76

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

The plot is the one thing that keeps me from ranking MR higher, as it's basically TSWLM in space.

I do take Drax over Stromberg though.

And I think I like Dr. Goodhead more than Agent XXX.

"Hostile takeovers.  Shall we?"

1. TLD 2. TND 3. GF 4. OP 5. TSWLM 6. MR 7. TWINE 8. TMWTGG 9. OHMSS 10. FRWL 11. L&LD 12. SF 13. LtK 14. YOLT 15. DN 16. QoS 17. DAD 18. AVTAK 19. CR 20. TB 21. FYEO 22. DAF (SP to be included later; GE to be rewatched and re-ranked)
1) Brosnan 2) Dalton 3) Moore 4) Connery 5) Lazenby and Craig

77

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

Agent Purple wrote:

The plot is the one thing that keeps me from ranking MR higher, as it's basically TSWLM in space.

Watching one after the other made this all the more obvious to me, and not the fact that Stromberg/Drax are both industrialists with maniacal dreams - but the working together with the other countries' agents bothered me the most.

I guess TSWLM was such an incredible success that the formula had to be done again, with FYEO being a clear departure from it. Seems they took many cues from the GF, TB and YOLT style.

Last edited by heartbroken_mr_drax (19th May 2016 09:19)

1. TWINE  2. FYEO  3. MR  4. TLD  5. TSWLM 6. OHMSS  7. DN  8. OP  9. AVTAK  10. TMWTGG  11. QoS 12. GE  13. CR  14. TB  15. FRWL  16. LTK  17. GF  18. SF  19. LaLD  20. YOLT  21. TND  22. DAD  23. DAF.

"If you'll forgive me, that's a little too scented for my palate."

78

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

Agent Purple wrote:

The plot is the one thing that keeps me from ranking MR higher, as it's basically TSWLM in space.

I agree that MR is basically a remake of TSWLM, except MR is not really "in space"

The battle for the villains lair takes place on a space station instead of a super tanker. Not even close to being a Star Wars type film.

"Please don't try to follow me"

1. GE 2. MR 3. TSWLM 4. GF 5. DN 6. TND 7. TMWTGG 8. OP 9. TWINE 10. AVTAK

79

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

Firemass wrote:
Agent Purple wrote:

The plot is the one thing that keeps me from ranking MR higher, as it's basically TSWLM in space.

I agree that MR is basically a remake of TSWLM, except MR is not really "in space"

The battle for the villains lair takes place on a space station instead of a super tanker. Not even close to being a Star Wars type film.

What's great about MR and something I considered when watching it last night was that the science fiction elements are present, but not in the sense it isn't believable. The nerve gas scene in the lab highlights this because the globes, the set, the concept is science fiction - but it still follows the Bond formula of just a villain doing something diabolical.

The space scenes use quite a bit of artistic licence in the sense of the size of the space station and the response of the US existing and even being so fast. Even now, none of this is possible. Despite that, the scenes to me still have plenty of realism to it and what a thrill it would've been to watch at the time.

1. TWINE  2. FYEO  3. MR  4. TLD  5. TSWLM 6. OHMSS  7. DN  8. OP  9. AVTAK  10. TMWTGG  11. QoS 12. GE  13. CR  14. TB  15. FRWL  16. LTK  17. GF  18. SF  19. LaLD  20. YOLT  21. TND  22. DAD  23. DAF.

"If you'll forgive me, that's a little too scented for my palate."

80

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

Moonraker has been floating around in my mind since I watched it the other day, and a few things have come to mind...

Bernard Lee's Final Film:

I believe the way M was written in Moonraker is a great sign off. The discussion between Bond and M in Venice after the MoD walks off is quite unique. M has complete faith in Bond but still has to follow his orders of sending Bond on 2 weeks leave. We see him at the end of the film, but the Venice scene to me is quite special.

Box office performance:

Yep it is impressive that Moonraker achieved the greatest box office take (without inflation) only to be passed by GE - but in comparison with TSWLM, Moonraker only made $25m more ($185m to $210m) with an extra $20m spent on the budget. What makes this all the more interesting is that United Pictures froze the budgets for the films following until LTK which was severely limited in budget.

Modern looking film:

The filming techniques, cinematography and special effects make this film feel more modern than it's surrounding Bond counterparts. Other than some 1979 style suits that Roger wears, everything else in the film doesn't look dated. It's a very good looking picture.

First Bond film with full credits at the end:

All ones before this had minor credits at the end of the film.

ajb007/cheers

1. TWINE  2. FYEO  3. MR  4. TLD  5. TSWLM 6. OHMSS  7. DN  8. OP  9. AVTAK  10. TMWTGG  11. QoS 12. GE  13. CR  14. TB  15. FRWL  16. LTK  17. GF  18. SF  19. LaLD  20. YOLT  21. TND  22. DAD  23. DAF.

"If you'll forgive me, that's a little too scented for my palate."

81

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

I too love the writing of M's character in this one. Great sendoff for Bernard Lee.

MR is my all time favorite at the moment so struggling to find many cons! Just such a wonderfully fun adventure ride for two hours.

82

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

It's a fun watch indeed.  ajb007/biggrin

"Hostile takeovers.  Shall we?"

1. TLD 2. TND 3. GF 4. OP 5. TSWLM 6. MR 7. TWINE 8. TMWTGG 9. OHMSS 10. FRWL 11. L&LD 12. SF 13. LtK 14. YOLT 15. DN 16. QoS 17. DAD 18. AVTAK 19. CR 20. TB 21. FYEO 22. DAF (SP to be included later; GE to be rewatched and re-ranked)
1) Brosnan 2) Dalton 3) Moore 4) Connery 5) Lazenby and Craig

83

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

MooseWithFleas wrote:

I too love the writing of M's character in this one. Great sendoff for Bernard Lee.

I agree. They made great use of him in Moonraker, and despite poor health he was always perfect as M. Not even in Moonraker was he turned into a joke.

84

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

MR is a fun ride .... When you want to just sit back and enjoy, MR is hard to beat ajb007/smile

85

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

am747 wrote:

MR is a fun ride .... When you want to just sit back and enjoy, MR is hard to beat ajb007/smile

ajb007/cheers

1. TWINE  2. FYEO  3. MR  4. TLD  5. TSWLM 6. OHMSS  7. DN  8. OP  9. AVTAK  10. TMWTGG  11. QoS 12. GE  13. CR  14. TB  15. FRWL  16. LTK  17. GF  18. SF  19. LaLD  20. YOLT  21. TND  22. DAD  23. DAF.

"If you'll forgive me, that's a little too scented for my palate."

86

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

There's too much love for the film here, won't anyone come in who doesn't like MR?

"Hostile takeovers.  Shall we?"

1. TLD 2. TND 3. GF 4. OP 5. TSWLM 6. MR 7. TWINE 8. TMWTGG 9. OHMSS 10. FRWL 11. L&LD 12. SF 13. LtK 14. YOLT 15. DN 16. QoS 17. DAD 18. AVTAK 19. CR 20. TB 21. FYEO 22. DAF (SP to be included later; GE to be rewatched and re-ranked)
1) Brosnan 2) Dalton 3) Moore 4) Connery 5) Lazenby and Craig

87

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

Agent Purple wrote:

There's too much love for the film here, won't anyone come in who doesn't like MR?

ajb007/mad

But yeah, I'm ready to defend!  ajb007/lol

1. TWINE  2. FYEO  3. MR  4. TLD  5. TSWLM 6. OHMSS  7. DN  8. OP  9. AVTAK  10. TMWTGG  11. QoS 12. GE  13. CR  14. TB  15. FRWL  16. LTK  17. GF  18. SF  19. LaLD  20. YOLT  21. TND  22. DAD  23. DAF.

"If you'll forgive me, that's a little too scented for my palate."

88

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

Moore has some fine moments in this one---the best is in the centrifuge, IMO. I also like the fight with Chang in Venice, the PTS (until Jaws flaps his wings  ajb007/crap  ), the suspense in the Venice lab, the sequence with Drax's dogs chasing down the girl in the woods, the hunting bit ("Such good sport")...and I actually didn't mind Bond going into space, actually---I always thought that the best way to end Blofeld (in #25? LOL) would be having Bond chase him across the surface of the moon in EVA suits, just when ESB had thought he'd got away from it all  ajb007/shifty 

But there is so much in MR that disturbs my sensibilities that it inevitably lands in my lowers (currently #22 of 24, behind NSNA and DAD, until SP officially pushes it down to #23): Jaws trying to 'fly'...the Bondola/double-taking pigeon...the guy on the gurney in the cigarette billboard...the really fake snake (Ed Wood would be proud)...the space station rotation magically providing gravity by magic instead of any actually centrifugal design...Jaws' love affair and toast, etc., et al. It's all fun, certainly, but at some point it crosses that fuzzy line for me to the point where cringes outweigh happy grins.

Cheers to all who love it, of course  ajb007/cheers  It's certainly preferable to a couple of other Moore entries  ajb007/wink  ...and it made loads of cash. So what do I know?  ajb007/martini

"Blood & Ashes"...AVAILABLE on Amazon.co.uk: Get 'Jaded': Blood & Ashes: The Debut Oscar Jade Thriller
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM

89

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

Anyone ever read "James Bond and the Moonraker"?-the novel by the screenplay writer of the movie, Christopher Wood. It's a fun little read. I recommend to anyone who loves the movie.

90

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

Loeffelholz wrote:

But there is so much in MR that disturbs my sensibilities that it inevitably lands in my lowers (currently #22 of 24, behind NSNA and DAD, until SP officially pushes it down to #23):

I will like to see your ranking .... may be you could re-post your ranking in "that" thread for the benefit of new members  ajb007/smile

91

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

Last I remember, Lh's Top 10 was dominated by Craigs and Connerys.

"Hostile takeovers.  Shall we?"

1. TLD 2. TND 3. GF 4. OP 5. TSWLM 6. MR 7. TWINE 8. TMWTGG 9. OHMSS 10. FRWL 11. L&LD 12. SF 13. LtK 14. YOLT 15. DN 16. QoS 17. DAD 18. AVTAK 19. CR 20. TB 21. FYEO 22. DAF (SP to be included later; GE to be rewatched and re-ranked)
1) Brosnan 2) Dalton 3) Moore 4) Connery 5) Lazenby and Craig

92

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

am747 wrote:
Loeffelholz wrote:

But there is so much in MR that disturbs my sensibilities that it inevitably lands in my lowers (currently #22 of 24, behind NSNA and DAD, until SP officially pushes it down to #23):

I will like to see your ranking .... may be you could re-post your ranking in "that" thread for the benefit of new members  ajb007/smile

My current, pre-SP rankings are on page 39 of that thread  ajb007/martini

"Blood & Ashes"...AVAILABLE on Amazon.co.uk: Get 'Jaded': Blood & Ashes: The Debut Oscar Jade Thriller
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM

93

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

Oddjoblofeldraxorin wrote:

Anyone ever read "James Bond and the Moonraker"?-the novel by the screenplay writer of the movie, Christopher Wood. It's a fun little read. I recommend to anyone who loves the movie.

It really is. What about the part where they float through an area full of naked boys and girls aboard the space station. Or is that Christopher Wood being randy again?

1. For Your Eyes Only      2. The Living Daylights    3 From Russia with Love  4. Casino Royale  5. OHMSS  6. Skyfall

94

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

Well who hasn't done that ?  ajb007/biggrin

Yes, I seen to remember Bond looking at a couple having some " Sexy times " in a
weightless room.

“I didn’t lose a friend, I just realised I never had one.”

95

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

"I think he's attempting re-entry, sir."

"Hostile takeovers.  Shall we?"

1. TLD 2. TND 3. GF 4. OP 5. TSWLM 6. MR 7. TWINE 8. TMWTGG 9. OHMSS 10. FRWL 11. L&LD 12. SF 13. LtK 14. YOLT 15. DN 16. QoS 17. DAD 18. AVTAK 19. CR 20. TB 21. FYEO 22. DAF (SP to be included later; GE to be rewatched and re-ranked)
1) Brosnan 2) Dalton 3) Moore 4) Connery 5) Lazenby and Craig

96

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

So as I continue my Bond marathon next up was Moonraker.  Once again you have to remember this film was made in the 1970's, and was made in front of For Your Eyes Only "to "piggy back" the success of the Star Wars movies that were also in cinemas at this time.  This proved to be a succesful move by the Producers as this film was very succesful at the box office, I know I went to the cinema numerous times over the years to see it until it began being shown on the TV

Other notable movies released in 1979 were, Star Trek The Movie, Alien, Warriors, Apocalypse Now, Mad Max and Rocky 2, all of which I saw in the cinemas.

For me as others have said this film is a re-hash of TSWLM.  It's far more camp than any of the previous Bond movies, full of one liners and innuendo, which as I have grown older now irritate me I have to say. 

There are some really good stunts in this movie though, but your sense of imagination is pushed to the limits to think that they are believable. 

How many times for example does Jaws survive what in real life would be "fatal" situations. 

In my opinion the opening PTS and the parachute stunts with Bond pushed out of the plane are fantastic.  However it is spoilt by the intervention of Jaws in such a comic book way.

I can go along with most of it, but why didn't he just open his parachute and float down to earth instead of falling into the circus tent.  Likewise I feel the whole scene of him going over the waterfall unbelievable as well unless they wanted to kill him, which obviously they didn't. 

They had written a great way for Bond to survive and I think they should have done the same for Jaws.

However having said all that you have to give credit though as this film introduced the World to what would become a common sight of "The Space Shuttle", back in 1979 no-one knew about it's existance as far as I can remember and the first one didn't launch until 1981.  They even showed how the Space Shuttle was transported on the back of a 747, which was a sensation back in 1979.

I love the Astronaut centrofuge scene, and is actually one of my all time favourite Bond scenes out of all the 24 movies.

So I'm not sure how I felt after my lastest viewing of the film, Moonraker is definately a "curates egg".  It has some really great scenes and then some not so good.

Did I enjoy it, of course I did I love all the James Bond films. 

Will I be watching it again any time soon?  Well some Bond movies I can just watch over and over again I'm thinking of FRWL, OHMSS, CR, SF, TLD, LTK, less so with MR.

However having said that, I will be repeating this marathon in a few months time when my Bond blu ray collection is complete.  I currently own 9 of them, so within a few months I should have bought them all.

This film in my opinion is the 2nd worst of the Moore Bond films,  next up is FYEO.

FRWl, OHMSS, CR, TSWLM, GF, SF, TLD,  LTK, TND, DN, FYEO, OP,TWINE, GE, LALD, TMWTGG, QOS, SPECTRE, YOLT, TB, MR, DAF, DAD, AVTAK.

"Do you expect me to talk?  "No Mister Bond I expect you to die"

97

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

I just picked up the Bond 50 collection on Bluray today and have just finished watching Moonraker.

The film gets a lot of flack for being outlandish and cashing in on the Star Wars phenomenon. While I can understand this point of view, especially from those who cling to the edgier, more realistic Bonds, I feel it's an underrated entry into the series. The sci-fi elements come across as believable and most concepts are based in reality.

Ken Adams' set design is marvelous and awe inspiring, especially the launch base sets. This is his best work in the entire series. The model work is fantastic, especially the space station. John Barry's soundtrack underscores everything with a dark and ominous tone and the title song is one of my favourites, with a chilling departure from the usual brassy affairs.

Moore gives a performance almost on par with TSWLM. His reactions in the centrifuge and lab scenes are fantastic. Drax is a great, if dry, villain, while Holly Goodhead is a great, capable Bond woman. The dialogue between Bond and Goodhead seems overly dry, however, and lacks the warmth of their growing relationship. In fact, a lot of the one liners are a bit on the nose in this film. Corrine, while beautiful, is a poor actress, but her death scene is wonderfully filmed. The Jaws and Dolly love story is cute but unnecessary and there is a huge amount of product placement in the film, particularly in Rio.

Gilbert's trilogy of Bond films all have epic battles in the finale. While it worked well in YOLT and, to a lesser degree, TSWLM, the battle between Drax's space men and the USA troops was just ridiculous. Still, the film's action sequences are great, with the PTS and the Venice fight with Chang being the standouts.

In the end, Moonraker is a great entry into the series with a similar plot to YOLT and TSWLM but different subject matter. It's a fun and enjoyable adventure, like most of Moore's entries.

Last edited by IcePak (25th Feb 2017 14:42)

1. CR 2 OHMSS 3. TSWLM 4. TLD 5. SF 6. GF
7. GE 8. FRwL 9. FYEO 10. LtK 11. DN 12. TMwtGG
13. AVtaK14. TB 15. OP 16. SP 17. TWiNE 18. TND
19. MR 20. LaLD 21. QoS 22. YOLT 23. DAD 24. DAF

98

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

I watched Moonraker yesterday ,first time in a couple of years with the BR upscaled to 4K.  I really enjoyed it but what grabbed me was the model work it has to be the best I have seen in ANY movie, the detailing was fantastic even down to the individual tiles on the shuttle models.

99

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

You guys are 100% right, the model work and set design is outstanding. The production value of the film is one of the reasons I love it so much - plus it's so damn entertaining.

If it didn't have Bondola and didn't have the cable car + ambulance scene I think the film would be a bit tighter. There are a few tacked in scenes - something TSWLM doesn't have.

One can see why it was nominated for an Oscar for the special effects.

1. TWINE  2. FYEO  3. MR  4. TLD  5. TSWLM 6. OHMSS  7. DN  8. OP  9. AVTAK  10. TMWTGG  11. QoS 12. GE  13. CR  14. TB  15. FRWL  16. LTK  17. GF  18. SF  19. LaLD  20. YOLT  21. TND  22. DAD  23. DAF.

"If you'll forgive me, that's a little too scented for my palate."

100

Re: Pros and Cons: Moonraker

UnderwaterBattle007 wrote:

"to "piggy back" the success of the Star Wars movies

I would agree it was a smart move to release it ahead of FYEO since the concept of space was popular. Imagine how dumb EON would feel to miss such an opportunity. (The box office results proved them right on that one)

Why should Star Wars hold the copyright on anything space related? I don't hear Alien (1979) ever been called a Star Wars imitator. 

sniperUK wrote:

I watched Moonraker yesterday ,first time in a couple of years with the BR upscaled to 4K.  I really enjoyed it but what grabbed me was the model work it has to be the best I have seen in ANY movie, the detailing was fantastic even down to the individual tiles on the shuttle models.

I'm glad Moonraker is being appreciated on modern Blu-ray and HD televisions. I thought it was a solid film on VHS so seeing all this extra detail work is just icing on the cake for me.  ajb007/biggrin 

One of the reasons I strongly object to MR being labeled as the "worst" Bond film is that title implies (to me) shoddy craftsmanship and general lack of effort of everyone involved.  Quite the opposite is true in MR as it's the biggest and most impressive looking Bond of all. The story and writing is rock solid too, although very similar to Lewis Gilbert's previous two Bonds.

"Please don't try to follow me"

1. GE 2. MR 3. TSWLM 4. GF 5. DN 6. TND 7. TMWTGG 8. OP 9. TWINE 10. AVTAK