspect he will be proven innocent, only to die in the next film.
I believe he'll turn out to be innocent as well. Because the more and more I think about it, the more I believe LeChiffre's kidnapping of Vesper wasn't staged but real -- he thought she had double-crossed him and given Bond the extra $5 million to buy back in, not knowing that it was Leiter. If Mathis had been on LeChiffre's payroll, he would have tipped off LeChiffre about Leiter staking Bond, I think. That would also help explain why LeChiffre felt he had to tell Bond that Mathis was his friend: he didn't want him to suspect that his girlfriend had in fact betrayed him.
I've always thought he dumped Vesper in the road so that Bond would run her over -- a cruel way to die made moreso since Bond was racing to rescue her. And he said the bit about Mathis more as a bluff to make Bond believe there would be no ally coming to rescue him.
But it's all pretty loopy right now. If Bond had died in the crash, there'd be no password to get. If Vesper wasn't working with LeChiffre, whey did he separate her from Bond? Wouldn't he have been more likely to crack with Vesper being tortured in front of him, too? She must have been working with White already since only seconds occur between the elimination of LeChiffre's crew and his own demise -- hardly time for Vesper to negotiate a new deal. But, then if she was already working with White, why even kill LeChiffre when Vesper would have gotten the money from Bond anyway? To make a point? That is in the novel and suggested by White's own words, but it seems rather unnecessary when all he wants is the money (he ain't SMERSH after all). White must have been watching LeChiffre or else he wouldn't have known where he'd taken Bond and Vesper -- if so, then why even let LeChiffre kidnap them when it would have been easier to get the money from Bond/Vesper? And, for that, how did he know that LeChiffre hadn't yet sweated the password out of Bond?
There's enough ambiguity to make one's head spin. Regardless, I suspect Mathis will be innocent . . . and ultimately suffer the fate of most of Bond's true allies.
HH, I'm confused. I thought Le Chiffre kidnapped Vesper to lure Bond, and he wanted the password from Bond. What is this about being crossed?
That's what I thought, too. But at my last viewing it occurred to me that Leiter gave Bond the money to get back into the game. If Vesper was working for LeChiffre, it was to neutralize Bond by not giving Bond the additional money if he lost. As we see in the film, she refuses to stake Bond again. But Leiter intercedes and gives him the money. If LeChiffre didn't know that, he would have assumed that Vesper double-crossed him and gave Bond the additional stake after all. He kidnaps her. Let's say she tells LeChiffre it wasn't her (she doesn't know where Bond got the money). He doesn't believe her, of course and then, realizing that Bond is pursuing him, puts her in the road so that Bond will stop and can be captured. I don't believe, as Gassy suggests, that he wanted Bond to run her over. There's really no reason for him think that Bond would crash or run her over, but he would be likely to believe he would stop to save her.
But you are right about loopy, Gassy. The ending is certainly ambiguous. Makes it kind of interesting.
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Posts: 38MI6 Agent
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How can you be so sure?
Because he is one of the most interesting characters in the entire sequence. Because CR the novel implied Mathis' experience and Bond's recognition of his influence.
Well, I would include him in the screenplay. We just can't be sure whether he is or he isn't in the film ...
When you're sure, give me a call ...
Good Post Hardy,
I agree about the constant bickering and "in your face" posts. Which is why I have been posting less.
Now about Mathis, I am no expert, but I would think he is involved, he is a main character in the book and we have heard (among other things) that they will be somewhat faithful to the book.
Just because they are filming in locations other than France, doesn't mean that it won't be France on screen. Everyone can now tell me how I know nothing.
I doubt Mathis will be in it however, as I'm sure Vesper has been expanded to assume his role as well. If you read the novel, her role is pretty minimal - she's just an assistant; making her Mathis (as indeed CR54 did!) would enable her to assume a larger role.
@merseytart
What you say is possible, but I hope it doesn't occur. Mathis is French and should be French. Why would we have to make him Czech. It's the magic of moving pictures, Canada is the U.S. in many pictures, Spain was Cuba in DAD and France can be anywhere.
As for Vesper, I repeat my often repeated hope, Vesper is not an action hero. Don't make her one.
Thats what I thought. Surely Prague/Italy filming locations could double as France.
I don't think increasing Vesper's role automatically makes her an action hero character. She didn't have much to do in the novel that would amount to very much screen time, I hope they give her something more to do...just not with machine guns.
As I understand it, the surrounding area of Prague will be used for location filming including the spa town that you were referring to. And it is Karlovy Vary.
You can see images of Karlovy Vary if you click on the link below.
http://www.ajb007.co.uk/index.php?topic=23880
http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=viewImage&friendID=14727569&imageID=309112624&Mytoken=10994B98-7CB5-D607-7865FF94A842FBEE62318534
very good example. Anyway since they're filming over here too there are a lot of Italian towns which are even more similar to France than Czech towns (for obvious reasons, since we're sharing borders!
It wouldn't be much of a problem to recreate the ambience of a French town here.
There are plenty of towns in the Piedmont region (Where I was born) and in Tuscany that look a lot like France.
Although I still hope they go to Sorrento and Positano and Costiera Amalfitana to film a fantastic car chase scene!!
No we don't. B-)
Michael Lonsdale is a very good actor indeed. I enjoyed his rather cold, deadpan portrayal of Hugo Drax in Moonraker. And yes, he was first rate in The Day Of The Jackal.
However, I would prefer that Eon do not re-cast old actors/actresses in new roles. But having said that, I am not bothered (for example) by Maud Adams portraying two different characters in two seperate Bond films. So, what do I know?
I think (and hope) that he was innocent, I really liked his character.
I believe he'll turn out to be innocent as well. Because the more and more I think about it, the more I believe LeChiffre's kidnapping of Vesper wasn't staged but real -- he thought she had double-crossed him and given Bond the extra $5 million to buy back in, not knowing that it was Leiter. If Mathis had been on LeChiffre's payroll, he would have tipped off LeChiffre about Leiter staking Bond, I think. That would also help explain why LeChiffre felt he had to tell Bond that Mathis was his friend: he didn't want him to suspect that his girlfriend had in fact betrayed him.
But it's all pretty loopy right now. If Bond had died in the crash, there'd be no password to get. If Vesper wasn't working with LeChiffre, whey did he separate her from Bond? Wouldn't he have been more likely to crack with Vesper being tortured in front of him, too? She must have been working with White already since only seconds occur between the elimination of LeChiffre's crew and his own demise -- hardly time for Vesper to negotiate a new deal. But, then if she was already working with White, why even kill LeChiffre when Vesper would have gotten the money from Bond anyway? To make a point? That is in the novel and suggested by White's own words, but it seems rather unnecessary when all he wants is the money (he ain't SMERSH after all). White must have been watching LeChiffre or else he wouldn't have known where he'd taken Bond and Vesper -- if so, then why even let LeChiffre kidnap them when it would have been easier to get the money from Bond/Vesper? And, for that, how did he know that LeChiffre hadn't yet sweated the password out of Bond?
There's enough ambiguity to make one's head spin. Regardless, I suspect Mathis will be innocent . . . and ultimately suffer the fate of most of Bond's true allies.
That's what I thought, too. But at my last viewing it occurred to me that Leiter gave Bond the money to get back into the game. If Vesper was working for LeChiffre, it was to neutralize Bond by not giving Bond the additional money if he lost. As we see in the film, she refuses to stake Bond again. But Leiter intercedes and gives him the money. If LeChiffre didn't know that, he would have assumed that Vesper double-crossed him and gave Bond the additional stake after all. He kidnaps her. Let's say she tells LeChiffre it wasn't her (she doesn't know where Bond got the money). He doesn't believe her, of course and then, realizing that Bond is pursuing him, puts her in the road so that Bond will stop and can be captured. I don't believe, as Gassy suggests, that he wanted Bond to run her over. There's really no reason for him think that Bond would crash or run her over, but he would be likely to believe he would stop to save her.
But you are right about loopy, Gassy. The ending is certainly ambiguous. Makes it kind of interesting.