A question about QoS and the tell
Jonny1980
Posts: 3MI6 Agent
Firstly I apologise if this is discussed elsewhere. I often find myself reading these forums, but have never posted before.
I thought QoS was fantastic, saw the BFI screening last Wednesday, and went back to see it on Friday at Leicester square again.
In my opinion the film is different, but in a good way and leaves you wanting more. Like DC said in an interview he would welcome the return of Moneypenny and Q, but we have to earn them. I think this could apply to many elements of the films that we love so much. I am confident that by the curtain call after Bond 23, a firm foundation will have been built for many of these elements to make a welcome return.
I do have a question that I cannot answer though, hence I make this post.
In QoS, we find out that Mathis was actually not rogue, and hadn’t told Le Chiffre that Bond new his ‘tell’.
So I went back to Casino Royale to try and get my head around this. Bond confided in both Vesper and Mathis that he new Le Chiffre’s tell. Le Chiffre then uses it to double bluff Bond causing him to bet all in against a strong hand.
At the dinner seen, Bond realises that Mathis talked. Yet we find out now he was innocent and couldn’t have done.
Therefore it must have been Vesper.
However, it is my understanding that Vesper was innocent of all involvement, and was merely a civil servant up until the kidnapping scene, where she has her life spared and her Boyfriend’s life if she agrees to get the money for Quantum.
This means she wasn’t working with Le Chiffre at the time of the Poker game, so who gave away the Tell.
Either, Le Chiffre created the tell, and assumed Bond would read into it. He knew Bond would be looking for one, so create one and use it to his advantage.
or
Vesper is actually involved with Quantum from an earlier stage. If she was, then why would Le Chiffre need to kidnap her. Surely then she wasn’t working with them until that scene. Who actually texts her in the restaurant, when she says ‘Mathis needs me’?
or
The film has a continuity error and doesn’t tie up with Casino Royale.
or
I’m missing something glaringly obvious, then forgive me!
I thought QoS was fantastic, saw the BFI screening last Wednesday, and went back to see it on Friday at Leicester square again.
In my opinion the film is different, but in a good way and leaves you wanting more. Like DC said in an interview he would welcome the return of Moneypenny and Q, but we have to earn them. I think this could apply to many elements of the films that we love so much. I am confident that by the curtain call after Bond 23, a firm foundation will have been built for many of these elements to make a welcome return.
I do have a question that I cannot answer though, hence I make this post.
In QoS, we find out that Mathis was actually not rogue, and hadn’t told Le Chiffre that Bond new his ‘tell’.
So I went back to Casino Royale to try and get my head around this. Bond confided in both Vesper and Mathis that he new Le Chiffre’s tell. Le Chiffre then uses it to double bluff Bond causing him to bet all in against a strong hand.
At the dinner seen, Bond realises that Mathis talked. Yet we find out now he was innocent and couldn’t have done.
Therefore it must have been Vesper.
However, it is my understanding that Vesper was innocent of all involvement, and was merely a civil servant up until the kidnapping scene, where she has her life spared and her Boyfriend’s life if she agrees to get the money for Quantum.
This means she wasn’t working with Le Chiffre at the time of the Poker game, so who gave away the Tell.
Either, Le Chiffre created the tell, and assumed Bond would read into it. He knew Bond would be looking for one, so create one and use it to his advantage.
or
Vesper is actually involved with Quantum from an earlier stage. If she was, then why would Le Chiffre need to kidnap her. Surely then she wasn’t working with them until that scene. Who actually texts her in the restaurant, when she says ‘Mathis needs me’?
or
The film has a continuity error and doesn’t tie up with Casino Royale.
or
I’m missing something glaringly obvious, then forgive me!
Comments
Bingo. Vesper was working for Quantum before she met Bond. Le Chiffre kidnapped her so that he could get Bond, he also wouldnt have cared if she lived or died. Hence why she was expendable enough to leave on the road. This is also how it was easy enough for Le Chiffre to capture her.
In the novel she gets a message from a waitress and goes and waits outside. Bond gets suspicious that Mathis would contact her and not both of them, and goes to investigate. I can imagine when Bond says "Mathis" he doesnt suspect him, merely questions that it was Mathis who sent the message.
But he's not innocent in either film...Mathis tells us that in QoS.
Mr. White moved in to kill Le Chiffre not only because his failure at the gambling table, but also because his financial failures indirectly killed an important Quantum client (Obanno), he was a big lead to Quantum that had MI6 and the CIA right on his tail, and he nearly rashly sacrificed an important Quantum mole in the British government (who by then had more of a chance to get the money while distracting a top MI6 operative).
Mathis was innocent, but Lynd told Mr. White who told Le Chiffre about James Bond's game-plan and other secrets (like the tracking device). It is true that Vesper Lynd was blackmailed into being a double agent for Quantum for at least 18 months, and it is confirmed that her boyfriend was a Quantum agent.
And Mr. White got the briefcase perhaps because it had a tracking device and floatation airbags, while he may have employed sophisticated surveillance devices to both help and hinder Le Chiffre (like inform Le Chiffre of Bond's tracker beacon because Mr. White had a satellite tracking device set on the same frequency as MI6's, while sending out a plane drone to observe the car chase and then to track down Le Chiffre's cars to the derelict barge).
But I understood that in QoS Mathis' girlfriend tells us that because he was arrested, tortured and found innocent he was given that luxury house/apartment at the first scene we see him in?
Plenty of people have been 'found' innocent when clearly they are not. Mitchell passes several lie-detector tests over the years, for example...it's not too far a stretch to assume that Mathis did too.