LTK is one of my favorites, it has a good villain, Bond is played well, it has gruesome deaths, it has some romance and it has one of the best leading ladies ever.
Would Fleming have written a revenge theme Bond, probably not, but I can overlook that as so much of the film is well done. As previously mentioned, Robert Davi is an excellent villain, violent and intelligent, a worthy foe for Bond. Dalton displays Bond's rage well, seeking justice, justice as Bond sees it. The deaths are creative and violent, a bad guy literally exploding inside a pressure chamber, who would have thought of that. Carey Lowell is beautiful and capable of assisting Bond, without trying to upstage him. I like the scene where she bursts through the door of the hotel room gun drawn after Bond has gone in to meet his "uncle" (Q) and after seeing everything is OK, saying "I thought I might have a mess to clean up". Sanchez's henchman, Dario, played by Bernicio Del Toro, is excellent, scary and deadly. LTK also has an excellent climatic battle as semi tractor trailer trucks do battle as they roll down a curvy mountain road, culminating in a mano a mano battle between Bond and Sanchez. Finally, I always loved the ending of the film where Bond jumps into the pool and pulls Pam Bouvier into the pool with him as Patti Labelle sings "If You Asked Me to", very romantic.
A lot of good elements puts LTK in my top 5 Bond films.
LTK is one of my favorites, it has a good villain, Bond is played well, it has gruesome deaths, it has some romance and it has one of the best leading ladies ever.
Would Fleming have written a revenge theme Bond, probably not, but I can overlook that as so much of the film is well done. As previously mentioned, Robert Davi is an excellent villain, violent and intelligent, a worthy foe for Bond. Dalton displays Bond's rage well, seeking justice, justice as Bond sees it. The deaths are creative and violent, a bad guy literally exploding inside a pressure chamber, who would have thought of that. Carey Lowell is beautiful and capable of assisting Bond, without trying to upstage him. I like the scene where she bursts through the door of the hotel room gun drawn after Bond has gone in to meet his "uncle" (Q) and after seeing everything is OK, saying "I thought I might have a mess to clean up". Sanchez's henchman, Dario, played by Bernicio Del Toro, is excellent, scary and deadly. LTK also has an excellent climatic battle as semi tractor trailer trucks do battle as they roll down a curvy mountain road, culminating in a mano a mano battle between Bond and Sanchez. Finally, I always loved the ending of the film where Bond jumps into the pool and pulls Pam Bouvier into the pool with him as Patti Labelle sings "If You Asked Me to", very romantic.
A lot of good elements puts LTK in my top 5 Bond films.
I agree with you 100%!!!! I love the grittiness, Q playing a large part in the story and Carey Lowell is a doll, a tough doll at that. And I'm an action fan. Bond is a man of action. This is a film that proves that.
LTK is one of my favorites, it has a good villain, Bond is played well, it has gruesome deaths, it has some romance and it has one of the best leading ladies ever.
Would Fleming have written a revenge theme Bond, probably not, but I can overlook that as so much of the film is well done. As previously mentioned, Robert Davi is an excellent villain, violent and intelligent, a worthy foe for Bond. Dalton displays Bond's rage well, seeking justice, justice as Bond sees it. The deaths are creative and violent, a bad guy literally exploding inside a pressure chamber, who would have thought of that. Carey Lowell is beautiful and capable of assisting Bond, without trying to upstage him. I like the scene where she bursts through the door of the hotel room gun drawn after Bond has gone in to meet his "uncle" (Q) and after seeing everything is OK, saying "I thought I might have a mess to clean up". Sanchez's henchman, Dario, played by Bernicio Del Toro, is excellent, scary and deadly. LTK also has an excellent climatic battle as semi tractor trailer trucks do battle as they roll down a curvy mountain road, culminating in a mano a mano battle between Bond and Sanchez. Finally, I always loved the ending of the film where Bond jumps into the pool and pulls Pam Bouvier into the pool with him as Patti Labelle sings "If You Asked Me to", very romantic.
A lot of good elements puts LTK in my top 5 Bond films.
Touché -{
Should also remember the little hint to OHMS (garter) – very moving scene and gives the whole revenge an extra dimension as he thinks about the death of Tracy…
I think LTK is one of the best Bond films ever. But it has weaknesses. Here are some things I would have liked to see instead of what we got:
- Les static and traditional framing of the shots and cutting.
Agreed. I mentioned before that the film does look deliberately retrograde- Siskel and Ebert commented on the art direction/photography. I am supposed to believe this film came out in '89. There are tons of films made before LTK that look far superior.
I'm a Dalton fan. Both his films had great action and plots, and were a welcome change to the franchise. Just like the Brosnan>Craig era too.
The tanker sequence is a standout for me, as is the whole boat scene from Bond sneaking in and planting the money, to the Milton Krest death (and Carey Lowell in her smalls ). I agree it has dated somewhat, Sanchez' house looks so 80s, and the bar scene is really weird too. Well actually the whole film looks 80s US, but I still really like it. Perhaps a different and stronger theme would have changed the feeling from the outset.
Bond might have gone roque but it is in favour of the task. It is very close to Fleming. Closer than any other Bond movie. The plot is very well put together. Great characters, a fantastic casting and some dark moments that make the movie stand out. It is definitely one of my top three favourites. And TLD isn't far from it. Mainly due to Daltons performance. But the plots for both of these films are so very well written. Especially LTK is a great Patchwork of a new and original plot and a shitload of precise moments taken right out of Flemings books. The series will never ever surpass the Connery and Dalton eras.
LTK is on my list as one of the very finest Bond films. Yes, it was different in tone and look from most of the other Bond movies, but I think that was one of the things that made it so enjoyable. Dalton was in top form and totally believable as Bond out for revenge. Not that I had grown tired of the Bond fomula, but it was time for a change of pace, and LTK provided just that. It has a very well-written, well-paced plot, and Robert Davi was excellent as Sanchez - twisted, sadistic (his whipping of Lupe made me cringe), yet strangely honorable (his appreciation for loyalty was a compelling trait). Carey Lowell was cute, yet formidable, as Pam, and I really enjoyed seeing Q playing a larger role in the plot. Even the minor villains played by Anthony Zerbe and Benicio Del Toro were interesting. The weakest element of the film for me was Talisa Soto- a gorgeous woman, but a terrible actress ("I love James so much!") After seeing Dalton in action in TLD and especially LTK, I was really excited about the prospect of seeing him as 007 in several more Bond films. How disappointing that things didn't turn out that way.
It was a disappointment for me when I saw it in theaters, though I didn't hate it and consider it a better Bond film than some. The Living Daylights, except for a weak villain, was a pretty good outing, and I thought that Timothy Dalton made for a good Bond at the time, but Licence to Kill came across as too much of a Miami Vice wannabe than the follow-up that I'd hoped for.
Parts that I liked:
Timothy Dalton as James Bond.
Opening sequence.
Assassination attempt on Sanchez.
Bond's interrogation scene with another, perhaps 00 British interrogator.
The Bond and Leiter dynamic.
Q doing a little more than hang around his work shop at headquarters.
Most of the stunts because they were not CGI.
Gladys Knight's "classic" movie theme/ballad
Parts I didn't like
Taliso Soto and Pam Barnes, both terrible.
Carey Lowell's Pam Bouvier, who was a bit too dry and Amazonian to temper the other actresses (traits which worked much more effectively on Law and Order.)
Sanchez as a Latin American thug -- again, Miami Vice pretty much showed this every week.
Michael Kamen's score, except for his rendition of the Bond theme.
In general unremarkable locations.
One has to remember that at the time, this movie's look and idea were pretty common in television and in film. In addition to Miami Vice, it's look and sensibilities reminded me of several movies, including To Live and Die in L.A. and a Richard Gere/Kim Basinger film called No Mercy.
The plot also seemed underdeveloped . . . they spent a great deal of time suggesting there would be a stronger relationship between Sanchez and Bond prior to Bond's "betrayal," and that there might actually be some more complex emotional ramifications. But the film quickly takes Bond from being an insider to being traitor. At the time, there was a show called Wiseguy that had basically played out a similar scenario but very effectively, and before people say "But they only had two hours to tell the story," TV's Mission: Impossible frequently did an effective job of showing complexity.
I totally agree on the Miami Vice influence and the 80's action influence in general. I really don't know why hard-core fans of LTK deny those aspects so much because they're so prevalent in the film. Hell, Licence To Kill's production value just screamed something that would have been spit out of Cannon Films. I don't think it's bad film but to call it a "Fleming film" is a gross exagerration.
I totally agree on the Miami Vice influence and the 80's action influence in general. I really don't know why hard-core fans of LTK deny those aspects so much because they're so prevalent in the film.
We don't deny it, we like it! Well, I do, anyway.
I don't think LTK is any worse off by being dated to the 80's than Roger Moore's movies were to the 70's, with their wide lapels, disco music action sequences, and questionable automotive choices (AMC Hornet, anyone?).
I totally agree on the Miami Vice influence and the 80's action influence in general. I really don't know why hard-core fans of LTK deny those aspects so much because they're so prevalent in the film.
We don't deny it, we like it! Well, I do, anyway.
I don't think LTK is any worse off by being dated to the 80's than Roger Moore's movies were to the 70's, with their wide lapels, disco music action sequences, and questionable automotive choices (AMC Hornet, anyone?).
Roger Moore's first two films in the 1970's were the only ones that looked very contemporary but the blaxplotation and kung-fu stuff bordered on the edge of parody. LTK was a straight-faced film that was being done a dime-dozen back then; Cheap looking and a having one-dimesonal human emotion with characters you don't care about getting slaughtered left and right.
I totally agree on the Miami Vice influence and the 80's action influence in general. I really don't know why hard-core fans of LTK deny those aspects so much because they're so prevalent in the film.
We don't deny it, we like it! Well, I do, anyway.
I don't think LTK is any worse off by being dated to the 80's than Roger Moore's movies were to the 70's, with their wide lapels, disco music action sequences, and questionable automotive choices (AMC Hornet, anyone?).
Roger Moore's first two films in the 1970's were the only ones that looked very contemporary but the blaxplotation and kung-fu stuff bordered on the edge of parody. LTK was a straight-faced film that was being done a dime-dozen back then; Cheap looking and a having one-dimesonal human emotion with characters you don't care about getting slaughtered left and right.
I rather cared for Della. She seemed sweet and appeared to have a genuine, plutonic affection for Bond.
I don't think LTK is any worse off by being dated to the 80's than Roger Moore's movies were to the 70's, with their wide lapels, disco music action sequences, and questionable automotive choices (AMC Hornet, anyone?).
Roger Moore's first two films in the 1970's were the only ones that looked very contemporary but the blaxplotation and kung-fu stuff bordered on the edge of parody. LTK was a straight-faced film that was being done a dime-dozen back then; Cheap looking and a having one-dimesonal human emotion with characters you don't care about getting slaughtered left and right.
I rather cared for Della. She seemed sweet and appeared to have a genuine, plutonic affection for Bond.
Those brief scenes with Bond, Della, and Felix were all so artificial that I don't see how you could feel any sympathy for them. Della's death and Felix's maiming got nothing from me because they were such non-entities.
Roger Moore's first two films in the 1970's were the only ones that looked very contemporary but the blaxplotation and kung-fu stuff bordered on the edge of parody. LTK was a straight-faced film that was being done a dime-dozen back then; Cheap looking and a having one-dimesonal human emotion with characters you don't care about getting slaughtered left and right.
I rather cared for Della. She seemed sweet and appeared to have a genuine, plutonic affection for Bond.
Those brief scenes with Bond, Della, and Felix were all so artificial that I don't see how you could feel any sympathy for them. Della's death and Felix's maiming got nothing from me because they were such non-entities.
Hmm well we'll have to disagree (again). I felt quite sympatheic towards the characters, especially the admittingly brief scene where Felix says to Della that "he (Bond) was married once but it was a long time ago". I thought that moment was quite poignant and showed how Bond and Felix had been through a lot together prior to his life with Della.
I rather cared for Della. She seemed sweet and appeared to have a genuine, plutonic affection for Bond.
Those brief scenes with Bond, Della, and Felix were all so artificial that I don't see how you could feel any sympathy for them. Della's death and Felix's maiming got nothing from me because they were such non-entities.
Hmm well we'll have to disagree (again). I felt quite sympatheic towards the characters, especially the admittingly brief scene where Felix says to Della that "he (Bond) was married once but it was a long time ago". I thought that moment was quite poignant and showed how Bond and Felix had been through a lot together prior to his life with Della.
That just reminded me how the artificial tragedy was going to pan out. Also, what has Bond and Felix gone through exactly over the years ? Nothing, at least according to the films. After Jack Lord, all they did was get a bunch of substitutes to play Leiter and all of them left no impression.
Those brief scenes with Bond, Della, and Felix were all so artificial that I don't see how you could feel any sympathy for them. Della's death and Felix's maiming got nothing from me because they were such non-entities.
Hmm well we'll have to disagree (again). I felt quite sympatheic towards the characters, especially the admittingly brief scene where Felix says to Della that "he (Bond) was married once but it was a long time ago". I thought that moment was quite poignant and showed how Bond and Felix had been through a lot together prior to his life with Della.
That just reminded me how the artificial tragedy was going to pan out. Also, what has Bond and Felix gone through exactly over the years ? Nothing, at least according to the films. After Jack Lord, all they did was get a bunch of substitutes to play Leiter and all of them left no impression.
Well Felix had been one of Bond's regular contacts in the older films and, despite the numerous actors that have played the character, he and Bond did have a cheery, friendly relationship that went beyond the call of duty.
I do agree though that the ever-changing faces of Felix did undermine the character somewhat.
Hmm well we'll have to disagree (again). I felt quite sympatheic towards the characters, especially the admittingly brief scene where Felix says to Della that "he (Bond) was married once but it was a long time ago". I thought that moment was quite poignant and showed how Bond and Felix had been through a lot together prior to his life with Della.
That just reminded me how the artificial tragedy was going to pan out. Also, what has Bond and Felix gone through exactly over the years ? Nothing, at least according to the films. After Jack Lord, all they did was get a bunch of substitutes to play Leiter and all of them left no impression.
Well Felix had been one of Bond's regular contacts in the older films and, despite the numerous actors that have played the character, he and Bond did have a cheery, friendly relationship that went beyond the call of duty.
I do agree though that the ever-changing faces of Felix did undermine the character somewhat.
Leiter really just became an empty shell occupied by different actors over the years. Him and Bond were civil to eatch other but not much else. Then what was worse was that the character disappeared for 14 years then he came back in a very meager role in The Living Daylights and then once again in LTK by a different actor. Yes Heidson played the role previously but that was unmemorable preformance in LALD and equally bland in LTK.
That just reminded me how the artificial tragedy was going to pan out. Also, what has Bond and Felix gone through exactly over the years ? Nothing, at least according to the films. After Jack Lord, all they did was get a bunch of substitutes to play Leiter and all of them left no impression.
Well Felix had been one of Bond's regular contacts in the older films and, despite the numerous actors that have played the character, he and Bond did have a cheery, friendly relationship that went beyond the call of duty.
I do agree though that the ever-changing faces of Felix did undermine the character somewhat.
Then what was worse was that the character disappeared for 14 years then he came back in a very meager role in The Living Daylights and then once again in LTK by a different actor.
Yes, that was a mistake but regarless I thought that Felix was played rather well in LTK.
The "man talk" scene by the pool in GF showed Bond and Felix on fairly friendly terms.
Yeah but I much prefer the stuff in the book. Leiter and Bond were sort of rivals, debating food and cars in a friendly manner.
No doubt he plays a more prominant role in the books but I still think the idea of him being one of Bond's few friends is still there in the films - albeit in a lesser manner.
The "man talk" scene by the pool in GF showed Bond and Felix on fairly friendly terms.
Yeah but I much prefer the stuff in the book. Leiter and Bond were sort of rivals, debating food and cars in a friendly manner.
No doubt he plays a more prominant role in the books but I still think the idea of him being one of Bond's few friends is still there in the films - albeit in a lesser manner.
I agree he's suppose to be one of Bond's few friends though he's been just a very weak character.
Yeah but I much prefer the stuff in the book. Leiter and Bond were sort of rivals, debating food and cars in a friendly manner.
No doubt he plays a more prominant role in the books but I still think the idea of him being one of Bond's few friends is still there in the films - albeit in a lesser manner.
I agree he's suppose to be one of Bond's few friends though he's been just a very weak character.
He's certainly been an inconsistant character in the films.
No doubt he plays a more prominant role in the books but I still think the idea of him being one of Bond's few friends is still there in the films - albeit in a lesser manner.
I agree he's suppose to be one of Bond's few friends though he's been just a very weak character.
He's certainly been an inconsistant character in the films.
I think the worst yet was Norman Burton. I mean really, shouldn't have been "pounding a beat" in New York somewhere ? I know a lot of folks say John Terry because of his horrid acting but that was a very small role not even worth noting.
I agree he's suppose to be one of Bond's few friends though he's been just a very weak character.
He's certainly been an inconsistant character in the films.
I think the worst yet was Norman Burton. I mean really, shouldn't have been "pounding a beat" in New York somewhere ? I know a lot of folks say John Terry because of his horrid acting but that was a very small role not even worth noting.
I can't remember which one that was, there have been so many
He's certainly been an inconsistant character in the films.
I think the worst yet was Norman Burton. I mean really, shouldn't have been "pounding a beat" in New York somewhere ? I know a lot of folks say John Terry because of his horrid acting but that was a very small role not even worth noting.
I can't remember which one that was, there have been so many
Oh yeah I know which one that was. Watched DAF today actually. He is quite a forgettable character.
While RicardoC and mrbain continue their patter, I'll just put a few pennies worth in:
I'm not a great fan of LTK. The post which likened it to an episode of Miami Vice is very close to the mark IMO.
I reviewed this in 2008 during my marathon 2 week 22 movie thread (it's in this forum somewhere) and I remember thinking it was a souless exercise, that it lacked a coherent story and strong characters, jumping from scene to scene rather than seemlessly progressing.
It looks quite dated now. The wedding scenes and the coda at Lupe's party are simply horrific, very similar to the dodgily acted fare you got in action films of the '80s. It really does feel like you are watching a T.v.movie.
The movie isn't helped by some tame acting. John Glen was always good with action (and the set pieces are rather good) but characters have never been his strong point and most of the people in LTK are caricatures - Truman Lodge, Dario, Leiter, Killifer, Krest. I agree with whoever said here that Pam is an uninteresting heroine, but Lupe has unfullfilled potential.
Robert Davi's Sanchez however is a brilliant; he gets full marks from me as one of the best villains in the series. I like that his plan isn't earth shattering. He's not comfortable in his position and resembles the embittered Michael Corleone from Godfather 2.
What is equally fascinating is watching Dalton's 007 gradually descending to Sanchez's level. Dalton's portrait is very grim faced here, lacking the charm of his turn in TLD. It's a deliberate ploy, but, while I can admire the bravery and execution, I find it quite alienating; I also found Craig's turn in QOS off putting for the same reasons. I need to warm to our hero and he's too cold in both those movies.
I understand there was a writer's strike in the US during production of LTK and Michael G. Wilson wrote most of this on his own. I often wonder if that is why the film is so unbalanced and so lacking in irony and good natured humour, that Maibaum's ability to craft a reasonably appreciable story is far superior to Wilson's.
The Bond formula was broken with this one, but it isn't an entirely successful shift. The aspects that work best are the ones which have a Fleming feel to them: Krest's warehouse, Leiter's mauling, Bond's drugs bust on the Wavekrest, the blackjack scam. The bits that don't (eg most of the stuff in Isthmus) are very disappointing.
"that it lacked a coherent story and strong characters, jumping from scene to scene rather than seemlessly progressing"
Funnily enough I thought that was the exact problem that dogged the latest film, more so than LTK. Whilst the "revenge" theme was there in both films, both the pacing and the plot were far more erratic in QoS IMO.
I can understand you being alienated by the darker Bond. To an extent I am a bit aswell. Even Fleming's more serious material was never quite as dour as those films. Bond was always someone who knew how to indulge and enjoy life as well as be dark and brooding. I just felt that LTK compensated and redeemed itself by having a compelling plot and a wonderfully memorable adversary.
In regard to Pam, I thought she was quite a good Bond girl myself. Feisty, independent and a good ally for James. Lupe was rather melodramatic and Truman Lodge was something of an 80s charcature.
Krest however I thought was excellent, slimy and sleazy yet you felt sorry for him when he was set up by Bond and met his grisly death.
In regard to Pam, I thought she was quite a good Bond girl myself. Feisty, independent and a good ally for James. Lupe was rather melodramatic and Truman Lodge was something of an 80s charcature.
Krest however I thought was excellent, slimy and sleazy yet you felt sorry for him when he was set up by Bond and met his grisly death.
mrbain, I certainly agree QOS was dogged by the same problems as LTK.
I guess, regarding Pam, I guess it has a lot to do with the rather "Charlies Angel" act she has to play with Bond and Q (ie Charlie and Bosley). I am also always agahst at how swiftly this independent and fiesty woman sleeps with James Bond. She generally seems much more determined than that. The love story created between her and 007 is one of the least exciting, memorable and believable.
Now Lupe, with her model/whore background is exactly the sort of Fleming "fallen angel" which we didn't see enough of in the 1980s Bond's (or much now come to think of it, Vesper aside) Melodramatic? Maybe, but her situation (and her tastes) raise many questions about her and her relationship/dependancy on Sanchez. Pam is sadly lacking this depth of character.
Krest, like Truman Lodge, is very much a caricature of the '80s or any era for me, being slimy, a drunk and a careless hanger on to the skirts of his boss. He's a bit of an ***licker. He's also a bit incompetent.
While I appreciate Bond is out for revenge, Krest's murder wasn't necessarily in the method he would have chosen. It is Sanchez who decides the means.
In this respect QOS is far more incriminating towards Bond: he deliberately leaves Greene to the wolves, has no compassion for the deaths of Mathis or Fields and rarely manages to extract information from his targets before killing them. Much more singlemindedly ruthless than in LTK (eg. Dalton actually displays shock at Sharkey's death) and not any better for it.
Comments
Would Fleming have written a revenge theme Bond, probably not, but I can overlook that as so much of the film is well done. As previously mentioned, Robert Davi is an excellent villain, violent and intelligent, a worthy foe for Bond. Dalton displays Bond's rage well, seeking justice, justice as Bond sees it. The deaths are creative and violent, a bad guy literally exploding inside a pressure chamber, who would have thought of that. Carey Lowell is beautiful and capable of assisting Bond, without trying to upstage him. I like the scene where she bursts through the door of the hotel room gun drawn after Bond has gone in to meet his "uncle" (Q) and after seeing everything is OK, saying "I thought I might have a mess to clean up". Sanchez's henchman, Dario, played by Bernicio Del Toro, is excellent, scary and deadly. LTK also has an excellent climatic battle as semi tractor trailer trucks do battle as they roll down a curvy mountain road, culminating in a mano a mano battle between Bond and Sanchez. Finally, I always loved the ending of the film where Bond jumps into the pool and pulls Pam Bouvier into the pool with him as Patti Labelle sings "If You Asked Me to", very romantic.
A lot of good elements puts LTK in my top 5 Bond films.
I agree with you 100%!!!! I love the grittiness, Q playing a large part in the story and Carey Lowell is a doll, a tough doll at that. And I'm an action fan. Bond is a man of action. This is a film that proves that.
Touché -{
Should also remember the little hint to OHMS (garter) – very moving scene and gives the whole revenge an extra dimension as he thinks about the death of Tracy…
www.007jamesbond.dk
http://thedangermen.com/
Agreed. I mentioned before that the film does look deliberately retrograde- Siskel and Ebert commented on the art direction/photography. I am supposed to believe this film came out in '89. There are tons of films made before LTK that look far superior.
The tanker sequence is a standout for me, as is the whole boat scene from Bond sneaking in and planting the money, to the Milton Krest death (and Carey Lowell in her smalls
Parts that I liked:
Timothy Dalton as James Bond.
Opening sequence.
Assassination attempt on Sanchez.
Bond's interrogation scene with another, perhaps 00 British interrogator.
The Bond and Leiter dynamic.
Q doing a little more than hang around his work shop at headquarters.
Most of the stunts because they were not CGI.
Gladys Knight's "classic" movie theme/ballad
Parts I didn't like
Taliso Soto and Pam Barnes, both terrible.
Carey Lowell's Pam Bouvier, who was a bit too dry and Amazonian to temper the other actresses (traits which worked much more effectively on Law and Order.)
Sanchez as a Latin American thug -- again, Miami Vice pretty much showed this every week.
Michael Kamen's score, except for his rendition of the Bond theme.
In general unremarkable locations.
One has to remember that at the time, this movie's look and idea were pretty common in television and in film. In addition to Miami Vice, it's look and sensibilities reminded me of several movies, including To Live and Die in L.A. and a Richard Gere/Kim Basinger film called No Mercy.
The plot also seemed underdeveloped . . . they spent a great deal of time suggesting there would be a stronger relationship between Sanchez and Bond prior to Bond's "betrayal," and that there might actually be some more complex emotional ramifications. But the film quickly takes Bond from being an insider to being traitor. At the time, there was a show called Wiseguy that had basically played out a similar scenario but very effectively, and before people say "But they only had two hours to tell the story," TV's Mission: Impossible frequently did an effective job of showing complexity.
We don't deny it, we like it! Well, I do, anyway.
I don't think LTK is any worse off by being dated to the 80's than Roger Moore's movies were to the 70's, with their wide lapels, disco music action sequences, and questionable automotive choices (AMC Hornet, anyone?).
Roger Moore's first two films in the 1970's were the only ones that looked very contemporary but the blaxplotation and kung-fu stuff bordered on the edge of parody. LTK was a straight-faced film that was being done a dime-dozen back then; Cheap looking and a having one-dimesonal human emotion with characters you don't care about getting slaughtered left and right.
I rather cared for Della. She seemed sweet and appeared to have a genuine, plutonic affection for Bond.
Those brief scenes with Bond, Della, and Felix were all so artificial that I don't see how you could feel any sympathy for them. Della's death and Felix's maiming got nothing from me because they were such non-entities.
Hmm well we'll have to disagree (again). I felt quite sympatheic towards the characters, especially the admittingly brief scene where Felix says to Della that "he (Bond) was married once but it was a long time ago". I thought that moment was quite poignant and showed how Bond and Felix had been through a lot together prior to his life with Della.
That just reminded me how the artificial tragedy was going to pan out. Also, what has Bond and Felix gone through exactly over the years ? Nothing, at least according to the films. After Jack Lord, all they did was get a bunch of substitutes to play Leiter and all of them left no impression.
Well Felix had been one of Bond's regular contacts in the older films and, despite the numerous actors that have played the character, he and Bond did have a cheery, friendly relationship that went beyond the call of duty.
I do agree though that the ever-changing faces of Felix did undermine the character somewhat.
Leiter really just became an empty shell occupied by different actors over the years. Him and Bond were civil to eatch other but not much else. Then what was worse was that the character disappeared for 14 years then he came back in a very meager role in The Living Daylights and then once again in LTK by a different actor. Yes Heidson played the role previously but that was unmemorable preformance in LALD and equally bland in LTK.
Yes, that was a mistake but regarless I thought that Felix was played rather well in LTK.
Yeah but I much prefer the stuff in the book. Leiter and Bond were sort of rivals, debating food and cars in a friendly manner.
No doubt he plays a more prominant role in the books but I still think the idea of him being one of Bond's few friends is still there in the films - albeit in a lesser manner.
I agree he's suppose to be one of Bond's few friends though he's been just a very weak character.
He's certainly been an inconsistant character in the films.
I think the worst yet was Norman Burton. I mean really, shouldn't have been "pounding a beat" in New York somewhere ? I know a lot of folks say John Terry because of his horrid acting but that was a very small role not even worth noting.
I can't remember which one that was, there have been so many
Oh yeah I know which one that was. Watched DAF today actually. He is quite a forgettable character.
I'm not a great fan of LTK. The post which likened it to an episode of Miami Vice is very close to the mark IMO.
I reviewed this in 2008 during my marathon 2 week 22 movie thread (it's in this forum somewhere) and I remember thinking it was a souless exercise, that it lacked a coherent story and strong characters, jumping from scene to scene rather than seemlessly progressing.
It looks quite dated now. The wedding scenes and the coda at Lupe's party are simply horrific, very similar to the dodgily acted fare you got in action films of the '80s. It really does feel like you are watching a T.v.movie.
The movie isn't helped by some tame acting. John Glen was always good with action (and the set pieces are rather good) but characters have never been his strong point and most of the people in LTK are caricatures - Truman Lodge, Dario, Leiter, Killifer, Krest. I agree with whoever said here that Pam is an uninteresting heroine, but Lupe has unfullfilled potential.
Robert Davi's Sanchez however is a brilliant; he gets full marks from me as one of the best villains in the series. I like that his plan isn't earth shattering. He's not comfortable in his position and resembles the embittered Michael Corleone from Godfather 2.
What is equally fascinating is watching Dalton's 007 gradually descending to Sanchez's level. Dalton's portrait is very grim faced here, lacking the charm of his turn in TLD. It's a deliberate ploy, but, while I can admire the bravery and execution, I find it quite alienating; I also found Craig's turn in QOS off putting for the same reasons. I need to warm to our hero and he's too cold in both those movies.
I understand there was a writer's strike in the US during production of LTK and Michael G. Wilson wrote most of this on his own. I often wonder if that is why the film is so unbalanced and so lacking in irony and good natured humour, that Maibaum's ability to craft a reasonably appreciable story is far superior to Wilson's.
The Bond formula was broken with this one, but it isn't an entirely successful shift. The aspects that work best are the ones which have a Fleming feel to them: Krest's warehouse, Leiter's mauling, Bond's drugs bust on the Wavekrest, the blackjack scam. The bits that don't (eg most of the stuff in Isthmus) are very disappointing.
"that it lacked a coherent story and strong characters, jumping from scene to scene rather than seemlessly progressing"
Funnily enough I thought that was the exact problem that dogged the latest film, more so than LTK. Whilst the "revenge" theme was there in both films, both the pacing and the plot were far more erratic in QoS IMO.
I can understand you being alienated by the darker Bond. To an extent I am a bit aswell. Even Fleming's more serious material was never quite as dour as those films. Bond was always someone who knew how to indulge and enjoy life as well as be dark and brooding. I just felt that LTK compensated and redeemed itself by having a compelling plot and a wonderfully memorable adversary.
In regard to Pam, I thought she was quite a good Bond girl myself. Feisty, independent and a good ally for James. Lupe was rather melodramatic and Truman Lodge was something of an 80s charcature.
Krest however I thought was excellent, slimy and sleazy yet you felt sorry for him when he was set up by Bond and met his grisly death.
mrbain, I certainly agree QOS was dogged by the same problems as LTK.
I guess, regarding Pam, I guess it has a lot to do with the rather "Charlies Angel" act she has to play with Bond and Q (ie Charlie and Bosley). I am also always agahst at how swiftly this independent and fiesty woman sleeps with James Bond. She generally seems much more determined than that. The love story created between her and 007 is one of the least exciting, memorable and believable.
Now Lupe, with her model/whore background is exactly the sort of Fleming "fallen angel" which we didn't see enough of in the 1980s Bond's (or much now come to think of it, Vesper aside) Melodramatic? Maybe, but her situation (and her tastes) raise many questions about her and her relationship/dependancy on Sanchez. Pam is sadly lacking this depth of character.
Krest, like Truman Lodge, is very much a caricature of the '80s or any era for me, being slimy, a drunk and a careless hanger on to the skirts of his boss. He's a bit of an ***licker. He's also a bit incompetent.
While I appreciate Bond is out for revenge, Krest's murder wasn't necessarily in the method he would have chosen. It is Sanchez who decides the means.
In this respect QOS is far more incriminating towards Bond: he deliberately leaves Greene to the wolves, has no compassion for the deaths of Mathis or Fields and rarely manages to extract information from his targets before killing them. Much more singlemindedly ruthless than in LTK (eg. Dalton actually displays shock at Sharkey's death) and not any better for it.