"He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
Speaking of the score, listen to Wine With Stacey somewhat loudly. YOU CAN HEAR THE PERSON BREATHING! It's rather annoying, and such a beautiful piece too.
The flautist is Susan Milan; it's a beautiful cue, to be sure. I think it may be her on "Kara Meets Bond" from TLD, too.
Alas, was James Bond. Assuming he'd never quit the role (any of the times he actually did just that!) he'd have been too old round about... when? If we say the same age Roger Moore retired at, that would make TLD his last 007 film- who should have replaced him at that point? Brosnan seems the logical choice, given that he had been under very active consideration for that exact film. Or should Sir Sean have hung around into his 60s?
Speaking of the score, listen to Wine With Stacey somewhat loudly. YOU CAN HEAR THE PERSON BREATHING! It's rather annoying, and such a beautiful piece too.
The flautist is Susan Milan; it's a beautiful cue, to be sure. I think it may be her on "Kara Meets Bond" from TLD, too.
I think so too! I was listening to that one the other day and heard the breathing. I was like SHE RETURNS!!! Seriously, beautiful as the music she plays, the breathing really detracts from the overall enjoyment.
I think so too! I was listening to that one the other day and heard the breathing. I was like SHE RETURNS!!! Seriously, beautiful as the music she plays, the breathing really detracts from the overall enjoyment.
Naah, I can live with that. I think the recording engineer should be faulted rather than the player- clearly, she has to breathe! This was the 80s, when digital recording was only in its infancy (Barry's first digital score had been six years earlier).
Alas, was James Bond. Assuming he'd never quit the role (any of the times he actually did just that!) he'd have been too old round about... when? If we say the same age Roger Moore retired at, that would make TLD his last 007 film- who should have replaced him at that point? Brosnan seems the logical choice, given that he had been under very active consideration for that exact film. Or should Sir Sean have hung around into his 60s?
Sir Sean should have quit after TB. He was a great Bond in the first four films, but from then on he was just a pale imitation.
Let's suppose Connery kept his motivation going and had the physical appearance and fitness to match. Under those circumstances he could have played Bond right through to AVTAK. But even as popular as Connery was (and still is) would the audience have accepted him in the role for so long? Bond box office history has shown that after four films it's a case of diminishing returns. Connery's highest grossing film was TB (his fourth), Roger Moore's highest grossing film was MR (his fourth), Pierce Brosnan's highest grossing film was DAD (his fourth). Of course, Brosnan never made a fifth but I would suggest there's more than a 50-50 chance it would have grossed less than DAD.
Let's suppose Connery kept his motivation going and had the physical appearance and fitness to match. Under those circumstances he could have played Bond right through to AVTAK. But even as popular as Connery was (and still is) would the audience have accepted him in the role for so long? Bond box office history has shown that after four films it's a case of diminishing returns. Connery's highest grossing film was TB (his fourth), Roger Moore's highest grossing film was MR (his fourth), Pierce Brosnan's highest grossing film was DAD (his fourth). Of course, Brosnan never made a fifth but I would suggest there's more than a 50-50 chance it would have grossed less than DAD.
Good point. Perhaps there's a case to be made that the frequent changes of actor have contributed to the success of the Bond series, keeping it fresh and interesting to the general viewers (although not always to the delight of the hardcore fans).
Let's suppose Connery kept his motivation going and had the physical appearance and fitness to match. Under those circumstances he could have played Bond right through to AVTAK. But even as popular as Connery was (and still is) would the audience have accepted him in the role for so long? Bond box office history has shown that after four films it's a case of diminishing returns. Connery's highest grossing film was TB (his fourth), Roger Moore's highest grossing film was MR (his fourth), Pierce Brosnan's highest grossing film was DAD (his fourth). Of course, Brosnan never made a fifth but I would suggest there's more than a 50-50 chance it would have grossed less than DAD.
Good point. Perhaps there's a case to be made that the frequent changes of actor have contributed to the success of the Bond series, keeping it fresh and interesting to the general viewers (although not always to the delight of the hardcore fans).
Oddly enough, Sean Connery was Bond at the same time as OP in NSNA. Being all of twelve-years old at the time, I was more familiar with Moore as Bond. I knew Sean was the original, but it wasn't his age that distracted me from his being Bond. I didn't see either him or Moore as 'old' - I was a kid...everyone was older than me it seemed. What I disliked about NSNA at the time was the lack of the signature elements (theme, gunbarrel, Desmond as Q). Put NSNA's Connery in OP and I would accept him just as much as I do Moore.
Sir Sean should have quit after TB. He was a great Bond in the first four films, but from then on he was just a pale imitation.
I thought he was brilliant in DAF and very good in YOLT, so really, I'm happy that he did the number of films that he did. (Although I would have loved for him to have done OHMSS.)
Of the six Bonds, apart from Connery, I would have preferred Lazenby not do OHMSS, I would have preferred Moore step down after OP, I would have preferred Dalton not be James Bond, I would have preferred Brosnan do a fifth film (either CR or another film back in 2004), and I would have preferred that Craig not be Bond.
"He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
Sir Sean should have quit after TB. He was a great Bond in the first four films, but from then on he was just a pale imitation.
I thought he was brilliant in DAF and very good in YOLT, so really, I'm happy that he did the number of films that he did. (Although I would have loved for him to have done OHMSS.)
To be fair, Dan. I quite like Sean Connery in DAF. I tend to believe he adjusted his performance to suit the lighter tone of the film, but he definitely should have lost some weight. There are some great Connery/Bond moments. There's the lift/elevator fight with Peter Franks, standing on top of the lift/elevator outside the Whyte House, trapped in the burning coffin, shooting Blofeld's double with the piton gun.
As for Connery in YOLT. It's the worst performance (I really mean non-performance) by a Bond actor in the entire series. He clearly had lost interest and motivation and made no effort to disguise his feelings in front of the camera, which was shameful.
I would also have loved Connery to do OHMSS, but only if he was fully motivated. Quite a number of fans believe he could/would not have convincingly handled the emotional aspects of the film, but I disagree with this point of view.
LoeffelholzThe United States, With LovePosts: 8,998Quartermasters
edited February 2007
I agree, MNL. Connery's performance in DAF was fine as far as I'm concerned, given the material. And I mind his performance in YOLT less than pretty much anyone here with whom I've discussed the matter...
I have enough faith in his acting chops to imagine his being able to pull off OHMSS (particularly the final scene), but I'm not at all sure that the audience in general would have bought it---regardless of his performance. The departure in tone from the rest of the Bond films was just too pronounced, IMO. It's probably just as well that an unknown did that particular film.
As for MR/OP...there are plenty of enjoyable Bond moments in each to merit they repeated viewings I continue to give them
Check out my Amazon author page!Mark Loeffelholz
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
I think Connery would have been able to handle OHMSS just fine, and would have been re-energized by the script's lack of emphasis on gadgetry and spectacle. The character of James Bond was so secondary to the action and lack of logic in YOLT that it would be hard to fault an actor for his lack of enthusiasm. With Bond getting back down to earth in OHMSS, it would have been a great opportunity for Connery, one I think he would have performed excellently.
That being said, I have no problem with OHMSS and George Lazenby. Rough around the edges, sure. But the film remains in my personal top five of the series.
As for MR/OP...there are plenty of enjoyable Bond moments in each to merit they repeated viewings I continue to give them
"Plenty" of Bond moments? What defines a Bond moment them?
Well, now you've put me in an uncomfortable postion: defending my least favourite Bond actor---and correspondingly, my least favourite Bond films :v But I'll give it a go...
I suppose I'd define a Bond moment as just that: a moment which quintessentially belongs to James Bond---i.e., not generally something you'd see in other films---where he does something especially cool, humorous or ruthless: and the audience nods in recognition.
OP examples: Bond, sliding down the curved banister with the machine gun. He spots the big knob on the end---a potential threat to little James---and shoots it off before he gets there.
During the safari sequence: a tiger threatens Bond, he points, says "sit!"...and the tiger does.
The Acrostar mini-jet, leading the missile into the hangar where his sabotage target is parked---and obliquely accomplishing his mission...whilst escaping through closing doors by the narrowest of margins.
In MR: Bond's escape from the centrifuge...and subsequent disregard for Holly Goodhead's platitudes.
The fight in Venini Glass.
The parachute-less free-fall, where he steals the baddie's chute.
Perhaps I was being generous by saying "plenty," but I'm forever fighting the misconception that I'm a Moore hater...sadly, every Bond from MR to AVTAK has far too many bad Bond moments, in my view---i.e., thing so silly and cheesy that they only appear in Bond films of a certain era* :v
Hi JFF!
*Which is certainly debatable, since every Bond after AVTAK has specific 'bad Bond moments' as well, in my view---with the notable exception of CR, which strikes me as perhaps the least self-conscious Bond film since the early '60's.
Check out my Amazon author page!Mark Loeffelholz
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
As for Connery in YOLT. It's the worst performance (I really mean non-performance) by a Bond actor in the entire series. He clearly had lost interest and motivation and made no effort to disguise his feelings in front of the camera, which was shameful.
I guess I'm still one of the few people who thougt that Connery was terrific in YOLT.
I would also have loved Connery to do OHMSS, but only if he was fully motivated. Quite a number of fans believe he could/would not have convincingly handled the emotional aspects of the film, but I disagree with this point of view.
I agree that he could have as well. The question is, would he have wanted to?
"He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
with the notable exception of CR, which strikes me as perhaps the least self-conscious Bond film since the early '60's.
So, I guess telling the bartender "Do I look like I give a damn?" after he was asked if he wanted his drink shaken wasn't self-conscious in th least? ) And let's not forget the ending. While I loved it, the fact that Bond walks up to a guy he just shot and says his name in a Bondian manner is also arguably self-conscious.
"He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
Which is certainly debatable, since every Bond after AVTAK has specific 'bad Bond moments' as well, in my view---with the notable exception of CR, which strikes me as perhaps the least self-conscious Bond film since the early '60's.
Well, CR has one specific 'bad Bond moment' and that's the defibrilator sequence. It starts of very well when Bond realises his drink has been spiked. He leaves the card table grabs a glass and a salt container then goes to the bathroom to make himself throw up the poison. This is where the sequence should have ended. Instead we get the farce of Bond stumbling to the Aston Martin then trying to connect the defibrilator with numerous MI6 people (who rather conveniently happen to be immediately available with the right medical knowledge) shouting instructions at him. When Vesper Lynd suddenly appears and saves the day Bond makes a miraculously quick recovery (considering he's just had virtual cardiac arrest) and goes straight back to the card table.
As for CR being perhaps the least conscious Bond film since the early '60's. You may be right, but I will add the Aston Martin DB5 to those that Dan mentioned.
Which is certainly debatable, since every Bond after AVTAK has specific 'bad Bond moments' as well, in my view---with the notable exception of CR, which strikes me as perhaps the least self-conscious Bond film since the early '60's.
Well, CR has one specific 'bad Bond moment' and that's the defibrilator sequence. It starts of very well when Bond realises his drink has been spiked. He leaves the card table grabs a glass and a salt container then goes to the bathroom to make himself throw up the poison. This is where the sequence should have ended. Instead we get the farce of Bond stumbling to the Aston Martin then trying to connect the defibrilator with numerous MI6 people (who rather conveniently happen to be immediately available with the right medical knowledge) shouting instructions at him. When Vesper Lynd suddenly appears and saves the day Bond makes a miraculously quick recovery (considering he's just had virtual cardiac arrest) and goes straight back to the card table.
As for CR being perhaps the least conscious Bond film since the early '60's. You may be right, but I will add the Aston Martin DB5 to those that Dan mentioned.
I really didn't like that scene either and agree it should have ended at him throwing up. Coupled with the pointless tracking device stuck in his arm. Otherwise there was "bad moments".
Perhaps I was being generous by saying "plenty," but I'm forever fighting the misconception that I'm a Moore hater...sadly, every Bond from MR to AVTAK has far too many bad Bond moments, in my view---i.e., thing so silly and cheesy that they only appear in Bond films of a certain era* :v
Hi JFF!
At least you're not a Moore hater. Sure AVTAK and every other film has a few clunker moments here or there, but for the most part, in my opinion, all of Moore's films are great or tolerable, the only one I dislike is TMWTGG.
If we're talking Bad Bond Moments, I can think of one thing that I can call a Bad Bond Moment.
Licence to Kill wasn't really a Bad Bond moment, sorry JFF, but I will defend this film to the death if I have to xD.
It was just very different from the rest of the Bond films, with Dalton playing a darker bond. it all depends on people's oppinions on what they want Bond to be like
LoeffelholzThe United States, With LovePosts: 8,998Quartermasters
with the notable exception of CR, which strikes me as perhaps the least self-conscious Bond film since the early '60's.
So, I guess telling the bartender "Do I look like I give a damn?" after he was asked if he wanted his drink shaken wasn't self-conscious in th least? )
No. I really don't think it was. It's a guy who's just lost his gambling capital---failed his mission---wanting a drink, and being impatient about it. I thought his reading of the line was spot-on, given the situation. It got a laugh from the audience because of a history created by 20 prior films, but I think that those unfamiliar with previous Bonds would have been oblivious to any 'extra' meaning.
While I loved it, the fact that Bond walks up to a guy he just shot and says his name in a Bondian manner is also arguably self-conscious.
I'll certainly argue that it wasn't Mr. White asks, "Who is this?" and Bond answers the question---first with a gunshot to the knee, and then in words. One of the best deliveries in 21 films, IMRO.
To me, 'self-conscious' is defined by Roger Moore or Pierce Brosnan saying "Bond...James Bond," and doing everything except winking directly into camera.
Check out my Amazon author page!Mark Loeffelholz
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
LoeffelholzThe United States, With LovePosts: 8,998Quartermasters
Well, CR has one specific 'bad Bond moment' and that's the defibrilator sequence. It starts of very well when Bond realises his drink has been spiked. He leaves the card table grabs a glass and a salt container then goes to the bathroom to make himself throw up the poison. This is where the sequence should have ended. Instead we get the farce of Bond stumbling to the Aston Martin then trying to connect the defibrilator with numerous MI6 people (who rather conveniently happen to be immediately available with the right medical knowledge) shouting instructions at him. When Vesper Lynd suddenly appears and saves the day Bond makes a miraculously quick recovery (considering he's just had virtual cardiac arrest) and goes straight back to the card table.
I minded this less than you did; IMO it did suffer from a lack of set-up, as we Bond fans are accustomed to it: Bond gets the briefing from Q, and rolls his eyes in boredom when Q points out the defibrillator in the glove box. As for his quick recovery...to me that's a Bond moment, :007) particularly when his first question is to ask Vesper if she's okay B-)
As for CR being perhaps the least conscious Bond film since the early '60's. You may be right, but I will add the Aston Martin DB5 to those that Dan mentioned.
Here again, the self-consciousness is far from overpowering, IMO, since those who haven't seen previous Bonds would think nothing of the DB5 Bond wins in the card game...although they might wonder why MI6 provides 007 a brand new Aston for the mission; definitely one Aston Martin too many...the mission car should have been a new Bentley :007)
Check out my Amazon author page!Mark Loeffelholz
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
Well, CR has one specific 'bad Bond moment' and that's the defibrilator sequence. It starts of very well when Bond realises his drink has been spiked. He leaves the card table grabs a glass and a salt container then goes to the bathroom to make himself throw up the poison. This is where the sequence should have ended. Instead we get the farce of Bond stumbling to the Aston Martin then trying to connect the defibrilator with numerous MI6 people (who rather conveniently happen to be immediately available with the right medical knowledge) shouting instructions at him. When Vesper Lynd suddenly appears and saves the day Bond makes a miraculously quick recovery (considering he's just had virtual cardiac arrest) and goes straight back to the card table.
I had the same complaints about this sequence as you. I also had one other problem with it; it proved just how pointless and idiotic the tracking device was. If Bond hadn't gone to the car, tracking device or no tracking device, he probably would have died. I couldn't see a point to the tracking device at all.
As for CR being perhaps the least conscious Bond film since the early '60's. You may be right, but I will add the Aston Martin DB5 to those that Dan mentioned.
I agree that the Aston Martin DB5 was also self-conscious, but I will have to side with Loeff on this. While self-conscious, I think it was far less so than other moments in previous films (as well as other moments in CR; such as the bar scene and the end.)
"He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
No. I really don't think it was. It's a guy who's just lost his gambling capital---failed his mission---wanting a drink, and being impatient about it. I thought his reading of the line was spot-on, given the situation. It got a laugh from the audience because of a history created by 20 prior films, but I think that those unfamiliar with previous Bonds would have been oblivious to any 'extra' meaning.
Perhaps, but who really could have been unfamilair with such an aspect? Vodka Martini, shaken not stirred, it's become like a cliche. I do agree with you that it is nowhere nearly as cheesy as some of the moments in other films like TMWTGG and AVTAK, and I also don't think that it is a bad moment in the way that the "You just killed James Bond!" moment in DAF is bad, but I think that if one defines 'bad Bond moments' as moments that are self-conscious, then I think that this is one of them.
That said, I think that as more and more Bond films have been made, it has become harder to be completely non-self-conscious. Afterall, which other series has the fans expecting to see the hero order a particular drink or say his name in a particular way? (But then again, there are degrees to the self-consciousness.)
I'll certainly argue that it wasn't Mr. White asks, "Who is this?" and Bond answers the question---first with a gunshot to the knee, and then in words. One of the best deliveries in 21 films, IMRO.
To me, 'self-conscious' is defined by Roger Moore or Pierce Brosnan saying "Bond...James Bond," and doing everything except winking directly into camera.
True. I do think that Moore and Brosnan (in some of their films, but not all) had a habbit of uttering the line in a really self-conscious manner. At the same time, I think that the audience wanting to hear this line and then getting really excited when Bond says it also suggests a degree of self-consciousness. I think that the line has featured a degree of self-consciousness ever since Connery started uttering it in every film. But that's fine, I have no problem with that. As long as it doesn't go OTT (which IMO in CR it did not) then I don't mind.
"He’s a man way out there in the blue, riding on a smile and a shoeshine. And when they start not smiling back—that’s an earthquake. and then you get yourself a couple of spots on your hat, and you’re finished. Nobody dast blame this man. A salesman is got to dream, boy. It comes with the territory." Death of a Salesman
Well, CR has one specific 'bad Bond moment' and that's the defibrilator sequence. It starts of very well when Bond realises his drink has been spiked. He leaves the card table grabs a glass and a salt container then goes to the bathroom to make himself throw up the poison. This is where the sequence should have ended. Instead we get the farce of Bond stumbling to the Aston Martin then trying to connect the defibrilator with numerous MI6 people (who rather conveniently happen to be immediately available with the right medical knowledge) shouting instructions at him. When Vesper Lynd suddenly appears and saves the day Bond makes a miraculously quick recovery (considering he's just had virtual cardiac arrest) and goes straight back to the card table.
The sequence is also medically inaccurate- the toxin should have put Bond into bradycardia, not tachycardia as one of the HQ staff says. The quick recovery is also miraculous, as you say.
That reminds me of the whole medical innacuracy with the Medula oblongata or whatever it was from TWINE. For me, issues like that are not a problem at all.
LoeffelholzThe United States, With LovePosts: 8,998Quartermasters
No. I really don't think it was. It's a guy who's just lost his gambling capital---failed his mission---wanting a drink, and being impatient about it. I thought his reading of the line was spot-on, given the situation. It got a laugh from the audience because of a history created by 20 prior films, but I think that those unfamiliar with previous Bonds would have been oblivious to any 'extra' meaning.
Perhaps, but who really could have been unfamilair with such an aspect? Vodka Martini, shaken not stirred, it's become like a cliche. I do agree with you that it is nowhere nearly as cheesy as some of the moments in other films like TMWTGG and AVTAK, and I also don't think that it is a bad moment in the way that the "You just killed James Bond!" moment in DAF is bad, but I think that if one defines 'bad Bond moments' as moments that are self-conscious, then I think that this is one of them.
We just disagree about that, I'm afraid. It's hardly fair to blame Craig and CR for what happened in previous films, and I'd never concede that this line is a 'bad Bond moment.' To place it alongside underwater tie-straightening, Tarzan yells, double-taking pigeons, et al., seems a double-standard to me.
Still, if this represents one of the most jarring moments of 'self-consciousness' in the film, I'd say my statement about CR being the least so since the early-mid Sixties holds up nicely {[]
And, if Eon had bowed to established convention---and had Q, M or someone else 'set up' the defibrillator for the audience---nobody would have had anything to complain about, since it would then fall into the same category as the wrist dart gun, the ejector seat...and all the other unlikely and/or outlandish gadgets which have saved Bond's hide over the years. Ironic, since portable defibrillators---when compared to super-magnetic watches---are fairly ubiquitous in our world.
Check out my Amazon author page!Mark Loeffelholz
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
Comments
The flautist is Susan Milan; it's a beautiful cue, to be sure. I think it may be her on "Kara Meets Bond" from TLD, too.
Alas, was James Bond. Assuming he'd never quit the role (any of the times he actually did just that!) he'd have been too old round about... when? If we say the same age Roger Moore retired at, that would make TLD his last 007 film- who should have replaced him at that point? Brosnan seems the logical choice, given that he had been under very active consideration for that exact film. Or should Sir Sean have hung around into his 60s?
I think so too! I was listening to that one the other day and heard the breathing. I was like SHE RETURNS!!! Seriously, beautiful as the music she plays, the breathing really detracts from the overall enjoyment.
Naah, I can live with that. I think the recording engineer should be faulted rather than the player- clearly, she has to breathe! This was the 80s, when digital recording was only in its infancy (Barry's first digital score had been six years earlier).
Sir Sean should have quit after TB. He was a great Bond in the first four films, but from then on he was just a pale imitation.
Let's suppose Connery kept his motivation going and had the physical appearance and fitness to match. Under those circumstances he could have played Bond right through to AVTAK. But even as popular as Connery was (and still is) would the audience have accepted him in the role for so long? Bond box office history has shown that after four films it's a case of diminishing returns. Connery's highest grossing film was TB (his fourth), Roger Moore's highest grossing film was MR (his fourth), Pierce Brosnan's highest grossing film was DAD (his fourth). Of course, Brosnan never made a fifth but I would suggest there's more than a 50-50 chance it would have grossed less than DAD.
Good point. Perhaps there's a case to be made that the frequent changes of actor have contributed to the success of the Bond series, keeping it fresh and interesting to the general viewers (although not always to the delight of the hardcore fans).
Oddly enough, Sean Connery was Bond at the same time as OP in NSNA. Being all of twelve-years old at the time, I was more familiar with Moore as Bond. I knew Sean was the original, but it wasn't his age that distracted me from his being Bond. I didn't see either him or Moore as 'old' - I was a kid...everyone was older than me it seemed. What I disliked about NSNA at the time was the lack of the signature elements (theme, gunbarrel, Desmond as Q). Put NSNA's Connery in OP and I would accept him just as much as I do Moore.
Of the six Bonds, apart from Connery, I would have preferred Lazenby not do OHMSS, I would have preferred Moore step down after OP, I would have preferred Dalton not be James Bond, I would have preferred Brosnan do a fifth film (either CR or another film back in 2004), and I would have preferred that Craig not be Bond.
To be fair, Dan. I quite like Sean Connery in DAF. I tend to believe he adjusted his performance to suit the lighter tone of the film, but he definitely should have lost some weight. There are some great Connery/Bond moments. There's the lift/elevator fight with Peter Franks, standing on top of the lift/elevator outside the Whyte House, trapped in the burning coffin, shooting Blofeld's double with the piton gun.
As for Connery in YOLT. It's the worst performance (I really mean non-performance) by a Bond actor in the entire series. He clearly had lost interest and motivation and made no effort to disguise his feelings in front of the camera, which was shameful.
I would also have loved Connery to do OHMSS, but only if he was fully motivated. Quite a number of fans believe he could/would not have convincingly handled the emotional aspects of the film, but I disagree with this point of view.
I have enough faith in his acting chops to imagine his being able to pull off OHMSS (particularly the final scene), but I'm not at all sure that the audience in general would have bought it---regardless of his performance. The departure in tone from the rest of the Bond films was just too pronounced, IMO. It's probably just as well that an unknown did that particular film.
As for MR/OP...there are plenty of enjoyable Bond moments in each to merit they repeated viewings I continue to give them
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
That being said, I have no problem with OHMSS and George Lazenby. Rough around the edges, sure. But the film remains in my personal top five of the series.
Well, now you've put me in an uncomfortable postion: defending my least favourite Bond actor---and correspondingly, my least favourite Bond films :v But I'll give it a go...
I suppose I'd define a Bond moment as just that: a moment which quintessentially belongs to James Bond---i.e., not generally something you'd see in other films---where he does something especially cool, humorous or ruthless: and the audience nods in recognition.
OP examples: Bond, sliding down the curved banister with the machine gun. He spots the big knob on the end---a potential threat to little James---and shoots it off before he gets there.
During the safari sequence: a tiger threatens Bond, he points, says "sit!"...and the tiger does.
The Acrostar mini-jet, leading the missile into the hangar where his sabotage target is parked---and obliquely accomplishing his mission...whilst escaping through closing doors by the narrowest of margins.
In MR: Bond's escape from the centrifuge...and subsequent disregard for Holly Goodhead's platitudes.
The fight in Venini Glass.
The parachute-less free-fall, where he steals the baddie's chute.
Perhaps I was being generous by saying "plenty," but I'm forever fighting the misconception that I'm a Moore hater...sadly, every Bond from MR to AVTAK has far too many bad Bond moments, in my view---i.e., thing so silly and cheesy that they only appear in Bond films of a certain era* :v
Hi JFF!
*Which is certainly debatable, since every Bond after AVTAK has specific 'bad Bond moments' as well, in my view---with the notable exception of CR, which strikes me as perhaps the least self-conscious Bond film since the early '60's.
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
I agree that he could have as well. The question is, would he have wanted to?
So, I guess telling the bartender "Do I look like I give a damn?" after he was asked if he wanted his drink shaken wasn't self-conscious in th least?
Well, CR has one specific 'bad Bond moment' and that's the defibrilator sequence. It starts of very well when Bond realises his drink has been spiked. He leaves the card table grabs a glass and a salt container then goes to the bathroom to make himself throw up the poison. This is where the sequence should have ended. Instead we get the farce of Bond stumbling to the Aston Martin then trying to connect the defibrilator with numerous MI6 people (who rather conveniently happen to be immediately available with the right medical knowledge) shouting instructions at him. When Vesper Lynd suddenly appears and saves the day Bond makes a miraculously quick recovery (considering he's just had virtual cardiac arrest) and goes straight back to the card table.
As for CR being perhaps the least conscious Bond film since the early '60's. You may be right, but I will add the Aston Martin DB5 to those that Dan mentioned.
I really didn't like that scene either and agree it should have ended at him throwing up. Coupled with the pointless tracking device stuck in his arm. Otherwise there was "bad moments".
At least you're not a Moore hater. Sure AVTAK and every other film has a few clunker moments here or there, but for the most part, in my opinion, all of Moore's films are great or tolerable, the only one I dislike is TMWTGG.
If we're talking Bad Bond Moments, I can think of one thing that I can call a Bad Bond Moment.
Licence to Kill
Hi Loeff!
It was just very different from the rest of the Bond films, with Dalton playing a darker bond. it all depends on people's oppinions on what they want Bond to be like
I love Roger Moore...just not as James Bond
No. I really don't think it was. It's a guy who's just lost his gambling capital---failed his mission---wanting a drink, and being impatient about it. I thought his reading of the line was spot-on, given the situation. It got a laugh from the audience because of a history created by 20 prior films, but I think that those unfamiliar with previous Bonds would have been oblivious to any 'extra' meaning.
Oh, absolutely not. I'll never forget it
I'll certainly argue that it wasn't
To me, 'self-conscious' is defined by Roger Moore or Pierce Brosnan saying "Bond...James Bond," and doing everything except winking directly into camera.
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
I minded this less than you did; IMO it did suffer from a lack of set-up, as we Bond fans are accustomed to it: Bond gets the briefing from Q, and rolls his eyes in boredom when Q points out the defibrillator in the glove box. As for his quick recovery...to me that's a Bond moment, :007) particularly when his first question is to ask Vesper if she's okay B-)
Here again, the self-consciousness is far from overpowering, IMO, since those who haven't seen previous Bonds would think nothing of the DB5 Bond wins in the card game...although they might wonder why MI6 provides 007 a brand new Aston for the mission; definitely one Aston Martin too many...the mission car should have been a new Bentley :007)
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
I agree that the Aston Martin DB5 was also self-conscious, but I will have to side with Loeff on this.
That said, I think that as more and more Bond films have been made, it has become harder to be completely non-self-conscious. Afterall, which other series has the fans expecting to see the hero order a particular drink or say his name in a particular way?
Me neither.
True. I do think that Moore and Brosnan (in some of their films, but not all) had a habbit of uttering the line in a really self-conscious manner. At the same time, I think that the audience wanting to hear this line and then getting really excited when Bond says it also suggests a degree of self-consciousness. I think that the line has featured a degree of self-consciousness ever since Connery started uttering it in every film. But that's fine, I have no problem with that. As long as it doesn't go OTT (which IMO in CR it did not) then I don't mind.
The sequence is also medically inaccurate- the toxin should have put Bond into bradycardia, not tachycardia as one of the HQ staff says. The quick recovery is also miraculous, as you say.
We just disagree about that, I'm afraid. It's hardly fair to blame Craig and CR for what happened in previous films, and I'd never concede that this line is a 'bad Bond moment.' To place it alongside underwater tie-straightening, Tarzan yells, double-taking pigeons, et al., seems a double-standard to me.
Still, if this represents one of the most jarring moments of 'self-consciousness' in the film, I'd say my statement about CR being the least so since the early-mid Sixties holds up nicely {[]
And, if Eon had bowed to established convention---and had Q, M or someone else 'set up' the defibrillator for the audience---nobody would have had anything to complain about, since it would then fall into the same category as the wrist dart gun, the ejector seat...and all the other unlikely and/or outlandish gadgets which have saved Bond's hide over the years. Ironic, since portable defibrillators---when compared to super-magnetic watches---are fairly ubiquitous in our world.
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM