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Topic: Gay Scene????

I saw this linked on the CnB site:

contactmusic.com
30/11/06

Craig wants gay Bond scene

DANIEL CRAIG is urging movie bosses to revolutionise the JAMES BOND franchise by including a gay scene involving the
superspy in the follow-up to CASINO ROYALE. The heart-throb actor has also reportedly told studio chiefs he is prepared to film a full frontal nude scene to please both his male and
female admirers. He says, "Why not? I think in this day and age, fans would have accepted it. "I mean, look at (British TV series) DOCTOR WHO - that has had gay scenes in it and no
one blinks an eye."

Is this for real?  a GAY BOND SCENE??? No way, 007 is too heterosexual for anything like this!!!

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Re: Gay Scene????

Dude, are you stirring up trouble, or are you just amazingly gullible?  Why would you even post this obvious falsehood?  It's from CnB, which has been spouting offensive anti-gay rants about Craig -- and fans who like him -- for the past week.

Hilly...you old devil!

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Re: Gay Scene????

First off, why are you hanging around on that site?  Lord knows what you'll catch!

Second, I saw this item yesterday (not on that irrelevant site) and I think it's just a bit of piffle.  For one thing, Craig DOESN'T say that he wants to do a gay scene--he says he wants to do the full monty in a Bond film, and he uses gayness in Doctor Who as an example of how tolerant audiences have become.  (Then again, I know that Captain Jack is supposed to be bisexual, but mentioning it is about as far as it got!)  I also wonder how serious Craig was being--he could have just been joking around, and, as usual, the tabloid media are turning it into something bigger than it is.

Vox clamantis in deserto

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Re: Gay Scene????

NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO

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Re: Gay Scene????

Whether its true or not, the day it happens, its the day I quit Bond for good, at least from that movie on.

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Re: Gay Scene????

What he's saying is that he'd have no problem doing a nude scene to appeal to both female fans, and the gay male fans of the films. He is simply pointing out that the new DR. WHO has broken boundaries. That's all.

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Re: Gay Scene????

Whether Craig is fully naked or not in any film is neither here nor there to me, but I do find it both a sign of the times and a testament to his quality as an actor that few, if any, people see a connection between the roles Craig takes on, his own sexuality, and the sexuality of James Bond.  Tastes are a-changin', and maybe we're finally growing up as a race.

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Re: Gay Scene????

CnB has a real gay obsession, doesn't it? They remind me of that vocally homophobic minister here in the States who got busted for getting "massages" from a male prostitute. Maybe someone over there needs to take the pressure off and come out of the closet. It'll be OK. It won't change our opinion of you. Honest. We'll still think you're idiots with your pathetic boycott. ajb007/lol

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Re: Gay Scene????

This is the biggest bunch of Bull***t I've ever seen!

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Re: Gay Scene????

I go over to CnB to get some laughs these days... I dunno, I hope the gay thing doesn't happen!  Full frontal nudity in a Bond film ain't right, either and I'm even really glad there is never any real foul language either...

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Re: Gay Scene????

delliott101 wrote:

I go over to CnB to get some laughs these days... I dunno, I hope the gay thing doesn't happen!  Full frontal nudity in a Bond film ain't right, either and I'm even really glad there is never any real foul language either...

I wouldn't worry too much about CnB ... this says far more about their homophobia (and attitude in general) than anything else.

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Re: Gay Scene????

I am not going to rise to the anti-gay comments, I just ignore them as I think they are unecessary. They are little do do with JB being gay and more to do with personal prejudice.

Whilst I don't thing we'll ever see a gay Bond (considering the direction this thread is taking) it might be interesting to see a gay villain who would push the boundaries a little, just to change the dynamics of the villians motivations (and although I would be fine with that I know a lot of gay folks would see it as a bad thing).

As I've said before, I don't really think that Bond films need full frontal, I am not convinced that there is anything it would bring to the film unless they are going to release a 15 rated film or a directors cut 18 rated DVD edition.

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Re: Gay Scene????

Predator wrote:

I wouldn't worry too much about CnB ... this says far more about their homophobia (and attitude in general) than anything else.

Glad to see your Santa hat back Pred. ajb007/smile

Last edited by Monique (1st Dec 2006 03:00)

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Re: Gay Scene????

a) I'm surprised that we haven't had the "naked walk in the moonlight butt shot" from Bond that we've seen with Mel Gibson and other actors - in the Connery era, we saw Bond undress and have a bath with the camera modestly cutting off any view of his other "gun". So really I think Bond should have gone full frontal ages ago.
b) Daniel Craig was in a movie called "Love is the Devil" in a dysfunctional gay relationship with an artist played by Derek Jacobi and this film has acquired gay cult film status. Indeed Craig's character in that film has some Bondian elements, especially the clothes and the brooding in hotel rooms with a bottle of whiskey etc. Craig is obviously very comfortable with his own sexuality and not afraid to play gay roles. But this doesnt mean Bond should turn bisexual or something.
c) EON still owes the gay community an apology for their cringable portrayal of Wynt and Kidd in DAF and it's way past time that Bond was brought up to date re sexual reality. He could easily be the cool heterosexual male who is neither offended by homosexuality nor threatened by it due to an insecure sexual identity. He could have a gay colleague perhaps, who would of course die in the line of duty as do most non-recurring supporting characters in Bond films. Bond could be a role model teaching straight men how to behave around gay men without the threat of violence on the one hand or seduction on the other. I think it's time we left Fleming's sexism, heterosexism and racism behind.

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Re: Gay Scene????

He should never become homosexual, bisexual or be involved in any scene imo. That would be as bad as casting a woman as bond.

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Re: Gay Scene????

"The heart-throb actor has also reportedly told studio chiefs he is prepared to film a full frontal nude scene to please both his male and
female admirers."

Why does Daniel Craig think doing a nude scene would please his male fans? Obviously gay fans will be the ones pleased, but no straight guys will find pleasure from that.

Last edited by CasinoChris75 (1st Dec 2006 08:46)

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Re: Gay Scene????

Firstly, the theme of homosexuality, or at least of sexual diversity (if you will), is nothing new to Bond stories. The novels and films have quite a few prominent gay/bisexual characters. Rosa Klebb in the FRWL novel is bisexual, and there are hints of it in the film; Pussy Galore, of course, is probably the most prominent character in that she's a lesbian in GF; and, of course, how can you forget the henchmen in the DAF film?

Off the top of my head, FRWL the novel, in particular, seemd to deal with sexuality outside of Bond's relations a great deal. There is also extended discussion of the MacLean treachery and defection when Bond is in the middle of a policy meeting in FRWL (and mention of his homosexuality). Kronsteen has the distinct thought that Bond is "not homosexual" due to the specification on his dossier that he has a weakness for women. Grant is listed as asexual, implying that he gets his releases through killing people.

There's also an interesting mention of Tanya having a bottom that was "in the shape of a man's" (paraphrasing), on which Fleming comments "This would have been a problem for a purist." What, exactly, does this imply? That Fleming himself isn't a "purist?" It is well known that Fleming had some odd tastes (he was a sado masochist, and he and his wife were into spanking), and this is embodied somewhat in Bond's fascination with spanking. It wouldn't be a stretch to say that, while Fleming wasn't homosexual, he acknowledged it as a legitimate sexual reality, not necessarily as some type of fire and brimstone curr as has been the conservative norm in post-industrial Anglo-Saxson society. One thing is for certain: it is a reality that has been observed throughout the history of the Bond franchise.

There's one other scene that I can't believe people are forgetting in GF: the scene in which Bond makes the sexually suggestive gesture toward the prison cell guard in an attempt to lure him into the cell so that he can get out. So here, while the character of Bond himself is not homosexual, we have already established in the film franchise that he is secure in his heterosexuality and not afraid to use his sexuality in a homoerotic context in order to achieve the furthering of the objective of his mission. I don't think this is out of the context of what we could expect a man as serious about his job as Bond is.

Will Bond ever be portrayed having a extended gay affair, or as being bisexual? Let me answer this one quite simply for you: no. It is not going to happen, even if Rupert Everett was cast. One of the defining points of Bond's character is his vice for women, and it is not a poitn that is really open to change. Could Bond perhaps use his sexual virility in a homoerotic context/encounter in order to accomplish a mission? I don't see why not, and it adds an element of believability to his character. (If you guys don't think that homosexual practice isn't involved in the real world intelligence business, I submit to you the Cambridge Five) Just because someone is straight doesn't mean they can't have an encounter with someone of their own gender for a reason such as accomplishing a mission or futhering a career, or that a gay person couldn't have sex with someone of the opposite gender toward the same ends. And both happen plenty in society, for these reasons and a variety of others, whether or not we have minds open enough to comprehend the possibility of such encounters occuring and simultaneously not necessarily defining true nature/identity. But I can absolutely guarantee you that Bond in nature will never, ever be portrayed as being homosexual or bisexual, as he has been well defined by nature as heterosexual. There will not be in the true romantic sense as defined by the franchise a "Bond Boy" anytime in the future.

And allow me to note that I find some of the anti-gay sentiment expressed in this thread and others on this board to be flat out appalling. There is a mountain of scientific evidence indicating that true sexual orientation is something that is natural and hardwired in DNA, and thus not something that people can necessarily choose to acquire or develop. Men can't determine whether they get a hard on looking at the Cindy Margolis spread in the December 2006 issue of Playboy (like I said, I can't help it ajb007/wink), by watching Backdoor Buddies, or if they just want a hole to stick it in and don't really care which one; an analogous case exists for women. Sexual orientation is biologically the same as hair color, eye color, bone structure, and skin color. I'm sure all of us can agree that no one in society should be discriminated against for the latter biological factors, so why should people be discriminated against based on who they naturally want to sleep with? The harsh attitude toward homosexuality that exists in many societies today has often had terrible consequences for the lives of a number of innocent people who just happen to be such: teen suicide, crippling depression (and often associated drug addiction and alcoholism), unjustified ruining of careers and effectively lives for people of very high ability (and the prevention in the first place of such people having careers upon discovery),the persistence in unsatisfying heterosexual relationships in which they feel trapped and unhappy and which ultimately lead to greater strains within these relationships, among many others. These are people who are just like heterosexuals every way, with the same thoughts and emotions and imperfections, except that they just happen to be wired differently in sexual orientation. Most are fine, productive citizens with great things to contribute on a variety of societal levels, just like heterosexuals; some happen to be selfish arses, just like heterosexuals. We could do these people and society as a whole a great deal of good if we'd just give them a bloody break. (I'm resorting to British euphemisms; God help me)

Last edited by Klaus Hergescheimer (1st Dec 2006 09:34)

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Re: Gay Scene????

Klaus Hergescheimer wrote:

And allow me to note that I find some of the anti-gay sentiment expressed in this thread and others on this board to be flat out appalling.

Klaus, what are you talking about?  No one in this thread has done any gay-bashing at all.  A couple of people have said that they don't want to see a gay Bond or Bond involved in a male-to-male sexual relationship; but no one has made disparaging comments about gay people or even implied that homosexuality is either a perversion or some kind of "choice."  If anything, the people in this thread have criticized that disgusting anti-Craig site for its rampant homophobia, and one has even said that the Bond series itself has created negative homosexual stereotypes.  I don't know that you're trying to pick a fight, but please be more mindful of what you say.

Vox clamantis in deserto

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Re: Gay Scene????

Klaus Hergescheimer wrote:

There's one other scene that I can't believe people are forgetting in GF: the scene in which Bond makes the sexually suggestive gesture toward the prison cell guard in an attempt to lure him into the cell so that he can get out. So here, while the character of Bond himself is not homosexual, we have already established in the film franchise that he is secure in his heterosexuality and not afraid to use his sexuality in a homoerotic context in order to achieve the furthering of the objective of his mission. I don't think this is out of the context of what we could expect a man as serious about his job as Bond is.

A wink and a wave is sexually suggestive and homoerotic?  This, coupled with your diatribe against non-existent anti-gay slurs in this this thread, leads me to believe your imagination is working overtime, Klaus.

Hilly...you old devil!

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Re: Gay Scene????

Sir Hillary Bray wrote:
Klaus Hergescheimer wrote:

There's one other scene that I can't believe people are forgetting in GF: the scene in which Bond makes the sexually suggestive gesture toward the prison cell guard in an attempt to lure him into the cell so that he can get out. So here, while the character of Bond himself is not homosexual, we have already established in the film franchise that he is secure in his heterosexuality and not afraid to use his sexuality in a homoerotic context in order to achieve the furthering of the objective of his mission. I don't think this is out of the context of what we could expect a man as serious about his job as Bond is.

A wink and a wave is sexually suggestive and homoerotic?  This, coupled with your diatribe against non-existent anti-gay slurs in this this thread, leads me to believe your imagination is working overtime, Klaus.

Yeah, I highly doubt that the ajb007/wink an the wave were ment to even be though of in a sexually suggestive way...

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Re: Gay Scene????

Sir Hillary Bray wrote:

A wink and a wave is sexually suggestive and homoerotic?  This, coupled with your diatribe against non-existent anti-gay slurs in this this thread, leads me to believe your imagination is working overtime, Klaus.

Firstly, I didn't say they were anti-gay "slurs." I said it was sentiment. Most have objected to Bond being gay, and that's fine; I object to it, too. The degree to which a couple of posts have gone in doing it, I think, implies something deeper. And I have seen other stuff on the forums outside of this thread that's pretty questionable.

Secondly, watch that scene again. I think it's pretty clear what Bond is doing. Again, he's not gay, but he's using a technique in order to get out of there, as anyone as serious about his job as Bond is would be expected to do.

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Re: Gay Scene????

I've never, ever, attached a sexual undertone to what Connery's Bond does in GF---i.e., the winking at the guard---to me it was always a seasoned, 'been here before' kind of thing from a veteran '00' agent, perhaps exploiting the inexperience of a low-level bad guy.

Sex never figured into it; nor have I ever before heard such a theory postulated  ajb007/confused   Perhaps I'm alone in this   ajb007/confused

Last edited by Loeffelholz (2nd Dec 2006 00:59)

"Blood & Ashes"...AVAILABLE on Amazon.co.uk: Get 'Jaded': Blood & Ashes: The Debut Oscar Jade Thriller
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM

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Re: Gay Scene????

Loeffelholz wrote:

I've never, ever, attached a sexual undertone to what Connery's Bond does in GF---i.e., the winking at the guard---to me it was always a seasoned, 'been here before' kind of thing from a veteran '00' agent, perhaps exploiting the inexperience of a low-level bad guy.

Sex never figured into it; nor have I ever before heard such a theory postulated  ajb007/confused   Perhaps I'm alone in this   ajb007/confused

I'm honestly surprised that I'm the only one so far who picked up on it. ajb007/wink

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Re: Gay Scene????

Hmm.  Well, for the time period, I would think it might be more of an insult to the guard than anything else -- a dig at his sexuality (and, perhaps, a play on western prejudices that eastern men are somehow less masculine than European men).  But given the stoicism of the guard's response, it seems more like simple childish behavior to get the guard's attention, escalated until Bond "disppears."  I will say, it never occured to me that Bond was "coming on" to the guard.

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Re: Gay Scene????

It's certainly easy enough (perhaps too easy  ajb007/wink  ) to project this kind of subcontext onto the sequence---from a modern 21st Century perspective---but I highly doubt such a thing was intended in 1964 by Broccoli, Saltzman, Hamilton and Maibaum...nice try, though  ajb007/rolleyes

Last edited by Loeffelholz (2nd Dec 2006 05:28)

"Blood & Ashes"...AVAILABLE on Amazon.co.uk: Get 'Jaded': Blood & Ashes: The Debut Oscar Jade Thriller
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM