I was indisposed last night, but I just caught the latest episode online. Hmmm--Jack, Sawyer, and even Juliette getting pounded by interrogators: at times I thought I was watching 24! Anyway, this wasn't a great episode, but it as a fun one--I always enjoy seeing the other side of the situation in these time-travel episodes, and I think Stuart (or Stewart) is shaping up to be a pretty decent minor villain. I pretty much sat back and let it all unfold, knowing that it will all lead. . .somewhere. . .eventually. . .
That's pretty much become my MO as well; I've given up trying to guess where things will go because we rarely ever have all the pieces to make an informed guess. Best instead to let it unfold and just take it all in.
As to the episode, it felt like another filler to me. More issues were raised, not much of anything was resolved. It is nice to see Sayid back in action and watching Jack's back. Kate on the other hand has become the most tiresome character of the show, once again cutting and running and generally making things awkward for everybody else. Honestly, if the writers don't know what to do with her, maybe it would be better if they just cut her loose.
This is just one big circle. Had the wheel never been turned, none of this would of happened. Before they crashed on the island, they never were on the island in the '70s. But since the wheel was turned it altered time. Now, they have to un-alter time by blowing up the hydrogen bomb before the magnetic field is unleashed. If they are successful in destroying the "energy field" how will this alter the already screwed up time line?
It is starting to look like we'll be back where we started by the end of this season, which would make the events of the season largely meaningless. Hopefully, the writers have something a little more original in store.
Mr MartiniThat nice house in the sky.Posts: 2,707MI6 Agent
It is starting to look like we'll be back where we started by the end of this season, which would make the events of the season largely meaningless. Hopefully, the writers have something a little more original in store.
The way Jack was talking to "Freckles" if they set off the Hydrogen bomb, they would of never gotten on the plane in the first place. None of the survivors would of meet each other. Maybe the last season will be the moments before the plane crashed. We already know why some got on the plane , but would Hurley have won the Lotto and ended up in the looney bin? Would Locke ever have been paralyzied? Did Jacks dad ever die? The time line is about to be altered once more and this might be a an adjustment they either like, or they don't like and can't fix.
Some people would complain even if you hang them with a new rope
The way Jack was talking to "Freckles" if they set off the Hydrogen bomb, they would of never gotten on the plane in the first place. None of the survivors would of meet each other. Maybe the last season will be the moments before the plane crashed. We already know why some got on the plane , but would Hurley have won the Lotto and ended up in the looney bin? Would Locke ever have been paralyzied? Did Jacks dad ever die? The time line is about to be altered once more and this might be a an adjustment they either like, or they don't like and can't fix.
Quite honestly Mr. M, I don't think anything will change in a major way. At one point in last night's episode Richard Alpert told Sun that he saw Jack, Kate and the rest of the time stranded survivors die back in 1977. I interpret that to read that Jack succeeded in setting off the bomb and Alpert, seeing the resulting explosion, assumed that they all died. If that is in fact the case, the the bomb had already gone off 30 years ago, and it didn't change anything, at least not in a significant way.
Also, if you changed the course of history it would create one of those time loop paradoxes: ie, if Jack & company detonate the bomb and thus change history, then they never make it to the island. But if they never make it to the island, then they would never go back in time and detonate the bomb. But if the bomb is never detonated, then everything is reset again, Oceanic 815 crashes and we're right back where we started from. That's the time paradox.
I have a feeling that Faraday had other reasons for wanting to detonate the bomb and that the only way it will affect the survivors is to somehow propel them back to the present, where they will conveniently show up at some critical moment during the show's finale. Beyond that, I don't think much will change. But that's all just a guess as I'm sure we haven't been shown everything.
And here it is: the much-vaunted two-hour season finale! I wondered what would be in store: this being a J. J. Abrams production, might our heroes find themselves in a parallel universe, being investigated by the Fringe squad while Leonard Nimoy puts in a cameo appearance? No, it turns out we finally see Jacob (who I swear bears a passing resemblance to one Daniel Craig), who has a nasty habit of turning up at key moments in the main characters' lives. . .though why he's reading Flannery O'Connor's story about racism, "Everything that Rises Must Converge," while John takes his tumble out the window is beyond me.
Anyhoo, this season has literally come to an explosive end--two major characters could very well be dead, we're left with no clue what shape anyone will be in (or where they'll be) at the start of the next and final season, and, apparantly
John Locke really is dead--the Locke we've seen is just Jacob's old enemy in disguise!
My favorite bit in the episode was the discovery of Bernard and Rose, living "retired" in the jungle ("It's always something with you people," Rose says); and a quick search on Google revealed the identity of the crocodile-headed god of the statue: Sobek, the Egyptian god of water (specifically the Nile), and, by extension, fertility; and, of course, he's holding the ankh, the symbol of life. I'm not sure what Egyptians have to do with the island, but perhaps it's something that will be explained in 2010. So, until then. . .
Vox clamantis in deserto
Mr MartiniThat nice house in the sky.Posts: 2,707MI6 Agent
What a great episode. For a few moments I was thinking the
Hydrogen Bomb wouldn't explode
HB mentions Jacob and Daniel Craig. Funny thing is DC never crossed my mind. But, Sean Bean did. I guess all us Bond fans think alike in some form. So now we wait until 2010 and the final season of Lost. Destiny Found.
Some people would complain even if you hang them with a new rope
Mr MartiniThat nice house in the sky.Posts: 2,707MI6 Agent
A few other thoughts.
since the hydrogen bomb was so far down, do you think it would affect anyone except Juliet since it exploded? If the blast didn't work, Juliet would be the only one who would "die" to direct contact with radiation.
And what about are present day survivors? What effect will the
stabbing and burning of Jacob
have to do with the present time and possbile future of the island? I'm curious how the events on the island will effect season 6?
Will the survivors be back on the plane?
Will the plane still crash but have different results since it wasn't brought down to electromagnetic stuff?
Will the plane land in LA and the survivors have a different life?
Will the life be a good one?
Maybe the survivors will wish the plane crashed since the life they come back to will be very bad?
I come to this conclusion by the comment made by Farradays mom. Somthing to the effect of, if everyone isn't on the plane, then god help us. Only six people of the orginal 40+ were on the second plane, will this effect the future?
Only the final season will tell.
Some people would complain even if you hang them with a new rope
Potential Spoilers Below; if you haven't seen the episode you may not want to read this.
With regard to the hydrogen bomb, I think that its interaction with the pocket of energy below the station was more important than the actual explosion. Much as Desmond didn't die after blowing the hatch at the end of Season 2 (he was also right on top of the explosion when he threw the switch), its very possible that Juliet also survived. If fact, lots of people are saying that the eye we see opening up at the very very end was Juliet's.
With regard to Jacob, I found it interesting that he physically touched every person he visited in those flashbacks. I'm sure there was some significance to that and his fate will probably tie in to those visits. I'm also not so sure that he's dead yet; he practically seemed to goad Ben into stabbing him and the Locke-thing didn't seem happy at Jacob's final warning that "they're coming".
With regard to what happens to the survivors and whether or not events unfold differently, they really didn't give us enough clues to form an educated guess one way or another. If they all continue with their lives but are unhappy, that would be very much a rehash of the fourth season. I keep going back to Jacob touching them - maybe Oceanic 815 won't crash but they'll still have all of their memories of what happened while on the island, drawing them all back. Once again though, that will feel very similar to the first part of the fifth season if they go that route.
The finale was entertaining but also a little frustrating in its conclusion (which I'm sure is exactly what the producers wanted). The writers set up all these threads but very little was actually resolved. About the only big reveal was seeing that Locke was really dead and I kind of suspected that all along. Even Jacob; for all we see of him, we still don't really know anything about him or his mysterious friend. I know a cliffhanger is part and parcel for a season-ending show but given that we'll have to wait until January 2010 they could have at least thrown us an extra bone or two.
The presence of the giant Sobek statue and the Egyptian hieroglyphics has me wondering. . . Could Jacob, Richard, and Jacob's unnamed enemy actually be Egyptian gods? They are associated with the elements and aren't entirely immortal--remember, Osiris is murdered, hacked to bits, and brought back to life. Then again, this series really does amount to one massive mind____!
Vox clamantis in deserto
Mr MartiniThat nice house in the sky.Posts: 2,707MI6 Agent
^I was wondering that to HB. I was reading a little about Egyptian Gods myself. You might be onto something.
Some people would complain even if you hang them with a new rope
Mr MartiniThat nice house in the sky.Posts: 2,707MI6 Agent
Here's another thing I found about the Egyptian God angle:
The presence of the giant Sobek statue and the Egyptian hieroglyphics has me wondering. . . Could Jacob, Richard, and Jacob's unnamed enemy actually be Egyptian gods?
I think the Egyptian angle must have something to with it, but Richard says he has never aged because of Jacob. Allana referred to Richard as being called Ricardo, so I'm guessing he was on that ship (Spanish Galleon?) at the beginning of the episode.
JD, I'm pretty sure that Allana refers to him as "Ricardus"--the Latin form of Richard (remember, all the "Others" speak Latin). As for the ship--I'm no nautical expert, but it looked to be a bit big and of a later manufacture to be a galleon. But what do I know? For that matter, this is Lost--what does ANYONE know?
JD, I'm pretty sure that Allana refers to him as "Ricardus"--the Latin form of Richard (remember, all the "Others" speak Latin). As for the ship--I'm no nautical expert, but it looked to be a bit big and of a later manufacture to be a galleon. But what do I know? For that matter, this is Lost--what does ANYONE know?
You've got me there Hardy, I have no knowledge of Latin at all. What about Allana? Any meaning there? As far as I understood it, Jacob and Allana knew each other. That was her in the hospital, under all those bandages wasn't it?
Comments
That's pretty much become my MO as well; I've given up trying to guess where things will go because we rarely ever have all the pieces to make an informed guess. Best instead to let it unfold and just take it all in.
As to the episode, it felt like another filler to me. More issues were raised, not much of anything was resolved. It is nice to see Sayid back in action and watching Jack's back. Kate on the other hand has become the most tiresome character of the show, once again cutting and running and generally making things awkward for everybody else. Honestly, if the writers don't know what to do with her, maybe it would be better if they just cut her loose.
It is starting to look like we'll be back where we started by the end of this season, which would make the events of the season largely meaningless. Hopefully, the writers have something a little more original in store.
The way Jack was talking to "Freckles" if they set off the Hydrogen bomb, they would of never gotten on the plane in the first place. None of the survivors would of meet each other. Maybe the last season will be the moments before the plane crashed. We already know why some got on the plane , but would Hurley have won the Lotto and ended up in the looney bin? Would Locke ever have been paralyzied? Did Jacks dad ever die? The time line is about to be altered once more and this might be a an adjustment they either like, or they don't like and can't fix.
Quite honestly Mr. M, I don't think anything will change in a major way. At one point in last night's episode Richard Alpert told Sun that he saw Jack, Kate and the rest of the time stranded survivors die back in 1977. I interpret that to read that Jack succeeded in setting off the bomb and Alpert, seeing the resulting explosion, assumed that they all died. If that is in fact the case, the the bomb had already gone off 30 years ago, and it didn't change anything, at least not in a significant way.
Also, if you changed the course of history it would create one of those time loop paradoxes: ie, if Jack & company detonate the bomb and thus change history, then they never make it to the island. But if they never make it to the island, then they would never go back in time and detonate the bomb. But if the bomb is never detonated, then everything is reset again, Oceanic 815 crashes and we're right back where we started from. That's the time paradox.
I have a feeling that Faraday had other reasons for wanting to detonate the bomb and that the only way it will affect the survivors is to somehow propel them back to the present, where they will conveniently show up at some critical moment during the show's finale. Beyond that, I don't think much will change. But that's all just a guess as I'm sure we haven't been shown everything.
Anyhoo, this season has literally come to an explosive end--two major characters could very well be dead, we're left with no clue what shape anyone will be in (or where they'll be) at the start of the next and final season, and, apparantly
My favorite bit in the episode was the discovery of Bernard and Rose, living "retired" in the jungle ("It's always something with you people," Rose says); and a quick search on Google revealed the identity of the crocodile-headed god of the statue: Sobek, the Egyptian god of water (specifically the Nile), and, by extension, fertility; and, of course, he's holding the ankh, the symbol of life. I'm not sure what Egyptians have to do with the island, but perhaps it's something that will be explained in 2010. So, until then. . .
Will the plane still crash but have different results since it wasn't brought down to electromagnetic stuff?
Will the plane land in LA and the survivors have a different life?
Will the life be a good one?
Maybe the survivors will wish the plane crashed since the life they come back to will be very bad?
I come to this conclusion by the comment made by Farradays mom. Somthing to the effect of, if everyone isn't on the plane, then god help us. Only six people of the orginal 40+ were on the second plane, will this effect the future?
With regard to the hydrogen bomb, I think that its interaction with the pocket of energy below the station was more important than the actual explosion. Much as Desmond didn't die after blowing the hatch at the end of Season 2 (he was also right on top of the explosion when he threw the switch), its very possible that Juliet also survived. If fact, lots of people are saying that the eye we see opening up at the very very end was Juliet's.
With regard to Jacob, I found it interesting that he physically touched every person he visited in those flashbacks. I'm sure there was some significance to that and his fate will probably tie in to those visits. I'm also not so sure that he's dead yet; he practically seemed to goad Ben into stabbing him and the Locke-thing didn't seem happy at Jacob's final warning that "they're coming".
With regard to what happens to the survivors and whether or not events unfold differently, they really didn't give us enough clues to form an educated guess one way or another. If they all continue with their lives but are unhappy, that would be very much a rehash of the fourth season. I keep going back to Jacob touching them - maybe Oceanic 815 won't crash but they'll still have all of their memories of what happened while on the island, drawing them all back. Once again though, that will feel very similar to the first part of the fifth season if they go that route.
The finale was entertaining but also a little frustrating in its conclusion (which I'm sure is exactly what the producers wanted). The writers set up all these threads but very little was actually resolved. About the only big reveal was seeing that Locke was really dead and I kind of suspected that all along. Even Jacob; for all we see of him, we still don't really know anything about him or his mysterious friend. I know a cliffhanger is part and parcel for a season-ending show but given that we'll have to wait until January 2010 they could have at least thrown us an extra bone or two.
i aint got sky, so i've only seen as far as series 4.
Vive le droit à la libre expression! Je suis Charlie!
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The DVD and BluRay have a December 8, 2009 release date in the USA; I would expect a similar release date in the UK.
http://www.cabiz.net/heartlink/jacob_pillar_dna.htm
What do you think about that?
I think the Egyptian angle must have something to with it, but Richard says he has never aged because of Jacob. Allana referred to Richard as being called Ricardo, so I'm guessing he was on that ship (Spanish Galleon?) at the beginning of the episode.
You've got me there Hardy, I have no knowledge of Latin at all. What about Allana? Any meaning there? As far as I understood it, Jacob and Allana knew each other. That was her in the hospital, under all those bandages wasn't it?