Darkest Moore Film?

Jarvio · November 2012

Both Moore and his bond films have been criticized for being too light-hearted. But which one, out of all 7, would you say is the darkest Moore film?

For me I think it's AVTAK. I mean, it has plenty of light-hearted stuff in there, like california girls, and the cops... but I just think overall it is the darkest (but that's not to say it's very dark)... Some moments that come to mind as dark are Zorin shooting Howe, Zorin gunning down his men in the mine, and the guy getting killed in the pumping station.

FYEO could have gotten my vote for darkest, but seeing as it features Bibi, it can't be.

Here's what I think, order-wise:

DARKEST
1 - AVTAK
2 - FYEO
3 - LALD
4 - TMWTGG (although probably Moore's darkest performance)
5 - TSWLM
6 - MR (the dogs scene however was very dark)
7 - OP
LIGHTEST

Blackleiter · November 2012

Can't argue with anything on your list. (Well.......I could, but then I'd just be arguing for the sake of arguing!

) )

Jarvio wrote:

Both Moore and his bond films have been criticized for being too light-hearted. But which one, out of all 7, would you say is the darkest Moore film?

For me I think it's AVTAK. I mean, it has plenty of light-hearted stuff in there, like california girls, and the cops... but I just think overall it is the darkest (but that's not to say it's very dark)... Some moments that come to mind as dark are Zorin shooting Howe, Zorin gunning down his men in the mine, and the guy getting killed in the pumping station.

FYEO could have gotten my vote for darkest, but seeing as it features Bibi, it can't be.

Here's what I think, order-wise:

DARKEST
1 - AVTAK
2 - FYEO
3 - LALD
4 - TMWTGG (although probably Moore's darkest performance)
5 - TSWLM
6 - MR (the dogs scene however was very dark)
7 - OP
LIGHTEST

JP · November 2012

For all it's criticism, AVTAK has some great moments. And yeah, i think when Zorrin shoots Howe is one of the best moments in the Bond series

Thunderpussy · November 2012

JP WROTE :

For all it's criticism, AVTAK has some great moments. And yeah, i think when Zorrin shoots Howe is one of the best moments in the Bond series

I agree Zorin is so cold and matter of fact about it. -{

Dutchfinger · November 2012

I'd say your list is about right Jarvio, although I would proberbly switch AVTAK and FYEO. (Even if it has Bibi) To me, FYEO seems like a darker movie overall then AVTAK. (Despite Zorin being a very dark villain.)

Dalkowski110 · November 2012

FYEO, to me, easily has the darkest tone. Zorin is a psychopath, but if you've ever played either one of the games Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic or Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords, he brings to mind at a few junctures the droid character HK-47 in spots in that he was so evil he was literally funny at times. That may be a dark plot point, but it isn't a dark TONE.

If we're going by plot alone without regard to tone, the darkest has to be Octopussy. Orlov's general lack of regard for human life and plans to detonate a nuclear bomb as an "accident" playing off the political climate and then come rolling across the Iron Curtain with 320,000 men and about 73,000 pieces of equipment (with close to 5,000 tanks), plus you have to assume he has huge amounts of air support; if you're reading it in a novel and not picturing Steven Berkoff in the role, just try it. Instead, imagine an actor portraying a completely serious, humorless, passive-aggressive psychotic cast instead. Now expand his role by deleting one or two chase scenes, make it more obvious that he wields much more power than Kamal Khan (something implicit in the film that gets overlooked thanks to screentime) and make sure that one of the scenes you deleted was the jungle chase. The plot hasn't changed at all. But in tone, you essentially get Brigadier General Jack D. Ripper from Dr. Strangelove minus any humorous qualities. Gets a lot darker, doesn't it?

I think MR has the lightest plot AND tone if you take out the dog scene.

chrisisall · November 2012

Dark is Octopussy, with AVTAK, FYEO & TMWTGG in tow IMO.

Silhouette Man · November 2012

FYEO, LALD and AVTAK are probably the darkest of Moore's Bond films in terms of tone.

Peppermill · November 2012

Dalkowski110 wrote:

(...) Zorin is a psychopath, but if you've ever played either one of the games Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic or Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic II: The Sith Lords, he brings to mind at a few junctures the droid character HK-47 in spots in that he was so evil he was literally funny at times. (...)

"Statement: Indeed, I am most eager to engage in some unadulterated violence. At your command of course, Master."

Muston · November 2012

Moore kicking the car over the cliff in FYEO is for me his best, darkest moment so it wins it for me.

BIG TAM · November 2012

Not sure about this. The sinister voodoo element of LIVE & LET DIE is something different & A VIEW TO A KILL does have its fair share of surprising brutality. This makes me think, are Moore's films in general the most sadistic Bonds?

LICENCE TO KILL gets most stick for its violent content, but to be fair that film plays its hand quite openly. Moore's however have a pretence of jocular playfulness but slip the sadism under the radar. Think about Moore's acts alone:-

1. Throwing Tee Hee out of a train window when totally defenceless (LALD)
2. Blinding a thug with hair spray (TMWTGG)
3. Threatening to shoot Lazar in his nether regions (TMWTGG)
4. General brutal harassment of Andrea Anders (TMWTGG)
5. Knocking a child off his boat (TMWTGG)
6. Underhandedly kicking a chap in the face during a ceremonial bow (TMWTGG)
7. Forcing Sandor to fall to his death (TSWLM)
8. Shooting Stromberg in the nether regions (TSWLM)
9. Ruthlessly releasing the magnetic grip on Jaws (TSWLM)
10. Kicking a parachuteless villain to his death (MR)
11. Dropping a wheelchair-bound baddie down a chimney (FYEO)
13. Kicking Locque's car off a cliff (FYEO)

And this doen't include the random acts of sadism dished out by the baddies in Moore's films.

All this makes Connery speargunning poor old Vargas in THUNDERBALL look quite tame by comparison.

)

For an actor who professes to dislike violence in films, Moore seems to have conveniently overlooked the content of the pictures he's appeared in.

That's my take on it anyhow.

chrisisall · November 2012

Nice list BT!

DaltonFan1 · November 2012

LALD has to be Moore's darkest. The villains are evil voodooists that feed their enemies to snakes and crocodiles.

DaltonFan1 · November 2012

And sharks.

Darkest Moore Film?

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