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Topic: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

OK so now you have watched SPECTRE .... May be you even watched it for multiple times .... Some of you probably love it so much that you think it cannot be bettered. On the other hand, there would be a few who would have ideas on improving it or may be removing or simplifying things to make the film even more appealing. Or you even have a different version in mind …. This is the thread to share your ideas.


Below is a slightly different version of SPECTRE: 


PTS

Bond is investigating a series of high profile assassinations. His trail has lead him to pursue Marco Sciarra in Mexico City. The PTS opens with like it did on the Day of the Dead Festival and ends with Bond blowing up Sciarra in that building and landing on the sofa.  ajb007/wink  .... Before blowing up the building, Bond heard the group discuss the Pale King. 


Theme Song

It is a theme song on SPECTRE on how it wants to dominate the world. The theme song has a catchy SPECTRE tune as well.


Act 1 - Blofeld's Introduction

Post the theme song, the scene opens with the SPECTRE meeting (a bit Thunderballish) in an undisclosed location. The group is taking stock of the situation and discussing a replacement for Sciarra. Blofeld is shown with his cat (no "welcome James and cuckoo"). Hinx self-appoints himself as the replacement by getting “rid” of his competitios. Hinx's next mission is to eliminate the Pale King.


Act 2 - London

Bond and M discuss the Pale King. Moneypenny searches the database and discovers that Pale King is in fact Mr. White. Q traces Mr. White's current location to Austria. We are also introduced to the new Defense Minister who wants to stop these high profile assignations.

Bond goes to Q's lab where he is given smart blood (don’t know if this would be useful in the film), the watch and the car.


Act 3 - Mr. White

Bond drives through the scenic Alps in “his car”. He arrives at Mr. White's house. Mr. White hands him the SPECTRE ring and asks him to find and protect his daughter who would provide further clues to Bond. Then Mr. White kills himself (of course after saying the kite thing).

Hinx arrives at Mr. White's house but find him to be dead already. His eyes flash on to the security camera from where he extracts the necessary information.


Act 4 - Dr. Swann

Bond meets with Swann who asks him to leave. Q meets with Bond at Swann's place to help him with his investigation. Bond hands him the SPECTRE ring. Swann is kidnapped by Hinx. Bond follows them in his car (instead of in the plane). Q is being chased as well and escapes like he did in the film.

In a breath taking death defying sequence, Bond uses multiple gadgets in the car to save Swann. Hinx survives but Bond is unaware of this.

Bond, Q and Swann meet to discuss the ring and the information obtained from it. Swann tells the group about “Point X”. Q punches the information (co-ordinates) given to him by Swann in his magical laptop and discovers the location.


Act 5 - Point X

Swann and Bond head to the Point X on the Desert Orient Express. Point X is hidden somewhere in the desert. After some private moments, they land at an unidentified station. Later, they are picked by a RR. Similar sequences as in the film follow.

Bond is captured and tortured. He learns that the assignation attempts where a part of a big scheme by Blofeld to put SPECTRE members in to key government positions throughout the world. The next move is to assassinate the PM of Britain.

Bond is held captive in the desert. He escapes in an extravagant sequence using the alarm in his watch. Blofeld lair is destroyed. 


Act 6 - London

Hinx is assigned to assassinate the PM of England. In an extravagant sequence involving great action and stunts including in a helicopter, Bond, along his team, manages to defeat Hinx and save the PM. The SPECTRE contact in the British Government is revealed as well.


Act 7 - The End

Bond and Swann are driving away on snaky mountain roads in the old Aston. They believe that they finally have peace. However, someone is watching them through binoculars. The binoculars lower and we get to see a face - Blofeld. Blofeld is alive but is now sporting a scar on his face. He looks angry (very angry I must say). He once again watches through his binoculars - Bond and Swann driving away in the Aston. .... There is an evil smile of Blofeld's face. May be something unpleasant is about to happen to Bond and Swann!

Bond theme plays, the credit roll. James Bond will return.


Hope you enjoyed this version too  ajb007/biggrin

Last edited by am747 (18th Nov 2015 20:51)

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

If you're going to cut the PTS in half, cut out the bad part: the CGI building explosion. You've basically also cut out the Day of the Dead festival. Instead, start with the gunbarrel opening on the skull float (no disruptive fade to black and title card) and then start with Bond chasing Sciarra through the festival. Bond can still take the ring from Sciarra. By Bond not taking Sciarra's ring or going to his funeral, why point would killing Sciarra serve to the rest of the plot? You've taken out the exciting part of the PTS (the Day of the Dead festival and the helicopter) and taken out the purpose of it.

I like the rest. It has more focus than the film.

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

I definitely would not lose the helicopter from the PTS, nor would I lose the fight on the train, as they're both highlights for me. The rest seems to work pretty well  ajb007/bond

(Kudos for making the effort; I try to never work for free!  ajb007/biggrin )

"Blood & Ashes"...AVAILABLE on Amazon.co.uk: Get 'Jaded': Blood & Ashes: The Debut Oscar Jade Thriller
"I am not an entrant in the Shakespeare Stakes." - Ian Fleming
"Screw 'em." - Daniel Craig, The Best James Bond EverTM

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

Thanks for liking it! .... I tried to make it as classical / traditional as possible from the available material .... This is the type of film I was hoping deep down to see the first time I went to see the film  ajb007/smile

With a name like SPECTRE, it should have focused more on the organization rather than "the writing on the wall"  ajb007/lol  .... But have seen the film 4 times now and appreciate the effort

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

am747,
pretty much nailed what i would have preferred. I'd probably remove the London ending also and maybe include the helicopter fight at the very climax - a fight with Hinx in the helicopter? I particularly like the idea of stopping the PTS after the building collapses. At this point, its already almost 7 minutes in and we've figured out what's occurring. The rest of this sequence is excessive but spectacular padding.

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

chrisno1 wrote:

am747,
pretty much nailed what i would have preferred. I'd probably remove the London ending also and maybe include the helicopter fight at the very climax - a fight with Hinx in the helicopter? I particularly like the idea of stopping the PTS after the building collapses. At this point, its already almost 7 minutes in and we've figured out what's occurring. The rest of this sequence is excessive but spectacular padding.

Is it really 7 minutes until the building collapses? I thought it was more like 3 minutes. Nothing really happens in that time. That's why I think the film should start with Bond chasing Sciarra through the parade. How would you feel about that? If you need the part with Bond listening in on Sciarra's conversation, start with that. Then Bond misses the shot and Sciarra runs, with Bond chasing him. The building doesn't need to explode. The CGI brings down the credibility of the film, and that would be a terrible place for the PTS to end. It just feels so incomplete to end it there, like nothing happened. Or with Bond landing on the sofa and just walking away? That would be disappointing. The substance in the PTS is after the building explodes.

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

chrisno1 wrote:

am747,
pretty much nailed what i would have preferred. I'd probably remove the London ending also and maybe include the helicopter fight at the very climax - a fight with Hinx in the helicopter? I particularly like the idea of stopping the PTS after the building collapses. At this point, its already almost 7 minutes in and we've figured out what's occurring. The rest of this sequence is excessive but spectacular padding.

To make things more interesting (and in the spirit of many of the classic Bond films), there has to be an upcoming or on going evil attempt that needs to be stopped - the London sequence about assassination provides that .... For e.g. in YOTL and TSWLM, it was the possibility of a nuclear war; in OHMSS, it was crop destruction and amnesty for Blofeld

Additionally, Bellucci can play the British PM. It would be a more meaningful role for her. Scott can be the new defense minister

ajb007/smile

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

Matt S wrote:

Is it really 7 minutes until the building collapses? I thought it was more like 3 minutes.

The tracking shot itself is almost 3 minutes. This shows how deceptive good film making can be. You don't even notice the time flying by. Pity they couldn't have been more thoughtful over some of the more laborious scenes. Mind, I agree the CGI in that building collapse was a bit dodgy. In the old days they'd have collapsed it for real or used very clever, intricate model work to create the same effect. It probably would've looked better too.

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

PTS - After Bond takes control of the helicopter, he lands it on the hotel roof, rappels down into Stephanie Sigman's room, straightens his tie and says, "now, where were we?".

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

chrisno1 wrote:
Matt S wrote:

Is it really 7 minutes until the building collapses? I thought it was more like 3 minutes.

The tracking shot itself is almost 3 minutes. This shows how deceptive good film making can be. You don't even notice the time flying by. Pity they couldn't have been more thoughtful over some of the more laborious scenes. Mind, I agree the CGI in that building collapse was a bit dodgy. In the old days they'd have collapsed it for real or used very clever, intricate model work to create the same effect. It probably would've looked better too.

So what's the 7 minutes you're talking about? For the PTS to end after 4 minutes would be a terrible idea, because nothing happened in that time.

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

In my opinion, your revision takes away a lot of the corny mistakes and bad decisions from the original script, but it also strips away a big chunk of the movie in general without adequate replacement.  Blofeld is even more underutilized (albeit not captured) and it doesn't feel like as much of a grand Bondian fantasy adventure.

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

If we're going with a personal Blofeld/Bond angle, I would've made Blofeld the killer of Bond's parents. Bond's father while working as an executive for Vickers Defense (it's in the obituary in the novel YOLT) stumbled upon a Soviet double agent and was taken out by Blofeld, a KGB subcontractor, who sabotaged their climbing equipment.

That would've truly made Blofeld the author of all Bond's pain.

Think of Waltz playing Blofeld as he explained to Bond how he killed Bond's parents!

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

Gala Brand wrote:

Think of Waltz playing Blofeld as he explained to Bond how he killed Bond's parents!

Something about that makes my stomach curl.  I think that would even be worse than the jealous-brother backstory.

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

Julius No M.D. wrote:

In my opinion, your revision takes away a lot of the corny mistakes and bad decisions from the original script, but it also strips away a big chunk of the movie in general without adequate replacement.  Blofeld is even more underutilized (albeit not captured) and it doesn't feel like as much of a grand Bondian fantasy adventure.

It could appear that way but at times less can be more as it would allow space for more extravagant action and stunt sequences  befitting the title SPECTRE ajb007/smile

Some of the action and stunts parts would include:
a) Q's escape and Bond's car chase in Austria
b) A detailed focus on Bond's escape from Blofeld's lair
c) Foiled assassination attempt in London, along with a showdown with Hinx involving everything from helicopter to boat

Other events would include:
a) A more detailed and cruel representation of Blofeld
b) More exchanges with Bond
c) The end where Blofeld watches Bond and Swann drive away
d) Attempt to find out who the SPECTRE mole in British Govt is (the new defense minister)
e) Interactions with British PM

I would change some portions of background music too  to give a complete Bond experience ajb007/bond

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

Gala Brand wrote:

If we're going with a personal Blofeld/Bond angle, I would've made Blofeld the killer of Bond's parents. Bond's father while working as an executive for Vickers Defense (it's in the obituary in the novel YOLT) stumbled upon a Soviet double agent and was taken out by Blofeld, a KGB subcontractor, who sabotaged their climbing equipment.

That would've truly made Blofeld the author of all Bond's pain.

Think of Waltz playing Blofeld as he explained to Bond how he killed Bond's parents!

That is a nice idea. However, it could also make it appear Batmanish. It appears as if the recent Bond films have drawn inspiration from a variety of sources including the Dark Knight, MI, and Bourne. It is probably time to play to Bond's strengths  ajb007/martini

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

Matt S wrote:
chrisno1 wrote:
Matt S wrote:

Is it really 7 minutes until the building collapses? I thought it was more like 3 minutes.

The tracking shot itself is almost 3 minutes. This shows how deceptive good film making can be. You don't even notice the time flying by. Pity they couldn't have been more thoughtful over some of the more laborious scenes. Mind, I agree the CGI in that building collapse was a bit dodgy. In the old days they'd have collapsed it for real or used very clever, intricate model work to create the same effect. It probably would've looked better too.

So what's the 7 minutes you're talking about? For the PTS to end after 4 minutes would be a terrible idea, because nothing happened in that time.

I can see that you want to make PTS more impressive. However, length does not determine that. IIRC, PTS in films such as FRWL, GF, TB, etc. were relatively short but still memorable .... Btw, I have not timed the PTS. But a lot would have happened by the time 007 lands on sofa - learned about the pale king and killed Sciarra

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

am747 wrote:
Matt S wrote:
chrisno1 wrote:

The tracking shot itself is almost 3 minutes. This shows how deceptive good film making can be. You don't even notice the time flying by. Pity they couldn't have been more thoughtful over some of the more laborious scenes. Mind, I agree the CGI in that building collapse was a bit dodgy. In the old days they'd have collapsed it for real or used very clever, intricate model work to create the same effect. It probably would've looked better too.

So what's the 7 minutes you're talking about? For the PTS to end after 4 minutes would be a terrible idea, because nothing happened in that time.

I can see that you want to make PTS more impressive. However, length does not determine that. IIRC, PTS in films such as FRWL, GF, TB, etc. were relatively short but still memorable .... Btw, I have not timed the PTS, a lot would have happened by the time 007 lands on sofa - learned about the pale king and killed Sciarra

Exactly. The PTS is a teaser sequence, which ought to introduce an element of the story arc. The need for excessive length is something I've come to detest (LTK, DAD, TWINE, SF, etc).

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

chrisno1 wrote:
am747 wrote:
Matt S wrote:

So what's the 7 minutes you're talking about? For the PTS to end after 4 minutes would be a terrible idea, because nothing happened in that time.

I can see that you want to make PTS more impressive. However, length does not determine that. IIRC, PTS in films such as FRWL, GF, TB, etc. were relatively short but still memorable .... Btw, I have not timed the PTS, a lot would have happened by the time 007 lands on sofa - learned about the pale king and killed Sciarra

Exactly. The PTS is a teaser sequence, which ought to introduce an element of the story arc. The need for excessive length is something I've come to detest (LTK, DAD, TWINE, SF, etc).

But why not cut out the part leading up to Bond eavesdropping on Sciarra if you want to cut something out? The one shot is cool, but it's not all that memorable since nothing happens during it. There's no substance to the first three minutes, and that's what should be cut. It should just open up to Bond on the roof. That would cut out three minutes of nothing. The helicopter sequence could be shortened a lot. The whole point of the PTS is the part is the Day of the Dead festival, and you've cut that out too. am747, why do you hate the chase so much? It recalls the great foot chase in TB. It's classic Bond!

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

Matt S wrote:

But why not cut out the part leading up to Bond eavesdropping on Sciarra if you want to cut something out? The one shot is cool, but it's not all that memorable since nothing happens during it. There's no substance to the first three minutes, and that's what should be cut. It should just open up to Bond on the roof. That would cut out three minutes of nothing. The helicopter sequence could be shortened a lot. The whole point of the PTS is the part is the Day of the Dead festival, and you've cut that out too. am747, why do you hate the chase so much? It recalls the great foot chase in TB. It's classic Bond!

Some good points. However note that the sequence where Bond is walking through the crowd on his way to the hotel and then walking on the roof tops sets up the mood of the film. For a change the background score is foot-tapping too .... The CGI of the building breaking down may not be spot on but again with Bond landing on the sofa, it adds a 007 touch to the film and makes up for the deficiencies in the CGI

When it comes to the chase and helicopter sequence, i feel it does not add much to the film. And the helicopter pilot looks dumb at times. I felt that he was enjoying the action in the back more than being a part of it  ajb007/lol  .... Also in my version, I have the helicopter fight with Hinx so that makes up for its omission in the PTS

Coming back to the chase, yes, you could have Sciarra running away (with the building not exploding) and Bond following him and then killing him. Once Sciarra is dead, Bond would take the ring and the theme song would begin to play

But Bond landing on sofa sounds different (and probably cooler) ajb007/lol

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

am747 wrote:
Matt S wrote:

But why not cut out the part leading up to Bond eavesdropping on Sciarra if you want to cut something out? The one shot is cool, but it's not all that memorable since nothing happens during it. There's no substance to the first three minutes, and that's what should be cut. It should just open up to Bond on the roof. That would cut out three minutes of nothing. The helicopter sequence could be shortened a lot. The whole point of the PTS is the part is the Day of the Dead festival, and you've cut that out too. am747, why do you hate the chase so much? It recalls the great foot chase in TB. It's classic Bond!

Some good points. However note that the sequence where Bond is walking through the crowd on his way to the hotel and then walking on the roof tops sets up the mood of the film. The CGI of the building breaking down may not be spot on but again with Bond landing on the sofa, it adds a 007 touch to the film.

When it comes to the chase and helicopter sequence, i feel it does not add much to the film. And the helicopter pilot looks dumb at times. I felt that he was enjoying the action more than being a part of it  ajb007/lol  .... Also in my version, I have the helicopter fight with Hinx

Coming back to the chase, yes, you could have Sciarra running away (with the building not exploding) and Bond following him and then killing him. Once Sciarra is dead, Bond would take the ring and the theme song would begin to play

But Bond landing on sofa sounds different (and probably cooler) ajb007/lol

There is too much mood setting in the film and not enough substance. Half the film is mood setting. The PTS should do something, not just set the mood. The opening one shot relates to nothing else in the film, so I don't even agree that it sets the mood for the film. It's just something cool that lacks meaning and substance for the film as a whole.

Most people I know didn't like Bond landing on the sofa because it was too Roger Moore like (funny). The whole explosion was a low point in the film because of how bad it looked. And it also sets up the whole thing about Bond being grounded, which is stupid. But Bond could have killed Sciarra in the street, and I would have been fine with that and not the helicopter. I mostly against you cutting out the street chase because I like the integration of the festival in the film. Just having it for a minute in the beginning with nothing happening around it would have been pointless.

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

Julius No M.D. wrote:
Gala Brand wrote:

Think of Waltz playing Blofeld as he explained to Bond how he killed Bond's parents!

Something about that makes my stomach curl.  I think that would even be worse than the jealous-brother backstory.

Agreed. That would have been worse.  ajb007/crap

Last edited by Number24 (19th Nov 2015 17:27)

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

Matt S wrote:

There is too much mood setting in the film and not enough substance. Half the film is mood setting. The PTS should do something, not just set the mood. The opening one shot relates to nothing else in the film, so I don't even agree that it sets the mood for the film. It's just something cool that lacks meaning and substance for the film as a whole.

Most people I know didn't like Bond landing on the sofa because it was too Roger Moore like (funny). The whole explosion was a low point in the film because of how bad it looked. And it also sets up the whole thing about Bond being grounded, which is stupid. But Bond could have killed Sciarra in the street, and I would have been fine with that and not the helicopter. I mostly against you cutting out the street chase because I like the integration of the festival in the film. Just having it for a minute in the beginning with nothing happening around it would have been pointless.

You make some good points for the chase  ajb007/cheers

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

Oooooohhh! Me too, me too!

Here are a few random thoughts on aspects of the film that I'd've liked to see:

1. The PTS is ok. I'd pretty much left it alone as it was, only maybe bringing Bond back to Estrella/Miss Bala at the end of it... to finish his mission, of course.
2. The credits were too photographic for my taste. I much rather preferred Kleinman's artistic choices in CR, when I think he just hit it out of the park. Also, the references to the previous movies were ok (EON have certainly done it in the past) but I would have at least acknowledged QoS with a dead Mathis, or Fields, as those were important aspects of the "formative" aspects of Bond in the reboot.
3. When I saw the "smartblood" subplot, I expected it to be relevant. After all, you can't show a gun in the first act for it NOT be fired in the third one. More on this later.
4. Rome is ok, but I would have expanded Monica Belluci's character for it not to be testimonial, and would have dropped the wave in the funeral. A bit too much.
5. Spectre's meeting: it's eerie, it's promising, little to change here. Something on Oberhauser's background, but again, more on that later.
6. The car chase was quite good. A couple details might have made it even better (especially with the ending) but nothing to say of real importance here.
7. White's reintroduction was also good. Also the Klinik and the plane chase. Q's antics could have been expanded and intertwined with the chase. But no big problems here either.
8. Morocco: L'Américain was quite good. Maybe expand the process of personal connection with Madeleine so as to not make the romance seem as forced as it was seen onscreen.
9. Train fight: ok, Spectre here does not seem to make up their mind. Hinx attacks without notice, is defeated (temporarily as we all know in our hearts...) and then upon arrival the Rolls is sent to pick them up... Why bother when you were trying to kill them? Did Oberblofeld say "the hell with it, let's invite them" or was Hinx working on his own? Some comment here would have been helpful.
10. The Big Reveal: unnecesary. The double reveal of "I am your brother" and "I am Blofeld" does not work for me. Instead, one strangely belittles the other. And neither is actually explored in depth. The original script opted for "Oh, but you were actually adopted, weren't you?" and, to me, that works better. If not, just go all out on one of the two options, and have Oberhauser rename himself Blofeld in the next movie, as an alias in order to avoid arrest.
11. The torture: it works and it's sinister, but there's no consequence to it. Why not make smartblood a weapon that can incapacitate Bond and cause massive organ failure? If you're using the drill and saying that the first incision will mess Bond's sight and balance, why not show him disoriented and groggy in the escape sequence? I really, really would have used Q here, hacking the smartblood program and negating that part of the torture, and hacking it again after the drill in order to give Bond a "boost" and negate the effects of the drilling.
12. The escape and the helicopter: Bond kills both with a handgun. Really  ajb007/lol ? Also, the afterescape would have been a better place for Bond and Madeleine to hook up. Q: "Bond, did you escape? The boost of the nanomachines I gave you is running out, you really need to rest and recover". Bond (looking at Madeleine): "Don't worry, I can think of a couple of routines to recharge".
13. The final showdown. Not much to add here. I'm ok with the choices Bond makes, only I would have kept them more ambiguous and given them less of a finality. They seem too much like a closing.
Bonus point 1: C's antics. The original ending, with him trying to betray OberBlofeld, worked better for me. It would also have been quite interested for him to be an unwitting accomplice out of political ambition.
Bonus point 2: the home team's antics. The comedy with Tanner, Q, Moneypenny and M had room for improvement. A bit more seriousness could have worked better from my pov.

All in all, I seem to like Sp better the more I think on it. Despite these suggestions, it was a perfectly fun, enjoyable Bond outing, and I really hope that Spectre will return for vengeance in the next one... and DC's Bond will be waiting for them.

"Enjoy it while it lasts."
"The very words I live by."

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

On the suggestion of the thread title, "Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE," IMO the movie doesn't need any major changes to make it a perfect movie, but tweaks in the script and editing, just tweaks but with some exceptions.  On editing, 2.5 hours would be okay if it were justified, but there were large chunks of different sequences that as a viewer, I thought could have been made better by more economical editing that would have given the movie a much better flow.

On the script, the Blofeld bits could use just enough changes to make his appearance in the end less sappy and to dial the sinister aspect just a notch.  I see there was an attempt to channel Christoph Waltz's Hans Landa character, whether it was a conscious effort or not; but that's okay, though I think the overall Blofeld characterization could have been improved just a bit  with minor re-writes without fundamentally changing that part of the script, but yielding a world of difference.

"...the purposeful slant of his striding figure looked dangerous, as if he was making quickly for something bad that was happening further down the street." -SMERSH on 007 dossier photo, Ch. 6 FRWL.....

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Re: Re-writing / Re-editing SPECTRE

Number24 wrote:
Julius No M.D. wrote:
Gala Brand wrote:

Think of Waltz playing Blofeld as he explained to Bond how he killed Bond's parents!

Something about that makes my stomach curl.  I think that would even be worse than the jealous-brother backstory.

Agreed. That would have been worse.  ajb007/crap


Hmmm, why's that?