Bond novels.

Dexter SmytheDexter Smythe Close to Fort KnoxPosts: 47MI6 Agent
I am new here but certainly not to 007 or Internet Forums. Seen all of the movies dozens of times.In 2010-11 I finally read all of the original Fleming novels in chronological order.I was impressed as they were much better than I expected.Anyone having any questions should feel free to ask.Four of the novels were actually better than the films:Dr No,Live and Let Die,Diamonds Are Forever,and You Only Live Twice.Moonraker was also very good although I am reluctant to say it was better than the film because Moonraker is one of my Top 5 007 films.
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Comments

  • BarbelBarbel ScotlandPosts: 37,868Chief of Staff
    Welcome aboard, Dexter Smythe. I've moved this to our Literature forum. Hope you enjoy yourself here!
  • Dexter SmytheDexter Smythe Close to Fort KnoxPosts: 47MI6 Agent
    Barbel wrote:
    Welcome aboard, Dexter Smythe. I've moved this to our Literature forum. Hope you enjoy yourself here!
    Thanks for the Welcome.I wanted to be Sir Hilary Bray but had to settle for a more obscure Bond character! :)
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy Behind you !Posts: 63,792MI6 Agent
    -{ Welcome Dexter Smythe
    "I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
  • AlphaOmegaSinAlphaOmegaSin EnglandPosts: 10,926MI6 Agent
    Welcome Smythe -{
    1.On Her Majesties Secret Service 2.The Living Daylights 3.license To Kill 4.The Spy Who Loved Me 5.Goldfinger
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy Behind you !Posts: 63,792MI6 Agent
    Should of added I'm re-reading all Flemings novels in order and can advise everyone
    to do it. You really see Fleming growing in skill as a writer and how Bond matures as an
    agent and a man.
    Infact Dexter if the novels are still fresh in your mind why not add your views and
    opinions to the others on " The Bond Book of the month " thread.
    "I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
  • AlphaOmegaSinAlphaOmegaSin EnglandPosts: 10,926MI6 Agent
    Doing the same here with the first five Novels TP.
    1.On Her Majesties Secret Service 2.The Living Daylights 3.license To Kill 4.The Spy Who Loved Me 5.Goldfinger
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy Behind you !Posts: 63,792MI6 Agent
    Are you only reading the first five ? Or are you going through them all ? As My idea
    Is to read all the Fleming then go on through the continuing novels . :))
    "I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
  • AlphaOmegaSinAlphaOmegaSin EnglandPosts: 10,926MI6 Agent
    I've read all the Fleming Novels, and finished License Renewed by Gardner. Started Icebreaker and have yet to start Colonel Sun. The first five Books to me, are the strongest Fleming did.
    1.On Her Majesties Secret Service 2.The Living Daylights 3.license To Kill 4.The Spy Who Loved Me 5.Goldfinger
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy Behind you !Posts: 63,792MI6 Agent
    I think that, alough it was fun reading the Fleming novels as a young Boy. I was a little too young
    to really get many of the subtleties of his stories. Now I'm a little more mature ( But only a little )
    I find them Brilliant, even the stories I found a bit slow, I can now appreciate for their writing skill.
    I'm about to start Thunderball this month. -{
    "I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
  • Dexter SmytheDexter Smythe Close to Fort KnoxPosts: 47MI6 Agent
    The most hideous villain in the novels was Mr. Big in Live and Let Die.I won't ruin it for people who haven't read it,however. Milton Krest in 'The Hildebrand Rarity' from FYEO was a bastard,too.Fleming's descriptions of the Seychelles Islands were excellent.Such an out of the way location.Only Goodbye,Emmanuelle was also located there.Not that I saw that,of course. :))
  • Dexter SmytheDexter Smythe Close to Fort KnoxPosts: 47MI6 Agent
    The most hideous villain in the novels was Mr. Big in Live and Let Die.I won't ruin it for people who haven't read it,however. Milton Krest in 'The Hildebrand Rarity' from FYEO was a bastard,too.Fleming's descriptions of the Seychelles Islands were excellent.Such an out of the way location.Only Goodbye,Emmanuelle was also located there.Not that I saw that,of course. :))

    BTW, Thunderpussy I agree with your #1 film! Octopussy is my #2.
  • FelixLeiter24FelixLeiter24 Posts: 3MI6 Agent
    I was a big fan of Live and Let Die as well as From Russia with Love.

    It might be the times, but the books seem even more misogynistic than the moviess...
  • AlphaOmegaSinAlphaOmegaSin EnglandPosts: 10,926MI6 Agent
    It was the Attitudes of the Period that the Books were written in.
    1.On Her Majesties Secret Service 2.The Living Daylights 3.license To Kill 4.The Spy Who Loved Me 5.Goldfinger
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy Behind you !Posts: 63,792MI6 Agent
    Absolutely, they are of their time. -{
    "I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
  • FelixLeiter24FelixLeiter24 Posts: 3MI6 Agent
    I hear JFK was a huge fan of them... figures lol -{ :007)
  • Dexter SmytheDexter Smythe Close to Fort KnoxPosts: 47MI6 Agent
    edited March 2014
    Much of the JFK deal came from him listing his Top 10 books for an interview in '62 I believe.From Russia With Love was one of them and it really boosted sales.Incidentally,Fleming was in the White House at one point in 1962.Incredibly JFK and Fleming withdrew into a room together.Historians tend to think JFK was picking Fleming's brain about dealing with Castro (JFK was fully aware of Fleming's WW2 activites.)
  • Golrush007Golrush007 South AfricaPosts: 3,421Quartermasters
    I think that, alough it was fun reading the Fleming novels as a young Boy. I was a little too young
    to really get many of the subtleties of his stories. Now I'm a little more mature ( But only a little )
    I find them Brilliant, even the stories I found a bit slow, I can now appreciate for their writing skill.
    I'm about to start Thunderball this month. -{

    I recently re-read the so-called 'Blofeld Trilogy' and was blown away by how fast they actually move despite my memories of TB and OHMSS being quite slow. Over the last couple of years I have re-read 9 of the books, splitting them into trilogies and tackling a trilogy at a time and then taking a break, which were CR-LALD-MR , followed by FRWL-DN-GF and then TB-OHMSS-YOLT. I haven't decided yet if I will go and re-read what I consider the lesser novels, ie. DAF, TSWLM and TMWTGG. Maybe one of these days. I also want to catch up on some of the Gardner and Benson books which I haven't got around to reading yet.
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy Behind you !Posts: 63,792MI6 Agent
    Funnily enough the only Book I'm dreading is TSWLM, I've only ever read it once ( admittedly long ago )
    but didn't rate it at all. Although as I'm older I might enjoy it more. :D
    "I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
  • Dexter SmytheDexter Smythe Close to Fort KnoxPosts: 47MI6 Agent
    Funnily enough the only Book I'm dreading is TSWLM, I've only ever read it once ( admittedly long ago )
    but didn't rate it at all. Although as I'm older I might enjoy it more. :D
    It's rather tedious although the villains are good.
  • ThunderpussyThunderpussy Behind you !Posts: 63,792MI6 Agent
    I though the same about QOS on first reading but re-reading it recently, I thought it was a brilliant story,
    Flemings writing just compels you to keep turning the page. -{
    "I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
  • Dexter SmytheDexter Smythe Close to Fort KnoxPosts: 47MI6 Agent
    It was my understanding that Fleming didn't want TSWLM published but there was some type of a loophole that allowed it. ?:)
  • Golrush007Golrush007 South AfricaPosts: 3,421Quartermasters
    When I read TSWLM, which was about 7 years ago now, I remember finding it quite an entertaining read. I went into it knowing roughly what to expect, and I found it surprisingly enjoyable.
  • BarbelBarbel ScotlandPosts: 37,868Chief of Staff
    It was my understanding that Fleming didn't want TSWLM published but there was some type of a loophole that allowed it. ?:)

    He wanted no paperback published, after the poor reception of the hardback edition. It didn't appear in paperback till after his death.
  • DEFIANT 74205DEFIANT 74205 Perth, AustraliaPosts: 1,881MI6 Agent
    It was my understanding that Fleming didn't want TSWLM published but there was some type of a loophole that allowed it. ?:)

    My understanding is that Fleming didn't want the book to be turned into film, so he never sold the rights to The Spy Who Loved Me which, if I'm not mistaken, is still with the Fleming estate.
    Golrush007 wrote:
    When I read TSWLM, which was about 7 years ago now, I remember finding it quite an entertaining read. I went into it knowing roughly what to expect, and I found it surprisingly enjoyable.

    Me too. I thought the book was better than the film (although admittedly, I thought every Fleming novel was better than its cinematic counterpart). I liked it because it was different, being first person view of James Bond from the eyes of Vivienne Michel rather than a third person point of view in all other Bond novels. To me, it reveals another dimension of the Bond character - that of a true gentleman coming to the aid of a damsel in distress.
    "Watch the birdie, you bastard!"
  • CmdrAtticusCmdrAtticus United StatesPosts: 1,102MI6 Agent
    I think he was trying to stretch his writing muscles with TSWLM, because many critics (especially his closest friends and his wife) thought they were not true "literature" and not much above a comic book level. It's for a similar reason he wrote Chitty Chitty Bang Bang for his son and why he did the documentary books like The Diamond Smugglers and Thrilling Cities. The public at large didn't take to the novel, so he went back to the way he had written them before.
  • RevelatorRevelator Posts: 604MI6 Agent
    Barbel wrote:
    He wanted no paperback published, after the poor reception of the hardback edition. It didn't appear in paperback till after his death.

    Correct. The reviews for TSWLM were vicious and hurt Fleming deeply (though, as Kinglsey Amis noted, female reviewers were much more positive). I think part of the reason Fleming was so hurt was because the book was personal to him--parts of it are even autobiographical. Vivienne's loss of virginity in the movie theater was based on Fleming's own experiences. But in his book he writes from the female's perspective, and Vivienne's boyfriend--based on Fleming himself--is portrayed as a callous young cad. Couple this with the contesting views on James Bond offered by Viv and the cop she speaks to and you have the most self-reflexive Bond novel of them all.
  • Dexter SmytheDexter Smythe Close to Fort KnoxPosts: 47MI6 Agent
    To change subjects slightly am I the only person that thinks the Dr.No book was absolutely awesome and the movie doesn't even come close? Of course it's hard to imagine filming the deal with the squid in 1962. :o
  • RevelatorRevelator Posts: 604MI6 Agent
    To change subjects slightly am I the only person that thinks the Dr.No book was absolutely awesome and the movie doesn't even come close? Of course it's hard to imagine filming the deal with the squid in 1962. :o

    You're not alone. The movie is a pretty tame version of the book. True, the squid probably wouldn't have worked back then, and the film's budget meant it wouldn't have been able to afford the special effects that could have made it work.
  • CmdrAtticusCmdrAtticus United StatesPosts: 1,102MI6 Agent
    It's true about DN. If they did it now they could do it exactly as in the novel and it would be a pretty intense scene. Ditto for the tortures he goes through before he reaches that scene. If it had not been filmed and Craig were doing it now (though Jamaica would have to be fictionalize as it was in LALD), I think it would be an exciting thriller.
  • BarbelBarbel ScotlandPosts: 37,868Chief of Staff
    If they ever film DN exactly as per the book, it won't be the squid scene we'll be talking about!
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