As said, if the UK government was Labour, you‘d be singing a totally different tune.
You call my statements horsecrap - that does not make them wrong.
I also called them unquantifiable, which they are so therefore incorrect. Unless of course you are privvy to conversations between the UK government and its advisors, which you aren't.
So your impotent political ramblings into this your own echo chamber are nothing more than supposition and guessology.
Once again you make statements about my stance with little or no tangible information, and once again you miss the mark. I only engaged on this as I find the thread being turned into a political soapbox both distasteful and unnecessary, especially in light of the human suffering around the world and that is the basis I shall in future engage here. I have now added to those politics and am sorry for doing so.
Getting personal, guys. Please use PMs if necessary.
My own view is that it's almost impossible to keep politics out of this discussion, but it is possible to keep matters civil and impersonal.
Governments are trying to handle this crisis in different ways. Sometimes we agree and sometimes we don't. I don't think Chriscoop and Higgins are responsible for their countries' Corona policies (in fact I hope they don't :v ) so this isn't really personal.
I wonder if Andrew Cuomo will run for president in 2024? I think the leadership he shows during the Corona crisis and the national (and international) exposure he gets puts him in a strong position, but four years is along time in politics. If there was a presidential election in 21-22 he would be a really strong candidate.
Getting personal, guys. Please use PMs if necessary.
My own view is that it's almost impossible to keep politics out of this discussion, but it is possible to keep matters civil and impersonal.
As always Barbel, nothing personal, I'm just partaking in the usual good humoured jousting.
Reports say states and hospitals are bidding against each other in the US to get masks and other vital equipment against Corona. I don't know the system in other countries then here, but I'd be surprised if countries with a national health service don't buy this equipment centrally and distrubute according to need. Hospitals and states bidding against each other seems like a waste of taxpayer money and an unfair system to me.
Asp9mmOver the Hills and Far Away.Posts: 7,535MI6 Agent
Hey gang. It's been a while since I posted on this thread.
I live in greater NYC -- Westchester County, to be more precise. The town of New Rochelle, an early COVID-19 hotspot, is less than 10 miles from my house. Things are still pretty bad here -- while Westchester has "cooled down", the density of NYC is a huge barrier to this region getting out of this quickly. People tend to "live and die" (bad pun, intended) by daily statistical reports about new cases, death rates, etc. -- statistics which have massive error rates inherent in them. Which is why I pay them little mind. Governor Cuomo has been great, but I can't watch the same thing day after day.
Two of my three kids (all grown) are back with us, but my middle child is stuck in Brooklyn and I am unlikely to see them for months. My wife's mother is in assisted living in New Rochelle, and since Thursday has been running a low-grade fever. So far, all is fine -- she has no other coronavirus symptoms, and the fever is manageable with Tylenol. Still, the medical staff was concerned enough to put her on an antibiotic regimen. Which of course would help if she is afflicted with something other than the virus. So, my wife, who previously visited daily but now is barred from doing so, remains on pins and needles. Sleep patterns have been totally disrupted.
This is NOT a call for sympathy. Despite everything, we are extremely fortunate. I live in a big house, I can jog daily and not come within 20 feet of anyone, my nuclear family seems to be healthy, and we are enjoying our time together. Many people have it way worse than me. Hell, people here at AJB have experienced (or are experiencing) far more trauma than I ever have, irrespective of COVID-19 -- as an example, Napoleon's accounts of his mother's treatment are absolutely heartbreaking to read (I can't imagine how they must be to write!).
All to say...stay positive, love each other, be patient with each other, listen to each other, help each other. And please self-quarantine the political grandstanding and "rumor has it..." nonsense. The facts are few, the speculation rampant -- don't give in to that.
/Sermon. Thanks for listening, and please stay safe.
Wow. As Theresa May said, “This horrific virus does not discriminate. Anyone can get it. Anyone can spread it.” Rich, poor; young, old—the danger is to everyone. Wishing him a full and speedy recovery. I’m sure he’s in good hands with the hard working and dedicated medical staff at the ICU.
Saw this image on an article the other day about Russia sending medical supplies to countries hit hardest by coronavirus, including Italy and the US. Note the text over the flags
Reports say states and hospitals are bidding against each other in the US to get masks and other vital equipment against Corona. I don't know the system in other countries then here, but I'd be surprised if countries with a national health service don't buy this equipment centrally and distrubute according to need. Hospitals and states bidding against each other seems like a waste of taxpayer money and an unfair system to me.
"Finland, ‘Prepper Nation of the Nordics,’ Isn’t Worried About Masks"
Below is a picture of the main bridge that connects Cebu City to Mactan Island, taken an hour after curfew. Usually would be a myriad of cars, lorries and mopeds.
Yeah, well, sometimes nothin' can be a real cool hand.
Hello. I have been away from the forum as I have been working continual 14 hour night shifts to cover for people. Add this to a fifty minute commute in each direction and it adds up to tiring work. This is only my second day off, yesterday I spent much time catching up on sleep!
My work load means that I have been unable to participate in the distribution of groceries to those in need, but thankfully, my employer and the owners of the site on which I work agreed that I could make some contact calls to those living alone. These are people who already know me because I do their gardening as part of the church programme, so we have something to talk about. I can only do two fifteen minute calls though in order to comply with what my employer says, but it is enough just to make sure that a conversation can be held (I do often exceed this time!). I am glad to see the NHS are now doing a similar effort.
I have rambled, but I work on a very large vehicle compound. This is a place which a certain high value vehicle brand stores their newly imported cars. They come in from the docks on car transporters, and from there distributed to all dealerships around the country. Normally, I could expect at least twelve car transporters of vehicles to arrive from the docks every night to replenish the stocks which have gone out. Now though, since the coronavirus has hit Europe hard, this has dried up completely. There are no cars going out.
I believe this is an indicator of things to come. However hard the virus strikes, I believe the economic impact will be much worse and last far longer. In the long run it may even account for more deaths globally.
The scientist who pretty much leads Sweden's anti-Corona efforts is a piece of work. He warns Denamrk and Austria against lifting some of their austere restrictions because they have managed to push the epidemic back a bit. That's quite a statement since Sweden (because of his advice) has perhaps the least strict Corona measures in Europe and has more Corona deaths than the other Nordic nations combined.
My work load means that I have been unable to participate in the distribution of groceries to those in need, but thankfully, my employer and the owners of the site on which I work agreed that I could make some contact calls to those living alone. These are people who already know me because I do their gardening as part of the church programme, so we have something to talk about. I can only do two fifteen minute calls though in order to comply with what my employer says, but it is enough just to make sure that a conversation can be held (I do often exceed this time!). I am glad to see the NHS are now doing a similar effort.
Look okay, I'm just some random person on an online forum; I'm not a medical professional, I don't know what country you're in and I do appreciate what you're doing Joshua, but if people are living alone or isolated at home you really shouldn't be making frequent visits to a number of them and staying with each one for an extended period. These times of quarantines, lockdowns and social distancing show that things cannot continue as normal, measures that are out of the ordinary have to be implemented, and I'd say that would include avoiding extended visits with "random" members of the community.
I'm just making an assumption here, but from the fact that you know them from church, you help them with gardening, they live alone and they are unable to leave home to get their own groceries, are these visits to elderly people? As the elderly are a far more susceptible demographic to the worst this virus can do, an extraordinary amount of care has to be taken to stop them from catching this. I'm sure you know that people can have this virus for a week or so before developing any symptoms, and even then still may not show any. If you happen to catch it, maybe even from someone you visit, without knowing and continue to see these people, you may be spreading around it to individuals with life-threatening consequences. I'm not saying you should cut off all contact or stop delivering them groceries—maybe just leave the groceries at their front door and instead of going inside and having an extended in-person conversation, maybe give them a call and converse that way...or go a little old fashioned and write them a letter, leaving it with the groceries and have them write a reply which you pick up next visit?
Again, I really do appreciate what you're doing for others Joshua, but the above is something to consider.
Pretty sure Joshua can speak for his own, but from his post, I read, that he‘s been gardening for them before the pandemic and is now limiting his aid to making telephone calls to them.
The scientist who pretty much leads Sweden's anti-Corona efforts is a piece of work. He warns Denamrk and Austria against lifting some of their austere restrictions because they have managed to push the epidemic back a bit. That's quite a statement since Sweden (because of his advice) has perhaps the least strict Corona measures in Europe and has more Corona deaths than the other Nordic nations combined.
When all your neighbours lock their societies down (with tremendous damages to their economies), it‘s easy to keep your little country open and point fingers on others.
Same happens currently with The Netherlands, who are befitting that their neighbours all have locked down and The Netherlands follow the concept of herd immunity while their economy is still operating.
And now they „generously“ consider supporting other EU countries with a small amount of money to reduce their suffering.
President of the 'Misty Eyes Club'.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
Your concerns are justified but I must point out that a while ago in this discussion (it must be several pages back by now) I explained the procedures surrounding my churches initiative. They were, and are, fully in line with medical advice. My workload means that I am unable to participate in this except to make telephone calls to those who live alone and other vulnerable people who would otherwise have no contact with the outside world.
It's a simple thing anyone in any country can do and it doesn't have to be formal. We all have relatives who are elderly or who live on their own. A quick telephone call to ask how they are and have a chat often means that these people will have their moral boosted. I am not working today but already have made one call. They are an elderly couple who know me from my gardening work (this also is a church programme which has been going on for some years and is a free service). Even though they are not alone they were very pleased to hear from me and I spoke to them for half an hour.
As I already mentioned, the NHS are now doing what my church has been doing. They are obviously following the same guidelines as myself and the other helpers are.
I hope this answers you questions and helps you to see that ours are not acts of irresponsibility, but simple neighbourlyness.
EDIT: By making 'contact calls' I mean contact telephone calls, not personal visits.
Some scientific studies now question if survivors of Covid-19 will be immune. It this is correct it will be harder to stop the epidemic, not to mention the herd imunity strategy won't work at all.
Wow. As Theresa May said, “This horrific virus does not discriminate. Anyone can get it. Anyone can spread it.” Rich, poor; young, old—the danger is to everyone. Wishing him a full and speedy recovery. I’m sure he’s in good hands with the hard working and dedicated medical staff at the ICU.
It doesn't affect everyone in the same way. Men are more susceptible than women. City dwellers, in particular the poor, are more likely to get it. Those in the suburbs like myself, less likely. Boris and his gang got it because frankly they didn't obey their own self-isolating rules.
When Prince Charles got it I did think, oh this is the bit where Buckingham Palace got bombed in the war prompting the Queen Mother to say they could now look the East End in the face.
Comments
So your impotent political ramblings into this your own echo chamber are nothing more than supposition and guessology.
Once again you make statements about my stance with little or no tangible information, and once again you miss the mark. I only engaged on this as I find the thread being turned into a political soapbox both distasteful and unnecessary, especially in light of the human suffering around the world and that is the basis I shall in future engage here. I have now added to those politics and am sorry for doing so.
My own view is that it's almost impossible to keep politics out of this discussion, but it is possible to keep matters civil and impersonal.
I can only echo this to our neighbours in the UK and all over the world and In particular I wish Boris Johnson a speedy recovery!
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
That is quite shocking imo.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/04/world/europe/germany-coronavirus-death-rate.html?smtyp=cur&smid=tw-nytimes
I live in greater NYC -- Westchester County, to be more precise. The town of New Rochelle, an early COVID-19 hotspot, is less than 10 miles from my house. Things are still pretty bad here -- while Westchester has "cooled down", the density of NYC is a huge barrier to this region getting out of this quickly. People tend to "live and die" (bad pun, intended) by daily statistical reports about new cases, death rates, etc. -- statistics which have massive error rates inherent in them. Which is why I pay them little mind. Governor Cuomo has been great, but I can't watch the same thing day after day.
Two of my three kids (all grown) are back with us, but my middle child is stuck in Brooklyn and I am unlikely to see them for months. My wife's mother is in assisted living in New Rochelle, and since Thursday has been running a low-grade fever. So far, all is fine -- she has no other coronavirus symptoms, and the fever is manageable with Tylenol. Still, the medical staff was concerned enough to put her on an antibiotic regimen. Which of course would help if she is afflicted with something other than the virus. So, my wife, who previously visited daily but now is barred from doing so, remains on pins and needles. Sleep patterns have been totally disrupted.
This is NOT a call for sympathy. Despite everything, we are extremely fortunate. I live in a big house, I can jog daily and not come within 20 feet of anyone, my nuclear family seems to be healthy, and we are enjoying our time together. Many people have it way worse than me. Hell, people here at AJB have experienced (or are experiencing) far more trauma than I ever have, irrespective of COVID-19 -- as an example, Napoleon's accounts of his mother's treatment are absolutely heartbreaking to read (I can't imagine how they must be to write!).
All to say...stay positive, love each other, be patient with each other, listen to each other, help each other. And please self-quarantine the political grandstanding and "rumor has it..." nonsense. The facts are few, the speculation rampant -- don't give in to that.
/Sermon. Thanks for listening, and please stay safe.
Wow. As Theresa May said, “This horrific virus does not discriminate. Anyone can get it. Anyone can spread it.” Rich, poor; young, old—the danger is to everyone. Wishing him a full and speedy recovery. I’m sure he’s in good hands with the hard working and dedicated medical staff at the ICU.
"Finland, ‘Prepper Nation of the Nordics,’ Isn’t Worried About Masks"
https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/05/world/europe/coronavirus-finland-masks.html
-Mr Arlington Beech
My work load means that I have been unable to participate in the distribution of groceries to those in need, but thankfully, my employer and the owners of the site on which I work agreed that I could make some contact calls to those living alone. These are people who already know me because I do their gardening as part of the church programme, so we have something to talk about. I can only do two fifteen minute calls though in order to comply with what my employer says, but it is enough just to make sure that a conversation can be held (I do often exceed this time!). I am glad to see the NHS are now doing a similar effort.
I have rambled, but I work on a very large vehicle compound. This is a place which a certain high value vehicle brand stores their newly imported cars. They come in from the docks on car transporters, and from there distributed to all dealerships around the country. Normally, I could expect at least twelve car transporters of vehicles to arrive from the docks every night to replenish the stocks which have gone out. Now though, since the coronavirus has hit Europe hard, this has dried up completely. There are no cars going out.
I believe this is an indicator of things to come. However hard the virus strikes, I believe the economic impact will be much worse and last far longer. In the long run it may even account for more deaths globally.
Look okay, I'm just some random person on an online forum; I'm not a medical professional, I don't know what country you're in and I do appreciate what you're doing Joshua, but if people are living alone or isolated at home you really shouldn't be making frequent visits to a number of them and staying with each one for an extended period. These times of quarantines, lockdowns and social distancing show that things cannot continue as normal, measures that are out of the ordinary have to be implemented, and I'd say that would include avoiding extended visits with "random" members of the community.
I'm just making an assumption here, but from the fact that you know them from church, you help them with gardening, they live alone and they are unable to leave home to get their own groceries, are these visits to elderly people? As the elderly are a far more susceptible demographic to the worst this virus can do, an extraordinary amount of care has to be taken to stop them from catching this. I'm sure you know that people can have this virus for a week or so before developing any symptoms, and even then still may not show any. If you happen to catch it, maybe even from someone you visit, without knowing and continue to see these people, you may be spreading around it to individuals with life-threatening consequences. I'm not saying you should cut off all contact or stop delivering them groceries—maybe just leave the groceries at their front door and instead of going inside and having an extended in-person conversation, maybe give them a call and converse that way...or go a little old fashioned and write them a letter, leaving it with the groceries and have them write a reply which you pick up next visit?
Again, I really do appreciate what you're doing for others Joshua, but the above is something to consider.
When all your neighbours lock their societies down (with tremendous damages to their economies), it‘s easy to keep your little country open and point fingers on others.
Same happens currently with The Netherlands, who are befitting that their neighbours all have locked down and The Netherlands follow the concept of herd immunity while their economy is still operating.
And now they „generously“ consider supporting other EU countries with a small amount of money to reduce their suffering.
Dalton - the weak and weepy Bond!
Your concerns are justified but I must point out that a while ago in this discussion (it must be several pages back by now) I explained the procedures surrounding my churches initiative. They were, and are, fully in line with medical advice. My workload means that I am unable to participate in this except to make telephone calls to those who live alone and other vulnerable people who would otherwise have no contact with the outside world.
It's a simple thing anyone in any country can do and it doesn't have to be formal. We all have relatives who are elderly or who live on their own. A quick telephone call to ask how they are and have a chat often means that these people will have their moral boosted. I am not working today but already have made one call. They are an elderly couple who know me from my gardening work (this also is a church programme which has been going on for some years and is a free service). Even though they are not alone they were very pleased to hear from me and I spoke to them for half an hour.
As I already mentioned, the NHS are now doing what my church has been doing. They are obviously following the same guidelines as myself and the other helpers are.
I hope this answers you questions and helps you to see that ours are not acts of irresponsibility, but simple neighbourlyness.
EDIT: By making 'contact calls' I mean contact telephone calls, not personal visits.
https://www.dagbladet.no/nyheter/kode-99/72341748
Not according to this: Emily Maitless sets it down
It doesn't affect everyone in the same way. Men are more susceptible than women. City dwellers, in particular the poor, are more likely to get it. Those in the suburbs like myself, less likely. Boris and his gang got it because frankly they didn't obey their own self-isolating rules.
When Prince Charles got it I did think, oh this is the bit where Buckingham Palace got bombed in the war prompting the Queen Mother to say they could now look the East End in the face.
Roger Moore 1927-2017