It read somewhere (I believe it was the James Bond bedside companion) that Fleming didn't reread what he had written the days before until he finished the first draft of his new novel. I can only imagine the times he went " What the hell?!?!? When did I write this? This is absurd! O well, carry on."
I think that's one of the reasons so many writers/ Musicians
Drink and do drugs as it makes them think in an unconventional
Manner, so creating some stunning stories and music.
I'd much rather have a stoned rocker to a sanctimonious, self -
Publicising one like Bono ! )
"I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
I've known and know a lot of musicians (my brother is one) and artists and from personal experience what I've learned is that there are two kinds. One is predisposed to addiction chemically (heredity usually) or they evolve into it through their associations. Some claim they get their creative ideas through drugs and that does happen but more often than not they don't. They use drugs for recreation because they enter professions like journalism, music, film, sports, etc., that encourage it and have constant access to it. These professions rely on a large degree of marketing and socializing that includes events such as parties, ceremonies, fundraisers and on. Alcohol, marijuana, tobacco and the harder drugs are present at these functions. These include anything from the journalist's "boys at the bar" after work or musicians during or after recording sessions to the industry awards shows.
Is alcoholism a disease? Yes, according to the medical profession:
Alcoholism or alcohol dependence is defined by the American Medical Association as "a primary, chronic disease with genetic, psychosocial, and environmental factors influencing its development and manifestations." - and there is no cure.
That's what they said about AIDS.
It's always more profitable to treat a disease rather than cure it.
Medicine, war, prisons... they're all businesses.
*rant over*
But it is only a problem if the person is drinking. What is an alcoholic that stopped drinking? According to (a part of) the medical world he will remain an alcoholic the rest of is life. Can you be an alcoholic without ever having touched a drink in your life? According to the medical world you can.
Can you suffer from obesity while having been 20 pounds underweight your entire life?
The cure for alcoholism is to stop taking the thing that makes you ill; liquor itself.
What is an alcoholic that stopped drinking? According to (a part of) the medical world he will remain an alcoholic the rest of is life.
That's so money can continue to be made in the form of ongoing 'treatment' for those tagged.
....Or how a guy wrongly accused of world domination plots will always have an arrest record (I never even had the money to purchase the deep core drilling equipment needed to open up the Earth's tectonic plates & fry half the planet).
Because it's ALL a BUSINESS.
Labels identify potential ongoing financial prospects.
Yes I think it is. You are right of course. However, like chrisisall correctly surmised this one hit pretty close to home that's why my response might be a bit bit fiery.
I think every family has had at least one or two
Alcoholics, in them. luckily for me, I started
Working in pubs etc , so from an early age I've
seen some of the nasty sides of drinking, Probably
Why I have no great interest in the stuff. Although on
An amusing note. George Best was once asked what
happened to all his money. He replied about 90% went on
Women, cars and parties. The rest he just wasted ! )
"I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
I think every family has had at least one or two
Alcoholics, in them. luckily for me, I started
Working in pubs etc , so from an early age I've
seen some of the nasty sides of drinking, Probably
Why I have no great interest in the stuff. Although on
An amusing note. George Best was once asked what
happened to all his money. He replied about 90% went on
Women, cars and parties. The rest he just wasted ! )
When Fleming was writing Bond, there were, as far as society was concerned, heavy drinkers like Bond, who could control,or handle their liquor, and those who couldn't, who were called "drunks",and it was considered one's own fault if he or she was a "drunk". There was an element of shame attached to being a drunk.Also smoking was prevalent. My family had a well stocked liquor cabinet, yet I never recall anyone being obviously "drunk"(i.e. acting drunk). Of course, my parents never invited anybody like that over .
I had to wait until college to encounter anyone falling down, vomiting, passing out drunk 8-) ....
As I have previously posted, I don't think there is a family that hasn't been
Affected by alcohol. ( My God you should see what my family put away at
Weddings etc ) while I barely touch the stuff.
I recently photographed a wedding and for the first time ever, I didn't get
Any family photos ( Parents, siblings with Bride and Groom) as No one could
get the families away from the bar !
Although funnily enough I have met more and more people who don't
Drink, so maybe it is slowly changing.
As for Bond, in the Books yes he'd be a really heavy drinker.
"I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
Perhaps. Alcoholism wasn't really seen as a disease in the past, as it is today.
Alcoholism is not a disease although it is perceived that way by people who need an excuse for not being able to stop drinking.
Alcoholism is certainly not a disease. The same way smoking/ obesity/ etc aren't either.
They can all cause disease, but are not diseases themselves.
On that topic, it makes one wonder how many calories Bond consumed with his drinking? I reckon his excercise routine would not be sufficient to keep him in good shape. All that alcohol along with fattening foods would soon take it's toll.
Back in the 50's, no one really took any Notice of Calorie Intakes, Smoking, Drinking, etc.
1.On Her Majesties Secret Service 2.The Living Daylights 3.license To Kill 4.The Spy Who Loved Me 5.Goldfinger
FelixLeiter ♀Staffordshire or a pubPosts: 1,286MI6 Agent
In Thunderball the MO's report on Bond says:
When not engaged upon strenuous duty, the officer's average daily consumption of alcohol is in the region of half a bottle of spirits between sixty and seventy proof. On examination, there continues to be little definite sign of deterioration. The tongue is furred. The blood pressure a little raised at 160/90. The liver is not palpable. On the other hand, when pressed, the officer admits to frequent occipital headaches and there is spasm in the trapezius muscles and so-called 'fibrositis' nodules can be felt. I believe these symptoms to be due to this officer's mode of life. He is not responsive to the suggestion that over-indulgence is no remedy for the tensions inherent in his professional calling and can only result in the creation of a toxic state which could finally have the effect of reducing his fitness as an officer.
Bond is seen as over-indulging but supposedly has suffered no serious ill effects. He 'remains basically physically sound' and two or three weeks in Shrublands is said to be enough to return him 'to is previous exceptionally high state of physical fitness'. I think this is probably Fleming justifying his own lifestyle with the idea that over-indulgence is fine so long as you take a break from it now and then. I find it highly unlikely that having drank like that for years there would be no other noticeable health problems. He might be able to 'handle' it in not appearing drunk, but he's probably just built up a tolerance over the years. It would still surely be damaging his liver.
As for whether Bond is an alcoholic, I'd say it's quite likely. If he uses alcohol as a 'remedy for the tensions inherent in his professional calling' then he is reliant on it to some degree.
On a different note, that passage in Thunderball also mentions that Bond smokes sixty a day, down from the seventy-something mentioned in Casino Royale. In You Only Live Twice Bond spends, I think, almost an entire day in some hut, waiting for darkness so he can get through Blofeld's 'Garden of Death' undetected. In order to remain hidden he doesn't smoke during this time and I've always found that odd. I used to smoke far less than that and with Bond smoking sixty a day, I find it almost unbelievable that he could have managed that so well. It truly shows what sacrifices that man will make for the sake of his mission! )
Relax darling, I'm on top of the situation -{
Silhouette ManThe last refuge of a scoundrelPosts: 8,845MI6 Agent
" Too many free radicals, that's your problem. Toxins that
Destroy the body and Brain ! Caused by eating too much
Red meat and white bread, and too many dry Martinis. ....
.... From now on you'll be suffering a strict regimen of diet
And exercise. We shall purge those toxins from you !"
M to Bond in NSNA
"I've been informed that there ARE a couple of QAnon supporters who are fairly regular posters in AJB."
Alcoholism is certainly not a disease. The same way smoking/ obesity/ etc aren't either.
They can all cause disease, but are not diseases themselves.
On that topic, it makes one wonder how many calories Bond consumed with his drinking? I reckon his excercise routine would not be sufficient to keep him in good shape. All that alcohol along with fattening foods would soon take it's toll.
Quite correct; alcoholism per se is not a disease, but addictive personality disorder certainly is, and alcoholism can be one manifestation of it. That is why safest way to "cure" an alcoholic is to get him hooked on something else, commonly religion or sports.
Now if you look at James Bond, he certainly displays in his behavior the tell tale signs of APD; overindulgence in cigarettes whisky and married women, also one can not overlook his addiction to action and danger. But, and this is a significant one, the generation that saw the death and destruction of WW2 all drank very, very heavily, it was pretty much the therapy they allowed them selves. And that is why Bonds drinking habit is nothing unusual for a man of his generation an a veteran of WW2.
"I mean, she almost kills bond...with her ass."
-Mr Arlington Beech
AMA considers alcoholism a disease. Some non medical professionals do not. Hmm. Wonder who's advice I would follow here....
Alcoholism is not considered disease in the sense that there is no cure for it. There is no fix that one can utilize to every case and be certain that the subject is ok and is never going to fall of the wagon.
Over indulgence of alcohol will cause a myriad of disease which can all be fatal, but quitting and correct medical treatment can cure these diseases. Where as when only quitting works with drinking it doesn't make the alcoholism go away. Therefore replacing drinking with something else that takes its place can and will work, this thing can be something like the 12 step program and AA meetings or religion or sports. Problem being, it's going to be a life time struggle, because like I said; the alcoholism (or addiction) will not go away. There is no cure for it. This APD thingy works (unfortunately) also the other way around, that is why there are so many former athletes hooked on drink or drugs, their former addiction to sports have been replaced with addiction to mind altering substances.
Current scientific view on all things mind altering is, that the mechanism on the cerebral level is similar/very similar, whether we're talking about smoke, sex, drink, drugs, adrenalin, pain, endorphin rush during sports, feel good effect of devout religious experience not to mention the rush you get from AJB'ing. And that is why it is easy to get hooked, it's easy to slip if you manage to get clean and it is hard to get on the wagon. But fortunately addiction is something that we have lately started understand on the scientific level (it was viewed as a psychological matter for a very long time) and therefore treatment and cure for addiction it self is not that far off in the future.
"I mean, she almost kills bond...with her ass."
-Mr Arlington Beech
AMA considers alcoholism a disease. Some non medical professionals do not. Hmm. Wonder who's advice I would follow here....
I still don't think it is, not in the traditional sense. It can stem from diseases of the brain according to the topic below (even then it only says sometimes). But it is not a disease in and of itself.
It's clear that this Thread has evolved from the original Topic.
On the Subject of Alcoholism, my Uncle has been a very heavy Drinker since his RAF Days. He has had two Strokes and many Chances to change his Lifestyle. Yet he still continues to drink himself into Oblivion.
1.On Her Majesties Secret Service 2.The Living Daylights 3.license To Kill 4.The Spy Who Loved Me 5.Goldfinger
I think that's one of the reasons so many writers/ Musicians
Drink and do drugs as it makes them think in an unconventional
Manner, so creating some stunning stories and music.
One of my favourite authors is Raymond Chandler, a very heavy drinker.
In the 40s he was writing the screenplay for "The Blue Dahlia" under severe time pressure (the film's star, Alan Ladd, had been drafted and only had a very limited time to shoot his scenes). Knowing that he wrote better when drunk, Chandler managed to persuade the producer to let him get tanked up while writing (with a team of secretaries and drivers on hand), since this was the only way to get the script ready on a day-to-day schedule.
It's clear that this Thread has evolved from the original Topic.
Quite! And in order to get back in the topic: No IMHO I don't think that Fleming's Bond would be considered an alcoholic nowadays. It is quite simple really: Bond drinks in the novels in the manner that was if not usual, nothing extraordinary for those times for a man of his back ground. Also many characters in Bond novels have "fully laden sideboards" if you have noticed. Therefore, Bond drinks according to the social mores of the time period and transmitted to present day his drinking would be of the variety you see these days: nothing while working, getting seriously sauced in fridaynight and then pizza and daytime tv for saturday hangover. )
"I mean, she almost kills bond...with her ass."
-Mr Arlington Beech
Comments
Drink and do drugs as it makes them think in an unconventional
Manner, so creating some stunning stories and music.
I'd much rather have a stoned rocker to a sanctimonious, self -
Publicising one like Bono !
Is alcoholism a disease? Yes, according to the medical profession:
Alcoholism or alcohol dependence is defined by the American Medical Association as "a primary, chronic disease with genetic, psychosocial, and environmental factors influencing its development and manifestations." - and there is no cure.
It's always more profitable to treat a disease rather than cure it.
Medicine, war, prisons... they're all businesses.
*rant over*
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
Can you suffer from obesity while having been 20 pounds underweight your entire life?
The cure for alcoholism is to stop taking the thing that makes you ill; liquor itself.
....Or how a guy wrongly accused of world domination plots will always have an arrest record (I never even had the money to purchase the deep core drilling equipment needed to open up the Earth's tectonic plates & fry half the planet).
Because it's ALL a BUSINESS.
Labels identify potential ongoing financial prospects.
#1.TLD/LTK 2.TND 3.GF 4.GE 5.DN 6.FYEO 7.FRWL 8.TMWTGG 9.TWINE 10.YOLT/QOS
Alcoholics, in them.
Working in pubs etc , so from an early age I've
seen some of the nasty sides of drinking, Probably
Why I have no great interest in the stuff. Although on
An amusing note. George Best was once asked what
happened to all his money. He replied about 90% went on
Women, cars and parties. The rest he just wasted !
Great quote!
I'm glad to hear you have a brain that's been used, TP
I had to wait until college to encounter anyone falling down, vomiting, passing out drunk 8-) ....
Regards,
Tecolote
Affected by alcohol. ( My God you should see what my family put away at
Weddings etc ) while I barely touch the stuff.
I recently photographed a wedding and for the first time ever, I didn't get
Any family photos ( Parents, siblings with Bride and Groom) as No one could
get the families away from the bar !
Although funnily enough I have met more and more people who don't
Drink, so maybe it is slowly changing.
As for Bond, in the Books yes he'd be a really heavy drinker.
Alcoholism is certainly not a disease. The same way smoking/ obesity/ etc aren't either.
They can all cause disease, but are not diseases themselves.
On that topic, it makes one wonder how many calories Bond consumed with his drinking? I reckon his excercise routine would not be sufficient to keep him in good shape. All that alcohol along with fattening foods would soon take it's toll.
Bond is seen as over-indulging but supposedly has suffered no serious ill effects. He 'remains basically physically sound' and two or three weeks in Shrublands is said to be enough to return him 'to is previous exceptionally high state of physical fitness'. I think this is probably Fleming justifying his own lifestyle with the idea that over-indulgence is fine so long as you take a break from it now and then. I find it highly unlikely that having drank like that for years there would be no other noticeable health problems. He might be able to 'handle' it in not appearing drunk, but he's probably just built up a tolerance over the years. It would still surely be damaging his liver.
As for whether Bond is an alcoholic, I'd say it's quite likely. If he uses alcohol as a 'remedy for the tensions inherent in his professional calling' then he is reliant on it to some degree.
On a different note, that passage in Thunderball also mentions that Bond smokes sixty a day, down from the seventy-something mentioned in Casino Royale. In You Only Live Twice Bond spends, I think, almost an entire day in some hut, waiting for darkness so he can get through Blofeld's 'Garden of Death' undetected. In order to remain hidden he doesn't smoke during this time and I've always found that odd. I used to smoke far less than that and with Bond smoking sixty a day, I find it almost unbelievable that he could have managed that so well. It truly shows what sacrifices that man will make for the sake of his mission!
It's apparent that many still don't.
Destroy the body and Brain ! Caused by eating too much
Red meat and white bread, and too many dry Martinis. ....
.... From now on you'll be suffering a strict regimen of diet
And exercise. We shall purge those toxins from you !"
M to Bond in NSNA
Quite correct; alcoholism per se is not a disease, but addictive personality disorder certainly is, and alcoholism can be one manifestation of it. That is why safest way to "cure" an alcoholic is to get him hooked on something else, commonly religion or sports.
Now if you look at James Bond, he certainly displays in his behavior the tell tale signs of APD; overindulgence in cigarettes whisky and married women, also one can not overlook his addiction to action and danger. But, and this is a significant one, the generation that saw the death and destruction of WW2 all drank very, very heavily, it was pretty much the therapy they allowed them selves. And that is why Bonds drinking habit is nothing unusual for a man of his generation an a veteran of WW2.
-Mr Arlington Beech
Alcoholism is not considered disease in the sense that there is no cure for it. There is no fix that one can utilize to every case and be certain that the subject is ok and is never going to fall of the wagon.
Over indulgence of alcohol will cause a myriad of disease which can all be fatal, but quitting and correct medical treatment can cure these diseases. Where as when only quitting works with drinking it doesn't make the alcoholism go away. Therefore replacing drinking with something else that takes its place can and will work, this thing can be something like the 12 step program and AA meetings or religion or sports. Problem being, it's going to be a life time struggle, because like I said; the alcoholism (or addiction) will not go away. There is no cure for it. This APD thingy works (unfortunately) also the other way around, that is why there are so many former athletes hooked on drink or drugs, their former addiction to sports have been replaced with addiction to mind altering substances.
Current scientific view on all things mind altering is, that the mechanism on the cerebral level is similar/very similar, whether we're talking about smoke, sex, drink, drugs, adrenalin, pain, endorphin rush during sports, feel good effect of devout religious experience not to mention the rush you get from AJB'ing. And that is why it is easy to get hooked, it's easy to slip if you manage to get clean and it is hard to get on the wagon. But fortunately addiction is something that we have lately started understand on the scientific level (it was viewed as a psychological matter for a very long time) and therefore treatment and cure for addiction it self is not that far off in the future.
-Mr Arlington Beech
I still don't think it is, not in the traditional sense. It can stem from diseases of the brain according to the topic below (even then it only says sometimes). But it is not a disease in and of itself.
You can't catch or transmit alcoholism.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Disease_theory_of_alcoholism
On the Subject of Alcoholism, my Uncle has been a very heavy Drinker since his RAF Days. He has had two Strokes and many Chances to change his Lifestyle. Yet he still continues to drink himself into Oblivion.
One of my favourite authors is Raymond Chandler, a very heavy drinker.
In the 40s he was writing the screenplay for "The Blue Dahlia" under severe time pressure (the film's star, Alan Ladd, had been drafted and only had a very limited time to shoot his scenes). Knowing that he wrote better when drunk, Chandler managed to persuade the producer to let him get tanked up while writing (with a team of secretaries and drivers on hand), since this was the only way to get the script ready on a day-to-day schedule.
Quite! And in order to get back in the topic: No IMHO I don't think that Fleming's Bond would be considered an alcoholic nowadays. It is quite simple really: Bond drinks in the novels in the manner that was if not usual, nothing extraordinary for those times for a man of his back ground. Also many characters in Bond novels have "fully laden sideboards" if you have noticed. Therefore, Bond drinks according to the social mores of the time period and transmitted to present day his drinking would be of the variety you see these days: nothing while working, getting seriously sauced in fridaynight and then pizza and daytime tv for saturday hangover.
-Mr Arlington Beech