Is EON Scared?

Barry NelsonBarry Nelson ChicagoPosts: 1,508MI6 Agent
As the attached articles points out, 2011 is going to be a big year for blockbuster movies, including many franchise film series that are sure to draw big crowds. While reading the article it occured to me that EON may have made a business decision to avoid 2011 and position Bond in 2012 where the competition may be less. I have to admit the film calender next year is loaded with a lot of films, that at this point anyway, I want to see. The last time a Bond film bombed (relatively) was when LTK faced some tough competition at the box office. In the long run, it may turn out to be a wise move, business wise, to release Bond in 2012.

http://movies.msn.com/paralleluniverse/geek-overload/story/across-the-universe/?GT1=28101
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Comments

  • Napoleon PluralNapoleon Plural LondonPosts: 10,239MI6 Agent
    Er, what do you mean? Those films come out in the summer. It's unlikely EON can get a film out even for Christmas next year bearing in mind it's Nov 2010 now. Filming should be due to start next month and that aint happening. If summer 2012 is a big year, that could be problem.
    "This is where we leave you Mr Bond."

    Roger Moore 1927-2017
  • Ricardo C.Ricardo C. Posts: 916MI6 Agent
    Er, what do you mean? Those films come out in the summer. It's unlikely EON can get a film out even for Christmas next year bearing in mind it's Nov 2010 now. Filming should be due to start next month and that aint happening. If summer 2012 is a big year, that could be problem.

    Exactly.
  • Barry NelsonBarry Nelson ChicagoPosts: 1,508MI6 Agent
    My point was, that perhaps EON planned all along for a 2012 release knowing that 2011 was loaded with huge films. Specific release dates for these movies were not known until fairly recently and schedules are always being juggled to provide best possible success at the box office. Example being the Harry Potter movie that was delayed about a year ago.

    It has been fairlry obvious since the release of QOS that EON has been in no hurry to release another film. So my theory, and it is just a theory for conversations purposes, was that EON may have seen the large number of blockbuster movies planned for next year and decided 2012 looked better.
  • Ricardo C.Ricardo C. Posts: 916MI6 Agent
    My point was, that perhaps EON planned all along for a 2012 release knowing that 2011 was loaded with huge films. Specific release dates for these movies were not known until fairly recently and schedules are always being juggled to provide best possible success at the box office. Example being the Harry Potter movie that was delayed about a year ago.

    It has been fairlry obvious since the release of QOS that EON has been in no hurry to release another film. So my theory, and it is just a theory for conversations purposes, was that EON may have seen the large number of blockbuster movies planned for next year and decided 2012 looked better.

    But the flaw in your theory is MGM's obvious financial problems has been holding up production. Most likely a 2011 release date was their original target. And that delay due to a Harry Potter film was not that dramatic.
  • bluemanblueman PDXPosts: 1,667MI6 Agent
    Pretty sure EON could release 23 whenever, to great BO and fanfare. It ain't '89, and Craig ain't Dalton.
  • LoeffelholzLoeffelholz The United States, With LovePosts: 8,988Quartermasters
    Not sure what they'd have been up against in November 2011 (is it H.P. and the Deathly Hallows 2?)...

    I'd think they're just trying to give themselves time, at this point, to do the proper location scouting, pre-prod, writing a good script (hopefully :# ), give Craigger some training time, etc.

    That said, of course I think it remains a sound business strategy to keep Bond out of the now-constant summer superhero noise.
    Check out my Amazon author page! Mark Loeffelholz
    "I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
    "Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
  • Barry NelsonBarry Nelson ChicagoPosts: 1,508MI6 Agent
    blueman wrote:
    Pretty sure EON could release 23 whenever, to great BO and fanfare. It ain't '89, and Craig ain't Dalton.


    Sorry, I forgot Craig was a huge box office star, let's see what film(s) other than Bond that he starred in was a big success. Gee, none. Please don't say Laura Croft or Road to Perdition because most folks don't even know he was in those. I just don't agree that Craig is some big star that draws people to the cinema.

    http://www.boxofficemojo.com/people/chart/?id=danielcraig.htm

    I think EON has recently been purposely avoiding summer releases to avoid competing against other action fare. I don't blame them for that, it is a smart move. The fall tends to be a time of more serious movie offerings and a Bond film can be a fun break from the drama. I think a Bond film released into the middle of next summer's blockbuster madness would get lost in the mix pretty quick. As may other films, for that matter.
  • LoeffelholzLoeffelholz The United States, With LovePosts: 8,988Quartermasters
    I like the Bonds in autumn rather than summer, for the reasons you just cited, Barry. If I were in the driver's seat, I'd be staying with what's been working nicely. Still, I wish they were getting ready to roll in a couple of months for a 2011 release... :# But a 50th Anniversary release it shall be. Perhaps it's fate.
    Check out my Amazon author page! Mark Loeffelholz
    "I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
    "Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
  • Barry NelsonBarry Nelson ChicagoPosts: 1,508MI6 Agent
    Not sure what they'd have been up against in November 2011 (is it H.P. and the Deathly Hallows 2?)...

    I'd think they're just trying to give themselves time, at this point, to do the proper location scouting, pre-prod, writing a good script (hopefully :# ), give Craigger some training time, etc.

    That said, of course I think it remains a sound business strategy to keep Bond out of the now-constant summer superhero noise.


    I think you are probably right, I started the thread after reading the article and thinking that was a lot of big films. Then I thought, gee maybe they avoided 2011 on pupose. I have no evidence they did, I just decided I would start a conversation and came up with a provocative title for the thread. I am certainly not adament that they avided 2011 to avoid trhe competition.
  • LoeffelholzLoeffelholz The United States, With LovePosts: 8,988Quartermasters
    I'd much rather it was 2011 (November)! Sooner is always better than later, as far as I'm concerned :007) And I can't help but be concerned about anniversary baggage in '12, but things are what they are. Looks like the last Potter is a summer '11 film, so there's nothing (except the bankruptcy, and the resulting lack of preparation) keeping them from next year...but Craig does seem to be busy---box office gold or not! {:)
    Check out my Amazon author page! Mark Loeffelholz
    "I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
    "Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
  • Ricardo C.Ricardo C. Posts: 916MI6 Agent
    blueman wrote:
    Pretty sure EON could release 23 whenever, to great BO and fanfare. It ain't '89, and Craig ain't Dalton.


    Sorry, I forgot Craig was a huge box office star, let's see what film(s) other than Bond that he starred in was a big success. Gee, none. Please don't say Laura Croft or Road to Perdition because most folks don't even know he was in those. I just don't agree that Craig is some big star that draws people to the cinema.

    http://www.boxofficemojo.com/people/chart/?id=danielcraig.htm

    I think EON has recently been purposely avoiding summer releases to avoid competing against other action fare. I don't blame them for that, it is a smart move. The fall tends to be a time of more serious movie offerings and a Bond film can be a fun break from the drama. I think a Bond film released into the middle of next summer's blockbuster madness would get lost in the mix pretty quick. As may other films, for that matter.

    I am going to have to disagree with both of you. First off, they certaintly can't release the film "whenever". The fact of the mater is Bond's popularity is fairly strong but it's being eclisped by the Twilights, Transformers', and Batmans.

    Secound, bringing up Craig's box office clout is a moot point. Out of all six Bond actors, so far, only Sean Connery had a long career of financial success and critical accolades. In general, this is the case of many who are heavily associated with franchises. Take for example Roman Polanski's Ghost Writer, they contained principle actors from the James Bond and Star Wars franchises which have generated billions of dollars and yet this film's release was played with little fanfare. Same thing applies to Christopher Reeve, Carrie Fisher, and Mark Hammill; All their careers in features all but dried up when they left their most popular roles.
  • HowardBHowardB USAPosts: 2,737MI6 Agent
    I believe the original plan, before all this MGM mess came about was to release Bond 23 in Nov 2011. Michael Wilson was pretty clear that they wanted a three year gap for the next film because he was tired and needed a break.
  • zaphodzaphod Posts: 1,183MI6 Agent
    Ricardo C. wrote:
    blueman wrote:
    Pretty sure EON could release 23 whenever, to great BO and fanfare. It ain't '89, and Craig ain't Dalton.


    Sorry, I forgot Craig was a huge box office star, let's see what film(s) other than Bond that he starred in was a big success. Gee, none. Please don't say Laura Croft or Road to Perdition because most folks don't even know he was in those. I just don't agree that Craig is some big star that draws people to the cinema.

    http://www.boxofficemojo.com/people/chart/?id=danielcraig.htm

    I think EON has recently been purposely avoiding summer releases to avoid competing against other action fare. I don't blame them for that, it is a smart move. The fall tends to be a time of more serious movie offerings and a Bond film can be a fun break from the drama. I think a Bond film released into the middle of next summer's blockbuster madness would get lost in the mix pretty quick. As may other films, for that matter.

    I am going to have to disagree with both of you. First off, they certaintly can't release the film "whenever". The fact of the mater is Bond's popularity is fairly strong but it's being eclisped by the Twilights, Transformers', and Batmans.

    Secound, bringing up Craig's box office clout is a moot point. Out of all six Bond actors, so far, only Sean Connery had a long career of financial success and critical accolades. In general, this is the case of many who are heavily associated with franchises. Take for example Roman Polanski's Ghost Writer, they contained principle actors from the James Bond and Star Wars franchises which have generated billions of dollars and yet this film's release was played with little fanfare. Same thing applies to Christopher Reeve, Carrie Fisher, and Mark Hammill; All their careers in features all but dried up when they left their most popular roles.


    I agree. I think that the age of the sure-fire 'Ill go see whatever they are in' type superstar is over, at least for the timebeing. Even with Connnery revisionist history forgets the wilderness years immediatley after Bond (The Anderson Tapes, Zardoz etc)
    Connery eventualy became an elder statesman, and to some extent a 'draw' in his own right, but it was far from immediate.
  • HowardBHowardB USAPosts: 2,737MI6 Agent
    "The Anderson Tapes" was actually a box office hit and definately one of Connery's better "wilderness years" films. Connery
    deserved at least an Oscar nomination for "The Offence" but the film had limited release in the States and while the film is very well done it's not exactly light entertainment and can be hard to watch. The list of "klinkers" he made during that "era" is long...in fact Connery has been in tons of bad movies throughout his entire post Bond career. Fortunately he also has been in some true classics and very good ones also; The Man Who Would Be King, The Untouchables, The Molly McGuires, The Great Train Robbery, Outland, The Hunt For Red October, and Robin and Marian come to mind.
  • zaphodzaphod Posts: 1,183MI6 Agent
    HowardB wrote:
    "The Anderson Tapes" was actually a box office hit and definately one of Connery's better "wilderness years" films. Connery
    deserved at least an Oscar nomination for "The Offence" but the film had limited release in the States and while the film is very well done it's not exactly light entertainment and can be hard to watch. The list of "klinkers" he made during that "era" is long...in fact Connery has been in tons of bad movies throughout his entire post Bond career. Fortunately he also has been in some true classics and very good ones also; The Man Who Would Be King, The Untouchables, The Molly McGuires, The Great Train Robbery, Outland, The Hunt For Red October, and Robin and Marian come to mind.


    I think we are talking about different things, I was restricting myself to 'Box Office' by picking up thge thread of $$$ clout. I am perfectly prepered to defer to your knowledge re the financial success of The Anderson Tapes if it was indeed a smash. As for the Offence it's a truly superb film and great performance and as such was rightly lauded bt the critics, but remained a somewhat left-field affair. A lot of the good films you mention did indeed occur sometime after his tenure as Bond. I was merely stating that even 'Big Tam' had his work cut out after Bond, and that being that closely associated with the Global phenomenom that was Jemes Bond was not enough in and of itself to guarantee big Box Office.
  • bluemanblueman PDXPosts: 1,667MI6 Agent
    blueman wrote:
    Pretty sure EON could release 23 whenever, to great BO and fanfare. It ain't '89, and Craig ain't Dalton.


    Sorry, I forgot Craig was a huge box office star, let's see what film(s) other than Bond that he starred in was a big success. Gee, none. Please don't say Laura Croft or Road to Perdition because most folks don't even know he was in those. I just don't agree that Craig is some big star that draws people to the cinema.

    http://www.boxofficemojo.com/people/chart/?id=danielcraig.htm

    I think EON has recently been purposely avoiding summer releases to avoid competing against other action fare. I don't blame them for that, it is a smart move. The fall tends to be a time of more serious movie offerings and a Bond film can be a fun break from the drama. I think a Bond film released into the middle of next summer's blockbuster madness would get lost in the mix pretty quick. As may other films, for that matter.

    Craig is hotter now whilst playing Bond than any other Bond actor was during their run. The films haven't come out yet, but consider:

    [list=*]
    [*]Dragon Tattoo, looks to be a decent hit as Fincher's films will do, and Craig's signed for two sequels.[/*]
    [/list]

    [list=*]
    [*]Tintin, animated Spielberg holiday fare, be very surprised if that doesn't put up hefty numbers, and again Craig is on the hook for two sequels.[/*]
    [/list]

    [list=*]
    [*]Cowboys v. Aliens, great cast with the Iron Man director and targeted for a summer release, also will be surprised if that one doesn't do good at the BO, and again Craig is contracted for sequels.[/*]
    [/list]

    Counting Bond that's 4 big-ticket franchises the guy's involved in, not even Connery in the 60s had this much play in Hollywood. Craig is the face of Bond right now, which grosses half a billion a pop. You might not think he's BO gold, but apparently lots of very big producer types do.

    So yeah, EON could release 23 whenever and make a killing. IMHO. But also agree they go November again, cuz it ain't broken. Just think the notion of EON being scared is pretty silly, considering.
  • Ricardo C.Ricardo C. Posts: 916MI6 Agent
    blueman wrote:
    Counting Bond that's 4 big-ticket franchises the guy's involved in, not even Connery in the 60s had this much play in Hollywood. Craig is the face of Bond right now, which grosses half a billion a pop. You might not think he's BO gold, but apparently lots of very big producer types do.

    None of those up-coming films you mentioned are long established film franchises you pointed out. Even if they were, it still dosen't prove Daniel Craig could be a box office draw on his own. He would have to star in a film with him being the biggest name that has no major past history.
  • bluemanblueman PDXPosts: 1,667MI6 Agent
    Ricardo C. wrote:
    blueman wrote:
    Counting Bond that's 4 big-ticket franchises the guy's involved in, not even Connery in the 60s had this much play in Hollywood. Craig is the face of Bond right now, which grosses half a billion a pop. You might not think he's BO gold, but apparently lots of very big producer types do.

    None of those up-coming films you mentioned are long established film franchises you pointed out. Even if they were, it still dosen't prove Daniel Craig could be a box office draw on his own. He would have to star in a film with him being the biggest name that has no major past history.
    You're right, they aren't established franchises. But I'd bet the producers want them to become franchises, and are banking at least in part on Craig's unlikely (remember, this was the actor fated to kill the franchise, according to some) but wildly profitable success with the Bond franchise to help with that. Maybe we should check back in a few years, see how all this turns out?

    But again, no Bond actor - not Connery, Lazenby, Moore, Dalton or Brosnan - whilst still in the role, had this kinda play in Hollywood, it's really unprecedented. And riffing on the "unlikely" aspect of it, spy action films are kinda vogue these days the way they haven't been since at least the 70s, that Craig/Bond can capture so much of a very crowded market also says a lot IMO.
  • Aston Martin DBSAston Martin DBS Derbyshire, EnglandPosts: 659MI6 Agent
    I think that a winter release would be good too... not only for all the reasons mentioned in this thread but with the current economic climate with people having to watch what they spend, cinema might not be the affordable luxury it once was. So if they release the new Bond movie in the winter I'm guessing more regular cinmea going people will choose it, because there won't me a glut of big box office films to choose from.
    "NEVER SAY NO TO ADVENTURES." Ian Fleming
  • Ricardo C.Ricardo C. Posts: 916MI6 Agent
    blueman wrote:
    Maybe we should check back in a few years, see how all this turns out?

    Agreed.
    But again, no Bond actor - not Connery, Lazenby, Moore, Dalton or Brosnan - whilst still in the role, had this kinda play in Hollywood, it's really unprecedented. And riffing on the "unlikely" aspect of it, spy action films are kinda vogue these days the way they haven't been since at least the 70s, that Craig/Bond can capture so much of a very crowded market also says a lot IMO.

    Craig has indeed set a presecedent but to see if he could truly stand out on his own, we'd have to see him in successive one shot pictures. We can never tell, he could be the next Harrison Ford and at least have some successful one shots under his belt.
  • Napoleon PluralNapoleon Plural LondonPosts: 10,239MI6 Agent
    I really have to say that all Craig's upcoming films could easily bomb. Tintin is getting bad forebodings on aintitcool, as it's not cartoon nor live action, it's neither fish nor fowl and while Jackson and Spielberg have no end of credit, there are doubts about this. Likewise, some will doubt that Craig should really be the lead in the Swedish thriller, he should be an older guy (though Craig's craggy older looks might assist here.) Dunno about Cowboys...

    That said, Craig will still be appealing as Bond I'm sure, but even better to strike when the iron was hot not wait until everything has moved on a bit.
    "This is where we leave you Mr Bond."

    Roger Moore 1927-2017
  • bluemanblueman PDXPosts: 1,667MI6 Agent
    Yeah, Tintin does sound like more of an oddity, be curious to see how that does. Dragon and Cowboy sound pretty dang crowd-pleasey to me, though, should be solid hits.
  • LoeffelholzLoeffelholz The United States, With LovePosts: 8,988Quartermasters
    The elephant in the room here is the fact that lots of producers are casting their die with Craig---never a bad thing if you're an actor! You can't win if you don't play. Sure, everything he does in '11 might lay a turd; then again, not every Bond actor's non-Bond film can be a huge box office hit/critical triumph like Zardoz B-)
    Check out my Amazon author page! Mark Loeffelholz
    "I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
    "Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
  • HowardBHowardB USAPosts: 2,737MI6 Agent
    IMO Craig, through Bond, has elevated to the level of "bankable star". Which to me means he is a very good actor, is a fresh face but has good recognition with the public, can have his name above the titles on high budget "big" films, but at the same time does not command (or demand) the ridiculous fees and piece of the profits that many other big megastars demand that inflate the budget of films to the point that if they are not huge blockbusters at the boxoffice it's hard for the film to make a decent profit. It's not a bad place to be...the guy is sure getting alot of work.
  • Ricardo C.Ricardo C. Posts: 916MI6 Agent
    HowardB wrote:
    IMO Craig, through Bond, has elevated to the level of "bankable star". Which to me means he is a very good actor, is a fresh face but has good recognition with the public, can have his name above the titles on high budget "big" films, but at the same time does not command (or demand) the ridiculous fees and piece of the profits that many other big megastars demand that inflate the budget of films to the point that if they are not huge blockbusters at the boxoffice it's hard for the film to make a decent profit. It's not a bad place to be...the guy is sure getting alot of work.

    He's getting work for sure with noted directors but he hasn't recieved his name above a title yet nor has he proven to be a box office draw on his own.
  • HowardBHowardB USAPosts: 2,737MI6 Agent
    "Defiance" may not have been a hit, but Craig's name is prominantly displayed above the title by itself and the entire poster is a picture of Craig holding a machine pistol . But I agree, he certainly has yet to prove he is a box office draw on his own.
  • Ricardo C.Ricardo C. Posts: 916MI6 Agent
    HowardB wrote:
    "Defiance" may not have been a hit, but Craig's name is prominantly displayed above the title by itself and the entire poster is a picture of Craig holding a machine pistol . But I agree, he certainly has yet to prove he is a box office draw on his own.

    I didn't know that about Defiance.

    The way I see it is if Craig participates in another major franchise, he may yet become an attraction on his own afterwards.
  • HowardBHowardB USAPosts: 2,737MI6 Agent
    "Cowboys and Aliens" has alot of summer box office potential based upon its' pedigree. This is not in any way a knock on Daniel Craig, but I don't see him becoming a Brad Pitt/Tom Cruise type superstar. Craig does not seek the spotlight, does not have a reputation as being difficult on the set, seems to keep a low profile when not promoting a film, is very private about his personal life, appears generally grounded and doesn't go around fighting with the press or punching out papparazzi. In the USA at least, he's not tabloid fodder. I think he's considered a leading man who's very adept at action but also respected as being a talented actor with range and most importantly high profile directors want to use him (he's been in two Speilberg films and wouldn't surprise me if he gets a starring role in another down the road). I like him very much as Bond and I hope EON take advantage of the great potential he brings to the charactor by demanding better scripts from the writers and learning from the mistakes of QOS.
  • LoeffelholzLoeffelholz The United States, With LovePosts: 8,988Quartermasters
    edited November 2010
    HowardB wrote:
    "Defiance" may not have been a hit, but Craig's name is prominantly displayed above the title by itself and the entire poster is a picture of Craig holding a machine pistol . But I agree, he certainly has yet to prove he is a box office draw on his own.

    A fine film, IMO.
    Check out my Amazon author page! Mark Loeffelholz
    "I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
    "Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM
  • Napoleon PluralNapoleon Plural LondonPosts: 10,239MI6 Agent
    cowboys-and-aliens-full-teaser-poster-15-11-10-kc.jpg
    "This is where we leave you Mr Bond."

    Roger Moore 1927-2017
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