I am supremely confident in myself as an individual and live a life that you could only dream of
LMAO
Commander Bond in the need of fake £ 200 Dupont cufflinks for his fake ego. )
i am actually laughing my arse off at this point.
its gotten to a point now where i'd love to help out people but i aint gonna touch this project with a bargepole.
its run by someone who hasn't a clue, and if its funded by self righteous gods like mr ego i don't want any part of it.
i'd actually been looking into this from behind the scenes, i've emailed and pm'd a number of people to ask their opinions on the whole project and i tried to figure out ways to help both mac and his custo.... victims.
imo, mac has taken too much money, too early, given no reason for why, i doubt very much he's even contacted more than 1 jeweller and basically decended ajb into what must be the biggest mess of turd since the golden gun situation.
anyway, the result of my research was that i could do the same project for £80 all in.
Yes, £80GBP inc p&p to anywhere in the world, for a pair of cufflinks, in solid silver.
my idea was, for those who wanted to, provide them (mac's original customers) with what they intended to buy in the first place, and also anyone else who'd want in. i'd also do the project for no profit and would gladly show invoices etc to prove this.
i wouldn't want to steal mac's business, and i'd have no interest in making more money than him etc etc. i'd also take alot less than 50% up front, and all the design work would be shown on here, publicly so everyone could say their piece etc. i'd also welcome comments from 'non-investors' as a lot of the time, people's opinons and knowledge is vast and extremely useful to us all.
would i do it now? no. why?
copyright concerns mainly as simply changing dimensions wouldnt make any difference, but would i want to help out mac since he's replied to none of my points, ignored my pm and taken the side of quite possibly the most over inflated arse this board might have seen? not in a million years. people don't have to take my advice, hell i bet some times i'm even wrong on things (bet mr ego doesn't have this problem). but to simply ignore people when they have valid points to address is arrogant, rude and non constructive.
i'm very fond of ajb, its members and the community spirit, but when this kind of thing happens it has such a detrimental effect on everyone's confidence and faith in others.
remember this though people, the issues, troubles, what ever you want to call them, has come about from a newcomer taking advantage of many long standing member's blind faith and confidence. this isn't, thankfully a regular occurance, and i strongly recommend that people take this into account the next time a 'home grown' project is mentioned. not everyone is out for a quick buck.
the troubles here have had a knock on effect, people are getting stressed out, and if we're not careful, it could all decend into a daft bun fight. and who would gain anything from that?
i really really wish the best of luck for mac and his clients, i really think they'll need it.
I am supremely confident in myself as an individual and live a life that you could only dream of
LMAO
Commander Bond in the need of fake £ 200 Dupont cufflinks for his fake ego. )
i am actually laughing my arse off at this point.
its gotten to a point now where i'd love to help out people but i aint gonna touch this project with a bargepole.
its run by someone who hasn't a clue, and if its funded by self righteous gods like mr ego i don't want any part of it.
i'd actually been looking into this from behind the scenes, i've emailed and pm'd a number of people to ask their opinions on the whole project and i tried to figure out ways to help both mac and his custo.... victims.
imo, mac has taken too much money, too early, given no reason for why, i doubt very much he's even contacted more than 1 jeweller and basically decended ajb into what must be the biggest mess of turd since the golden gun situation.
anyway, the result of my research was that i could do the same project for £80 all in.
Yes, £80GBP inc p&p to anywhere in the world, for a pair of cufflinks, in solid silver.
my idea was, for those who wanted to, provide them (mac's original customers) with what they intended to buy in the first place, and also anyone else who'd want in. i'd also do the project for no profit and would gladly show invoices etc to prove this.
i wouldn't want to steal mac's business, and i'd have no interest in making more money than him etc etc. i'd also take alot less than 50% up front, and all the design work would be shown on here, publicly so everyone could say their piece etc. i'd also welcome comments from 'non-investors' as a lot of the time, people's opinons and knowledge is vast and extremely useful to us all.
would i do it now? no. why?
copyright concerns mainly as simply changing dimensions wouldnt make any difference, but would i want to help out mac since he's replied to none of my points, ignored my pm and taken the side of quite possibly the most over inflated arse this board might have seen? not in a million years. people don't have to take my advice, hell i bet some times i'm even wrong on things (bet mr ego doesn't have this problem). but to simply ignore people when they have valid points to address is arrogant, rude and non constructive.
i'm very fond of ajb, its members and the community spirit, but when this kind of thing happens it has such a detrimental effect on everyone's confidence and faith in others.
remember this though people, the issues, troubles, what ever you want to call them, has come about from a newcomer taking advantage of many long standing member's blind faith and confidence. this isn't, thankfully a regular occurance, and i strongly recommend that people take this into account the next time a 'home grown' project is mentioned. not everyone is out for a quick buck.
the troubles here have had a knock on effect, people are getting stressed out, and if we're not careful, it could all decend into a daft bun fight. and who would gain anything from that?
i really really wish the best of luck for mac and his clients, i really think they'll need it.
MG -{
Am I right in saying then that the only reason you won't do this is because of copyright concerns?
Things I hate:
1. People who hate things.
2. Irony.
3. Lists.
yes, i don't think subtly changing dimensions would cut the mustard as it were with regards the copyright issues.
i mean, this is ST dupont, i don't want to start treading on people's toes and getting myself or anyone else into trouble. the risk isn't worth it.
i did think about changing the design, like, say having the design symetrical (as if you'd have two cufflinks back to back) to change things, but you end up with;
change the design so much it doesn't look anything like the real ones, hence why buy them?
or
have the design virtually identical to dupont's design, and skate so close to the legal line you get a paper cut.
yes, i don't think subtly changing dimensions would cut the mustard as it were with regards the copyright issues.
i mean, this is ST dupont, i don't want to start treading on people's toes and getting myself or anyone else into trouble. the risk isn't worth it.
i did think about changing the design, like, say having the design symetrical (as if you'd have two cufflinks back to back) to change things, but you end up with;
change the design so much it doesn't look anything like the real ones, hence why buy them?
or
have the design virtually identical to dupont's design, and skate so close to the legal line you get a paper cut.
Although I agree, you dont really see the other knock offs being pulled from eBay so St Dupont obviously have better things to do
true welshboy, but i know that people/companies do look at these boards.
its not just myself im looking out for here, both me, the buyers, the jeweller and this forum could get in trouble for organising/backing/advertising/producing copies of the dupont design.
its very thin ice, and something mac needs to be very careful about. the 'it won't happen to me' attitude could lead to some misfortune for all.
I was just checking back through this link and there are elements I simply don't get?
1. The cufflink maker clearly started the project without any upfront money as the prototype photos were available while the majority of funds were still being received by MAC, if so, why was it then necessary for MAC to issue him with what appears to be several hundred pounds as an upfront payment when the immediate feedback on the first prototype was so poor, this makes no sense.
2. MAC, surely based on the first prototype you must have doubts about this guys ability, has anyone actually seen this guys other "bespoke" projects?
3. Assuming feedback has been provided to the maker, why, over 2 weeks on is there no glorious redemption to this project in the form of prototype 2, although this guy has the pleasure of anonymity, surely he must realise he's staring a gift horse in the mouth, but rather than milking it for this and potential future projects he's either gone into hiding or preparing to knock it's teeth out.
4. If MAC is so keen to keep this underground why is he still so comfortable to openly discuss a paypal dispute openly on the forum, surely he realises this will create far more negativity than any other subject.
MAC, I have experience in project management, we put significant amounts of effort into sourcing any external contractors if required, based on their experience and evidence of their ability to achieve the desired result and if the prototype wasn't up to scratch we worked 24/7 to ensure that no matter how many times it took us or them to get it right, the project was completed within the deadline, if not heads rolled.
Clearly this sort of pressure is not being placed on your man; you have a bunch of people here who have placed their trust in you and unfortunately as things stand currently, It appears you are not delivering, and as such, in my imho you should be taking all the negativity and passing it onto your man and threatening him with withdrawal of funds and no chance of any future work if he doesn't deliver something to silence the abuse pretty damn.
Ultimately despite your views on paypal policy, if more buyers make complaints against you, rules can always be interpreted and you could find yourself in a very difficult position, the policy of "customer is 'nearly' always right" rings very true in the hallowed halls of paypal towers, the language you are using in your responses will only enhance that feeling.
I do wish you luck, but seriously, you need to be kicking some cufflinks maker ass!!!
true welshboy, but i know that people/companies do look at these boards.
its not just myself im looking out for here, both me, the buyers, the jeweller and this forum could get in trouble for organising/backing/advertising/producing copies of the dupont design.
its very thin ice, and something mac needs to be very careful about. the 'it won't happen to me' attitude could lead to some misfortune for all.
Yeah , always wonder if Magnoli gets any bother. Then again Tom Ford can hardly speak, you cant get a more blatant rip off then the Oliver Peoples Airman
i'm afraid the idea of me running my own cufflinks projects is purely theoretical, unless we could get confirmation that any proposed design would be free from the constraints of copyright.
however, i feel that in order to satisfy dupont that its not simply a copy of their product, the design would have to be so different that it wouldn't represent the original screen used attire any more, and thus, whats the point of buying it?
'ere, lads, want some cufflinks that are kind of, but nothing like the dupont ones worn buy DC?'
i'm afraid the idea of me running my own cufflinks projects is purely theoretical, unless we could get confirmation that any proposed design would be free from the constraints of copyright.
however, i feel that in order to satisfy dupont that its not simply a copy of their product, the design would have to be so different that it wouldn't represent the original screen used attire any more, and thus, whats the point of buying it?
'ere, lads, want some cufflinks that are kind of, but nothing like the dupont ones worn buy DC?'
doesn't really work for me tbh.
Well that sums up what ive been thinking with regards to this project, Mac can't really win as he either has to produce identical replicas to satisfy the die hard collectors here (For 200 pound I would want exact replicas!) however many people would not want this due to copyright reasons
i'm afraid the idea of me running my own cufflinks projects is purely theoretical, unless we could get confirmation that any proposed design would be free from the constraints of copyright.
however, i feel that in order to satisfy dupont that its not simply a copy of their product, the design would have to be so different that it wouldn't represent the original screen used attire any more, and thus, whats the point of buying it?
'ere, lads, want some cufflinks that are kind of, but nothing like the dupont ones worn buy DC?'
doesn't really work for me tbh.
Well that sums up what ive been thinking with regards to this project, Mac can't really win as he either has to produce identical replicas to satisfy the die hard collectors here (For 200 pound I would want exact replicas!) however many people would not want this due to copyright reasons
exactly, hence 'im out'.
a great shame for all, but there ya go. lesson learnt (hopefully by mac)
MAC, I have experience in project management, we put significant amounts of effort into sourcing any external contractors if required, based on their experience and evidence of their ability to achieve the desired result and if the prototype wasn't up to scratch we worked 24/7 to ensure that no matter how many times it took us or them to get it right, the project was completed within the deadline, if not heads rolled.
Clearly this sort of pressure is not being placed on your man; you have a bunch of people here who have placed their trust in you and unfortunately as things stand currently, It appears you are not delivering, and as such, in my imho you should be taking all the negativity and passing it onto your man and threatening him with withdrawal of funds and no chance of any future work if he doesn't deliver something to silence the abuse pretty damn.
Ultimately despite your views on paypal policy, if more buyers make complaints against you, rules can always be interpreted and you could find yourself in a very difficult position, the policy of "customer is 'nearly' always right" rings very true in the hallowed halls of paypal towers, the language you are using in your responses will only enhance that feeling.
I do wish you luck, but seriously, you need to be kicking some cufflinks maker ass!!!
My thoughts exactly. If your excuse(Mac) towards me(and anyone of the other participants) for not giving me a 100% full refund is that you already sent the money to this company. Why not ask for it back if people who invested money was not at all satisfied and wanted to take their leave?
It is not you, Mac, we should be(and I dont think we are) angry about, but the company that makes such greedy demands before even producing a prototype, as well as asking for a ridiculuosly high amount of money for something that cannot be perfected(when compared to the original ST Dupont cufflinks..) because of copyright issues.
I hope you would ask for refund on behalf of anyone not satisfied with the product immidiately and if they refuse, follow the good advice presented in previous posts!
Yes....it's fun...but it does detract from the purpose of this thread somewhat....
I'd be a little annoyed if I had £200 tied up in this and people were filling this thread with jokes....well, a bigger joke than it already appears to be.
Joking apart it frustrates me to see members struggling to get refunds - afterall it is their money and they work hard to earn it. I don't follow the line of thought that those who have not invested money in this project should keep out of the discussions - as an online community all members have a right to express their opinions and concerns. Much of the more pointed comments or the jokes are actually a result of members frustrations with Mac and his continued silence or when he does answer questions he is very selective about which ones he will respond to. Perhaps if things had of been more transparent earlier on this thread would have been a much smoother ride for all concerned.
I do run a forum myself but rarely have to deal with issues like this. I do not envy Sir Miles position in this, as he said he would consider closing the thread but cannot because the issues are not yet resolved. A very difficult situation to deal with!
Lets hope Mac comes good and does the right thing...
Comments
Love it Pete!!!
utterly brilliant.
Vive le droit à la libre expression! Je suis Charlie!
www.helpforheroes.org.uk
www.cancerresearchuk.org
Brilliant, I love it!
NMS
Dude noone will be attacking you - we love you all :x
Please let us learn from you!
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
i am actually laughing my arse off at this point.
its gotten to a point now where i'd love to help out people but i aint gonna touch this project with a bargepole.
its run by someone who hasn't a clue, and if its funded by self righteous gods like mr ego i don't want any part of it.
i'd actually been looking into this from behind the scenes, i've emailed and pm'd a number of people to ask their opinions on the whole project and i tried to figure out ways to help both mac and his custo.... victims.
imo, mac has taken too much money, too early, given no reason for why, i doubt very much he's even contacted more than 1 jeweller and basically decended ajb into what must be the biggest mess of turd since the golden gun situation.
anyway, the result of my research was that i could do the same project for £80 all in.
Yes, £80GBP inc p&p to anywhere in the world, for a pair of cufflinks, in solid silver.
my idea was, for those who wanted to, provide them (mac's original customers) with what they intended to buy in the first place, and also anyone else who'd want in. i'd also do the project for no profit and would gladly show invoices etc to prove this.
i wouldn't want to steal mac's business, and i'd have no interest in making more money than him etc etc. i'd also take alot less than 50% up front, and all the design work would be shown on here, publicly so everyone could say their piece etc. i'd also welcome comments from 'non-investors' as a lot of the time, people's opinons and knowledge is vast and extremely useful to us all.
would i do it now? no. why?
copyright concerns mainly as simply changing dimensions wouldnt make any difference, but would i want to help out mac since he's replied to none of my points, ignored my pm and taken the side of quite possibly the most over inflated arse this board might have seen? not in a million years. people don't have to take my advice, hell i bet some times i'm even wrong on things (bet mr ego doesn't have this problem). but to simply ignore people when they have valid points to address is arrogant, rude and non constructive.
i'm very fond of ajb, its members and the community spirit, but when this kind of thing happens it has such a detrimental effect on everyone's confidence and faith in others.
remember this though people, the issues, troubles, what ever you want to call them, has come about from a newcomer taking advantage of many long standing member's blind faith and confidence. this isn't, thankfully a regular occurance, and i strongly recommend that people take this into account the next time a 'home grown' project is mentioned. not everyone is out for a quick buck.
the troubles here have had a knock on effect, people are getting stressed out, and if we're not careful, it could all decend into a daft bun fight. and who would gain anything from that?
i really really wish the best of luck for mac and his clients, i really think they'll need it.
MG -{
Vive le droit à la libre expression! Je suis Charlie!
www.helpforheroes.org.uk
www.cancerresearchuk.org
Am I right in saying then that the only reason you won't do this is because of copyright concerns?
1. People who hate things.
2. Irony.
3. Lists.
i mean, this is ST dupont, i don't want to start treading on people's toes and getting myself or anyone else into trouble. the risk isn't worth it.
i did think about changing the design, like, say having the design symetrical (as if you'd have two cufflinks back to back) to change things, but you end up with;
change the design so much it doesn't look anything like the real ones, hence why buy them?
or
have the design virtually identical to dupont's design, and skate so close to the legal line you get a paper cut.
Vive le droit à la libre expression! Je suis Charlie!
www.helpforheroes.org.uk
www.cancerresearchuk.org
Although I agree, you dont really see the other knock offs being pulled from eBay so St Dupont obviously have better things to do
its not just myself im looking out for here, both me, the buyers, the jeweller and this forum could get in trouble for organising/backing/advertising/producing copies of the dupont design.
its very thin ice, and something mac needs to be very careful about. the 'it won't happen to me' attitude could lead to some misfortune for all.
Vive le droit à la libre expression! Je suis Charlie!
www.helpforheroes.org.uk
www.cancerresearchuk.org
Comic genius!
I was just checking back through this link and there are elements I simply don't get?
1. The cufflink maker clearly started the project without any upfront money as the prototype photos were available while the majority of funds were still being received by MAC, if so, why was it then necessary for MAC to issue him with what appears to be several hundred pounds as an upfront payment when the immediate feedback on the first prototype was so poor, this makes no sense.
2. MAC, surely based on the first prototype you must have doubts about this guys ability, has anyone actually seen this guys other "bespoke" projects?
3. Assuming feedback has been provided to the maker, why, over 2 weeks on is there no glorious redemption to this project in the form of prototype 2, although this guy has the pleasure of anonymity, surely he must realise he's staring a gift horse in the mouth, but rather than milking it for this and potential future projects he's either gone into hiding or preparing to knock it's teeth out.
4. If MAC is so keen to keep this underground why is he still so comfortable to openly discuss a paypal dispute openly on the forum, surely he realises this will create far more negativity than any other subject.
MAC, I have experience in project management, we put significant amounts of effort into sourcing any external contractors if required, based on their experience and evidence of their ability to achieve the desired result and if the prototype wasn't up to scratch we worked 24/7 to ensure that no matter how many times it took us or them to get it right, the project was completed within the deadline, if not heads rolled.
Clearly this sort of pressure is not being placed on your man; you have a bunch of people here who have placed their trust in you and unfortunately as things stand currently, It appears you are not delivering, and as such, in my imho you should be taking all the negativity and passing it onto your man and threatening him with withdrawal of funds and no chance of any future work if he doesn't deliver something to silence the abuse pretty damn.
Ultimately despite your views on paypal policy, if more buyers make complaints against you, rules can always be interpreted and you could find yourself in a very difficult position, the policy of "customer is 'nearly' always right" rings very true in the hallowed halls of paypal towers, the language you are using in your responses will only enhance that feeling.
I do wish you luck, but seriously, you need to be kicking some cufflinks maker ass!!!
Yeah , always wonder if Magnoli gets any bother. Then again Tom Ford can hardly speak, you cant get a more blatant rip off then the Oliver Peoples Airman
Their cufflinks is not monogrammed for them or something like that = Paypal should pay.
i'm afraid the idea of me running my own cufflinks projects is purely theoretical, unless we could get confirmation that any proposed design would be free from the constraints of copyright.
however, i feel that in order to satisfy dupont that its not simply a copy of their product, the design would have to be so different that it wouldn't represent the original screen used attire any more, and thus, whats the point of buying it?
'ere, lads, want some cufflinks that are kind of, but nothing like the dupont ones worn buy DC?'
doesn't really work for me tbh.
Vive le droit à la libre expression! Je suis Charlie!
www.helpforheroes.org.uk
www.cancerresearchuk.org
Well that sums up what ive been thinking with regards to this project, Mac can't really win as he either has to produce identical replicas to satisfy the die hard collectors here (For 200 pound I would want exact replicas!) however many people would not want this due to copyright reasons
exactly, hence 'im out'.
a great shame for all, but there ya go. lesson learnt (hopefully by mac)
Vive le droit à la libre expression! Je suis Charlie!
www.helpforheroes.org.uk
www.cancerresearchuk.org
OK im dreaming
If they view this thread their legal department might go into over-drive!
NMS
My thoughts exactly. If your excuse(Mac) towards me(and anyone of the other participants) for not giving me a 100% full refund is that you already sent the money to this company. Why not ask for it back if people who invested money was not at all satisfied and wanted to take their leave?
It is not you, Mac, we should be(and I dont think we are) angry about, but the company that makes such greedy demands before even producing a prototype, as well as asking for a ridiculuosly high amount of money for something that cannot be perfected(when compared to the original ST Dupont cufflinks..) because of copyright issues.
I hope you would ask for refund on behalf of anyone not satisfied with the product immidiately and if they refuse, follow the good advice presented in previous posts!
What the...
Vive le droit à la libre expression! Je suis Charlie!
www.helpforheroes.org.uk
www.cancerresearchuk.org
Vive le droit à la libre expression! Je suis Charlie!
www.helpforheroes.org.uk
www.cancerresearchuk.org
You are lucky. I've had someone tell me that, as far as they are concerned, I'M partly responsible for people losing money on this project !
This thread is totally out of control now....and I would normally close it....but that isn't an option while people are out of pocket....
I'm asking Mac to make a full statement about the project right here on this thread....exactly where he's up to with it...what has been agreed...etc.
Mac, you need to come forward and put your cards on the table...
don't think thats what miles had in mind luke....
Vive le droit à la libre expression! Je suis Charlie!
www.helpforheroes.org.uk
www.cancerresearchuk.org
There's an opening for Bondtoys to comment
Yes....it's fun...but it does detract from the purpose of this thread somewhat....
I'd be a little annoyed if I had £200 tied up in this and people were filling this thread with jokes....well, a bigger joke than it already appears to be.
Although I'd be more concerned that those members are in a position of possibly losing that money than the jokes about the instigator.
I do run a forum myself but rarely have to deal with issues like this. I do not envy Sir Miles position in this, as he said he would consider closing the thread but cannot because the issues are not yet resolved. A very difficult situation to deal with!
Lets hope Mac comes good and does the right thing...
NMS