376

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Hi Delicious, read my new posts on the film's subtexts to see where they were going with it. It's on the hype died down thread. Though I agree with you.

"This is where we leave you Mr Bond."

Roger Moore 1927-2017

377

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Pierce seem to enjoy skyfall.  ajb007/lol
http://youtu.be/pKDSiI7rnAA

Pierce Brosnan On The New James Bond

378

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

If they want to revive Bond they need to do the following:

(1) ask the fans what they love about Bond and cater to that (that's why Star Trek is still so good and popular)
(2) take the focus off Bond and put it back on the villain - Bond began to be the focus with GE and the writing has steadily encroached on him ever since to the point where he has almost been psycho-analyzed out of existence
(3) bring back the joy and lightness of Bond - in a world which is becoming more serious and grim by the day, we need to escape - bring back the gadgets, the exotic locations, the humour and the sex.
(4) make sure everything that happens means something and contributes to the plot and themes - SF was a mess
(5) make the action and logic of the film believable (allowing for the usual physics-defying action of course)
(6) make the villain's plan something that deserves Bond's attention - missing hard drives and secret water supplies don't cut it

379

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

delicious wrote:

If they want to revive Bond they need to do the following:

(1) ask the fans what they love about Bond and cater to that (that's why Star Trek is still so good and popular)
(2) take the focus off Bond and put it back on the villain - Bond began to be the focus with GE and the writing has steadily encroached on him ever since to the point where he has almost been psycho-analyzed out of existence
(3) bring back the joy and lightness of Bond - in a world which is becoming more serious and grim by the day, we need to escape - bring back the gadgets, the exotic locations, the humour and the sex.
(4) make sure everything that happens means something and contributes to the plot and themes - SF was a mess
(5) make the action and logic of the film believable (allowing for the usual physics-defying action of course)
(6) make the villain's plan something that deserves Bond's attention - missing hard drives and secret water supplies don't cut it

Revive Bond???

I think with Skyfall being the biggest Bond film ever etc I dont think EON will be changing the formula as Bond is very much alive and well  ajb007/biggrin

Instagram - bondclothes007

380

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

welshboy78 wrote:
delicious wrote:

If they want to revive Bond they need to do the following:

(1) ask the fans what they love about Bond and cater to that (that's why Star Trek is still so good and popular)
(2) take the focus off Bond and put it back on the villain - Bond began to be the focus with GE and the writing has steadily encroached on him ever since to the point where he has almost been psycho-analyzed out of existence
(3) bring back the joy and lightness of Bond - in a world which is becoming more serious and grim by the day, we need to escape - bring back the gadgets, the exotic locations, the humour and the sex.
(4) make sure everything that happens means something and contributes to the plot and themes - SF was a mess
(5) make the action and logic of the film believable (allowing for the usual physics-defying action of course)
(6) make the villain's plan something that deserves Bond's attention - missing hard drives and secret water supplies don't cut it

Revive Bond???

I think with Skyfall being the biggest Bond film ever etc I dont think EON will be changing the formula as Bond is very much alive and well  ajb007/biggrin

Absolutely! It sounds like our friend delicious is lobbying for a return to the Roger Moore era Bond. Sorry, but that time has passed.

"Felix Leiter, a brother from Langley."

381

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Oh, I think I caught a few Nods to the Moore era in Skyfall.   ajb007/lol

382

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Thunderpussy wrote:

Oh, I think I caught a few Nods to the Moore era in Skyfall.   ajb007/lol

Among others! (Most obviously the DB5) But it WAS the 50th anniversary movie, so that's only natural. It was handled more subtly than the 40th anniversary nods in DAD.

383

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Oh Way more subtle.  ajb007/martini and nicely done.  ajb007/wink  If Only we could of
had a few "Double taking " pigeons.

384

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Thunderpussy wrote:

  If Only we could of
had a few "Double taking " pigeons.

They'll be back- just be patient....  ajb007/lol

385

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

welshboy78 wrote:
delicious wrote:

If they want to revive Bond they need to do the following:

(1) ask the fans what they love about Bond and cater to that (that's why Star Trek is still so good and popular)
(2) take the focus off Bond and put it back on the villain - Bond began to be the focus with GE and the writing has steadily encroached on him ever since to the point where he has almost been psycho-analyzed out of existence
(3) bring back the joy and lightness of Bond - in a world which is becoming more serious and grim by the day, we need to escape - bring back the gadgets, the exotic locations, the humour and the sex.
(4) make sure everything that happens means something and contributes to the plot and themes - SF was a mess
(5) make the action and logic of the film believable (allowing for the usual physics-defying action of course)
(6) make the villain's plan something that deserves Bond's attention - missing hard drives and secret water supplies don't cut it

Revive Bond???

I think with Skyfall being the biggest Bond film ever etc I dont think EON will be changing the formula as Bond is very much alive and well  ajb007/biggrin

Commercial success does not indicate quality. Casino Royale is the only good Daniel Craig Bond film to date. QoS and SF were both terrible. As I said in my original review, SF was like a really intense sales pitch to try and convince us that Bond is good - I didnt fall for it but a lot of people obviously did. It was like some one shouting to get their point across as though volume makes up for meaning.

386

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

delicious wrote:

If they want to revive Bond they need to do the following:

(1) ask the fans what they love about Bond and cater to that (that's why Star Trek is still so good and popular)
(2) take the focus off Bond and put it back on the villain - Bond began to be the focus with GE and the writing has steadily encroached on him ever since to the point where he has almost been psycho-analyzed out of existence
(3) bring back the joy and lightness of Bond - in a world which is becoming more serious and grim by the day, we need to escape - bring back the gadgets, the exotic locations, the humour and the sex.
(4) make sure everything that happens means something and contributes to the plot and themes - SF was a mess
(5) make the action and logic of the film believable (allowing for the usual physics-defying action of course)
(6) make the villain's plan something that deserves Bond's attention - missing hard drives and secret water supplies don't cut it

You do realise the new Trek films are intensely divise for Trekkies right?  I mean, I enjoy the movies and they are good... but they are absolutely terrible TREK films.  They just don't fit the series to me. 

As for a Bond reboot.. sadly, since Skyfall wooed enough people somehow we are stuck with this overtly gritty, dark, brooding bond that has to opine about aging and a chanign world for a few more films I fear.  O well, at least it will eventually get back to it in a decade or so.  I mean, I got through the Moore years with only a few true gems and survived to the powerhouse Dalton and Brosnan films (DAD not included...).

Top Ten Bond - 10:Goldfinger 9:Thunderball 8:The Spy who Loved Me 7:For Your Eyes Only 6: Casino Royale 5:The Man with the Golden Gun 4:Quantum of Solace 3:Licence to Kill 2:Goldeneye 1:The Living Daylights

387

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

delicious wrote:
welshboy78 wrote:
delicious wrote:

If they want to revive Bond they need to do the following:

(1) ask the fans what they love about Bond and cater to that (that's why Star Trek is still so good and popular)
(2) take the focus off Bond and put it back on the villain - Bond began to be the focus with GE and the writing has steadily encroached on him ever since to the point where he has almost been psycho-analyzed out of existence
(3) bring back the joy and lightness of Bond - in a world which is becoming more serious and grim by the day, we need to escape - bring back the gadgets, the exotic locations, the humour and the sex.
(4) make sure everything that happens means something and contributes to the plot and themes - SF was a mess
(5) make the action and logic of the film believable (allowing for the usual physics-defying action of course)
(6) make the villain's plan something that deserves Bond's attention - missing hard drives and secret water supplies don't cut it

Revive Bond???

I think with Skyfall being the biggest Bond film ever etc I dont think EON will be changing the formula as Bond is very much alive and well  ajb007/biggrin

Commercial success does not indicate quality. Casino Royale is the only good Daniel Craig Bond film to date. QoS and SF were both terrible. As I said in my original review, SF was like a really intense sales pitch to try and convince us that Bond is good - I didnt fall for it but a lot of people obviously did. It was like some one shouting to get their point across as though volume makes up for meaning.

According to you, that is. Your review is no indication of quality either - its subjective.

YNWA 96

The Unbearables

388

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Sir Miles wrote:

According to you, that is. Your review is no indication of quality either - its subjective.

Absolutely spot on Sir!!  ajb007/martini

It does make me smile when I read such "empty" claims such as the one that you commented upon.  Surely to god people can accept that not all of us think the same way or have the same tastes ... one man's poison & all that??!

For the record I thoroughly enjoyed Skyfall and I also enjoyed QoS.  Without shouting about it ...  ajb007/biggrin   ajb007/wink

389

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

delicious wrote:

As I said in my original review, SF was like a really intense sales pitch to try and convince us that Bond is good - I didnt fall for it but a lot of people obviously did.

Or perhaps those of us who felt SF was a very good Bond film didn't "fall for" anything, but instead we were able to discern qualities that you somehow failed to grasp? I understand that you didn't think much of Skyfall, but do you really have to be so condenscending towards the viewers that did? Sheesh! ajb007/confused

"Felix Leiter, a brother from Langley."

390

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Blackleiter wrote:
delicious wrote:

As I said in my original review, SF was like a really intense sales pitch to try and convince us that Bond is good - I didnt fall for it but a lot of people obviously did.

Or perhaps those of us who felt SF was a very good Bond film didn't "fall for" anything, but instead we were able to discern qualities that you somehow failed to grasp? I understand that you didn't think much of Skyfall, but do you really have to be so condenscending towards the viewers that did? Sheesh! ajb007/confused

I for one don't hate SF, but I do feel that it did not fully live up to it's promise, or realise it's ambitions so I find it frustrating rather than bad as it was so nearly superb. In some ways it's the DAD of the Craig era for me (although nowhere near the Train wreck that DAD was ) I think we should be able to acknowledge it's flaws whilst recognising it as a superior entry than many of the series ( I have it pegged at about 5 or 6 overall) but it could have been so much higher.

391

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

zaphod wrote:
Blackleiter wrote:
delicious wrote:

As I said in my original review, SF was like a really intense sales pitch to try and convince us that Bond is good - I didnt fall for it but a lot of people obviously did.

Or perhaps those of us who felt SF was a very good Bond film didn't "fall for" anything, but instead we were able to discern qualities that you somehow failed to grasp? I understand that you didn't think much of Skyfall, but do you really have to be so condenscending towards the viewers that did? Sheesh! ajb007/confused

I for one don't hate SF, but I do feel that it did not fully live up to it's promise, or realise it's ambitions so I find it frustrating rather than bad as it was so nearly superb. In some ways it's the DAD of the Craig era for me (although nowhere near the Train wreck that DAD was ) I think we should be able to acknowledge it's flaws whilst recognising it as a superior entry than many of the series ( I have it pegged at about 5 or 6 overall) but it could have been so much higher.

I don't disagree with you, Zap (although the DAD comparison escapes me), but I get somewhat annoyed when someone suggests, as delicious does, that the only folks who think SF is a good Bond film are those foolish enough to "fall for" the flim-flam. That's pretty insulting, if you ask me.

"Felix Leiter, a brother from Langley."

392

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Let me try to make it clearer if I can. DAD had a strong first act, and got progressively weaker as it progressed. For me SF is similar although nowhere near as pronounced.DAD could have been a superb entry but lost it's momentum.it may be a weak observation but they strike a similar chord for me.

393

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

I agree, Only those who think QOS is Great.
Have fallen for the flim flam. :-)

394

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

zaphod wrote:

Let me try to make it clearer if I can. DAD had a strong first act, and got progressively weaker as it progressed. For me SF is similar although nowhere near as pronounced.DAD could have been a superb entry but lost it's momentum.it may be a weak observation but they strike a similar chord for me.

I see your point now, and it's a good one.

"Felix Leiter, a brother from Langley."

395

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Thunderpussy wrote:

I agree, Only those who think QOS is Great.
Have fallen for the flim flam. :-)

Only those who think QoS is great, what ?

And its good for you to openly admit you have fallen for the flim flam  ajb007/cool

YNWA 96

The Unbearables

396

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Oh, I love a bit of Flim Flam.  ajb007/lol

397

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Sir Miles wrote:
delicious wrote:
welshboy78 wrote:

Revive Bond???

I think with Skyfall being the biggest Bond film ever etc I dont think EON will be changing the formula as Bond is very much alive and well  ajb007/biggrin

Commercial success does not indicate quality. Casino Royale is the only good Daniel Craig Bond film to date. QoS and SF were both terrible. As I said in my original review, SF was like a really intense sales pitch to try and convince us that Bond is good - I didnt fall for it but a lot of people obviously did. It was like some one shouting to get their point across as though volume makes up for meaning.

According to you, that is. Your review is no indication of quality either - its subjective.


er....perhaps you can direct me to an "objective" review? ahem

398

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

There was a quality to SF which was contrived and trying too hard to manipulate the audience - for instance when M dies at the end we're supposed to feel sadness/pathos - I was unmoved but I knew the film makers expected me to be moved - that was their intention with that scene. That's manipulation. However if we turn to The Bourne Ultimatum where Bourne visits the daughter of the couple he murdered in the hotel room and explains that her mother didn't kill her father, Bourne killed both of them - that was truly sad and had real pathos because Bourne was thinking of the death of his own girlfriend at the start of the film. See the difference?

Ask yourself and be honest - did you feel sad at M's death because the scene was sad or because the film was telling you to feel sad the way canned laughter tells you something is funny in a lame American sitcom like Everybody Loves Raymond? Is your loyalty to Bond as a brand - wanting the films to be good - blinding you to the actual quality of the last 2 films.

I'm not a Moore fan, I think Dalton was the best Bond - an action man with manners and a sense of humour - and Brosnan wasn't too bad either for the most part.

Mathis's death in QoS was also contrived and didn't quite work, BUT the scene where Bond finds Vesper under the shower in CR and comforts her does have real pathos about it. There was nothing contrived about that situation - I didn't feel like I was being manipulated into feeling something that wasn't really there just because the circumstances demanded that I should. Vesper's fear after witnessing the violence of the fight in the stairwell was something that anyone could relate to. It touched a universal chord. M's death in SF did not.

The villain's escape from MI5 in SF and the trap involving diverting a train to crash on top of Bond was also incredibly contrived. And how did the villain escape from his prison and kill his guards - we don't know and we are never told how. That's a long way from the genius of films like Oceans 11 etc where every aspect of the film's infiltrations is either shown or explained later - pure entertainment. It made SF look lazy - were the writers having an RDO that day?

QoS did not have a plot/villain deserving of Bond - Bond should be stopping men who are trying to take over or destroy the whole world. The lame missing hard drive idea in SF was even weaker - who cares about a few agents who could have been told to leave their posts if they were in danger. Hardly edge of the seat stuff.

Any competent screenwriter will tell you that the villain and the challenge he presents drives the film and defines the hero. This has been sadly lacking in the all of the Craig films. If you don't believe me look it up in screenwriting 101 in any university curriculum.

399

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Good post delicious  ajb007/martini  enjoyed reading it.  ajb007/smile

I did feel sad at M's Death but Only because we were saying goodbye
to Dame Judi. Our last time to see her in a Bond film.  Although I do agree
the villains for Craig's Bond haven't been up to much. Here's hoping they will
start to get a little more larger than life as we go on.  ajb007/lol

400

Re: Skyfall AJB reviews - SPOILERS!

Blackleiter wrote:
delicious wrote:

As I said in my original review, SF was like a really intense sales pitch to try and convince us that Bond is good - I didnt fall for it but a lot of people obviously did.

Or perhaps those of us who felt SF was a very good Bond film didn't "fall for" anything, but instead we were able to discern qualities that you somehow failed to grasp? I understand that you didn't think much of Skyfall, but do you really have to be so condenscending towards the viewers that did? Sheesh! ajb007/confused

Comming from you that is kind of funny...

1. Ohmss   2. Frwl   3. Op   4. Tswlm   5. Tld   6. Ge  7. Yolt 8. Lald   9. Cr   10. Ltk   11. Dn   12. Gf   13. Qos   14. Mr   15. Tmwtgg   16. Fyeo   17. Twine   18. Sf   19. Tb   20 Tnd   21. Spectre   22 Daf   23. Avtak   24. Dad