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Topic: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Here's a very interesting article you might want to check out...

LA based, Matthew Chernov recently attended a luncheon hosted by the Academy of Scoring Arts. There, John Altman discussed his contribution to the Goldeneye score. Turns out all was not well behind the scenes...

http://jamesbondradio.com/composer-john … w-chernov/

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Very interesting story on the background of the score.

“I didn’t lose a friend, I just realised I never had one.”

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Fascinating stuff! It's great to hear some more of the background on this. Particularly that my favourite jazz trumpet/flugelhorn player and one of my favourite composers, Kenny Wheeler, played on this recording! I've always wondered if he played on an Bond films.

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Great to see this info coming out!

Pleasant Drive in Saint Petersburg is one of the oddest tracks within the score, interesting how the article called it the "bright-spot". If anything I find that it to be the silliest sounding track!

1. TWINE  2. FYEO  3. MR  4. TLD  5. TSWLM 6. OHMSS  7. DN  8. OP  9. AVTAK  10. TMWTGG  11. QoS 12. GE  13. CR  14. TB  15. FRWL  16. LTK  17. GF  18. SF  19. LaLD  20. YOLT  21. TND  22. DAD  23. DAF.

"If you'll forgive me, that's a little too scented for my palate."

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Ah, you've got two similarly-named pieces of music confused there, hmd.

"A Pleasant Drive In St Petersburg" is the track Serra submitted, and it's the one you can hear on the OST album.  This stinks.

"Tank Drive Around St Petersburg" is the track Altman wrote (er... arranged, as it's credited to Monty Norman... now where  have I heard that before?  ajb007/biggrin ) and is the one heard in the film. A faithful reproduction of this was made by Nic Raine & The City Of Prague Philharmonic Orchestra and is easily available on CD.   This rocks.

"Tank Drive" is the one the article called the bright spot.

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Barbel wrote:

Ah, you've got two similarly-named pieces of music confused there, hmd.

"A Pleasant Drive In St Petersburg" is the track Serra submitted, and it's the one you can hear on the OST album.  This stinks.

"Tank Drive Around St Petersburg" is the track Altman wrote (er... arranged, as it's credited to Monty Norman... now where  have I heard that before?  ajb007/biggrin ) and is the one heard in the film. A faithful reproduction of this was made by Nic Raine & The City Of Prague Philharmonic Orchestra and is easily available on CD.   This rocks.

"Tank Drive" is the one the article called the bright spot.

Thank you Barbel! I assume something can be found on YouTube.

1. TWINE  2. FYEO  3. MR  4. TLD  5. TSWLM 6. OHMSS  7. DN  8. OP  9. AVTAK  10. TMWTGG  11. QoS 12. GE  13. CR  14. TB  15. FRWL  16. LTK  17. GF  18. SF  19. LaLD  20. YOLT  21. TND  22. DAD  23. DAF.

"If you'll forgive me, that's a little too scented for my palate."

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Alas, the relevant videos have been removed  ajb007/crap .  "Pleasant Drive" can easily be found but "Tank Drive" is only there as from the film.

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Here's Serra's original version.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LJWzNT2B810

The City of Prague Orchestra's cover of Altman's track.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=anfxljPXg7M

There is an incomplete version of Altman's track on his Film and TV showreel album. It's not on Youtube but send me a PM and I can send it to you.

"No for me."
"You forgot the first rule of Mass Media Elliot! Give the people what they want!!!"
"I never miss..."
"Time to face gravity!"

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

No, the "Tank Drive" video has been removed.

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Barbel wrote:

No, the "Tank Drive" video has been removed.

Both work fine on my end. It must be blocked to other regions.

"No for me."
"You forgot the first rule of Mass Media Elliot! Give the people what they want!!!"
"I never miss..."
"Time to face gravity!"

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Yeah, that'll be it. I did find this though: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFbfqmdfORI

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Sidenote- I had a pleasant chat with Carl Davis some years ago about the two "St Petersburg" pieces after listening to him performing the Altman one in concert, and very well too.

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Barbel wrote:

Yeah, that'll be it. I did find this though: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aFbfqmdfORI

That's more accurate too since it's been slightly slowed down.

"No for me."
"You forgot the first rule of Mass Media Elliot! Give the people what they want!!!"
"I never miss..."
"Time to face gravity!"

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

I just listened to City of Prague Philharmonic version, the film version and Serra's piece. While I really appreciate that Nic Raine made the tank chase music available to enjoy on its own, it's just not played as well as the film version. When I just listened to Raine's version, I didn't like it as much as I remembered. But then I watched the scene in the film and it had a completely different impact. The trumpet section with Derek Watkins and Kenny Wheeler explains why the film version is so much better. You couldn't find finer horn players than those two men!

There are some negatives about Altman's tank chase music. Because it's so brilliant, it just makes it even more obvious how lacking the rest of the film's music is. And because of this, Altman's music doesn't really fit with the rest of the film's music and makes the film feel unbalanced. I almost want to say that Serra's track fits better with the rest of the soundtrack. Altman's great music just comes out of nowhere, kind of like the scene on the beach. As fantastic as it is, I find it jarring, and it takes me out of the film. Serra's tank music has some good moments (in the context of his score), but overall it's not as solid as the PTS music. But I actually think if they went back to Serra and told him they wanted something more exciting, I might have preferred that for the sake of the film's score as a whole work. But considering the time constraints, Altman doing it instead was definitely the safer move.

Don't get me wrong, Altman's music improves the scene, but one scene does not make a movie. The mood gets better with the tank scene, and then it doesn't take long for it to drop again when the electronic sounds come back. Ideally, the film would have been better if Altman did the whole thing, but in understanding the situation, they did the best thing possible. If they had a month instead of a few days, I wonder if they would have hired Altman to re-score the entire film.

Just a lot of 'what ifs'.

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Matt S wrote:

but overall it's not as solid as the PTS music.

You're right, IMO the PTS music is brilliant and iconic. It's a very good rendition of the Bond theme.

1. TWINE  2. FYEO  3. MR  4. TLD  5. TSWLM 6. OHMSS  7. DN  8. OP  9. AVTAK  10. TMWTGG  11. QoS 12. GE  13. CR  14. TB  15. FRWL  16. LTK  17. GF  18. SF  19. LaLD  20. YOLT  21. TND  22. DAD  23. DAF.

"If you'll forgive me, that's a little too scented for my palate."

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

The GoldenEye overture is one of my all time favorite Bond tracks.

"No for me."
"You forgot the first rule of Mass Media Elliot! Give the people what they want!!!"
"I never miss..."
"Time to face gravity!"

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

I don't think I've ever seen one thread with this many positive notes about Serra's work on Goldeneye!

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

clublos wrote:

I don't think I've ever seen one thread with this many positive notes about Serra's work on Goldeneye!

It's actually very popular on here. It ruins the movie for me.

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Matt S wrote:
clublos wrote:

I don't think I've ever seen one thread with this many positive notes about Serra's work on Goldeneye!

It's actually very popular on here. It ruins the movie for me.

It doesn't ruin the movie for me, but it certainly detracts from the film in a way that a forgettable, but not offensive (think Newman's work in Spectre) score does not. For instance, the gun barrel music is easily the worst in the entire series.

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

More like the best! GE's Gunbarrel is easily my favorite.  ajb007/smile

"No for me."
"You forgot the first rule of Mass Media Elliot! Give the people what they want!!!"
"I never miss..."
"Time to face gravity!"

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

BruceMurdock wrote:

More like the best! GE's Gunbarrel is easily my favorite.  ajb007/smile

What a horrible thing to say when John Barry scored 11 gun barrels. But it seems like the ones that are most popular are never Barry's, probably because Barry's don't stand out compared to the ones that break the mould.

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Matt S wrote:
BruceMurdock wrote:

More like the best! GE's Gunbarrel is easily my favorite.  ajb007/smile

What a horrible thing to say when John Barry scored 11 gun barrels. But it seems like the ones that are most popular are never Barry's, probably because Barry's don't stand out compared to the ones that break the mould.

All of the 90s Gunbarrels are excellent. Better than Kamen's awful OTT mess.

1. TWINE  2. FYEO  3. MR  4. TLD  5. TSWLM 6. OHMSS  7. DN  8. OP  9. AVTAK  10. TMWTGG  11. QoS 12. GE  13. CR  14. TB  15. FRWL  16. LTK  17. GF  18. SF  19. LaLD  20. YOLT  21. TND  22. DAD  23. DAF.

"If you'll forgive me, that's a little too scented for my palate."

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Matt S wrote:
BruceMurdock wrote:

More like the best! GE's Gunbarrel is easily my favorite.  ajb007/smile

What a horrible thing to say when John Barry scored 11 gun barrels.

Yup! Much prefer GF, TB... etc

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Barbel wrote:
Matt S wrote:
BruceMurdock wrote:

More like the best! GE's Gunbarrel is easily my favorite.  ajb007/smile

What a horrible thing to say when John Barry scored 11 gun barrels.

Yup! Much prefer GF, TB... etc

We might be the only people who can tell all of them apart by the first chord. You can too, right? I think the similar structure of all of them makes people think they're not as special, but boy are they wrong.

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Re: John Altman talks about what went wrong with the Goldeneye score...

Matt S wrote:
BruceMurdock wrote:

More like the best! GE's Gunbarrel is easily my favorite.  ajb007/smile

What a horrible thing to say when John Barry scored 11 gun barrels. But it seems like the ones that are most popular are never Barry's, probably because Barry's don't stand out compared to the ones that break the mould.

To be fair, GoldenEye's gunbarrel was my first and I just love those cool synth sounds Serra created by remixing Goldfinger's Gunbarrel. I just love it.  ajb007/wink

"No for me."
"You forgot the first rule of Mass Media Elliot! Give the people what they want!!!"
"I never miss..."
"Time to face gravity!"