WatchTime article thread suspended
Hardyboy
Posts: 5,906Chief of Staff
That thread was turning into an ugly fight. For the time being, it's gone.
Vox clamantis in deserto
This discussion has been closed.
Comments
Will it come back? Or are we subject to more Orwellian purging at the behest of Mr. Deaton. Or was he trying to erase again and got caught?
DG
"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." Richard Grenier after George Orwell, Washington Times 1993.
I also apologise for joining simply to respond. However, I hope it is clear why I did so.
Finally, Is it possible that, rather than removing it, you could consider simply locking it?
Yes I hope the thread was locked and saved and preserved for posterity without anyone being able to delete or change responses. I believe Watchtime would want to know about it. Please don't destroy the evidence.
DG
"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." Richard Grenier after George Orwell, Washington Times 1993.
No such communication from me. I was content to plow through as I was, Post by Post, answering and refuting each claim.
Should the Thread come back, I would appreciate at least as much opportunity to state my side of any issue as others are given here.
After all, AJB clearly seems to respect my work enough to continue to make available through your website the James Bond Omega watches article that I contributed here (and which remains an exclusive).
On the other hand, from what I'm seeing already above: What's the purpose of starting a new Thread that already seems to be headed in the same direction?
Thank you.
He's back. Mr. Deaton, you can still answer the question.
DG
"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." Richard Grenier after George Orwell, Washington Times 1993.
Please re-state your question.
O.K., that sounds good to me. I'm not ashamed of anything I've written, so you don't have to edit me. Unless, of course, you see it differently.
DG
"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." Richard Grenier after George Orwell, Washington Times 1993.
What's the point? You have not answered it in 3 or 4 pages of a now locked post. So just fade away. You've lost. Everyone now knows what you are about. There is no point in continuing, you just do yourself more damage. I'm truely sorry for you. You apparently don't even realise how sad you are. Go in peace. It is finished.
DG
"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." Richard Grenier after George Orwell, Washington Times 1993.
Thanks for the opportunity to state my case, I'm sorry it got so messy. Thanks Rick for letting me know.
Interesting site you have here guys.
Matt
Really? It seems just like when I left.
{[]
Except you have a new username, are you the real Dell Deaton or are you Spartacus?
Bond’s Beretta
The Handguns of Ian Fleming's James Bond
Ooh, sorry about that. I'm sure it would have been good. Please post it here.
DG
"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." Richard Grenier after George Orwell, Washington Times 1993.
No problem M4tt. If you like I can send you a copy. PM with your address, and you got it. Bontoys, don't worry, you can still have mine.
DG
"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." Richard Grenier after George Orwell, Washington Times 1993.
To my opinion, you have no reason to apologize. I am happy, that you made your point clear and have been very specific.
I think, that Mr. Deaton was so busy to snipe on everyone and everything from page 1 and 2 on the thread, that he had no occasion to read, what you have been asking from page 4 and on.
I can't believe, that I am still talking for him by the way.
So I suggest, you ask your question again as he may not have seen it.
Not really. Mr. Deaton had a minor rant here and the last thing was, that he left the forum majorly because of you and me and that I am not competent in choosing the correct watches for my webpage
And I reported him for using real names and running amok here. But I did not want the entire thread to be removed.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
Now I have a pressing reason for making a request:
Over at WUS Mr Deaton has stated that:
"Now, now: Come on, M4tt. In a Thread that's already definitively destroyed the fantasties of Richard dos Santos ("Donald Grant") w/ a clear statement that didn't use your work, you have to go and spoil it by suggesting that I somehow got you involved in the "other" Forum Thread that is now locked."
Either I missed this 'clear statement' or it didn't happen. I take this 'clear statement to be a denial of plagiarism. I saw no such denial, however, I could have missed it.
Did anyone else see a clear denial?
Moderators, This is the problem: this hidden thread may be bad tempered but it is also a record of what was actually said. Without that record it is difficult to establish the truth of assertions now being made.
There are two arguments of relevance here. The first concerns an accusation of theft of intellectual property. While I have not actually made this accusation I am becoming increasingly interested in the answer. I am acutely aware that this discussion is of little interest to this forum, except in as much as it bears on the question of the character of its members.
The second concerns a hypothesis about the watch that Fleming and, by extension, Bond may have worn. This discussion would, I think be of interest to this board.
As it stands Mr Deaton asserts it was a 1016 Rolex Explorer.
I claim that Fleming had at least two Explorers, one of which was a 1016 and the other of which was probably a 6350 and may well not have actually had 'Explorer' on the dial.
Now, the history of ideas is full of people arriving at very similar conclusions at about the same time so I would be slow to accuse Mr Deaton of stealing ideas. However, I have to admit that his failure to actually answer a very simple question does not look good.
He now claims to have done so, and is making conciliatory PMs to me, Can someone either confirm or refute this or release the information that will allow those with an interest to make up their own minds.
Please?
The mods on here do a fantastic, unpaid, and occasionally unappreciated job...
an essential job.
I for one followed (contributed) to the tread, but wasn't surprised that it quickly morphed into sewerage. It badly needed closing before someone put in print that which might later end up in court.
From memory, I doubt it got quite that far, but befoe it is re-instated, someone should cast a legal eye over it.
Once that's done satisfactorily, I feel M4tt has made a compelling case to have it re-instated, closed.
A closing word....this is easily the best, friendliest, and most professionally run bond collecting forum, on one of the (arguably the ) best bond fan sites on the web...
let's keep it that way...
The WatchTime article was completely my own, original work. Nothing you wrote had anything to do w/ it.
As far as comments about legal concerns and Moderation of this Forum, I wouldn't be dismissive of that. Unsubstantiated claims of "plagarism," which is, of course defamatory to my character, were made and allowed to perpetuate here. Then, suddenly, when I refuted them, the Thread was suddenly Closed.
Someone used the term "Orwellian" here. Yeah, that fits. Think of how many people have weighed in on this who have not even read my article. Think of how much easier it would have been to get copies than to go on and on here. Motives?
No, this is not a well-moderated Forum. I have "we screwed up" and "please come back" eMails from Simon dating back to my departure two years ago. It's outrageous to think that I'd have to come back here to Post what is really the simple question:
"Have you actually read the article?"
- or -
"What's your substantive basis for making what can otherwise be read as libelous charges?"
Sad.
now you are having a go on the mods. Who's next?
And I remember, that some of your terms in the recent discussions have not been role models for good behaviour, too.
I am 100% of the opinion of ke02eww - this forum is definitely the best and the fact that not everyone is bowing down in front of you has nothing to do with it's qualities.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
Well said. When people are not snowed by what Mr. Deaton says about them in secret, he's not happy.
DG
"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." Richard Grenier after George Orwell, Washington Times 1993.
As I said. Can't answer my questions?
Just preserving this for posterity. M4tt will have a look at the text and make up his own mind. Please, use my screen name from here on in. You have been warned.
Just to be clear, Mr. Deaton, are you saying that you did not appropriate M4tt's work on the literary Bond's Rolex over at WUS and use it for your Watchtime article?
DG
"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." Richard Grenier after George Orwell, Washington Times 1993.
Friendliest?
Well, there certainly are some here who are genuine and whole-heartedly decent.
However, there would also seem to be a number motivated by that human failing noted as "self interest".
Sadly, this is probably reflected in the quite limited number of regular contruibutors to the forum.
Absolutely.
Mr. Deaton, O.K., you realise, of course, that the evidence suggests that M4tt's work pre-dates your own. The evidence also shows that you were aware of what M4tt wrote and that you participated in that thread concerning his discovery. The evidence also suggests that you were upset and agitated with M4tt's discovery.
Now on to accuracy. The problem that I have always had with you is that you spread falshoods about the watches in Bond's world. The gold watch theory that you had was false. Now, it seems you published a falsehood with respect to the literary Bond's watch. The painting of Fleming pre-dates the introduction of the 1016 Explorer. So the watch on Fleming's wrist in that picture could not have been the 1016 Explorer. Do you have an explanation for this Mr. Deaton?
DG
"People sleep peacefully in their beds at night only because rough men stand ready to do violence on their behalf." Richard Grenier after George Orwell, Washington Times 1993.
The PM button can be found on the left hand side of the screen. Might I suggest you use this to continue the discussion in future, before the lot of you receive bans?
Thanks for your time.
@merseytart
Let me follow up my fellow moderator's post closing this topic ...
AJB is not a location in which to post defamatory comments about other members.
As a professional publisher myself, if you feel you have a complaint against a member who has written an article that is - in your opinion - plagiarised, then I insist you contact the publisher of that article.
They can be contacted by writing to:
WatchTime
Ebner Publishing International, Inc.
274 Madison Avenue, Suite 705
New York, NY 10016
USA
Any further comments defaming a member will be dealt with severely.